I Will not accept Tilia

[Arduenn Schwartzman]

Things that have changed for me since I signed that Tilia agreement:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Amina Sopwith]

5 hours ago, Skell Dagger said:

In addition: when people who are not part of your 'debate' see you resorting to ad-hominem attacks such as -

6 hours ago, DemonicSage said:

you uneducated being

and patronising sarcasm such as -

6 hours ago, DemonicSage said:

Prove me wrong then child 

then those 'outside-the-debate' people see that you are already on the back foot in said 'debate' and that you most likely are only a few steps away from Godwin.

Actually, my biggest objection is how rubbish, boring, unfunny and lazy those insults are. Come on, man. Make me laugh. Think a bit. Look to my current government for inspiration. 

[Lyssa Greymoon]

7 hours ago, DemonicSage said:

i can def say they will lose an estimation of 60% of the populous in matter of days by denying the service. R.I.P Second Life  Year 2020

How do you come to that conclusion?

[bigmoe Whitfield]

52 minutes ago, Lyssa Greymoon said:

How do you come to that conclusion?

Always some one dooming and glooming,  been that way even since I joined in 2007.   The sky it falls when LL has to make a change.

[Love Zhaoying]

4 hours ago, Arduenn Schwartzman said:

Things that have changed for me since I signed that Tilia agreement:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not sure if dark font, or nothing.

[Lyssa Greymoon]

21 minutes ago, bigmoe Whitfield said:

Always some one dooming and glooming,  been that way even since I joined in 2007.   The sky it falls when LL has to make a change.

I want to see the work behind the 60% figure. 

[Alwin Alcott]

24 minutes ago, Lyssa Greymoon said:

I want to see the work behind the 60% figure. 

Edited September 5, 2019 by Alwin Alcott

[Selene Gregoire]

9 hours ago, DemonicSage said:

 

Child? At 60? roflmnao

Read the whole thread and the one stickied. You'll soon learn you are just as wrong about Tilia being new and a threat as you are about my maturity.

Debate? Anyone who resorts immediately to name calling (child lmao) is not only not prepared for a debate, they lose the moment they start name calling. Even I know that and I was never in the debate club in high school.

They can't force users into agreeing to the Tilia ToS when that individual does not use the service. If they were to do that it would be coercion, which just happens to be illegal in the US where Linden Lab is domiciled.

In fact, in the official Tilia Q & A thread that you obviously didn't bother to read, not only was I the first person to post on the thread, I brought up the coercion issue, specifically. As you read more in that thread and educate yourself, you'll discover that LL is not requiring everyone agree to the Tilia ToS. I have yet to agree to it and the ToS went into force on August 1. Why? Because LL can not legally force us to do so in order to be able to continue logging in. 

There's your debate. Enjoy it from the spectator stands.

 

 

ETA: And just for the grins 'n' giggles, I've been in  SL since 2004. Far longer than 2012.

Edited September 5, 2019 by Selene Gregoire
Tilia with two eyes, not three

[Butch Daddy]

10 hours ago, DemonicSage said:

"If you had done the research you claim, you'd know that LL has been using Tilia FOR YEARS. "

(Show me legit proof then )

Some Updates to The Terms of Service

Entry posted by Linden Lab · July 11, 2017

We have added references to our wholly-owned subsidiaries, Tilia Inc. and Tilia Branch UK Ltd., which will be handling payment services on our behalf under certain circumstances.

 

 

[DemonicSage]

thank you jacob for the information that's what i have been waiting for. Def good information so i was right they did have a branch located in UK after all. and that their recent location in the US was actually not their main base of operations. this shed some light on a few things. thanks for taking the time. 

[Solar Legion]

Except you're not "right" as the UK location was always nothing more than a branch - meaning it was never the headquarters. Furthermore the information someone else was so kind as to present to you could have easily been found had you actually bothered to look for it.

In short, you suffer from confirmation bias. Cure yourself.

Edited September 5, 2019 by Solar Legion

[Selene Gregoire]

6 minutes ago, DemonicSage said:

thank you jacob for the information that's what i have been waiting for. Def good information so i was right they did have a branch located in UK after all. and that their recent location in the US was actually not their main base of operations. this shed some light on a few things. thanks for taking the time. 

