Do you care about your render cost?

[Cinos Field]

Hello, dear Second Life! I have a question: do you care about your render cost/complexity/polycount?

For example, if you had hair that you really liked, but was 100k triangles, would you wear that or a 10k hair that you like a little less? How about an ideal 500k polygon body, or a 20k great one?

The examples are arbitrary, but I'd like to get a feel for what the average user feels. Is your appearance all that matters, or are there things you'd not be willing to do just for beauty's sake?

I realize that might sound a little judgmental but it's really not meant to; I just want to hear thoughts from people I don't yet know about this!

 

[Maryanne Solo]

I average between 90k to 150k <- when blinged out. You will always see someone around 3/400k at most public venues so I think I'm doing ok. Not sure about others.

[Amina Sopwith]

I think it would depend on the context and how badly the place I was in was subject to lag. I'd certainly keep it simple if the lag was so bad that upping my complexity was keeping people from seeing my beautiful av anyway.

[Prokofy Neva]

No.

However, when I got to a crowded event, I take off jewelry or HUDs or things taking up scripts because it's a common courtesy.

[Ren Toxx]

Yes, I balance it. If a hair is too render-costly but I like it, I’ll usually pick lighter items for other parts of my outfit.

[Lyssa Greymoon]

Not enough to count the triangles in my hair. Sometimes when I get the message that my avatar's complexity is 39,770 and some people may not be able to view me properly, I laugh a little.

[Kyrah Abattoir]

28 minutes ago, Lyssa Greymoon said:

Not enough to count the triangles in my hair. Sometimes when I get the message that my avatar's complexity is 39,770 and some people may not be able to view me properly, I laugh a little.

Yeah those usually give me a chuckle when i'm surrounded by 200K+ avatars.

[Arduenn Schwartzman]

2 hours ago, Cinos Field said:

For example, if you had hair that you really liked, but was 100k triangles

I purchased hair like that once. It looked really great and it wasn't cheap, but when I put it on, I saw my rendering cost triple. I deleted it immediately.

I do the same with objects that use thousands of triangles to make a flat surface. Unfortunately, there's a lot of them around.

Oh, no, I encourage everyone to wear 100k+ poly garment!

They take longer to load, so I can see all of your naked mesh bodies for a longer period of time.  

Edited September 10, 2019 by Arduenn Schwartzman

[Sylvia Tamalyn]

I don't worry about it at all, since others can derender me if they wish. Having said that, I almost never get those messages about my avatar's complexity, so I guess it's OK without me monitoring it. 

[Rhonda Huntress]

I try to keep my draw weight low.  Like 50K or so.  If I ever get over 80K I find out what is causing the problem and get rid of it.

[Lindal Kidd]

Since I spend a lot of time helping newcomers, and want them to see me as a normal person and not a scary purple cutout, I do pay attention to complexity.  I try to keep it under about 120,000 or so.

Plus, vanity.  I mean, I might look abso fabbo to myself, but if everyone else is seeing me as a jelly doll, what's the point?

 

[Linda Reddevil]

I rarely give it much thought.  I wear what I think will look good and only sometimes do I get floored by how high my complexity is.  I won't change what I'm wearing but I am mindful of it, and will wear another outfit (hair) with less complexity if I'm attending a crowded event or club.

[Alyona Su]

I have my settings to render others set to 250k or less (and I refuse to render them, unless a friend or we are in a *good* chat. For myself I set three firm levels, and I tend to really decorate myself up with attention-to-detail things like earrings, bracelets, anklets, thighlets, armlets... LOL:

• 50K or below: DOES THAT HAPPY DANCE "You go, girl!"
• 100K threshold is broken: "O-Man, this is okay, but we could prolly do better."
• 150K threshold reached: Definitely conscious now, *might* push it to 155k, but absolutely feel horribly-vain above that.

