So what do you all think to the Premium Plus package?

[Sammy Huntsman]

1 hour ago, Marianne Little said:

You saw my posts? LL cover VAT when we pay annually. I think it is to keep us as long time customers. If they quit doing it, it will be bad. Really bad. A very big roadblock for Premium and Plus. I am paying 25% VAT.

I have pinged @Patch Lindento ask him if he will inform us about the Plus, will annually subscription be free of VAT? And will old common Premium continue to be free of VAT? I hope for information in the official blogpost they should send out in a couple of days.

It can kill Premium Plus. 25% on top of 250 US.

 

I don't think that they can circumvent laws put on by countries such as the EU. 

[Alwin Alcott]

1 minute ago, Sammy Huntsman said:

I don't think that they can circumvent laws put on by countries such as the EU. 

they don't

[Claireschen Hesten]

1 hour ago, Reiki Mystic said:

Absolutely no! the price is crazy already 99 $ I find it too expensive for what they give

but 249 $ if you then calculate that many countries have to pay us VAT (for example in Europe an average from 20 / 22 up to even 25%) I would say absolutely no

In the UK at least VAT isn't charged on an annual premium membership, 

https://secondlife.com/corporate/vat?lang=en

It would seem other countries don't get charged either on annual plans

What are the items for which Linden Lab doesn't charge VAT?

Transactions in L$ between individual Residents are not subject to VAT. Linden Lab does not charge VAT for Annual Premium Membership subscriptions

[Reiki Mystic]

For Italy,France etc, pay the vat in premium

[LittleMe Jewell]

5 minutes ago, Sammy Huntsman said:

I don't think that they can circumvent laws put on by countries such as the EU. 

They are not circumventing any laws.  Either the 'annual' membership is classified differently than monthly/quarterly and thus VAT doesn't apply or LL is covering it themselves as a way to entice people to pay annually.  The second is the more likely scenario.

[Rowan Amore]

3 minutes ago, Reiki Mystic said:

For Italy,France etc, pay the vat in premium

Yearly? or is that monthly or quarterly?

 

Anything that you pay Linden Lab for will have VAT applied. This includes:

Purchases from the Land Store

Land use fees (tier)

Private Region fees

Land auctions

LindeX™ transaction fees

Monthly & Quarterly Premium Memberships

Edited June 21, 2022 by Rowan Amore

[Kitteh Whiskers]

Seems great but sadly I can't afford it. I feel this plan will mostly benefit shop owners/businesses but for regular sl people like me, it's a bit much. I could use the extra group slots but not at that price

[Marianne Little]

15 minutes ago, Sammy Huntsman said:

I don't think that they can circumvent laws put on by countries such as the EU. 

They must pay VAT for us instead. To make us pay annually instead of one month and then stop.

9 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

They are not circumventing any laws.  Either the 'annual' membership is classified differently than monthly/quarterly and thus VAT doesn't apply or LL is covering it themselves as a way to entice people to pay annually.  The second is the more likely scenario.

Yeah. And it is really nice. I mean, they must have calculated how many that would stop Premium after one of two months, against those that pay for a year.

After paying for a year, some would stop logging in because they have so much money that 99 US is nothing. And after a year, is a new annual subscription paid. Repeat.

For those of us that stay in SL, we contribute to the economy, by shopping, spending money on clubs or loose women. Every resident they can keep is money in circulation.

Yes, some never spend money, but those who come because of the reputation, is leaving because no one will do it for free with ugly noobs, and those that would, want to be paid.

Edited June 21, 2022 by Marianne Little

[Sammy Huntsman]

2 minutes ago, Marianne Little said:

They must pay VAT for us instead. To make us pay annually instead of one month and then stop.

Yeah. And it is really nice. I mean, they must have calculated how many that would stop Premium after one of two months, against those that pay for a year.

After paying for a year, some would stop logging in because they have so much money that 99 US is nothing. And after a year, is a new annual subscription paid. Repeat.

For those of us that stay in SL, we contribute to the economy, by shopping, spending money on clubs or loose women. Every resident they can keep is money in circulation.

Yes, some never spend money, but those who come because of the reputation, is leaving because no one will do it for free with ugly noobs, and those that would, want to be paid.

