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Starting a new dance Club? You should read this.

CougEr Vultee

By CougEr Vultee,
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Tari Landar

Tari Landar

Posted
Posted

I can fix the "op removed all text" issue for folks. Fair warning...it's a rough read .

I am quoting it in it's entirety, so I shall place it in quotes..then people will know why my TTS threw a "hell no" at me. I really am the last person that would judge long winded posts, I don't do so willy nilly ;) 

"

What's more precious than years of experience on SL...? Well I think I qualify  as a very experienced  Avatar . I've been on sl  for the past 10 years,  on and off..  During that time I got into what most people do on SL,  chasing music, dance clubs,  Djs,  and people directly associated with this scene. Well, I was a DJ both in RL and on the internet before I joined SL,  so it was only natural that I would bring my skills here.  I did well, I was given a job at Dance Island immediately and started to perform there regular sessions to crowds of up to 70 people often enough. As the nature of the beast dictates  I ended up with this need to express myself more, and started my own club.  I learnt to build and made my first "box" with lights, a DJ box and some dance animations.  This soon escalated  to a bigger parcel, then two parcels,  then a quarter sim and then eventually I bought a full region from Linden Lab and called it IBIZA EIWISSA.   Boom!  The place  exploded and so did my staff to manage everything. I started to see my bank account  slowly going  down,  spending on average almost 1000 US Dollars  per month, insane I know but I had a successful club, actually it was clubs, as it was more than one on the island.  Just as everything was going okay  Real Life  kicked-in BIG time!  I found myself  abandoning everything from one day to the next, and  gave up on SL  for  mmm.. about 5  years. I started to slowly come back with short visits to say hello to old friends and eventually, about 8 months ago I decided to make a full come back and to the DJ and clubbing scene. Again I repeated the same  process, started to play from my land, then opened up a event club and here I am with a full sim again. Needless to say that things in the SL community have changed drastically. Gone are those numbers of people that would come to the club and  in fact the figures have been  halved  and  then halved  again.  The lag on sl has become  unbearable and with the new mesh advent people now walk around with such complex avatar that often you can't even see them, if  not for a green  blob. But the most significant change that I have noticed, and on this I know I have a general consent,  is the people. The SL society at large seams to be made  for the majority by highly unstable people that will never admit that they are roleplaying some kind of a life, and with such strong negative  emotions that breathe  jealousy,  spite, anger and malicious intent. One would think the only way to find some cover from all that is to take  refuge in old established clubs, where there are still people that I can claim to say I've known for  10 years or so..  WRONG!  Those are principally the most established clubs, I'm talking about Dance Island, Energy, Woods.  all clubs that if I am not banned I know I am not really welcome to neither  play as a DJ  or just visit. I am banned at Dance Island since two years ago and when I asked Dietrich, a good old friend, she didn't even want to speak or tell me why. pff, as they say...  Energy I saw that place before it open to the public, I supported it for years and a few months ago I even managed to become close buddy with the owners and  played a hell of a lot of covers there as a DJ to try to help out,   Now, although I still  have Dat on my friends list I am provoked and almost insulted everytime I go there by his wife Cooky,  Why?  Because two times I had a problem with in-house stream and without knowing I remained logged to it. I was asked to give up my djing and to leave the group.  WOW!!  Sure I dished out a few words to such injustice and that only made things worst. So I don't go to Energy anymore, and I'm hoping in  the new year to sort out and  put behind us those  stupid  issues. Another club that has banned me without ever giving me an explanation is The 4th. A club I loved and was going to all the time, I thought I was growing a great close friendship with the owner a Belgian Woman, only to find myself banned there too.  WOW!  Hydra, another place I devoted a lot of time, friendship and energy towards, banned me, Soho, same story,  but I was warned  about the management of that place being made of  unreasonable people and that I wouldn't last. The incident started because I refused to play as a DJ at SOHO in a  time slot when for 5 weeks in a raw and in fact still now sees the club empty, it's just a bad  bad timezone shoulder between Euro and  USA.   All this clubs are in actual fact the more established clubs on SL, and  what the owners of these clubs are failing to understand is that I too have had my clubs and my sims and I too have been under the same stress and strain that is associated with running a club but I have never banned or kicked anyone off my group or land. And trust me I've had some real assholes  to deal with.  Now the latest spitefulness comes from two DJs that lately have partnered One in particular has played for me at Hangar and getting paid 800 and more linden by me  plus his tips. Instead of  saying Thank you Snoopy, him and his new partner are spreading bad rumors to start some big drama between myself and the owner of another one of those main clubs, BOILER. Frank is the owner, a man I respect,  Im not in frquent contact with him but I have been frequenting his club almost each Friday and I've always found him politeand maybe a little  reserved which is perfectly  okay.  I do not regard any clubs competition, even if they play the same style of music as my clubs does and I think a smart intelligent "Normal person" club owner should feel the same.  Advertisement and spamming on group notice is a regular things we all do at the beginning of each gig  and playing with words is not competing, and certainly not an act of  war as it was declared to me by malicious third parties. Fortunately a quick note to that club owner should have fixed that, but for those people I have no more time, I derez them, blocked them and for me they simply do not exist anymore. Two great Techno DJs that allowed their gossiping and malicious chat have the best of them. Those two and their associate will never play my club, and although the word never seams to be a long time, that's  how it will stand, I have a very valid reason for doing this. I challenge the owners of those clubs above mentioned (except Energy) to publicly disclose their reason for being rude, abrupt, short or unreasonable to me, or offer duly made apologies.  

