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10 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Pearl is completely inoffensive. Annoying? Maybe, but that's subjective. She's not attacked anyone, either as an individual or a class.

If I don't get to decide whether or not I've offended someone else, regardless of my intentions (which has been stated multiple times in the forums while discussing various topics), then you can't say whether or not someone else is offensive to others.  Your claim of her being inoffensive only applies to your perception of her.

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3 hours ago, Bagnu said:

I can't approach the forum in any other way. I'm me lol!!! 

If I was an a**hole in RL, do you think it would go over very well if I told everyone "I can't approach life any differently, that's just who I am. I'm me" ?

Edited by LittleMe Jewell
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5 hours ago, Bagnu said:

Of course I do. I'm human. I maintain my composure though. And I'm a sponge in the sense that I'm learning. Inworld would be a very different story....

 

10 hours ago, Bagnu said:

I ask questions when I don't know the answers. SL IS different than RL, so I ask questions to understand.

 

8 hours ago, Bagnu said:

I'm human. I can contradict myself sometimes, as do we all. So even a child would know? Well I didn't , so I asked. You probably read how that has been to my advantage through my education. There are no questions that we shouldn't ask if we don't know the actual answer. I'm not here to please or displease anyone. I'm simply myself. I have no enemies, but have made some very dear friends!!!

I mean on the forums. Obviously not inworld. You know what I mean.

And even though you are quite vehement at opposing me, I actually like you, as i said before.

Aside from your choice to work as an escort in world, why do you continually make a distinction between rl and sl.  Your personality doesn't suddenly disappear when you log in.  Of course behaviors can be different which to me is a good thing but not WHO you are or your moral compass.  It seems to be your go to excuse/reason and maybe therein lies the major problem. Most of the questions you've asked, if you had taken a minute and thought of the same question in rl, you'd find the answer in the same.  SL is not this place.in a.bubble where everything, every decision is somehow so much different than rl.

This entire thread had you worrying about how we would treat your friends if we knew who they were.  It should have been something you discussed solely with them not us in my opinion.  Same as in rl.  Tell them your concerns and let them decide what if anything to do.  Do you ask everyone at your place of work to comment on your personal matters?

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3 hours ago, Pomeline Pancake said:

She stirs up drama for personal enjoyment.

"I help people live out their sexual fantasies here, (and make them feel human if they are RL disabled). In RL what I am would be considered immoral. In SL I feel that I'm morally doing the right thing!!!"

"None of my clients have ever admitted to having any sort of disability. I'm going on discussions I have had inworld, and what I have read on the internet."

I don't know if she was seeking personal enjoyment from making that first statement.  I read it too in the "sexy clothes means hookers" thread.  What did send up a red flag to me in the first statement was it seemed extremely, extremely naive and naive to a scary degree in that it sounds like something a P.I.M.P. period would tell a naive person in order to keep them "working".  I don't like P.I.M.P.S. period much BUT I let the statement go because 1) I thought Bagnu was only going to respond in that particular thread and 2) There is nothing I can do to personally help all the naive girls who fall for stuff like that from P.I.M.P.S. period.  This is an internet forum, not a help and rescue board.  

However, in reading some of Pearl's threads my other feeling is that she is lonely as opposed to trolling although I have no crystal ball to say that is 100% true as she said she wants to be the Jenna Jaminson (spelling? not sure of the persons name exactly) of SL so she wants HUGE attention.  But, with her hanging around the forum the way she has, I also thought she might want out of the business but again that is not for me to fix nor do I believe it could be fixed on the internet.  

I have wondered about the lonely part though.  As far as some of this thread, it's getting redundant not just from Bagnu but from other posters too repeating the same stuff over and over.  

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4 minutes ago, FairreLilette said:

my other feeling is that she is lonely as opposed to trolling

Although I'm currently leaning towards "troll" because of the apparently deliberate and manipulative nature of it, this did cross my mind as well. I don't believe for a second that this character is real; people who really are being their true selves don't need to keep telling you and doubling down about it, and it's just so contrived. But I was starting to wonder why Bagnu seems to prefer this really quite awful persona to whatever her real one is, and it did occur to me that she is perhaps lonely. I suppose this way, when you piss everyone off, at least you can claim it's because they can't take how sexual or larger than life you are (not true, of course, but you can tell yourself that)...and since it isn't the real you anyway, it's not really a rejection.

Anyway, if that's what it is, there is an old Yiddish proverb that may apply here: Do not make yourself so big. You are not so small.

