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12 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Opensim regions have gone down in price for those who rent them and the code to run the servers is mostly updated by one developer who works for free. Other than the parts of the code meant for extracting money from the residents, there is nothing in S/L that Opensim does not have. It kind of hints what the development money is going towards.

Everything except for people.   I log in to be social so not really an option for me.  But I'm sure it is for you and others.

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2 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

Everything except for people.   I log in to be social so not really an option for me.  But I'm sure it is for you and others.

I didn't bring it up as a promotion for Opensim but to point out that the development work in S/L is quite lackluster considering the millions they bring in. When one opensource unpaid dev in Opensim can keep up easily, then I see that as a problem with where or how the money is being spent here.

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5 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

Everything except for people.   I log in to be social so not really an option for me.  But I'm sure it is for you and others.

OpenSim has utterly destroyed the argument that all SL needs to grow and be more popular is cheap land for builders.

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5 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

OpenSim has utterly destroyed the argument that all SL needs to grow and be more popular is cheap land for builders.

Well that might be a little strong as S/L has certainly lost quite a few regions just from the educational sector but even so, it is entirely beside the point in regards to what is the money they do get from the remaining regions, going towards? If one is paying $300 per region, shouldn't one be able to expect that development of new and useful features would be a priority?

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10 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Well that might be a little strong 

NOT when the number of regions (or region equivalents) exceed the number of online users across ALL grids by an order of magnitude.

https://www.hypergridbusiness.com/2021/05/opensim-regions-tally-crosses-100k-mark-for-the-first-time/

 

Edited by Coffee Pancake
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5 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

NOT when the number of regions (or region equivalents) exceed the number of online users across ALL grids by an order of magnitude.

https://www.hypergridbusiness.com/2021/05/opensim-regions-tally-crosses-100k-mark-for-the-first-time/

Those are commercial grids first of all. The educational sector do not list there as they are not open for joining by the public. Some can be visited by hypergrid though. The dreamgrid install are also not listed there and that accounts for 1500 installs or more as well plenty of vanilla grids hiding out on the dark metaverse. Even so, you are missing the gist of my post which is not about who has more regions or people but why is an opensource platform able to keep parallel with one server developer vs all the paid ones in LL? You keep skirting that question.

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55 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

there is nothing in S/L that Opensim does not have

The ability to jump properly and an actual user-base?

The ability to report people? anti-piracy that actually seems to stick (more or less)?

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2 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

but why is an opensource platform able to keep parallel with one server developer vs all the paid ones in LL? You keep skirting that question.

because you're assuming opensim is in any way equivalent to SL simhosts architecturally

Why can't my Ford Escort go as fast as that Ferrari, they both have red paint and wheels.

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5 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

you're assuming opensim is in any way equivalent to SL simhosts architecturally

Just out of intellectual curiosity, does anyone have a list of some major architectural differences and their practical effects?

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33 minutes ago, Quistess Alpha said:

Just out of intellectual curiosity, does anyone have a list of some major architectural differences and their practical effects?

We can only infer the differences based on external observation, LL do not publish details of how their backend works. The communication between the client and server isn't really sufficient on it's own.

There are major differences in pretty much every backend system from asset handling, physics, scripting to how the different platforms scale (or in OpenSIm's case, doesn't ).

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3 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

There are major differences in pretty much every backend system from asset handling, physics, scripting to how the different platforms scale (or in OpenSIm's case, doesn't ).

Oh opensim scales and can do so much better then S/L but differently. When one can appreciate the differences then it is possible to see that opensim has no limit because it is in effect a peer to peer system more than a client/server one.

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1 hour ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Why can't my Ford Escort go as fast as that Ferrari, they both have red paint and wheels.

They are both Escorts but we want them to be Ferrari's! 

1 hour ago, Quistess Alpha said:

The ability to jump properly and an actual user-base?

The ability to report people? anti-piracy that actually seems to stick (more or less)?

Jump as in TP's? Myself and many others in S/L have experienced way more failed TP's over the past 6 months then I have experienced in Opensim in a few years. There is a reason for that but it happened all the same. The userbase is smaller because Opensim doesn't have all the sex clubs....a pity.

 

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Well I did like some features of opensim worlds. I created a huge multi-sim thingie in one of them not long ago. I could stretch prims to enormous sizes....like half a sim...so these huge trees and rocks I could create were amazing to me.  And link an entire region together (did that ever make the full region complex skyboxes so much easier to box up in Inworldz).

I have no idea about more complex scripting and such though..

Edited by Luna Bliss
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7 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Well I did like some features of opensim worlds. I created a huge multi-sim thingie in one of them not long ago. I could stretch prims to enormous sizes....like half a sim...so these huge trees and rocks I could create were amazing to me.  And link an entire region together (did that ever make the full region complex skyboxes so much easier to box up in Inworldz).

I have no idea about more complex scripting and such though..

Well Inworldz was getting behind the rest of Opensim in a number of ways though there were some options they had which stock Opensim didn't. Some would strongly contest Inworldz being included with Opensim in general as they forked off in 2009. Since they closed though, stock Opensim has brought in quite a few more features.