If I see someone who is a JellyDoll I just ignore them and don't even bother telling them (unless friend, because friends don't let friends reach JellyDoll status.) As for those with super-high RC, like 600k+ - I just don't have the heart to tell them that *no-one* can see them. LOL Highest I have ever seen: 1.2 Million. Yes. really. But only once ever. I suspect it was an experiment on their part because there is just no other explanation for that.

🧐

Edited September 10, 2019 by Alyona Su

[Lindal Kidd]

Complexity numbers over a million indicate that the person's probably wearing a graphics crasher.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

I don't focus a lot on my complexity, but I have noticed that it rarely creeps past 80,000, and is more usually in the 40,000-60,000 range. It very very rarely exceeds 100,000, and when it does, then I do take action.

I'm not sure how this compares with the experience of others? I don't wear jewelry very often, which might be one factor.

On the other hand, I have noticed that my alt Laskya, when she's wearing older mesh clothing that I picked up for her in 2013-14, frequently does exceed 100,000. She has one pair of boots, made by a very well-known and still very popular maker, that are 60,000 on their own. (Which is a shame, because they're very nice boots.)

My assumption is that makers have become better at managing complexity since the early days of mesh?

Edited September 10, 2019 by Scylla Rhiadra
typo

[Lindal Kidd]

Jewelry and hair are the worst offenders, although you can find very high complexity examples in other things...and very low complexity jewelry and hair.

Demo, demo, demo.

[Solar Legion]

ARC value? Meh, not really - I still have a few whole avatar and wardrobe changes in my outfits that weigh in at over 100k.

Triangle count (or most else honestly)? I bloody well laugh my arse off at those concerned with such, just as I laugh my bloody arse off at a certain TPV dev who went so far as to enshrine their personal viewpoint in their client code and have a fervet hope that the bulk of ARCTan never sees the light of day - not for the average end user anyway.

Look, if you're a content creator then yes you ought to be mindful when creating and uploading your content. The end user simply shouldn't have to - ever.

[steeljane42]

47 minutes ago, Lindal Kidd said:

Plus, vanity.  I mean, I might look abso fabbo to myself, but if everyone else is seeing me as a jelly doll, what's the point?

And tons of users on potato PCs with 20k limit won't see you anyway, users on text viewers won't see you either. Can't please everyone, nor should you. I won't even mention that what you (I or anyone else)  consider as vanity might be epitome of ugliness for other person.

----

As for the answer - no, I don't care one bit, even though majority of my outfits are below 80k (not a fan of jewelry). And I did turn off notifications about someone not being able to see me the day FS with jellydolls feature was released.

When I go shopping I turn on friends only mode anyway, because I'm there to get new stuff and not to look at other people, especially ones who stand in front of the vendors blocking the view. And parts of SL where I'm often when I'm... let's call ot "socializing", are render cost heavy anyway, with 200k+ being normal.

[Janet Voxel]

Short answer: it depends on what body I’m wearing. When I’m wearing a Belleza I can usually keep it under 100k and like a few people said it’s usually hair or jewelry that puts me over. 

I limit my viewable complexity to 180k in firestorm. I haven’t noticed any ill effects for having it that high and I seem to be able to see most things. I think 100k-150k is about average in SL.

Asking here, might skew your data here a bit. A lot of SL users are pretty low information and most people that post here consistently are a bit more knowledgeable than your average user.

Little anecdote: I’m starting to find male avatars are the worst offenders and don’t GAF, either. I was chatting with a nice guy one day. He was cool, so I added him as a friend. The next time I saw him his complexity was 300k. He was completely jellied. I casually mention I couldn’t see him, he was aware it was high, but said “you gotta set to no limits to see me baby.” More curious about what he was wearing I cranked it up and he was wearing some prim tron looking suit from like 2010. It looked nice, but 300k? He said he just liked it and they don’t make em like that anymore. So he likes wearing his old stuff.

This isn’t the first guy I talked to that felt that way or said something to that effect. But I’m going to go out on a limb and say most people are in the 100k-180k range and the people that are higher don’t know or care that it’s higher.

 

[Syo Emerald]

No, it is not an issue for me...but for a different reason.

