Buy Fee Change Discussion

[Silent Mistwalker]

3 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Careful now, wouldn't want to be called a smart-#ss.

At least they have brains somewhere. 😉

[Finite]

3 hours ago, Jaylinbridges said:

Earning $9 every 2 weeks with a $2000 investment is an annual interest rate of 11.7%

My bank pays me 0.10% annual interest.  Of course I have no risk with my bank.  

What Tilia needs is a Futures market, to give me some leverage.

 

Except with SL you start off 2k usd in the hole. The initial "investment" is not considered yours anymore. It belongs to SL now. You can only cash out the net proceeds from it. According to their policy at least. Unless I am reading it wrong. I've been guilty of this in the past so wouldn't surprise me.

[ItHadToComeToThis]

On 4/16/2021 at 6:15 AM, animats said:

Let's all check back in 3 months to see how LL does on this.

*Years

Remember the great promises of....was it SL15B?. The long list of things that for the most part just never happened.

[Distraida]

Reed Linden said " The revenue generated from this modest fee increase...." 7.5% is not a modest fee increase. You all are ripping people off, because you can. There is no other thing like SL, and you all know it, so you can get away with charging exorbitant fees because you know people will pay the fees. You keep jacking up your fees, fewer people will buy less things, and you will just eventually price yourself out of business.

[LittleMe Jewell]

5 minutes ago, Distraida said:

Reed Linden said " The revenue generated from this modest fee increase...." 7.5% is not a modest fee increase. You all are ripping people off, because you can. There is no other thing like SL, and you all know it, so you can get away with charging exorbitant fees because you know people will pay the fees. You keep jacking up your fees, fewer people will buy less things, and you will just eventually price yourself out of business.

That is one opinion.

Then again, if I had just a single dollar for every time someone said something similar about various past actions, I'd have myself a pretty nice stash by now -- and yet most of us are still here.

[Rowan Amore]

No one is happy about the increase but then, no one has to spend a dime in SL either. 

[Kathlen Onyx]

20 minutes ago, Distraida said:

Reed Linden said " The revenue generated from this modest fee increase...." 7.5% is not a modest fee increase. You all are ripping people off, because you can. There is no other thing like SL, and you all know it, so you can get away with charging exorbitant fees because you know people will pay the fees. You keep jacking up your fees, fewer people will buy less things, and you will just eventually price yourself out of business.

Actually opensim is exactly like SL. Most things are free there so have at it. It doesn't work as well and the content is limited because it's mostly ripped from SL but you don't have to spend a dime there.  Do you tell your landlord they are ripping you off when they raise your rent? Inflation happens.

[Mariusz Ivanovic]

Please stop defending greedy tactics that punish the people that spend the most in world. There are PLENTY of games, and online worlds that have in game currency that you pay for with real money, and none of them have transaction fees, and almost ALL of those also go through 3rd party payment authorization which may take up to 75% of the total purchase price (Steam). The transaction of you buying currency is handled completely in house by LL, they don't have to pay anyone to handle the transaction or have a cut taken...they OWN the market, the currency, and the platform. They also make over 10L$ on each 1USD$ being bought OR sold in that market in the SPREAD on each sale (the difference between the purchase, and sell price) already, and that is ON TOP of this transaction fee...and sorry Rowan, but if you think SL would be the same place it is now if nobody spent a dime, you are sadly mistaken...The people creating in world who rely on that income would not just make items for free for fun. Clubs wouldn't get anyone to work, DJ's would find other platforms to play their music...SL would die if nobody spent a dime...was that your point? I've cut my monthly spending in SL in HALF after this increase, and every time I buy L$ and see that rediculous transaction fee, it irks the crap out of me. Not really the feeling you want your customers having when paying you their money for any service or product.

[Solar Legion]

Reality, stick to it.

That L$10 is a sink - they make nothing on it, at all. Your statements/belief to the contrary is irrelevant!

Steam? Seriously? Steam/Valve does not allow you to convert to an in house currency. Those games and such that you can purchase their tokens from? They do not allow you to convert them back into real currency.

