Are You Showing Support for Black Lives Matter in Second Life?

[Drakonadrgora Darkfold]

Simple answer.. no.

Complex reason.. it's pointless  because most of the people of the world don't come  here; so what  protests or support is shown on the forums or in world is meaningless. It's just being done to try and make a few feel good for not going out and actually participating..in the real world. 

[Gatogateau]

18 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I can vouch for Gato (who is a she, btw) as well.

I agree with you, Amina, and others that those three words, "all lives matter," whether capitalized or not, have been rendered so toxic by actual usage that they constitute a de facto dismissal of racism, and an insult to black Americans who labour under the very real burden of systemic racism.

But I also know -- and you can see it in some of her posts here as well -- that she is not racist, nor is she denying the importance of BLM.

I think she's dead wrong. But she's absolutely not a racist.

Thank you. Even with the "dead wrong." Hopefully you'll read the bit about "noisy channel" ... (and it was another blankety blank Canadian expert who had the most marvelous convo with me about that. I understood every other word or so.)  I honestly thought in a "room" of relatively like-minded people that there was room for a discussion, using lots of words, to put forth a slightly differing view.

And yeah, you and I both knew (from your earlier post) that your OP was ... I really shouldn't be referencing "acrimonious" threads so much...

I can also now put on my profile "RL verified as a she by Scylla Rhiadra." Yay!

[Madelaine McMasters]

5 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

5 hours ago, Hiroshima Wyx said:

So, remind me, why are BLM mobilising on the street right now? Why are people shouting "No justice, no peace"?

Because it keeps happening.

Over and over and over and over again.

I lost a lengthy missive because I forgot to save it before addressing Dano's blatant innumeracy. In it, I explained why I will not adorn myself, SL or RL, with BLM imagery. Though I am absolutely in support of the idea, I worry that the BLM meme/hashtag itself is counterproductive. I have conservative black neighbors across the road who think BLM is making things worse. My emergency backup son would agree. The chanting of "Black Lives Matter" by the people who burned down the warehouse containing his property still rings in his ears. Through no fault of his own, he's lost hundreds of hours of his own work and rental fees that helped pay his rent. He will place blame and it's going to be on BLM.

I hope there is an answer to this. I'm concerned that BLM is not it. I hope I'm wrong.

As with #metoo and so many other hashtags people have hoisted above the parapets, it doesn't take long for the bullet holes to appear.

I'll look for other ways to support the effort.

Edited June 3, 2020 by Madelaine McMasters

[Gatogateau]

9 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

BLM does not officially say it.

Are they not? I thought I read they had put out an official "not us" statement?

[LittleMe Jewell]

6 minutes ago, Gatogateau said:

Are they not? I thought I read they had put out an official "not us" statement?

I must have missed it and I cannot find any statement on their website that specifically says they do not condone any of the violence, arson, looting, etc.... that continues to happen almost every time the protests happen.

ETA:  White people are told that if we don't specifically call out the atrocities, do not specifically do something in support of change, then we are passively agreeing with what goes on (which, for the most part I do agree with).  So, why does that attitude not hold with BLM not officially stating that they are against the violence and looting?

 

Edited June 2, 2020 by LittleMe Jewell

[Nadia Chatterbox]

25 minutes ago, Hiroshima Wyx said:

So, remind me, why are BLM mobilising on the street right now? Why are people shouting "No justice, no peace"? That'd make sense if the cop had just been suspended or nothing had happened. And, peaceful as many of the protesters may be, nobody in their right mind is going to get behind a movement that shrugs off looting, arson and violence as lesser evils.

Because they want all the cops arrested.   Because POC keep getting killed by cops & non POC and the killers are getting away with it.   Because cops will shoot rather than stun.  Because cops kneel on a mans neck for 9 minutes.   If they even think POC were doing the killing, they would be locked up & convicted immediately.  Because POC get browbeat into confessing to crimes they didn't commit because they're slow or children or poor.  

Because when my two sons were children, I taught them to respect the cops, the cops are there to help us, the cops are the good guys who get the bad guys.  And, when they became teenagers, I had to teach them that if a cop says, "Hey" that they were to stop and put their hands up and to STFU.  Say NOTHING.  Because now that they are 32 and 26, and while they are both good men, one doesn't like the cops and doesn't like authority, even  I still have to yell at them to put your hands on the steering wheel, don't open your mouth, don't look sideways, don't roll your eyes. don't argue, don't say a word except LAWYER or phone call.  