I take it this means you don't have what it takes to apologize, much less not be too lazy to do the research for yourself so you have to coerce others into doing it for you when the paper trail is a mile long. 

[Solar Legion]

2 minutes ago, Selene Gregoire said:

I take it this means you don't have what it takes to apologize, much less not be too lazy to do the research for yourself so you have to coerce others into doing it for you when the paper trail is a mile long. 

Not even a mile long .... A very basic Google or even DuckDuckGo search would have returned the same information.

[Selene Gregoire]

10 minutes ago, Solar Legion said:

Not even a mile long .... A very basic Google or even DuckDuckGo search would have returned the same information.

I was referring to the mile long thread. 

 

[Solar Legion]

Just now, Selene Gregoire said:

I was referring to the mile long thread. 

 

Ah, yeah the thread itself has been going for a while it seems.

[Butch Daddy]

23 hours ago, DemonicSage said:

thank you jacob for the information that's what i have been waiting for. Def good information so i was right they did have a branch located in UK after all. and that their recent location in the US was actually not their main base of operations. this shed some light on a few things. thanks for taking the time. 

I want some of whatever it is that you are smoking. 

Recent? Second Life just celebrated its 16th Birthday. Which means it was created in 2003.   2019 - 16 = 2003

Tilia appears to have been created around 2 years ago.   2019 - 2017 = 2

This means that Second Life / Linden Labs has been in existence in the US for at least 14 years before Tilia was created.  

Even Google Maps Street view shows that they have had the same office location in San Francisco as far back as 2009 and probably before that too. A location that has existed for at least 10 years is in no way more recent than a branch location created around 2 years ago. 

So there is no way, in any stretch of the imagination, that the US location is "recent" compared to any branch they have in the UK.  The only way you could come to that conclusion is if you are smoking something. 

So, I say again, share it, because I definitely want some of whatever it is you are smoking.

[Drake1 Nightfire]

5 hours ago, Jacob Cagney said:

I want some of whatever it is that you are smoking. 

Recent? Second Life just celebrated its 16th Birthday. Which means it was created in 2003.   2019 - 16 = 2003

Tilia appears to have been created around 2 years ago.   2019 - 2017 = 2

This means that Second Life / Linden Labs has been in existence in the US for at least 14 years before Tilia was created.  

Even Google Maps Street view shows that they have had the same office location in San Francisco as far back as 2009 and probably before that too. A location that has existed for at least 10 years is in no way more recent than a branch location created around 2 years ago. 

So there is no way, in any stretch of the imagination, that the US location is "recent" compared to any branch they have in the UK.  The only way you could come to that conclusion is if you are smoking something. 

So, I say again, share it, because I definitely want some of whatever it is you are smoking.

He means the  Tilla branch is recent... Not LL... 

[Soft Linden]

On 9/5/2019 at 2:49 AM, Arduenn Schwartzman said:

Things that have changed for me since I signed that Tilia agreement:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I laughed. But this is largely true.

In the short term, Tilia is merely us formalizing an internal segmentation that already existed. The additional paperwork around cashouts is stuff that was coming whether we put a new name on the group or not. We can't control what regulators require of us.

In the long term, we want to undertake some significant projects in the payments and security space which will be expensive to implement. Income from SL alone wouldn't pay for these projects without our absorbing some big losses. To address this, we aim to offer Tilia services to additional companies. This will help us distribute many of the costs of projects and services across more companies. In turn, these additional projects will benefit all Tilia customers, including SL.

Beyond that, the separate business entity also saves a lot of hair pulling for the legal and finance teams. Take a little trip with me...

Imagine sitting down with a team of external regulatory representatives. They're used to talking to a category of businesses that all look nearly identical. Dollars in, dollars out. They like it that way. It's simple. They do yearly audits, make sure everything the business does follows the most boring format possible. Again, boring and predictable makes them happy. You've never seen so much tweed. You'll never see so many flip phones used unironically. One guy on the external team just got Angry Birds. That's Bill. Bill is the cool guy, but the rest of the team is a little skeptical about Bill. Bill's phone doesn't even flip, and that seems kind of edgy.

This whole group gets paid by the hour, and in many cases you get to foot the cost of both sides of these engagements. Multiply this by a bunch of states and countries. The way the world is changing, soon it will be nearly all 50 states with different groups of tweed people, and half again as many for countries overseas. Never bet against bureaucracy.