You've cut your spending? Lovely. That was all that you needed to say.

[Rowan Amore]

Where did I say no one should spend a dime?  SL is a luxury item.  Can't afford it this month, can't spend what you used to spend then don't.  Its a choice.  I HAVE to pay the price for gas when it goes up.  I have no choice.  I CHOSE not to spend to rent land in SL this last year.  I don't NEED to spend money here.  There's a distinct difference between choosing to spend money in SL and having to spend money on RL necessities.  Obviously.

I made my choices not because of the fee increase but because I wasn't inworld enough to need to rent and less income due to the pandemic.

Edited June 22, 2021 by Rowan Amore

[Mariusz Ivanovic]

A sink? Do you understand how a currency market works? its not a belief, its a FACT...I don't know what a SINK is unless you're talking about where one does dishes. If you are buying a THING at 50$ and selling it at 60$ that's not a sink, that's profit. When you see video footage of Wall Street, and you see the nice marble building, and shiny floors and thousands of monitors and gadgets with numbers scrolling through them, that SINK as you call it...is what pays for all that...its how the MARKET makes its money...on every TRANSACTION...through the difference between the SELL price and the BUY price...sound familiar? Except on Wall Street, the MARKET doesn't ALSO OWN the currency, and the stocks (product) they are dealing with...LL owns all these things in this scenario, and that's what makes it a GREEDY TACTIC. As to my comparison to games and online worlds on Steam, my point was not that one could buy and sell currency in them, my point is that Steam siphons off a HUGE % of that transaction from the game developer, and they only get a small portion of the purchase, and the game developer still doesn't charge a transaction fee, while LL gets 100% on TOP of the SPREAD of the market that they own (or sink as you call it).

And Rowan, please read your previous post...you literally said "NO ONE HAS TO SPEND A DIME in SL". I wont worry about the difference between the words "HAS to", and "SHOULD" I was merely pointing out the consequences of "no one spending a dime in SL"

[Rowan Amore]

3 minutes ago, Mariusz Ivanovic said:

A sink? Do you understand how a currency market works? its not a belief, its a FACT...I don't know what a SINK is unless you're talking about where one does dishes. If you are buying a THING at 50$ and selling it at 60$ that's not a sink, that's profit. When you see video footage of Wall Street, and you see the nice marble building, and shiny floors and thousands of monitors and gadgets with numbers scrolling through them, that SINK as you call it...is what pays for all that...its how the MARKET makes its money...on every TRANSACTION...through the difference between the SELL price and the BUY price...sound familiar? Except on Wall Street, the MARKET doesn't ALSO OWN the currency, and the stocks (product) they are dealing with...LL owns all these things in this scenario, and that's what makes it a GREEDY TACTIC. As to my comparison to games and online worlds on Steam, my point was not that one could buy and sell currency in them, my point is that Steam siphons off a HUGE % of that transaction from the game developer, and they only get a small portion of the purchase, and the game developer still doesn't charge a transaction fee, while LL gets 100% on TOP of the SPREAD of the market that they own (or sink as you call it).

And Rowan, please read your previous post...you literally said "NO ONE HAS TO SPEND A DIME in SL". I wont worry about the difference between the words "HAS to", and "SHOULD" I was merely pointing out the consequences of "no one spending a dime in SL"

No ONE as in no single person

So again No one has to or needs to spend in SL if they can't afford it.

I'm sure most people didn't assume I meant every single person.  Only those who find SL to be a luxury they can do without when necessary.

Thought that was obvious.

 

 

 

[Solar Legion]

Ah yes, a wall of text response that doubles down on everything that was wrong or irrelevant in your initial post to this thread.

[Mariusz Ivanovic]

 

Quote

On 6/15/2021 at 9:56 PM, Rowan Amore said:

No one is happy about the increase but then, no one has to spend a dime in SL either. 

 

I wasn't assuming anything, I was replying to what you posted in your own words...I am saying exactly what you said, and just replacing SL topics with something else...

 

No one likes broccoli, but then again, no one has to eat broccoli either. 

