So what changed in the Terms of Service?

[Extrude Ragu]

1 minute ago, Theresa Ravenheart said:

Adult land is for adult activities

Many of us have adult regions we don't use as sex hostels. They often don't even have sex beds. Many regions are rated adult simply to ensure the real life participants are adult and ensure more mature participants. Don't get me wrong, sex can happen, but no more than on a moderate sim.

The age rating system up until now has been used in different ways by different people. Yes, there are sex clubs. But not every adult rated sim is a sex club.

In real life, there's a good chance there's someone having sex nearby right this moment and you don't even know about it. We don't all lose our minds. Do we all banish our children from the city?

Personally I think the whole morality crisis is a bit overblown, but America always seemed really insecure about this kind of thing, so it doesn't surprise me.

[LittleMe Jewell]

Just now, Love Zhaoying said:

18 and 19 are still teenagers.. 🙂

 

Only by "word".  In the majority of the US and other countries, folks are considered adult at the age of 18 (and in some places, a bit younger).

In the US, an 18 yr old is typically given all adult privileges except for drinking alcohol.

[Extrude Ragu]

I also think part of this issue is because TPV's letting users disable camera constraints. In the traditional SL viewer, you can't cam across a whole region. In firestorm, 200 meters away feels like next to you, because you can instantly cam across whole continents.

[Love Zhaoying]

2 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

4 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

18 and 19 are still teenagers.. 🙂

 

Only by "word".  In the majority of the US and other countries, folks are considered adult at the age of 18 (and in some places, a bit younger).

In the US, an 18 yr old is typically given all adult privileges except for drinking alcohol.

I agree.

My point when I quoted someone else above was, when they say it's ok "until someone thinks you're a teenager" - being a "teenager" isn't the issue.  It's looking "underage" (under adult age) that is the issue.

 

[Starberry Passion]

2 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Only by "word".  In the majority of the US and other countries, folks are considered adult at the age of 18 (and in some places, a bit younger).

In the US, an 18 yr old is typically given all adult privileges except for drinking alcohol.

Yep, age of consent here where I am is 16 but you are an adult at age 18. 16 is age of consent in most areas of the world and is the average national age with 18 being the adult age. 

[Theresa Ravenheart]

7 minutes ago, Extrude Ragu said:

Many of us have adult regions we don't use as sex hostels. They often don't even have sex beds. Many regions are rated adult simply to ensure the real life participants are adult and ensure more mature participants. Don't get me wrong, sex can happen, but no more than on a moderate sim.

The age rating system up until now has been used in different ways by different people. Yes, there are sex clubs. But not every adult rated sim is a sex club.

In real life, there's a good chance there's someone having sex nearby right this moment and you don't even know about it. We don't all lose our minds. Do we all banish our children from the city?

Personally I think the whole morality crisis is a bit overblown, but America always seemed really insecure about this kind of thing, so it doesn't surprise me.

My point is, if I go shopping at a M sim, I am covered and decent-ish, but I never check what I'm wearing when I go to an A sim, I go fully decked out in fetish or BDSM gear and possibly nips showing. However I read rules once I get there, but even if the purpose of the sim is not a sex club it can still freely happen depending on that sims rules. And sex has to be in private on a M sim, behind closed doors, on adult sims we can get freaky in the streets, in public if we want to, again depending on that sim's rules. 

And in real life, they are behind closed doors, behind the privacy of their home, and if they aren't there is a chance that they can get arrested; I don't see how this is different. If they expose themselves and have sex when children are around they will face serious jail time. 

Edited May 3 by Theresa Ravenheart

[Vivienne Schell]

4 minutes ago, Extrude Ragu said:

In real life, there's a good chance there's someone having sex nearby right this moment and you don't even know about it. We don't all lose our minds. Do we all banish our children from the city?

In RL one cannot zoom into someone´s bedroom. From miles away. Also, in RL quite a lot of creeps doing the same creepy things they do in SL would be banned from RL by some judge. Especially in regards to creepy child things.

[Ceka Cianci]

8 minutes ago, Extrude Ragu said:

Many of us have adult regions we don't use as sex hostels. They often don't even have sex beds. Many regions are rated adult simply to ensure the real life participants are adult and ensure more mature participants. Don't get me wrong, sex can happen, but no more than on a moderate sim.

The age rating system up until now has been used in different ways by different people. Yes, there are sex clubs. But not every adult rated sim is a sex club.

