Why is Second Life expensive?

[Silent Mistwalker]

17 minutes ago, Profaitchikenz Haiku said:

Ah, Ok,. I hadn't seen anything about that and was a bit puzzled when I first read the replies, it makes things clearer now.

So, the reason LL is so expensive (Bill 'n Ted NOT) is that they need to cover the salaries of web page coders monkeying around with the forums, innit?

The real reason land is so expensive is because it started out that way. In the early days the prices were high because it was the main source of income after doing away with prim taxes etc. LL just never got around to reducing the prices, as they came up with more ways of bringing in enough income to keep the doors open, until more recent years. Server farms have never been cheap even if you are just renting "cloud space".

The forum update was a mandatory one pushed out by Invision so LL didn't really have a choice unless they want to go shopping for a new forum platform.

 

I haven't heard innit/enit in years! \o/

[Extrude Ragu]

The thing about SL Simulators is that it does just that, simulate.

Every 40th of a second it goes through and processes any script events in all objects, does the physics calculations for physics objects, sends updates to all the viewers, makes http requests on behalf of the radio the media and scripts can access the wide Web on http too, not to mention also the cost of voice servers.

And it does just that, 24 hours a day 7 days a week. There's a fair amount of bandwidth and electricity cost that that entails. Most game servers are only running as long as someone is using them and servers are dynamically spun up and shut down according to demand but not in SL because of the way simulators work.

Even so I would say as someone who works as a software engineer and deals with AWS instances and also someone who owns a full region I think there's at least a 3x markup on the cost it would take to host something like that on a VM, not counting the cost of salary of some staff to make sure all sims are ticking over. 

I think it would be a good thing if sims were more accessibly priced, or maybe looking into the possibility of instantiated regions for those who just want a nice home and space to run around in but are only on for a few hours and don't need a server running 24/7. 

[Bagnu]

On 9/23/2020 at 8:37 AM, RowanMinx said:

Oh and btw, A lot of people.wouldn't think to call SL a "game" in the same sense as those phone apps.  Just sayin'.

I agree. SL is not a game. If someone is here long enough, they will have the emotional scars to prove that. And the amazing relationships as well.

Edited September 26, 2020 by Bagnu

[animats]

27 minutes ago, Extrude Ragu said:

The thing about SL Simulators is that it does just that, simulate.

Every 40th (45th, actually) of a second it goes through and processes any script events in

Right. Even when no one is around to see them, the trains continue to run, the Yava pods continue to travel, the breedables continue to graze and age, the leaves continue to fall from the trees, the crops continue to grow, and the amusement park rides continue to run.

The designers did not envision that the population would be so spread out, with most sims empty of avatars.

[Silent Mistwalker]

15 hours ago, animats said:

Right. Even when no one is around to see them, the trains continue to run, the Yava pods continue to travel, the breedables continue to graze and age, the leaves continue to fall from the trees, the crops continue to grow, and the amusement park rides continue to run.

The designers did not envision that the population would be so spread out, with most sims empty of avatars.

Holy hell. Skynet has taken over and we are all in the Matrix. 

/me takes the green pill and moves to Mars

[Sassy Kenin]

On 9/21/2020 at 2:05 PM, Lord Derryth said:

It's starting to dawn on me that SL is by far the most expensive platform out there.   If SL ever goes bye bye.  All that money you spent on items INGAME will go bye bye.  The future for us doesn't look too bright.

Even Real Life is Temporary you never own, just borrow the things in life, when you die those things also do not cross the other side with you.

Read the news everyday in real life how bright is it looking as well? ..the endless struggle for resources,etc.

If you own land/a home in Real Life you pay tax's every year and if not they evict you as well (the government) so if you were to ask me second life is just as real as real life....at least here we have an eject button.

I guess the the thing is everything is temporary, but did you enjoy what you had?, while you had it with those who mattered to you the most... maybe thats the perspective often overlooked.

 

Edited October 22, 2020 by Sassy Kenin
Typo

[Fauve Aeon]

On 9/21/2020 at 2:05 PM, Lord Derryth said:

DU is a metaverse like SL.  

