Belleza Update

[Pussycat Catnap]

11 hours ago, Karly Kiyori said:

My concern with doing this is that it will disable use of the HUD.  I don't mind losing the ability to use the alpha sections, and feet height I can wear separately as you suggested, but what about other things on the hud like hand position (which I find I still have to re-set every time I log in), nail texture & nipple texture (yes I could mod them for tint, but I don't have access to the textures).

Does removing all the unwanted pieces disable those features too or is it only hiding alpha sections that is lost?

If you use hand positions that might be an issue. I'm kind of working under the assumption everyone has a bento AO now. Didn't realize anyone still used those.

Personally I can write a script to do them better than the HUD does - and if all else fails I will. The script I wrote to control my Neko tail for example. The issue there is I don't like HUDs so I write these things to work by typing in a chat command. I'd have to learn how to make one through a HUD...

 

As far as avoiding the finger splay bug - there is a script in the body for hands that I leave in.

Going to see if the thing to reset scripts works for getting the HUD back.

- if that works the issues fixing the body causes will be non-issues.

 

Edited September 2, 2021 by Pussycat Catnap

[s2Pandora]

1 hour ago, Lewis Luminos said:

That was the problem, you never see it on yourself, only on others. You only know if someone tells you, or if you're logged in with another alt at the same time and you're watching.

But basically, every teleport would cause the hands to splay for others, even if you didn't see it yourself. My poor alt had to keep the hud on and re-select hand poses after every teleport, just to be sure.

That's so weird. It must had not always been every time, as my fiance uses Jake and he never had the issue when he teleported(i'd see him as it'd usually be with me). I'd seen plenty of guys in places it wasn't happening to either.. well, luckily and hopefully it's fixed now!

Edited September 2, 2021 by s2Pandora

[Pussycat Catnap]

 

12 hours ago, Paul Hexem said:

The links all appear to be named, so with a script reset to re-read them, I would think that would have fixed it?

Script reset fails to work.

It works for the bottom half of the body but messes up the chest and the hand position HUD becomes non-responsive. On the female body at least. Haven't tested with the male yet.

 

What I suggest is the the solution Maitreya used, that is actually what pre-mesh Slink hands and feet and that old breast addon that used to be popular did:

Make a base body minus the hands, feet, and breasts.

Then just save out the hands, feet, and breasts on their own, and wear the one you need when you need it...

- that may seem excessive but it's actually a MAJOR reduction in lag over wearing it all.

Maitreya did NOT do this. They did it with the onion layers but left the hands and feet in.

Since the parts are named, someone with a little scripting knowledge can actually make a working HUD for the 'fixed' body. It likely won't be that complicated. And we could write that HUD to work with a body that had the hands and feet still in. Or at least had the hands still in.

 

It's kind of insane that they put the body out in such a bad default state... And it starts to become a question of "is it worth it to fix this?"

Maybe I got spoiled by how massive of an upgrade the Maitreya V5 was - they went through and fixed EVERYTHING and then made sure it was all fixed the RIGHT WAY... Nothing 'half done' like BOM without Mask as default. And no leaving Onion layers that are obsolete due to BOM - though they kept them as separate items you could wear in case your old Omega item didn't have a new BOM version.

The ONLY think Maitreya did wrong was not give us a Mod copy...
- which feels like the ONLY thing that was right about Belleza V6...

Thankfully that's an item so major it lets us fix the other issues. But I'm not concerned about me, I'm concerned about the crowds of people that don't know how to mod these things.

 

1 hour ago, Lewis Luminos said:

That was the problem, you never see it on yourself, only on others. You only know if someone tells you, or if you're logged in with another alt at the same time and you're watching.

38 minutes ago, s2Pandora said:

well, luckily and hopefully it's fixed now!

The handsplay bug is because the OLD hands script didn't check often to set it's value. When I made the script for my Neko tail I had the same issue, and when you look at the ancient Nixon era ZHAO AO script everyone who worships lag uses ( )... it stays working by telling you every 1 second to "hey, do this animation"... every... single... second...

For normal AOs you can avoid this, and just set your state. But there is no 'state' for hands or tails, so yeah - they have to tell you every so often to run the animation, or various other actions will stop it.