Okay but you are expecting them to pay VAT for you on a month to month basis. That can get expensive, really expensive. I mean yearly can too. But it's far cheaper. It would be like me asking for Linden Lab to pay for the exchange rate on Linden Dollar Purchases to Canadian dollars, every time I make a purchase. I mean yeah it would be nice and yeah all that can get expensive. Trust me, I pay taxes on that kinda stuff. But I mean I really can't avoid that. 

[Aria Aurelia]

Some of you are very against this but anyone taking it out has a choice to either not bother or make sure they get the money they’ve spent out of it in free uploads.  The point I’m making is that it does give you incentive to make things if you have the will and want to do it.  You can have more than one premium account a year.  
 

I akin this to getting latte everyday or going out for dinner once a month.  It will cost you far more than 249 in a year.

Edited June 21, 2022 by Aria Aurelia

[Codex Alpha]

1 minute ago, Aria Aurelia said:

Some of you are very against this but anyone taking it out has a choice to either not bother or make sure they get the money they’ve spent out of it in free uploads.  The point I’m making is that it does give you incentive to make things if you have the will and want to do it.

For those of us who  may have 1-2 materials per object >:-D it isn't really a draw.Good for those who put 8 x textures on 8 linked objects though

[LittleMe Jewell]

I think the Plus package can be very beneficial to some creators - even more so if the discounted mesh uploads does become a perk.  I see it being less beneficial to the average 'consumer' though - or even the average Linden Home user.

[Malin Sabra]

Still no 30 second sound clip uploads... pfffffft

Too expensive for what you get in my opinion. I have 13 groups remaining at the moment and could remove some if needed.

2048 is cheaper to just buy the extra 1024 of tier.

Free image uploads is cool but I don't upload enough images to make up for the cost.

With the cost of living on the rise, gas prices, and lack of wage increases to cover the inflation in the real world I don't see these prices being feasible. These prices may be ok for anyone who has a business on SL and is making enough lindens to cover the costs but even then.. I think most will say "is it worth it?" and probably decide against it (do the math). But who knows I've seen some people do some crazy stuff on SL lol.

If the price was $150/year I'd go for it. But with Marketplace fee's now higher, cost to buy and sell lindens being taxed higher than before, and soon US will be taxed based on your state taxes (similar to VAT)...

Math tells me... No Way Jose!!

Just my opinion... 

 

[Qie Niangao]

14 hours ago, Kimmi Zehetbauer said:

Would've been nice if event listings were free for premie-plus members.

Aren't they? I'm looking at Inara Pey's summary of the benefits Patch presented, and seeing:

Quote

• Fees:
  • No upload fees for textures, animations, sounds.
  • No fees for event listings.
  • Mesh / Animesh upload fees will change for Premium Plus will be adjusted in the future.
  • Group creation fee reduced to L$10

Inara usually gets it right, so… maybe? It will be nice when we get the official product offer to quote. (I still don't know why YouTube doesn't have a transcript for this session.)

ETA: While sloping around the video, hunting for this fee waiver, I stumbled on something that Patch seems to have gotten wrong, which I see Inara also notes: Around 28:28, Saffia seems to ask about an increase to three animesh attachments, and Patch says it will go from one to two, but regular Premium accounts already get two animesh attachments, and this is actually a way to tell whether an avatar is Premium or not. If it goes to three, then we'll be able to tell who's gone Plus, too.

What I was actually looking for came up around 30:17, where Patch says:

Quote

For those folks who like to run and host events, and especially the recurring ones that typically cost you L$50, it goes to zero.

 

Edited June 21, 2022 by Qie Niangao

[Marianne Little]

1 hour ago, Sammy Huntsman said:

Okay but you are expecting them to pay VAT for you on a month to month basis. That can get expensive, really expensive. I mean yearly can too. But it's far cheaper. It would be like me asking for Linden Lab to pay for the exchange rate on Linden Dollar Purchases to Canadian dollars, every time I make a purchase. I mean yeah it would be nice and yeah all that can get expensive. Trust me, I pay taxes on that kinda stuff. But I mean I really can't avoid that. 