I watched the trailer. Wher da kyoot shooZ doh? That’s what I wanna know. 🤣
 

seriously though, will millions join and work together to do this game? After watching the trailer I didn’t really feel compelled to learn more. 

[Michaelatv Destiny]

I came back to SL the other day, came into some money. Had my eye on a half a sim or full sim in blakes seas as an aviator and ATController (Certified). went there to day, and found even my inheritance from a family member wasnt enough to buy a blakes seas sim. very disappointed. 14 years been waiting to buy my own sim, and  the price quoted was over a MILLION L$.............thats just not fair, because I struggle in the UK with already ridiculous energy and food. While those living in Linden Labs or put these prices in to sell half a sim have no idea whats it like to live on peanuts and enjoy life, especially if your retired like me.  So I uninstalled Firestorm again. i shall probably pack up my 15 year account now, as done almost everything there is to do, but Insane land prices is just going to push me out of Second Life for good shortly. You need to be rich to buy land in Second life, but it wasnt all like this, I leased Two full sims in blakes seas in 2009 British Airways Airport and another full sim next door for other things. These were affordable but the lag and aircraft just kept crashing.   But now, I really dont know what to make of it. half the world is starving or drowning in rain or boiling hot in summer yet these sims in Blakes seas get even further away from normal working class people. you would think you were buying real land.  

[Ceka Cianci]

1 hour ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

I came back to SL the other day, came into some money. Had my eye on a half a sim or full sim in blakes seas as an aviator and ATController (Certified). went there to day, and found even my inheritance from a family member wasnt enough to buy a blakes seas sim. very disappointed. 14 years been waiting to buy my own sim, and  the price quoted was over a MILLION L$.............thats just not fair, because I struggle in the UK with already ridiculous energy and food. While those living in Linden Labs or put these prices in to sell half a sim have no idea whats it like to live on peanuts and enjoy life, especially if your retired like me.  So I uninstalled Firestorm again. i shall probably pack up my 15 year account now, as done almost everything there is to do, but Insane land prices is just going to push me out of Second Life for good shortly. You need to be rich to buy land in Second life, but it wasnt all like this, I leased Two full sims in blakes seas in 2009 British Airways Airport and another full sim next door for other things. These were affordable but the lag and aircraft just kept crashing.   But now, I really dont know what to make of it. half the world is starving or drowning in rain or boiling hot in summer yet these sims in Blakes seas get even further away from normal working class people. you would think you were buying real land.  

I gave all my land up and went  to Belisseria  with a nice linden home. there is all the ocean and sky someone could ever want there.. I don't have the land i had , but I have all the room in the world for boating and flying..

[Nalates Urriah]

@Lord Derryth You need to work on your math. For Premium I pay ~US$100/year or about $8.25 per month. But I get L$300/week or about $62/year. So my actual real cost is $3.14/week. About half the cost of what you a touting. Also, I sell stuff in SL. That drives my cost down more.

In the sense SL is expensive, it is for the same reason Super Bowl ads cost so much.

Those 'working' in SL took about US$80 million out of the game in 2021... if I remember correctly. How much did players take out of your less expensive game?

So, if you look at the entire user base's cost, which is more expensive?

 

[Theresa Tennyson]

2 hours ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

But now, I really dont know what to make of it. half the world is starving or drowning in rain or boiling hot in summer yet these sims in Blakes seas get even further away from normal working class people. you would think you were buying real land.  

There's an upside - having the land purchase that expensive means that people won't be able to blow money on some cockamamie project which doesn't pay for itself, not be able to afford tier, and then come back and tell us the same sob story over and over and over and over again.

.

.

.

Just hypothetically, mind you.

[Silent Mistwalker]

30 minutes ago, Nalates Urriah said:

@Lord Derryth You need to work on your math. For Premium I pay ~US$100/year or about $8.25 per month. But I get L$300/week or about $62/year. So my actual real cost is $3.14/week. About half the cost of what you a touting. Also, I sell stuff in SL. That drives my cost down more.

In the sense SL is expensive, it is for the same reason Super Bowl ads cost so much.

Those 'working' in SL took about US$80 million out of the game in 2021... if I remember correctly. How much did players take out of your less expensive game?