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12 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

She's been a bit defensive in places, sure, but unlike the vast majority of posters, new or old, who come under this kind of fire, she's remained pretty good humoured.

And, really, this is why I don't get the hostility here. Pearl is completely inoffensive. Annoying? Maybe, but that's subjective. She's not attacked anyone, either as an individual or a class.

And my third bit of advice: keep up the good humour. You are a genuinely nice person. You don't lash out. People will recognize that, once you've figured out how to stop annoying them.

O.o. Fair disclosure, Scylla is on my friends list too! ZOMG, conflict of interest! And yes, the above quote is snipped.

Yeah, maybe it is the extra "u" in humour but I don't see the humor in her posts.

Pearl may be completely inoffensive to you, but clearly that is not the case to many others (and I see you've been called out for this statement by others, too). Also, "attacked" is a bit subjective as well, especially if you add in the passive-aggressive type.

Again, she may be a genuinely nice person in your opinion, but others are seeing a manipulative troll, who doesn't care who or what she offends because she doesn't have to think she just has to be accepted for who she is, regardless. Others are seeing this insincere manipulation color every stinkin' thread on the gdf.  Some of us don't define "nice" as someone who has no basic concept of right and wrong.

Even I will modulate, and I've never pretended to be all that nice.

 

Edited by Seicher Rae
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9 hours ago, Amina Sopwith said:

I don't mean to drag stuff up (honestly), but this really isn't historically true and some people have indicated that their hackles are still a bit up about it.

Is it '"offensive" to continually engineer situations to get the attention of a community on the lamest pretexts, while completely ignoring its response and making posts that indicate that you don't think much of it? (In this case, once again accusing us of being judgemental over a profession and then of being horrible people who will victimise individuals for their friendships?) Or bringing up the distress that one felt after some unpleasant incidents as justification for yet more transmit-only projection, while completely forgetting the distress one caused at the same time? Some might say no, but I think there's a case for it. 

 

I've been trying to work out what it is about Pearl that has made everyone so very angry.

I used the word "inoffensive," which in hindsight may have been a poor choice, because what is "offensive" is so very subjective. But I was implicitly distinguishing between the kind of offense we take to someone who eats with their mouth open, or interrupts people, and someone who says things that are genuinely hateful. Yes, Pearl has said one thing that was absolutely appalling -- at the time, I posted asking her to make an uncomplicated apology for it. To the best of my recollection she did.

It's a bit odd that we had someone in this forum, not a new poster, who made some absolutely outrageously homophobic and transphobic comment about Ebbe (not to mention calling me a "dimwit bimbo"!!!! Da nerve of da guy!), and it garnered something like three or four responses. But Pearl runs into the room and shouts "Look at ME!" and we've got the makings of a monster thread on the subject of how self-absorbed and annoying she is. It seems to me . . . disproportionate.

I think that my friend [name redacted by request] may have put it best just now as I was talking to her and others about this: she said this is like a reality show. People enjoy being annoyed by her, she makes them feel a bit better about themselves, and piling on makes everyone feel a bit like they're part of a community. (For the record, my friend would count herself among those "annoyed.")

I dunno.

Anyway, I've said I'm not here to plead with people to stop, or defend Pearl. I'm not going to insist that you shouldn't find her irritating or "offensive" or whatever. She'll work out how to fit in here, or not; that's on her.

Edited by Scylla Rhiadra
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29 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I was talking to her and others about this: she said this is like a reality show. People enjoy being annoyed by her, she makes them feel a bit better about themselves, and piling on makes everyone feel a bit like they're part of a community. (For the record, Saskia would count herself among those "annoyed.")

Speaking only for myself, I will say "nope" to this theory of "why" you are postulating.

The piling on may be some people's motives, I have no idea, but as someone who has both been accused of piling on and who has been piled on against (oh gawd, that's a confusing sentence)... Seeker don't play that. Never has. Accused of it yes, actually doing it, no.  I say what I mean. Sometimes it aligns with others, quite often it doesn't.

Edited by Seicher Rae
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30 minutes ago, Amina Sopwith said:

Although I'm currently leaning towards "troll" because of the apparently deliberate and manipulative nature of it

Hmmm.  I have been away from the forum for awhile but I read one poster who said she does it every single day, so I am not current as to what is going on around here.

But, if she wants to be the Jenna Jaminson (again, sorry spelling, not sure of name) of SL, what is she doing on the forum so much?  