No no, I am not. I know LL have nothing to say about it, the VAT has to be paid. It is nice as long as LL cover it for us when we pay annually. It is more than I expected, I was really surprised! I refused to believe it until I was shown the same page as I have posted here.  ❤️

[Patch Linden]

3 hours ago, Marianne Little said:

You saw my posts? LL cover VAT when we pay annually. I think it is to keep us as long time customers. If they quit doing it, it will be bad. Really bad. A very big roadblock for Premium and Plus. I am paying 25% VAT.

I have pinged @Patch Lindento ask him if he will inform us about the Plus, will annually subscription be free of VAT? And will old common Premium continue to be free of VAT? I hope for information in the official blogpost they should send out in a couple of days.

It can kill Premium Plus. 25% on top of 250 US.

 

 

There is no VAT charged on the Annual Premium subscriptions, and that does include Premium+.

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Patch Linden said:

 

There is no VAT charged on the Annual Premium subscriptions, and that does include Premium+.

The assumption has come up a few times that Linden Lab must be paying the VAT in these cases.  Is that true?

Otherwise, for us non-VAT people (like in the USA), there may be some assumption that other countries don't require payment of VAT for yearly subscriptions.

[Sammy Huntsman]

Just now, Love Zhaoying said:

The assumption has come up a few times that Linden Lab must be paying the VAT in these cases.  Is that true?

Otherwise, for us non-VAT people (like in the USA), there may be some assumption that other countries don't require payment of VAT for yearly subscriptions.

Canada is also excluded from VAT charges, I think it's mainly the UK and the EU that pay VAT. 

[DadaDuck]

This would be a no-brainer for me if it included more land tier. Give folks 4096 sqm, that would actually make it a great deal relative to the current land tier pricing. 

[Love Zhaoying]

All these "square meters" are confusing.  Can we go back to "acres", or "hectares"?

[Marianne Little]

4 minutes ago, Patch Linden said:

 

There is no VAT charged on the Annual Premium subscriptions, and that does include Premium+.

❤️🥰😍❤️

Nice! I am really happy to hear that. We residents need to help spread the news. It must be very few that know annual subscription is free of VAT.

Paying annually is already the best value, and without VAT it is even sweeter. ❤️

[Malin Sabra]

2 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

All these "square meters" are confusing.  Can we go back to "acres", or "hectares"?

lol

1 acre = 4046sqm lets just round up 4096 = 1 acre for SL purposes since we have doors and avis that arent to scale either lol.

it just works..

[Patch Linden]

4 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

The assumption has come up a few times that Linden Lab must be paying the VAT in these cases.  Is that true?

Otherwise, for us non-VAT people (like in the USA), there may be some assumption that other countries don't require payment of VAT for yearly subscriptions.

This is a bad assumption.  There are certain types of services and elements of products that qualify a fee to have VAT levied upon it.  I will spare everyone from going down that rabbit hole because it is safer we if do not as we are not the taxation legal counsel involved in such decisions.  😁

[Kimmi Zehetbauer]

4 minutes ago, Patch Linden said:

This is a bad assumption.  There are certain types of services and elements of products that qualify a fee to have VAT levied upon it.  I will spare everyone from going down that rabbit hole because it is safer we if do not as we are not the taxation legal counsel involved in such decisions.  😁

Legal stuff gets so complicated it makes most of our heads explode!

[Kimmi Zehetbauer]

1 hour ago, Qie Niangao said:

Aren't they? I'm looking at Inara Pey's summary of the benefits Patch presented, and seeing:

Inara usually gets it right, so… maybe? It will be nice when we get the official product offer to quote. (I still don't know why YouTube doesn't have a transcript for this session.)

ETA: While sloping around the video, hunting for this fee waiver, I stumbled on something that Patch seems to have gotten wrong, which I see Inara also notes: Around 28:28, Saffia seems to ask about an increase to three animesh attachments, and Patch says it will go from one to two, but regular Premium accounts already get two animesh attachments, and this is actually a way to tell whether an avatar is Premium or not. If it goes to three, then we'll be able to tell who's gone Plus, too.

What I was actually looking for came up around 30:17, where Patch says:

 

Somehow I missed the no event fee part.  Which is funny since it was once free to post events.