So if you have this  insane idea of starting your own club, consider carefully the following:

a) How much is it going to cost you in L$...?

b) Can you afford this price for as long as you really intend to keep your club open?

c) Are you ready to become a target for any asswipe to throw crap at you..?

d) Do you have any experience at running your own business both in RL or  SL?

e) With so many other clubs out there what makes you think people will favour yours...?

 

I hope this made for good reading, There are no slandering, insulting  information there, most people in the music scene and clubbing  know  their version of these stories, I only know one version the one I wrote and lived at my own expenses.

I now own a new sim, well, I rent it  but itìs the same. I have two clubs a techno club called Hangar 2 where we had some great parties each Wednesday and will continue in the new year and  REDS INTERNATIONAL, open 6 days per week and covering the USA and EURO Time zone.  Reds will open in Jan 2018.

As some of the older club owners might have noticed, I'm  still around, and  again with a sim and two clubs on it and this time with a lot more experience and I simply...  well, will not go away. Too stubborn, too rich and with waaay too much time on my hands. perhaps we should start respecting each other instead of  belittleing each other.  BTW this last I'm not very good at  (belittleing) but i can learn from  you.

Let the game  commence  again...

CougEr Vultee 

  aka Snoopy  RvG Rob 

"

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Skell Dagger
Skell Dagger

I'm not an 'agent', but here: Pro bono, too, so I've saved you some money! (By the way, it's never a good sign when your editor's notes have to be approximately eight times longer than

Pamela Galli
Pamela Galli

I used to teach second graders to use paragraphs, since no one wants to read a page with no paragraphs. It took about two minutes for them to get the idea.

Klytyna
Klytyna

Most things really... Especially chocolate. You have an inaccurate opinion of what "most people do" Ah so you DON'T have 10 years experience, just 5 years sort of spaced out a bit...

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Klytyna

Klytyna

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Tari Landar said:

I can fix the "op removed all text" issue for folks. Fair warning...it's a rough read .

I am quoting it in it's entirety, so I shall place it in quotes..then people will know why my TTS threw a "hell no" at me. I really am the last person that would judge long winded posts, I don't do so willy nilly ;)

Frankly, my retinas preferred my summary, haha... Couldn't you at least shove it in 'spoiler' tags or something? Protect the innocent forumites who might see it by accident.
 

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Callum Meriman

Callum Meriman

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Ceka Cianci said:

giphy.gif

 

Wish I could find a three person sandwich dance animation in SL!