I don't know what the fix they did in the new hands script was - but I am guessing they just added a simple timer like an old-fashioned AO.

 

Edited September 2, 2021 by Pussycat Catnap

[Jenna Huntsman]

20 hours ago, Janet Voxel said:

Yes, please!

I've now completed the work to automate the simplification process.

My script will now automatically reduce your body's complexity by shedding the traditional onion layers, and optimize the body towards BoM - it also cleans up after itself!

Bonus: The body HUD works! You can use your alpha HUD, or system alphas, change your breast shape, foot shape, etc. all as if nothing had ever happened.

Marketplace link (Free!): https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Belleza-Auto-Optimizer/22630871

Edited September 2, 2021 by Jenna Huntsman
More info

[Pussycat Catnap]

5 hours ago, Karly Kiyori said:

I am also going to need to buy a third party bento hand animator.

Nope right out of that.

I may need to repurpose my tail script for this. Because that only runs a single animation, and the belleza hands needs to individually track animations for each hand - the rewrite is a little more than I thought, but not likely to be too difficult.

I really don't like that this would be needed... but it makes sense that once you mod the body scripts for it would break. That is not something I can fault Belleza for. I fault them for needing to mod the body to have it ready for 'mainstream use'.

 

Only people wanting to do 'weird things' should need to mod the body. The base default body should have been no onion layers and 'BOM at mask' already set.

Onion layers should have been separate attachments.

The BOM needing to click to turn on mask is inconvenient, but not something needing modding to fix... The onion layers is the real issue - some 60-80 pieces of mesh that should not be there on the default, as most people will never use them (most people who use a mesh body wear mesh clothes, and tattoos/makeup have rapidly embraced BOM - thus the 'HD faces' and such have shifted to 'spot onion' that only cover part of the face rather than a whole wrapper sometimes combined with new UV maps that make the key parts larger textures).

 

I would then argue it should have had only 1 of the breast sizes with the other 2 as options to wear - but that can be debated as now that I look it's a lower lag impact than I used to believe.

 

 

 

Edited September 2, 2021 by Pussycat Catnap

[Janet Voxel]

1 hour ago, Jenna Huntsman said:

I've now completed the work to automate the simplification process.

My script will now automatically reduce your body's complexity by shedding the traditional onion layers, and optimize the body towards BoM.

Bonus: The body HUD works! You can use your alpha HUD, or system alphas, change your breast shape, foot shape, etc. all as if nothing had ever happened.

Marketplace link (Free!): https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Belleza-Auto-Optimizer/22630871

Thank you!

[Lillith Hapmouche]

And once again, a third party add-on saves the day...

[s2Pandora]

@Jenna Huntsman Thank you~

Are we still suppose to see the invisible layers attached after using that script? They're still there for me, so I have no idea if it's worked lol. It's also hard for me to tell anything as SL seems to be giving me different numbers every time I put anything on or take anything off.

[Jenna Huntsman]

13 minutes ago, s2Pandora said:

@Jenna Huntsman Thank you~

Are we still suppose to see the invisible layers attached after using that script? They're still there for me, so I have no idea if it's worked lol. It's also hard for me to tell anything as SL seems to be giving me different numbers every time I put anything on or take anything off.

There will be some layers left over, as these are parts which change your foot shape, breast shape, HD nipple, etc. There are some parts which cannot be optimized (e.g. the hands) as the onion layers are incorporated into the mesh itself.

You'll know if the script worked, as after it completes it's work, it will tell you that 'Your body is now optimized'. The name of the body will also have changed to (Opt)[bodyname] to indicate that the mesh has been optimized.

[Pussycat Catnap]

2 hours ago, Jenna Huntsman said:

There will be some layers left over, as these are parts which change your foot shape, breast shape, HD nipple, etc.

Looks like I'll have to write another script to complete the job then, I see yours is not mod so I can't just edit it?

 

[Jenna Huntsman]

34 minutes ago, Pussycat Catnap said:

Looks like I'll have to write another script to complete the job then, I see yours is not mod so I can't just edit it?

 

You're welcome to do so.

The main reason I stopped where I did was to preserve features that I know for a fact people do make use of, and to make sure the body HUD continued to work as expected. I did play around with removing more components, but the HUD would often break after doing so (YMMV).