Edited June 2, 2020 by Nadia Chatterbox

[FairreLilette]

28 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

One track mind, that actually doesn't have much to do with the BLM movement, the protests currently going on, and the deaths that sparked it all.

Sorry.  

It's been upsetting me for months now.  I think we need to do something soon or should have already.  

But, again, Sorry.  Carry on your discussion. 

Edited June 2, 2020 by FairreLilette

[Vivienne Schell]

17 minutes ago, Gatogateau said:

This really is (mostly) not about a bunch of white folks across the globe yammering about black lives.

 

I beg your pardon. According to your logic the holocaust was not worth being "yammering about",  because it was not about "us"? Did someone have to be a jew at Auschwitz to understand the dimensions of the crime? Also, I do not notice any "yammering" right now, in regards to the protests, neither here nor elsewhere on the planet.

Please hold your breath and think twice before you hit the send button.

[Harper Held]

37 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I can vouch for Gato (who is a she, btw) as well.

I agree with you, Amina, and others that those three words, "all lives matter," whether capitalized or not, have been rendered so toxic by actual usage that they constitute a de facto dismissal of racism, and an insult to black Americans who labour under the very real burden of systemic racism.

But I also know -- and you can see it in some of her posts here as well -- that she is not racist, nor is she denying the importance of BLM.

I think she's dead wrong. But she's absolutely not a racist.

Again -exception that proves the rule.

She may not be racist; but the way the trope is normally used is as a cover for racism. Likewise "blue lives matter".

It's a dog-whistle.

My apologies to Gato for misgendering her. Owch, I'm sorry.

[FairreLilette]

14 minutes ago, Nadia Chatterbox said:

Because they want all the cops arrested. 

I just read there is a calling to abolish The Police.  

To the thread posters in general:  Sorry, my being upset about COVID-19 in the midst of all this and the high risk factors for blacks and other POC.    I am extremely upset about the high risk factors here and that our governments aren't taking this seriously in regards to this issue either. 

Edited June 2, 2020 by FairreLilette

[Scylla Rhiadra]

4 minutes ago, Han Held said:

My apologies to Gato for misgendering her. Owch, I'm sorry.

You have to lift the tail to tell for sure.

And, really, you don't want to do that.

[Harper Held]

Just now, Scylla Rhiadra said:

You have to lift the tail to tell for sure.

And, really, you don't want to do that.

Definately not on my to-do list -don't worry! 😛

[Vivienne Schell]

 

21 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

I cannot find any statement on their website that specifically says they do not condone any of the violence, arson, looting, etc.

I cannot find any statement on Mister Trumps website which condems the launching of teargas  and rubber bullets and shock grenades at peaceful protesters, only because  Mr. Trump had the glorious idea of doing a pointless propaganda photoshoot at a church which did not invite him.

[Gatogateau]

19 minutes ago, Vivienne Schell said:

I beg your pardon. According to your logic the holocaust was not worth being "yammering about",  because it was not about "us"? Did someone have to be a jew at Auschwitz to understand the dimensions of the crime? Also, I do not notice any "yammering" right now, in regards to the protests, neither here nor elsewhere on the planet.

Please hold your breath and think twice before you hit the send button.

Ya might want to read (and quote) things in context and apparently you need to think thrice before you hit the send button.

And, also, you might want to know your audience before making bad analogies. I'm part Jewish, I had relatives killed in the Holocaust and also French relatives in the Resistance.

[Gatogateau]

16 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

You have to lift the tail to tell for sure.

And, really, you don't want to do that.

This is at least the second time you have referred to looking under my tail. Totally without my consent. I need a safe space.

[Lyssa Greymoon]

59 minutes ago, Hiroshima Wyx said:

A cop has done wrong, either through racism or lack of training, and has been arrested for his action. He will certainly do jail time and the rest of his life is effectively over. 

Four cops, not one. Three of whom are still walking free today. It is also far from certain he will do jail time. The American justice system has a track record of not convicting cops for brutal crimes. This is hardly an isolated incident. It's the latest in a long string of them that are a symptom of a broken society.