In that statement, do you ASSUME that I'm speaking about ONE person? If that were the case, I'd say "I don't like broccoli, so I just don't eat it."

But again, I'm not discussing grammar here, merely pointing out the consequences of your statement, and hopefully clearing up your "confused response" state that you left to my post.

[Janet Voxel]

[Rowan Amore]

I like broccoli.  I'd assume you couldn't possibly mean everyone.  That's just silly.

 

 

[Mariusz Ivanovic]

Saying something is WRONG without explaining WHY, or offering ways to correct what you think is wrong is just your opinion...Please provide some constructive feedback, instead of acting like a pig headed imbecile. I also don't see how ANYTHING I said was irrelevant to what I was talking about...I was comparing REAL WORLD markets and other similar situations and products to the current discussion. If you want to defend constant fee hikes, and greedy tactics, that's your right I guess...I don't agree with that, but it doesn't make you WRONG...perhaps you like starting pointless arguments about things you know little about, or fully understand...also your right to do...doesn't make you wrong...just look kinda silly

[Solar Legion]

The explanation is contained within this - and similar- threads. Go, read. Understand.

I have no patience to expend on such things anymore.

[Coffee Pancake]

We're going to have a lot more finical pain unless SL can show growth.

The fewer of us there are, the more proportionally expensive things get.

[Mariusz Ivanovic]

I've actually read, and comprehended most of this thread, and have seen things much less relevant than my posts, and things I've disagreed with as well, but I didn't take the time to reply to them all and call the people out like you seem to enjoy doing. I never ASKED for your patience OR your opinions, and if you want to defend constant rate/fee hikes and other greedy tactics, that's your business...although it makes me wonder if you're not on the LL payroll to have that point of view. I also have no idea what "explanation" you think I'm looking for in this thread. The explanation to raising fees? I was just stating my opinion, and making comparisons to other similar things which ARE relevant and similar while making it clear my displeasure about the direction something is going that I love, enjoy and care greatly about (SL). Hopefully YOU have the patience to read and understand MY explanation, instead of just flatly denying it saying "its wrong and irrelevant" or not based in reality without anything to back that opinion up. I hope your other 4400+ posts are more insightful, friendlier, more thought out, and a little less confrontational than your last few interactions towards me....I'd read a few of them, but frankly, I don't have the patience to expend on such things.

[Finite]

I don't like broccoli but I'll eat some broccoli with cheese.

[Mariusz Ivanovic]

50 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

I like broccoli.  I'd assume you couldn't possibly mean everyone.  That's just silly.

 

 

If you comprehend, read, write and communicate using the English language, you don't have to assume, since "I" always refers to a singular entity meaning...ones self...while "no one" does not, and could also mean "everyone" or "not everyone".

Edited June 22, 2021 by Mariusz Ivanovic

[Silent Mistwalker]

4 hours ago, Mariusz Ivanovic said:

No one likes broccoli, but then again, no one has to eat broccoli either. 

Hello. Please don't call me No one again. I happen to love broccoli.

[Gwin LeShelle]

Ay now I crave broccoli 🥦 and it's just 7 am so this means a painful lot hours until lunch break XD *shakes tiny hungry fist at you all*

But for real, to stay on topic, SL is a hobby to me I love it as creative outlet and I am lucky that the few ¥ more each months I can easily afford and am totally fine with paying, because I would be pretty unhappy of SL dies anytime soon.

And I am much too busy with other things than starting a riot over Something tiny like that.

There are other things in SL with the new owners and such that are much more worry some to me personally (・_・;)

[MoiraKathleen]

I wasn't really bothered by the transaction fee increase.   I budget a maximum dollar amount to spend on buying lindens each month, including the transaction fee within that.  Some times I may get a few less lindens,  but that can happen over time anyway, with changes to the exchange rate.  Some months I don't even make a large enough transaction to trigger the increased transaction fee, so there's really not much change at all for me on those months. I don't think I'd ever be able to tell you the exact total of lindens purchased in one transaction, but I could tell the exact dollar amount I had spent for that purchase.