The components (layers*) left are as follows:

• Breast shapes - normal, perky and push up (You must leave one, otherwise you'll have no chest!)
• Foot shapes - all heights. Left to preserve compatibility with heeled shoes, as a lot of people live in heels on SL. (Why has no one actually made use of the Bento bones for feet yet! 😢)
• Foot adapters - BellezaFit & SlinkFit - Left to preserve compatibility with Slink feet, as the Belleza feet UVs do not align well at all.
• Arm adapters - BellezaFit & SlinkFit - Left to preserve compatibility with Slink hands. May be a solution to those experiencing the 'splayed hands' issue.
• Neck sizes - all sizes. Preserves compatibility with non-SLNeck compatible heads.

*I realized that using layers to describe core body parts was a poor move on my part. Now referring to them as 'components'

Edited September 3, 2021 by Jenna Huntsman
adding the asterisk

[Pussycat Catnap]

20 minutes ago, Jenna Huntsman said:

You're welcome to do so.

The main reason I stopped where I did was to preserve features that I know for a fact people do make use of, and to make sure the body HUD continued to work as expected. I did play around with removing more components, but the HUD would often break after doing so (YMMV).

 

Perhaps that's it then. I noticed one onion layer on the thighs (or was this an arm?) was still there.

Yesterday when I tested resetting the scripts, I did it with a body I may have unlinked in the wrong order, or it may have been from removing one too many links...

It looks like your script is working through a list going one by one unlinking parts, correct?

 

Edited September 3, 2021 by Pussycat Catnap

[Jenna Huntsman]

17 minutes ago, Pussycat Catnap said:

 

Perhaps that's it then. I noticed one onion layer on the thighs (or was this an arm?) was still there.

Yesterday when I tested resetting the scripts, I did it with a body I may have unlinked in the wrong order, or it may have been from removing one too many links...

It looks like your script is working through a list going one by one unlinking parts, correct?

 

I've just looked over the script now - that's a bug. I've now patched the script, and will roll it out later today. (Redelivery will come to you automatically via Caspervend). I've also implemented a scripthook which tells any other interested script that my script has finished it's work. (see instructions in package)

 

Correct - the script actually generates 2 lists, one of parts to keep, the other of parts to delete. The parts to keep list is never used, but is there in the event that a future scripthook could request that list to assist in whatever that script wants to do.

Edited September 3, 2021 by Jenna Huntsman

[Fenimore Hapmouche]

@Jenna Huntsman You are awesome for doing this and making it available freely to all of us! Thank you!

Everyone, it's so cool to see this cooperation. I am just a simple user and I'd never tackle these mods myself and consequently carry the extra load forever. I never used those layers even once.

[Pussycat Catnap]

3 hours ago, Fenimore Hapmouche said:

@Jenna Huntsman You are awesome for doing this and making it available freely to all of us! Thank you!

A comment I just left in the "rival" Erika thread. This is something I am now hopeful for:

 

Over in the furry community bodies have always been Mod. So almost every new idea in SL starts with Furries, despite them being a much smaller population. Human body users, if they see those ideas ever, see them years later.

With Belleza V6 and Erika 1.5 both now Mod, this might flip - human body users can now innovate.

@Jenna Huntsman's script is just the first example of proof of this. We're likely to start seeing a lot more new ideas now, especially if more human bodies join in.

 

[Paul Hexem]

2 hours ago, Pussycat Catnap said:

We're likely to start seeing a lot more new ideas now, especially if more human bodies join in.

I hope we see a trend develop, for sure.

Give me a mesh head that's mod so I can finally manually match the materials settings, and not rely on their buggy HUDs...

[Skell Dagger]

On 9/2/2021 at 8:33 PM, Jenna Huntsman said:

I've now completed the work to automate the simplification process.

My script will now automatically reduce your body's complexity by shedding the traditional onion layers, and optimize the body towards BoM - it also cleans up after itself!

Bonus: The body HUD works! You can use your alpha HUD, or system alphas, change your breast shape, foot shape, etc. all as if nothing had ever happened.