You get the picture. This is expensive, frustrating, and time consuming, right?

It's worse than you think. Because now imagine that you aren't just explaining the US$ pages. Imagine that you have to take a detour through explaining all of Second Life, Sansar, and Blocksworld. Bill's got all kinds of questions about furries, and it's making the rest of his team anxious. Nobody's sure which checkbox applies to what anymore. Questions about flexi hair have people confused even though the audit has nothing to do with how that half of the company works. Every time. Multiply that by all those states and countries.

You can probably imagine that these teams were more than a little happy when we wanted to spin off Tilia for the business customer reason. They'll never again have to explain Ruthing, or why you've still got that emotional attachment to your prim hair.

[Beth Macbain]

8 minutes ago, Soft Linden said:

Bill's got all kinds of questions about furries, and it's making the rest of his team anxious. 

Bill went straight home and made an account so he could live out his furry fantasies... 

[Selene Gregoire]

9 minutes ago, Soft Linden said:

I laughed. But this is largely true.

In the short term, Tilia is merely us formalizing an internal segmentation that already existed.

In the long term, we want to undertake some significant projects in the payments and security space which will be expensive to implement. Income from SL alone wouldn't pay for these projects without our absorbing some big losses. To address this, we aim to offer Tilia services to additional companies. This will help us distribute many of the costs of projects and services across more companies. In turn, these additional projects will benefit all Tilia customers, including SL.

Beyond that, the separate business entity also saves a lot of hair pulling for the legal and finance teams. Take a little trip with me...

Imagine sitting down with a team of external regulatory representatives. They're used to talking to a category of businesses that all look nearly identical. Dollars in, dollars out. They like it that way. It's simple. They do yearly audits, make sure everything the business does follows the most boring format possible. Again, boring and predictable makes them happy. You've never seen so much tweed. You'll never see so many flip phones used unironically. One guy on the external team just got Angry Birds. That's Bill. Bill is the cool guy, but the rest of the team is a little skeptical about Bill. Bill's phone doesn't even flip, and that seems kind of edgy.

This whole group gets paid by the hour, and in many cases you get to foot the cost of both sides of these engagements. Multiply this by a bunch of states and countries. The way the world is changing, soon it will be nearly all 50 states with different groups of tweed people, and half again as many for countries overseas. Never bet against bureaucracy.

You get the picture. This is expensive, frustrating, and time consuming, right?

It's worse than you think. Because now imagine that you aren't just explaining the US$ pages. Imagine that you have to take a detour through explaining all of Second Life, Sansar, and Blocksworld. Bill's got all kinds of questions about furries, and it's making the rest of his team anxious. Nobody's sure which checkbox applies to what anymore. Questions about flexi hair have people confused even though the audit has nothing to do with how that half of the company works. Every time. Multiply that by all those states and countries.

You can probably imagine that these teams were more than a little happy when we wanted to spin off Tilia for the business customer reason. They'll never again have to explain Ruthing, or why you've still got that emotional attachment to your prim hair.

This is why you need people like me. Bookkeepers and accountants. Bookkeepers, because we do all the grunt work. Accountants, because they put it all together in a neat little pile for the IRS. Something a bookkeeper can do (and does) but accountants act as a double check system for accuracy and compliance. 

[Soft Linden]

16 minutes ago, Selene Gregoire said:

This is why you need people like me. Bookkeepers and accountants. Bookkeepers, because we do all the grunt work. Accountants, because they put it all together in a neat little pile for the IRS. Something a bookkeeper can do (and does) but accountants act as a double check system for accuracy and compliance. 

I didn't want to guess wrong on your tweed jacket size.

But no, we're in a category of business that extends well beyond the IRS. It would be wonderful if it were still that simple! I'll ask our own beloved tweed team if they'd ever consider blogging about the fun they have.

 

[Selene Gregoire]

Just now, Soft Linden said:

I didn't want to guess wrong on your tweed jacket size.

But no, we're in a category of business that extends well beyond the IRS. It would be wonderful if it were still that simple! I'll ask our own beloved tweed team if they'd ever consider blogging about the fun they have.

 

Thanks for the flip phone. I'm going to keep it glued to my ear. I love it! This is perfect for when I need to be afk or I'm busy building.