 

Thanks also Tari for the restoration of the wall of text. TTS is quite worried by that. Mind you, I only pasted into google translate, and pressed down the speak button, very bottom left of the text box xD

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Kimmi Zehetbauer

Kimmi Zehetbauer

Posted
Posted
On 12/30/2017 at 10:46 AM, Klytyna said:

The last time I was involved in hiring an SL DJ...

He told us he would only work 1 set per week, that being the BEST set on the BEST day, and as a "Famous JaZZ DJ" he expected L$1000 appearance money AND we had to provide the Host, AND if the Host didn't make him L$2000 per set in tips, we had to replace the Host, AND if the Host of the audience which we also had to provide didn't produce the L$2000 in tips, WE had to make good the short fall.

 

I remember having someone similar approach me like that while back. Dude wanted appearance money, percentage of the club tips and a top notch host. When I mentioned I'm a sole owner and don't have any hosts and my venue is mostly handles live performers, I could heard a pin drop.  He moved on.

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mehllama

mehllama

Posted
Posted
On 1/1/2018 at 8:38 PM, Callum Meriman said:

/me imagines .... "Oh la la I love this DJ" gestures followed by a round of spank spamming from their Host HUD.

 

On 1/2/2018 at 2:37 AM, Alwin Alcott said:

you forget the Linden Love .... :)

Or just the host that waltzes in 20 minutes late with "oh, I'm here!" to collect their tips after you've sent all of their notices for them and then badmouths your club to all their friends, which never seemed to make any sense to me. I mean, don't these people realize that their tips are directly connected to attendance? 

I actually had a manager working for me who had her friend as our DJ and her gf as our host for a set. The host walks in an hour late and says, "Oh, I was watching Netflix" and then she and my manager started in on me when I dared question her highness for showing up an hour late. But that ended up being kind of fun for me. As they were both ranting in my IMs, I lined up the groups they were in and highlighted them both on my radar and then rapid-fire ejected and banned them from the groups and the land and blocked them. It was one of the most rewarding bye Felicias I've honestly ever done.

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Lewis Luminos

Lewis Luminos

Posted
Posted (edited)

Wow. wall of text. I did plough through most of it and it was, well, mildly entertaining. But your experience as a club owner has been very different from mine.

I've been in SL since 2008 without a break. Every week, except for vacations and that one time I got bird-flu and could hardly even get out of bed for 3 weeks. So I've seen a lot of changes.

A little over five years ago (five years and two weeks to be precise) I opened a club. And it's still going. We have on average around a dozen visitors per event, of whom the majority are return visitors. Yes, people like my club, and they keep coming back every week. I must be doing something right.

Here, I think, are the reasons for Club Noir's success.

1) We serve a specialist niche of music, specifically vintage jazz and swing from the 1930s and 1940s. Occasionally we branch out into other niches, for example jazz from other countries besides the US/UK. Or old showtunes from vintage musicals. But on the whole, we stick to what we do best. Our focus is on the music itself, not on the venue as a "romantic spot". There are very few clubs in SL catering to this niche and Club Noir is the only one that serves up events at an hour that's friendly to both European and American guests. And it's the only club in SL that's built entirely in monochrome, like an old "Film Noir" movie.  We are, quite literally, unique.

2) One event per week, at 2pm on Sundays. And that's it. I host it myself so I don't have to worry about employing hosts. It doesn't interfere with my RL schedule, it doesn't burn me out, and more importantly, it doesn't burn my guests out.  I know they have other places they want to be at other times, but that one slot a week is Club Noir's time.  And for those who do want their swing fix more often, my club has a jukebox with a stream-changer that anyone can use, so they can come and choose a stream and spend some romantic time with their partner or whoever.