Scripting wise OPS has some OSSL functions which allow stuff you can't do in S/L.

Edited by Arielle Popstar
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8 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Jump as in TP's

No I mean literally jump as in pressing 'e'  to go upwards and then gracefully land. first thing I noticed in opensim was that when I jump I don't go very far off the ground. I don't jump very often, but when I do, I expect it to work. . .

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7 minutes ago, Quistess Alpha said:

No I mean literally jump as in pressing 'e'  to go upwards and then gracefully land. first thing I noticed in opensim was that when I jump I don't go very far off the ground. I don't jump very often, but when I do, I expect it to work. . .

Oh I use the PageUp key as the e doesn't do that for me but I do see there is a difference depending on which physics engine the region uses. The older Bullet is a low jump whereas the Ubode physics is a much better jump.

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6 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

I'm not sure where else any revenue can be generated.  Fees, premium membership increase, larger percentage from MP?  No one is ever happy about paying more but what else in the last 5 years hasn't gone up in price.

Off the top of my head how about they release the need of having a full region to buy the cheaper homestead? Their excuse of it burdening their outdated server farm to much is no longer the case as they have moved to AWS which is easily scalable. 

It is a quick fix, requires little to no staff costs other than to remove the full region restriction and will allow people with lower budgets to get a region or regions to enjoy second life especially if those people dont see any benefit for premium (which most dont in its current format). These are people that dont want a full region with all the bells and whistles and would never buy a full region due to price. There is no excuse LL can make now not to make this change being on AWS and the positives for their bottom line massively outweigh any negatives (if there are any).

If they want even more money the could simply offer one homestead to all without restriction and if you want a second homestead you must have a premium subscription. Win-win scenario for both LL and the userbase all without impacting on the spending or purchasing of existing users.

It is not rocket science. There are numerous ways LL can make more money, they just have a very bad habit of choosing the wrong ways and spending on the wrong things.

Edited by Drayke Newall
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31 minutes ago, Drayke Newall said:

Off the top of my head how about they release the need of having a full region to buy the cheaper homestead? Their excuse of it burdening their outdated server farm to much is no longer the case as they have moved to AWS which is easily scalable. 

It is a quick fix, requires little to no staff costs other than to remove the full region restriction and will allow people with lower budgets to get a region or regions to enjoy second life especially if those people dont see any benefit for premium (which most dont in its current format). These are people that dont want a full region with all the bells and whistles and would never buy a full region due to price. There is no excuse LL can make now not to make this change being on AWS and the positives for their bottom line massively outweigh any negatives (if there are any).

If they want even more money the could simply offer one homestead to all without restriction and if you want a second homestead you must have a premium subscription. Win-win scenario for both LL and the userbase all without impacting on the spending or purchasing of existing users.

It is not rocket science. There are numerous ways LL can make more money, they just have a very bad habit of choosing the wrong ways and spending on the wrong things.

I was with you up until the end.  Giving something such as that away free makes no sense.

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4 hours ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Oh opensim scales and can do so much better then S/L but differently. When one can appreciate the differences then it is possible to see that opensim has no limit because it is in effect a peer to peer system more than a client/server one.

If you think OpenSim can keep up with SL, you clearly don't write any scripts.

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12 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

I was with you up until the end.  Giving something such as that away free makes no sense.

Drake was suggesting LL allow anyone to buy there own homestead, forgoing the premium account requirement.

Not that everyone should get free homesteads.

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4 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Drake was suggesting LL allow anyone to buy there own homestead, forgoing the premium account requirement.

Not that everyone should get free homesteads.

The way it was worded made it seem so but I'd still rather they keep the offer to premium only.  I'd actually think less people would choose to go premium if that were the case.

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18 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

The way it was worded made it seem so but I'd still rather they keep the offer to premium only.  I'd actually think less people would choose to go premium if that were the case.

Let me clarify.

What I meant was a basic account would be able to buy one homestead without the need for having premium or a full region. This means that basic accounts benefit from the ability to get that homestead just like they can get a full region now without premium. This would mean that basic users that will never go for premium and want to buy a cheaper full size region have the ability to get it in the form of a homestead meaning more money for LL.

If those basic users then want to get a second (or more) homestead(s) they will then need to have premium. This means once again more money for LL. Similar to how basic accounts can only have one animesh attachment yet premium can have 2.

I am not suggesting they get one free, they will still need to buy it however, imposing a specific restriction on basic users will see a negative reaction and will impact on any potential profit LL would gain. Locking the purchase of all homesteads behind premium is no better than locking it behind the purchase of a full region.

They need to maximise the potential uptake and by offering a single homestead purchase to basic users and multiple to premium members enables them to have maximum uptake of it and maximise their revenue stream from it.

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Just now, Coffee Pancake said:

buying a region should include premium

Hmm what benefit would that give though? They get support as part of the region purchase which is all they need. All other stuff included in premium is not needed by the region owner and would also impact on LL revenue. If LL were to offer multiple tiers of premium specific for each area such as normal premium, land owner premium and creator premium with benefits specific to those types of users then it may be a different case.

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