So, if you look at the entire user base's cost, which is more expensive?

 

Uh oh. I've agreed with Nalates. We're all in for it now.

[Lewis Luminos]

Second Life is as cheap or as expensive as you want it to be.

You can spend tens/hundreds of thousands on private regions or Blake Sea land. Or you can rent a skybox for L$50 a week (about ten bucks a year). Or you can set home at an infohub and spend nothing at all.

I have chosen how much I want to spend here, that allows me a certain amount of land and a certain amount of pocket money, and that's why I have the amount of land that I do, and why it isn't on Blake Sea.

[Ceka Cianci]

12 minutes ago, Lewis Luminos said:

Second Life is as cheap or as expensive as you want it to be.

You can spend tens/hundreds of thousands on private regions or Blake Sea land. Or you can rent a skybox for L$50 a week (about ten bucks a year). Or you can set home at an infohub and spend nothing at all.

I have chosen how much I want to spend here, that allows me a certain amount of land and a certain amount of pocket money, and that's why I have the amount of land that I do, and why it isn't on Blake Sea.

Exactly..  For years I was spending  like money was falling from trees.. But the more I seen prices going up and quality going down in some things that i liked to get all the time, I went to the bare minimum..

So now, I have my annual membership which gives me a home and 400 a week in lindens.. Which honestly, since I stopped buying so much stuff, that 400 builds up..  I think it's been 3 months since i bought lindens and I used to buy them a few times every weekend..

So ya, you can make it really expensive or  go on the LL plan like I have and just ride the grid like a nice tasty wave.. hehehe

ETA:Private regions are nice for having land and privacy, but not fun lookng out at a void and picturing it all being an ocean you'll never be able to sail.

Edited January 10, 2023 by Ceka Cianci

[Arielle Popstar]

2 hours ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

I came back to SL the other day, came into some money. Had my eye on a half a sim or full sim in blakes seas as an aviator and ATController (Certified). went there to day, and found even my inheritance from a family member wasnt enough to buy a blakes seas sim. very disappointed. 14 years been waiting to buy my own sim, and  the price quoted was over a MILLION L$.............thats just not fair, because I struggle in the UK with already ridiculous energy and food. While those living in Linden Labs or put these prices in to sell half a sim have no idea whats it like to live on peanuts and enjoy life, especially if your retired like me.  So I uninstalled Firestorm again. i shall probably pack up my 15 year account now, as done almost everything there is to do, but Insane land prices is just going to push me out of Second Life for good shortly. You need to be rich to buy land in Second life, but it wasnt all like this, I leased Two full sims in blakes seas in 2009 British Airways Airport and another full sim next door for other things. These were affordable but the lag and aircraft just kept crashing.   But now, I really dont know what to make of it. half the world is starving or drowning in rain or boiling hot in summer yet these sims in Blakes seas get even further away from normal working class people. you would think you were buying real land.  

There are alternatives where one can have a grid the size of Blake sea running on home hosted hardware, so you get the benefit of being able to fly or boat to your content and yet have a S/L account when you want to go clubbing or socializing.

[Rolig Loon]

1 minute ago, Lewis Luminos said:

Second Life is as cheap or as expensive as you want it to be.

You can spend tens/hundreds of thousands on private regions or Blake Sea land. Or you can rent a skybox for L$50 a week (about ten bucks a year). Or you can set home at an infohub and spend nothing at all.

I have chosen how much I want to spend here, that allows me a certain amount of land and a certain amount of pocket money, and that's why I have the amount of land that I do, and why it isn't on Blake Sea.

Yes, this sort of complaint strikes me as an upside-down way of looking at life. Some things are more expensive than we can afford, but are necessities. We learn to buy lower cost versions and we give up the idea of having lobster and truffles regularly. Diamond brooches and SL regions on the Blake Sea are not on anyone's list of necessities. If we can't afford them, we find enjoyable things that we can afford and quit moaning. 

When we were young, my little sister used to wish she had enough money to buy an elephant. She didn't actually want an elephant; she just wanted that much money so she could afford to buy other things on her wish list.  The elephant was her personal reminder that the things on her wish list were luxuries.