Edited June 2, 2020 by Lyssa Greymoon
words are hard

[Gatogateau]

22 minutes ago, Han Held said:

Again -exception that proves the rule.

She may not be racist; but the way the trope is normally used is as a cover for racism. Likewise "blue lives matter".

It's a dog-whistle.

My apologies to Gato for misgendering her. Owch, I'm sorry.

For misgendering I get an apology. For telling me I have no right to speak and to go eff myself... crickets.

I "may not" be a racist, gee thanks. Again, you could not have read what I actually wrote.

And no, not an exception that proves a rule, by a long shot.

That the words I used, despite being fine in context, were a dog-whistle, that is obviously so.

[kiramanell]

35 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I can vouch for Gato (who is a she, btw) as well.

I agree with you, Amina, and others that those three words, "all lives matter," whether capitalized or not, have been rendered so toxic by actual usage that they constitute a de facto dismissal of racism, and an insult to black Americans who labour under the very real burden of systemic racism.

But I also know -- and you can see it in some of her posts here as well -- that she is not racist, nor is she denying the importance of BLM.

I think she's dead wrong. But she's absolutely not a racist.

 

This thread has been moving too fast again. Just want to make sure I, nor Beth, nor anyone else I know, has ever even hinted at her being a racist. Of course she's not.

My point has just simply been this: invite me to a studio, put some cameras on me, with a bunch of other ppl, tell us we're going to talk about a certain aspect of the 'The Meaning of Life' today, namely whether all lives matter equally or not and I will merrily do the whole generic philosophical debate thang.

I like you, Scylla. A lot. And I like Gatogateau. A lot. And I really hate being in a fight with either of you. In this case, though, I feel I must remain steadfast in my belief that All Lives Matter, in this context, is unnecessarily hurtful, and that it actually helps the detractors in their racism. And no, I'm not a complete moonbrain. I understand, to the fullest, what Gato meant, and in what generic context she meant to place it. But, ultimately, I think it's not about my ability, or alleged inability, to understand where's she coming from (which I know to be a totally benign place), but how I feel All Lives Matter (capitalized or no) impacts others, or enables others even.

Outside of this thread, though, meet me in the aforementioned studio, and we'll talk a blue streak.  Or maybe we won't, really, as I have yet to find someone here even suggesting not all lives matter.

[Gatogateau]

3 minutes ago, Lyssa Greymoon said:

Four cops, not one. Three of whom are still walking free today. It is also far from certain he will do jail time. The American justice system has a track record of not convicting cops for brutal crimes. This is hardly an isolated incident. It's the latest in a long string of them that are a symptom of a broken society.

This. This just instantly blows my blood pressure sky-high. Also that so little is said about the three cops who did nothing. They are on video doing nothing except looking at the camera and the people screaming "you're killing him." I mentioned in an earlier post (that got lost in the noise) that I can totally understand why the civilian bystanders didn't jump in, they probably would have been shot. The complicit cops?????

[Gatogateau]

2 minutes ago, kiramanell said:

 

This thread has been moving too fast again. Just want to make sure I, nor Beth, nor anyone else I know, has ever even hinted at her being a racist. Of course she's not.

And I really hate being in a fight with either of you. In this case, though, I feel I must remain steadfast in my belief that All Lives Matter, in this context, is unnecessarily hurtful, and that it actually helps the detractors in their racism.

I'm assuming you haven't made it to the "noisy channel" post of mine yet. I do not think you, Beth, or Scylla or Amina have called me racist. Stupid, possibly. Wrong (Scylla said it verbatim as "dead wrong.") I can live with that. If the noise can be bypassed, I meant what I said, not how it was taken. In this case the fault of communication (delivery, not content) was wrong because I truly thought that most of the people in the conversation were on the same page and could look past trigger words if they were put into a bigger picture. I was wrong.

I'm not fighting (much) with "you guys." I know who I am and what I believe in and I'm very OK with that, and I think most of the people I communicate with regularly also know. But... reference back to "noisy channel."

[kiramanell]

16 minutes ago, Lyssa Greymoon said:

Four cops, not one. Three of whom are still walking free today. It is also far from certain he will do jail time. The American justice system has a track record of not convicting cops for brutal crimes. This is hardly an isolated incident. It's the latest in a long string of them that are a symptom of a broken society.