In real life, there's a good chance there's someone having sex nearby right this moment and you don't even know about it. We don't all lose our minds. Do we all banish our children from the city?

Personally I think the whole morality crisis is a bit overblown, but America always seemed really insecure about this kind of thing, so it doesn't surprise me.

Now why'd you have to make it seem like an America thing, when there are more stricter rules about this on the other side of the pond?

We were having such a nice day too!! \o/

hehehe

[Monika Skydancer]

37 minutes ago, Leslie Trihey said:

Wishful thinking on your part sure. Fact is if you don't look like a 7 foot tall Kupra Karen your walking on thin ice.

Eh no. My avi's 5 feet 5, slim & petite. Nobody ever takes me for a kid cause I got ink, I wear adult clothes & I talk like an adult.

[Starberry Passion]

4 minutes ago, Theresa Ravenheart said:

My point is, if I go shopping at a M sim, I am covered and decent-ish, but I never check what I'm wearing when I go to an A sim, I go fully decked out in fetish or BDSM gear and possibly nips showing. However I read rules once I get there, but even if the purpose of the sim is not a sex club it can still freely happen depending on that sims rules. And sex has to be in private on a M sim, behind closed doors, on adult sims we can get freaky in the streets, in public if we want to, again depending on that sim's rules. 

And in real life, they are behind closed doors, behind the privacy of their home, and if they aren't there is a chance that they can get arrested; I don't see how this is different. If they expose themselves and have sex when children are around they will face serious jail time. 

There are places, irl, that are public that you can do that and not get arrested. Like in Brazil, I believe, af night you can do all of that in public and not be charged. Then you have places where adult sex work is legal.

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

6 minutes ago, Extrude Ragu said:

Personally I think the whole morality crisis is a bit overblown, but America always seemed really insecure about this kind of thing, so it doesn't surprise me.

Not sure where you're from but I live in a country where we take steps to keep kids safe. The problem with online spaces is that once a behavior is allowed to flourish anonymously for years, it is seen as normal within those communities. Until reality comes knocking. 

[Starberry Passion]

1 minute ago, Monika Skydancer said:

Eh no. My avi's 5 feet 5, slim & petite. Nobody ever takes me for a kid cause I got ink, I wear adult clothes & I talk like an adult.

Yeah, I've walked around at 5'0" and no one said I was a child unless they were a 7'0"+ monstrosity that was a Karen. Which that has not been many.

[Innula Zenovka]

1 minute ago, Extrude Ragu said:

Many of us have adult regions we don't use as sex hostels. They often don't even have sex beds. Many regions are rated adult simply to ensure the real life participants are adult and ensure more mature participants. Don't get me wrong, sex can happen, but no more than on a moderate sim.

The age rating system up until now has been used in different ways by different people. Yes, there are sex clubs. But not every adult rated sim is a sex club.

In real life, there's a good chance there's someone having sex nearby right this moment and you don't even know about it. We don't all lose our minds. Do we all banish our children from the city?

Personally I think the whole morality crisis is a bit overblown, but America always seemed really insecure about this kind of thing, so it doesn't surprise me.

People using SL to create scenes of virtual child sexual abuse is clearly a large reputational risk to Linden Lab, so it seems to me only prudent of the Lab to ensure it's able to say "We've taken all reasonable steps to prevent this kind of thing, while still enabling people to role-play as children if that's what they want to do."     Banning child avs from Adult land is clearly a step in that direction.

It also helps people who run adult venues, because in the past they've had to worry about taking steps to prevent avatars who clearly represent children from using their sex furniture (this is one reason why people use annoying scripted nonsenses to exclude avatars based on height).   That's not now such a concern, because avatars representing children will be risking a permaban by being on the same region as the club, let alone standing too close to the furniture.  

Furthermore I would imagine LL have also considered the likely effect on retention of having new users who've decided to try SL because they've heard it's a place to have virtual sex going to an Adult region looking for fun and running into child avatars when they get there. 

[Kathlen Onyx]

10 hours ago, Denim Robonaught said:

And then we fall in that good old axiom where decisions are made of which RP is acceptable and which is not.

Well, that is exactly WHY this had to be done. People obviously were not making acceptable decisions on what RP is allowed.

There is absolutely no reason at all to HAVE to RP anything that involves having no clothes on. A bath you can take with a swimsuit on. There is no need at all to have to be naked.  Is it realistic? No, but RP isn't real ,that is why it's called RP. You don't have to RP every single second of the day. Skip the baths or put swim trunks on. 