I simply do not own anything that lets my complexity number rise above the clouds. Not even if I really go all in and create a fantasy outfit with horns, wings etc. Many people seem to believe you can't look amazing without being at 200k+, but its simply not true. If a demo of an item shows, that it has an unresonable high complexity, I'm not buying it, as I have to assume that it was made in a really careless way.

[Cinos Field]

2 minutes ago, Syo Emerald said:

No, it is not an issue for me...but for a different reason.

I simply do not own anything that lets my complexity number rise above the clouds. Not even if I really go all in and create a fantasy outfit with horns, wings etc. Many people seem to believe you can't look amazing without being at 200k+, but its simply not true. If a demo of an item shows, that it has an unresonable high complexity, I'm not buying it, as I have to assume that it was made in a really careless way.

You can absolutely have a very detailed outfit with all the bells and whistles below 100k (and an equally low polycount) even! It just might not be exactly what you specifically want.

[Bree Giffen]

I keep getting the message that I'm over a limit and people may not be able to see me but then I also get a message that people can see me now when I don't change anything. I keep my graphics preference to the setting just under ultra but in crowded Sims I drop it to just above minimum. I see lots of jelly dolls but I can move around. I think high arc settings might not be too important because our clients can simply not render them 

[ThorinII]

Actually, I don't really care about ARC

Currently, I'm wearing a simple outfit: The CC Drone Suit as catsuit,  a Vintage Watch leash holder, my Akeruka Maia head, some Piercings(earrings, eyebrow rings,and a septum ring), [D'eViL] ankle ballet boots, my Maitreya Bento hands, an invisible collar,and Wasabi April hair.

And yet, my complexity is whopping 231,051.

[panterapolnocy]

I usually balance between 35k and 40k, depending on clothes I'm wearing, which I consider a good result for a furry avatar, as the base. Now, do I care? About others? Meh, it's their business. About myself? Actually, yes - first of all, I'd prefer to not look like a single-colour pixelated monster from old FPS game for everyone else, but as my actual self; Secondly, my own avatar is a thing that is rendered by my GPU all the time, not a single object or person in Second Life gets as much prime time as my dragoness. Why to choke the system and force it to constantly calculate and render something heavy?

[Selene Gregoire]

6 hours ago, Cinos Field said:

Hello, dear Second Life! I have a question: do you care about your render cost/complexity/polycount?

1. For example, if you had hair that you really liked, but was 100k triangles, would you wear that or a 10k hair that you like a little less? How about an ideal 500k polygon body, or a 20k great one?
2. The examples are arbitrary, but I'd like to get a feel for what the average user feels. Is your appearance all that matters, or are there things you'd not be willing to do just for beauty's sake?

I realize that might sound a little judgmental but it's really not meant to; I just want to hear thoughts from people I don't yet know about this!

 

Yes, I do care. I try to keep mine below 50k (general advice is below 100k) and usually succeed because everyday wear. 

1. I have a number of hairs that are high poly that I still wear on special occasions, although I have "replaced" most of them with a few mesh hairs. On this account I have the Lara body and I'm perfectly happy with it. My other accounts use the non updateable (some day!) Ebody and I'm perfectly happy with it. I would like to get the updateable one though.

2. I do take a good bit of care with my appearance but it isn't the be all and end all of my SL existence. I treat my SL avatar the same way I treat my RL body, I just don't have to bathe it to keep it smelling fresh and clean. I only wear makeup for special occasions (or work). I wear everyday clothing (jeans, sportswear, casual, beachwear) and usually change once a day (24 hours). I dress up (formal) or down (semi-formal, business casual) and add appropriate accessories (jewelry mainly).  

I have found, for me, the items that have the highest impact on complexity is jewelry and hair. Most of my jewelry are sculpts and they are the worst. But if you know what you are doing (not hard to learn!) you can still wear those high impact items without having to sacrifice in other areas.

The knowledge is out there. Find it. Use it. You'll be glad you did. And so will everyone else.