 

I always suck at names, but there was this US journalist who basically said "The police have a legal right to kill you." And by 'you' an unarmed black man was meant, of course. They can shoot you in the back, just say you had a knife or something (even when you were just holding a phone), and they'll get away with it, scotfree. Every Time. Except when that sweet Australian lady was gunned down, by a black cop no less. Then the wheels of justice moved really, really fast, suddenly. THAT should radically change: black lives should get the exact same consideration; you know, as if their lives matter too.

Edited June 2, 2020 by kiramanell

[Waiomao]

21 hours ago, kali Wylder said:

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Kiyori-BLM-Crop-Top-GIFT/19685081

Thanks Kali!

[Gatogateau]

5 minutes ago, Waiomao said:

Thanks Kali!

Also, Moira told us waaaaay back on pg 1 (?) that Petite Mort (sorry not inworld so no LM) has a free group gift of a BLM crop that looks very nice, and there is also an appropriate tapestry available, all for FREE and you do NOT need to be a group member to get them.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

I think, given that these are almost all freebies, that it's ok for me to post these links here.

All items are free on the SL Marketplace unless otherwise noted below. (A few items cost L$1 so that they can be gifted.)

Kiyori // BLM Crop Top (Women's) (L$1)
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Kiyori-BLM-Crop-Top-GIFT/19685081

Kiyori // BLM Men's Tee (Men's) (L$1)
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Kiyori-BLM-Mens-Tee-GIFT/19687782

#BLM Hoodies Soft Hoodie Mod (Women's) (L$1)
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/GIFT-lastplace-BLM-Hoodies-Soft-Hoodie-Mod/19694865

BM Slogan Tees (Variety, including Black Lives Matter)
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/BM-Slogan-Tees/16781722

*dimma* Black Lives Matter Protest Signs
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/dimma-Black-Lives-Matter-Protest-Signs/19676220

BLM Hoodies (Four slogans, men's and women's)
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/BLM-Hoodies-FREE-add-updated-to-include-mens-sizes/19668819

BLM Mask
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/BLM-Mask/19698845

Kiyori // BLM Unisex Bracelet  (L$1)
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Kiyori-BLM-Unisex-Bracelet-GIFT/19699777

Bade - BLM Tattoo
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/BADE-BLM-TATTOO/19685955

BLM Wall Tapestry ("I can't breath / Black Lives Matter")
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/BLM-Wall-Tapestry-FREE-GIFT/19702411

*~*HopScotch*~* Lightbox Black LIves Matter (electric lightbox)
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/HopScotch-Lightbox-Black-Lives-Matter-GIFT/19684066

Psycho - No to Racism! Black Live Matter (BLM flags, animation, mouth patch)
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/PSYCHO-NO-TO-RACISM-Black-Lives-Matter/19681966

ARK - BLM Fist in Air (Animation)
https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/ARK-BLM-Fist-in-air/19683953

In addition, Petite Mort is offering both a free BLM tank top for women, and a "Compassion Tapestry." You'll find these with the Group Gifts, but you don't need to join the group to buy them.

 

[kiramanell]

10 minutes ago, Gatogateau said:

I'm assuming you haven't made it to the "noisy channel" post of mine yet. I do not think you, Beth, or Scylla or Amina have called me racist. Stupid, possibly. Wrong (Scylla said it verbatim as "dead wrong.") I can live with that. If the noise can be bypassed, I meant what I said, not how it was taken. In this case the fault of communication (delivery, not content) was wrong because I truly thought that most of the people in the conversation were on the same page and could look past trigger words if they were put into a bigger picture. I was wrong.

I'm not fighting (much) with "you guys." I know who I am and what I believe in and I'm very OK with that, and I think most of the people I communicate with regularly also know. But... reference back to "noisy channel."

 

Hehe, I would never call you stupid -- not directly, nor by inference. In this thread? 'Unnecessarily stubborn,' maybe; but the same can likely be said of me too.

And you and Beth, and Marcia, were totally right on the need to listen. Remember how that guy set Luna straight, a few days ago, on diagnosing ppl over the net? That's how I felt here today: when the real experts arrive, those who actually know what they're talking about, from real knowledge, or from having lived it, I wisely stay quiet. It was good to hear from actual black ppl in this thread.