[Orwar]

   .. And where is my pony?!

[Fauve Aeon]

I’ll probably upgrade to premium plus, paid yearly, ~USD$11 each in both a L$ stipend and a 2048 worth of tier monthly, then free texture, sound and animation uploads will easily account for the rest. Owning land in large chunks on popular regions? Yes, that’s ‘expensive’, but as hobbies go, not nearly as expensive as many common ones. Some people say it’s an apples to oranges comparison to bring up RL hobbies but if I compare the price of fine dining or a concert ticket, both of those are expensive experiences, ephemeral and also ‘disappear’ without leaving something tangible - so for me, it’s comparable. Handbag collectors will want a certain bag, but someone just interested in carrying their stuff might be happy with a freebie tote bag. I think it just depends on what you really want and how you choose to look at things in your disposable spending. 

[Fauve Aeon]

3 minutes ago, Orwar said:

   .. And where is my pony?!

We never got a pony in a premium gift? Hm…

[Ceka Cianci]

9 minutes ago, Fauve Aeon said:

We never got a pony in a premium gift? Hm…

Rodvik gave away a pony for his linden bear.. hehehe

I remember we were hounding and hounding him for a linden bear and he ended up giving us a pony instead.. hehehe

Edited January 10, 2023 by Ceka Cianci

[Istelathis]

6 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

There are alternatives where one can have a grid the size of Blake sea running on home hosted hardware, so you get the benefit of being able to fly or boat to your content and yet have a S/L account when you want to go clubbing or socializing.

Yep, I have the equivalent of dozens of regions running on an older, budget laptop all at the cost of a few CPU cycles where I am free to build, drive around, boat, fly - with no worry of security orbs or banlines.  Even as much of a recluse I am, it does get lonely in my world so I have SL for being around others while being a safe distance from them 🙃  Plus having access to my inventory, budget shopping, all of the great gadgets in SL, the latest updates, etc.  Plus, 1024 sqm of property which surprisingly, is very accommodating in SL. 

It truly is the best of both worlds, for those who don't have the money to purchase a lot of land in SL.  

[Rowan Amore]

Um, the original post was from 2 years ago so I'm guessing any post directed at the OP will at least give him a chuckle.  😂

[Rowan Amore]

3 hours ago, Michaelatv Destiny said:

I came back to SL the other day, came into some money. Had my eye on a half a sim or full sim in blakes seas as an aviator and ATController (Certified). went there to day, and found even my inheritance from a family member wasnt enough to buy a blakes seas sim. very disappointed. 14 years been waiting to buy my own sim, and  the price quoted was over a MILLION L$.............thats just not fair, because I struggle in the UK with already ridiculous energy and food. While those living in Linden Labs or put these prices in to sell half a sim have no idea whats it like to live on peanuts and enjoy life, especially if your retired like me.  So I uninstalled Firestorm again. i shall probably pack up my 15 year account now, as done almost everything there is to do, but Insane land prices is just going to push me out of Second Life for good shortly. You need to be rich to buy land in Second life, but it wasnt all like this, I leased Two full sims in blakes seas in 2009 British Airways Airport and another full sim next door for other things. These were affordable but the lag and aircraft just kept crashing.   But now, I really dont know what to make of it. half the world is starving or drowning in rain or boiling hot in summer yet these sims in Blakes seas get even further away from normal working class people. you would think you were buying real land.  

Linden Lab really doesn't control the prices other residents can charge for their Mainland.  It's a free market and always has been.  That's not going to change.  Any land available on sailable water will ALWAYS be at a premium price.    

[Tary Allen]

10 minutes ago, Ceka Cianci said:

Rodvik gave away a pony for his linden bear.. hehehe

I remember we were hounding and hounding him for a linden bear and he ended up giving us a pony instead.. hehehe

yep, here it is, Rodvik's pony

[Ceka Cianci]

2 minutes ago, Tary Allen said:

yep, here it is, Rodvik's pony

I think that was the only time I ever used the feed.. hehehe  I still have us asking in there, plus when he came into SLU and us hitting him up there too..

He was always like , I'm working on it.. hehehe