3) The parcel is small, just 2048m, and the club fills half of it (the other half is an outdoor street scene ideal for photoshoots).  It doesn't need to be bigger than this. The dance-floor is carefully sized to ensure that everyone on it is within chat-range of everyone else.  The other advantage to this is that it's cheap; I don't have to stress out about whether I can afford the rent on it every month because it's about the same cost to me as a couple of pints of beer.  Sometimes I make enough in tips to cover the rent and my DJs costs, sometimes I don't. Either way, it doesn't matter. I do this because I love it, and because my guests love it, not because I want to make a profit at it.

4) No gestures, no sploders, no trivia games, no "Best In.." contests, no traffic-bots. Just real, actual, entertaining conversation with real people who love this music as much and I and my DJs do.  We're a friendly bunch and it shows in the complete lack of drama. In 5 years I've banned four people; three because of nudity and one who was stalking one of my DJs.

5) Unlike certain other well-known jazz clubs in SL, Club Noir welcomes same-sex couples, furries and other non-human avatars.  We welcome new residents and our old-timers are always happy to help anyone who needs assistance understanding how SL works. I don't mind what you are or how old your avatar is, as long as you're properly dressed and behave like a mature adult. 

6) I look after my DJs and in turn, they look after me. I pay them a set salary per event and they keep 100% of their tips. When they need to swap a shift, most of the time they can be accommodated.

The bottom line is, if you want to run a successful club in SL, you have to do something that no other club is doing, you have to love it, and you have to do it well.

When I'm tired of it, and it's no longer fun, I'll close it down and do something else. But I'm not tired of it yet.

(And yay! Paragraphs!)

 

Edited by Lewis Luminos
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Klytyna

Klytyna

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Was it harder to read than a post by Pr*k*f*?

Yes, but for different reasons... One it just long and fact free and batcrap insane ideology bodering on the religious worship of discredited pseudo-economists, the other was just a wall of un-formated text, ranting about enemy clubs and record-changers, and how they owed the poster a public apology for being mean th them by ejecting them from their enemy clubs.
 

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Love Zhaoying

Love Zhaoying

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Klytyna said:

Yes, but for different reasons... One it just long and fact free and batcrap insane ideology bodering on the religious worship of discredited pseudo-economists, the other was just a wall of un-formated text, ranting about enemy clubs and record-changers, and how they owed the poster a public apology for being mean th them by ejecting them from their enemy clubs.
 

Strangely similar! 

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Callum Meriman

Callum Meriman

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, Lewis Luminos said:

The parcel is small, just 2048m, and the club fills half of it (the other half is an outdoor street scene ideal for photoshoots).  It doesn't need to be bigger than this.

As a landlord and club owner - that's a particular bugbear of mine. If you regularly have 12 people in the region you are using 25% of the region's resources. You should be renting 25% of the region to cover that.

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lostsoul2017

lostsoul2017

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Posted
On 12/30/2017 at 12:40 PM, Tari Landar said:

Aww, but what's the fun in that :D

Though, I could have used spoiler tags...I probably should have, lmao. 

thank you so much for the repost. it was a great read.  i had to do it with 5 breaks, and highlighting the area i was going to read at a time.  my eyes really do hurt now but not as much as my heart since i wasted a part of my life that i will never get back.

wow, i've read things written by my 6 yr old that were less egotistical and whiny. the sense of entitlement runs strong in the OP.  :)

 

at least i know the name of 2 clubs i should avoid in SL.  

for someone that says he has a lot of EXP in SL, he really doesn't seem to understand that only a small portion of Sl'rs go to clubs.  i suppose if all you do is club, then it would seem to you like everyone is doing it.  i'm sure there are at least 4 people on SL that care about his rant but i am not one of them.  honestly, this reads like it was written by some high school kid.

 

i wonder if i can sue the OP to get the minutes of my life that i wasted back?  i suppose that is probably the threat that made OP delete their post and paste the new and improved "i'm going to whine since you all mocked my post for not using basic English skills".

thank you so much Tari for reposting. i really do hate missing out the fun long tirades that people post expecting sympathy.

every time i see one of these posts start, i usually have the music from Jaws playing in my head....as i start to see the forum folks start to circle once they smell the blood in the water. ;)

 

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