Marketplace link (Free!): https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Belleza-Auto-Optimizer/22630871

Thank you for this, and especially for the generosity in making it free. I've picked up a copy of it. Hopefully I should be able to get a review of Jake out soon, so I'll try out this script on the modifiable body and see if I can include it in the review.

Just a note to mention that at the bottom of your MP listing you have the following: "THIS ITEM REQUIRES THE 2021 V6 UPDATE TO BELLEZA BODIES!"

Only the three female bodies are V6. Jake's update took him to V3, so it might be prudent to edit that listing text to mention as much, otherwise some guys may wonder why their redeliveries are only giving them V3, and that could give Belleza support a few headaches.

On 9/2/2021 at 6:16 AM, Marianne Little said:

If bloggers like @Skell Daggerpost about the Belleza Jake now, it might be an uptick. Especially if the body is half price a bit longer.

I do plan on blogging it at some point, but it won't be immediate. I'm ridiculously busy IRL right now (as evidenced by the fact that this is my first forum visit in two weeks) so SL has taken a bit of a backseat. I'm sure the likes of Boston Blaisdale and NovataSL have the updates covered with their videos, though.

Edited September 3, 2021 by Skell Dagger

[Pussycat Catnap]

7 hours ago, Paul Hexem said:

I hope we see a trend develop, for sure.

Give me a mesh head that's mod so I can finally manually match the materials settings, and not rely on their buggy HUDs...

OMG Yes.

Especially because all of those HUDs never tell you or let you enter numbers.

I'm like... 'dragging this one so far to the left is... how much the same as clicking the dial of that one this much up?, is it even tweaking the same value... well, he goes another attempt followed by running through 50 windlight settings to see if it worked...'

 

 

[Lewis Luminos]

On 9/3/2021 at 10:36 PM, Paul Hexem said:

I hope we see a trend develop, for sure.

Give me a mesh head that's mod so I can finally manually match the materials settings, and not rely on their buggy HUDs...

Lightstar heads are mod. A couple of my alts have these.

Second Life Marketplace - *LightStar by Krystal Silverweb

[Karl Herber]

On 9/2/2021 at 6:56 PM, Lewis Luminos said:

I just dismantled one of the bodies and you're right about the nails, they no longer work, but the poses do (as long as you remember to keep the root prim as root).

*facepalm* that's what I forgot.

[Lokiande]

On 9/3/2021 at 4:36 PM, Paul Hexem said:

I hope we see a trend develop, for sure.

Give me a mesh head that's mod so I can finally manually match the materials settings, and not rely on their buggy HUDs...

Also the BJD Bento Heads James, Jessie and Lance, by Raven Bell are all modify!

There was also a Faun Gacha by Whisk [or was it Oakie?] that had a modifiable earless BOM human head included in the package

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/stores/101160

Edited September 6, 2021 by Lokiande

[Maitimo]

On a whim I tried the demos of the Belleza bodies and I'm sad now because I really like Venus and that's the one that has hardly any clothing for it and most clothing makers dropped it as soon as Isis came out. Also the mod for my arm doesn't work on it. If I could figure out how to make one for myself that was seamless with the body, I'd consider buying it though.

[Ajay McDowwll]

On 9/6/2021 at 3:18 AM, Maitimo said:

On a whim I tried the demos of the Belleza bodies and I'm sad now because I really like Venus and that's the one that has hardly any clothing for it and most clothing makers dropped it as soon as Isis came out. Also the mod for my arm doesn't work on it. If I could figure out how to make one for myself that was seamless with the body, I'd consider buying it though.

I absolutely love Isis, especially the shoulders... but again, no clothing support   I hate it, but I guess it is what it is.

[Lillith Hapmouche]

... go naked? 😊

Like "hitch hiking, single-handed and nudie, through SL"? "With friends", if Ajay joins in?

No?

[KKMallory]

On 8/30/2021 at 5:35 PM, Coffee Pancake said:

You are reducing the poly count .. but in this exercise, you are also cutting the number of rigged mesh objects, that's where any performance gains will come from.

More polygons = more transform & shade ops for your GPU cores to do. Granted, recent GPUs can handle a lot more geometry than they used to, but transforming, lighting, texturing, and shading two million polygons per avi isn't free.