Even actors wear swimsuits or covering on their bodies when doing movies.  Do you think that all actors are actually naked when acting. They are not and it doesn't need to be done in SL either.

[Arielle Popstar]

14 minutes ago, Leslie Trihey said:

 

It's all fine until someone decides that you look like a teenager. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Or decides adult anime avatars look to young. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Or that you haven't paid enough attention to them or put out so they AR  because we could be seen as under 18. Not safe anymore.

[brodiac90]

Trying to think positively, I hope that people will treat child avis better now that the rules are clearer and that people don't feel so threatened. 

[Extrude Ragu]

2 minutes ago, Ceka Cianci said:

Now why'd you have to make it seem like an America thing, when there are more stricter rules about this on the other side of the pond?

We were having such a nice day too!! \o/

hehehe

True, here in the UK we are also very insecure about the sexual nature of the human body. We even go so far as to forbid videography of the female orgasm.

I guess I habitually say America because it is where LL is based along with the majority of its residents. But yes you are right.

[Ceka Cianci]

2 minutes ago, Extrude Ragu said:

True, here in the UK we are also very insecure about the sexual nature of the human body. We even go so far as to forbid videography of the female orgasm.

I guess I habitually say America because it is where LL is based along with the majority of its residents. But yes you are right.

I was just giving you a hard time..

I get playful like that a lot.. hehehe

ETA: I mean giving people a hard time playful.. Not the playful that the rules are about..  LOL

Edited May 3 by Ceka Cianci

[Arielle Popstar]

1 minute ago, brodiac90 said:

Trying to think positively, I hope that people will treat child avis better now that the rules are clearer and that people don't feel so threatened. 

From the heightened awareness of child avi's, I feel it is going to get worse with false AR's so I stepped out of SL during the witch hunting. But then I don't run any inworld business so it was easy to do.

[Vivienne Schell]

3 minutes ago, brodiac90 said:

Trying to think positively, I hope that people will treat child avis better now that the rules are clearer and that people don't feel so threatened. 

Other way around. The vast majority of the age player community is not known for acting respectful.

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

2 minutes ago, Kathlen Onyx said:

Well, that is exactly WHY this had to be done. People obviously were not making acceptable decisions on what RP is allowed.

Sometimes you have to spell ot out for people. Which is sad but human nature can lead us down some pretty twisted rabbit holes. 

[Leslie Trihey]

2 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

I agree.

My point when I quoted someone else above was, when they say it's ok "until someone thinks you're a teenager" - being a "teenager" isn't the issue.  It's looking "underage" (under adult age) that is the issue.

 

The problem is anyone can decide that you look "underage" and decide to ruin your day for a number of factors. From clothing, to make up, to heads, to avatar shape can effect this. I put on a goth dommy outfit and makeup one moment, then I go for kawaii aesthetic the next and all the sudden I look "underage" because of a blush layer that makes my cheeks look bigger and make up that accentuates my eyes. 

 

People say "Oh I can spot *insert type here* a mile away", to which I say: sure if they are blatantly a child avatar. But we all know this is a can of worms.

[Kathlen Onyx]

6 minutes ago, brodiac90 said:

Trying to think positively, I hope that people will treat child avis better now that the rules are clearer and that people don't feel so threatened. 

I actually think it will stay about the same. The people who think child avi's should not be on SL are not going to change their mind because they are wearing a modesty layer.  

There is always an uproar when changes to a platform or game are done.  Play any MMO and go to their discord on patch day.  Eventually it dies down till the next big change happens.

 

[Vanity Fair]

11 hours ago, Kathlen Onyx said:

I am pretty sure that their is way to know if a child avi is in compliance.  In open sim when Athena was believed to be a copybot body of Maitrya (I may have this info wrong) there were certain grids that a pop up came up that said you were not allowed to wear Athena on this grid. You will be disconnected from the grid. Come back after you remove Athena.  Point being that if you are not in compliance a warning message should be given.

Again, I am sure I got some info jumbled but that was the gist of it. @Arielle Popstar probably has the correct info.

Yes, I wrote about copybotted content on some OpenSim grids on my blog in the past, and I believe that the creator of Maitreya Lara mesh body already knows about the Athena knockoff version, and doesn't want the hassle of trying to police copybotted content on OpenSim (which would be a full-time job).

However, you raise an interesting point: that LL could potentially actively check for—and ban—content which clearly goes against the recent updates to the ToS.

[Katherine Heartsong]

35 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Just don't be naked.

And/or don't be on A-rated land either.