That's why I think something is not on the up and up here or all spelled out here, but many just suspect trolling.  Unfortunately, I have been a little concerned about Bagnu.  If she does want out of the profession, she needs to seek real life counselling though.

Edited by FairreLilette
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12 minutes ago, Seicher Rae said:

Speaking only for myself, I will say "nope" to this theory of "why" you are postulating.

The piling on may be some people's motives, I have no idea, but as someone who has both been accused of piling on and who has been piled on against (oh gawd, that's a confusing sentence)... Seeker don't play that. Never has. Accused of it yes, actually doing it, no.  I say what I mean. Sometimes it aligns with others, quite often it doesn't.

Yeah, I was making a general observation about the forum community rather than suggesting that all individuals are motivated for the same reasons. @Amina Sopwith, I think, similarly has different reasons for disliking her.

No one should apply that observation to themselves if they don't think it applies to them.

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8 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I've been trying to work out what it is about Pearl that has made everyone so very angry.

I'm just trying to work out Pearl!

19 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

It's a bit odd that we had someone in this forum, not a new poster, who made some absolutely outrageously homophobic and transphobic comment about Ebbe (not to mention calling me a "dimwit bimbo"!!!! Da nerve of da guy!), and it garnered something like three or four responses. But Pearl runs into the room and shouts "Look at ME!" and we've got the makings of a monster thread on the subject of how self-absorbed and annoying she is. It seems to me . . . disproportionate.

I was one of the responders to that asshat, and I responded because I had worked him out to be... an asshat.

Though it may be a fool's errand to gauge intent, I still try. Pearl can't seem to get out of her own way, but I've yet to gauge her as malicious. In another post, you remarked about her resilience in the face of withering criticism. Though that criticism doesn't seem to be absorbed, her unfailing good grace is a wonder.

I reserve my anger for malice. I'm not there, nor am I heading in that direction.

28 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

She'll work out how to fit in here, or not; that's on her.

Yep. I've got my fingers crossed!

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1 minute ago, Madelaine McMasters said:

I reserve my anger for malice. I'm not there, nor am I heading in that direction.

Yes. Perfectly said.

There are a couple of regular posters here who used to irritate the hell out of me. I've actually grown quite fond of both of them. In one case, my opinion began to shift when he offered me a fresh baked cookie. (I'm really remarkably shallow.) He hasn't changed -- he still does the things that irritated me. But I have a fuller, more expansive sense of who he is now. And mostly I quite like what I've come to understand about him.

Put an irritant, a bit of annoying grit, into a mollusk, and you sometimes end up with . . . a pearl?

Maybe. We'll see.

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2 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I've been trying to work out what it is about Pearl that has made everyone so very angry.

I think it's been made clear by now, really. 

 

2 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Yes, Pearl has said one thing that was absolutely appalling -- at the time, I posted asking her to make an uncomplicated apology for it. To the best of my recollection she did.

I personally could have let this one go by now (for whatever that's worth, as I'm not in the group of people she was talking about), but Bagnu herself keeps resurrecting it, as per this very thread...and always to claim victim status for the RL distress she experienced, without any acknowledgement that it really did cut both ways.

2 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

It's a bit odd that we had someone in this forum, not a new poster, who made some absolutely outrageously homophobic and transphobic comment about Ebbe (not to mention calling me a "dimwit bimbo"!!!! Da nerve of da guy!), and it garnered something like three or four responses. 

I didn't see the homophobia/transphobia, but if I had, I'd have done what I did when I saw the "dimwit bimbo" comment, and reported it without engaging.

I think it's fair to say that Bagnu gets a lot more attention because she engineers it because, as she says, she wants it. It's obviously not hateful like homophobia but it is a bit contemptuous and disrespectful of the community at large, especially since it really is transmit only.

 

2 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I think that my friend [name redacted by requent] may have put it best just now as I was talking to her and others about this: she said this is like a reality show. People enjoy being annoyed by her, she makes them feel a bit better about themselves, and piling on makes everyone feel a bit like they're part of a community. (For the record, my friend would count herself among those "annoyed.")

This is the kind of justification someone would make to themselves but no, I personally don't enjoy flame wars and I really don't enjoy someone effectively streaking through what was a pretty well functioning community because they think we need what they consider an improvement.

But I think it's a troll. A successful one, I guess, but I can't say I think the place is improved by it.

Edited by Amina Sopwith
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