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Infrastructure Investment Update: Buy/Sell Fee Change and Land Pricing Effective Mar 6, 2023 DISCUSSION

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Paul Hexem
Paul Hexem

So the reaction to people asking for reasonable land prices is to charge them more in small fees, mess with the economy, generate a ton of bad will, all while giving two different forms of discount to

Coffee Pancake
Coffee Pancake

Every individual creator I know is on the poverty line. Every single one.   People are breaking themselves to keep this place afloat. Let that sink in LL.

Coffee Pancake
Coffee Pancake

And there goes the economy.  

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Love Zhaoying

Love Zhaoying

Posted
Posted (edited)
42 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:
Quote
  • Increasing the buy fee to 10% with a minimum fee of $1.49 and a maximum fee of $14.99USD per transaction
  • Increasing the sell fee to 5%

 

And there goes the economy.

People like me who aren't "directly" impacted, will wonder where the merchants all went, and everyone else..

But then again, at least the merchants can pay for 1 Region of Tier, without paying any cash-out fees, if they sell enough stuff to do that.

So, if the larger merchants only have 1 Region, then..they'll be OK so long as they don't want to cash out.

Edited by Love Zhaoying
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Ceka Cianci

Ceka Cianci

Posted
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4 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

TBH, $20/mo less per Region will make a lot of people happy!

Possibly not as many people who will be made unhappy by the L$ fee changes.

But, maybe more people will buy Regions!

It's a confusing game of maths.

 

It's probably just one thing covering the cost to be able to do the other.. Kinda like taxes paying for something.. hehehehe

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Orwar

Orwar

Posted
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4 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

TBH, $20/mo less per Region will make a lot of people happy!

   If you're a land baron with a dozen or more regions with no intention of lowering the rent for the increased strain on the majority of your tenants' means of acquiring L$ to pay to you - sure! 

   If you're a mere mortal who can't quite understand why a virtual region costs as much as the rent for your first apartment, $20 this way or that probably won't make you consider becoming a large scale virtual land owner. I'd think. 

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Coffee Pancake

Coffee Pancake

Posted
Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

TBH, $20/mo less per Region will make a lot of people happy!

Possibly not as many people who will be made unhappy by the L$ fee changes.

But, maybe more people will buy Regions!

Iono .. "cheap land" does not a virtual world make. See Opensim. I can't afford $209 a month on a region here any more than I could afford $229, but I can tell you want I wont be doing .. buying and burning L$ and friends have stated the same .. 

I've already seen income in SL drop to the point I don't bother cashing out anymore.

Edited by Coffee Pancake
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ST33LDI9ITAL

ST33LDI9ITAL

Posted
Posted (edited)

Translates to: "Hey folks, our sales and retention of land and specifically full regions have gone down. So, now we are going to charge everyone more for lindens to make up for it!" Land prices are already robbery, so no surprise there. $210 for a region? Tell us this, how many regions run on that 1 server? How much is that server? Anyone that has a clue about online hosting and cloud services knows it's a ripoff. For every two people paying $200/mo for some virtual pixels on a server instance you are able to get another server from that. Any decent server should be able to run at minimum at least 2 to 3 regions. (Being very conservative here) Amazon's services are actually quite reasonable and I know that you should be getting more than 1 region per instance and 1 instance doesn't even cost that. So, here we are.

Can you even imagine the trouble SL would be in if the land whales decided to pull out all a sudden? Is that what we are trying to do with this? Appease the land barons? Were some of them starting to get a lil finicky?

This may help you in the short term.. but ultimately I believe it's a bad move. People aren't going to like this.

You want to encourage land ownership? Really? Make ownership of both land and regions require membership. Slash prices in half across the board for land/regions. Increase tier plot sizes. Put in mainland ownership limits per account (say regular account can own up to half region and prem plus can go up to full sim or two size worth of land) but don't limit private regions. Then sit back and watch what happens. Yes, you will need multiple premium accounts if you want to be a land whale. Because if you cut the prices in half... people would actually be interested then! And could actually retain them long term. Imagine that... if there were actual demand for all the supply!? Supply that is literally just sitting there and wasting resources currently. Resources wasting that still cost upkeep...

On the good side, it's about time people can pay for their land with lindens. That should have been a thing since day 1 of lindens and land ownership tbh.
Oops! Spoke too soon.. sigh. Only pay for private region. Rip.

Edited by ST33LDI9ITAL
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steeljane42

steeljane42

Posted
Posted (edited)
53 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

But then again, at least the merchants can pay for 1 Region of Tier, without paying any cash-out fees, if they sell enough stuff to do that.

They can/could do that anyway, you don't need to cash out to pay the tier or any other USD-only services (premium tiers, name change, region moving/ region's name change). Selling L$ and using USD's balance for it has been a thing for ages. Unless you meant the sell fee in the first place.

But unless a merchant will/does utilize the premium plus' free textures uploading perk fully it's still cheaper to just sell 61k worth of L$ (assuming full 20k region) with a 5% fee, than pay ~8kL$ for a premium plus (assuming montly plan, if annual, then it's around 6k L$ a month)  to access this perk. If they already have it, then yeah, it's extra ~2.8k saving.

---

As for the changes, I suppose I'll save a bit with that change. Buy fee was 7.5% I believe, so it's 2.5% increase with a cap of 14.99$ (it was 9.99 if I'm not wrong on that either). Assuming buying 50k L$/month on average (in one transaction) it'll be 5$ more now, but 20$ less for a region.

Some math can be off, it has been a long day, but should be something around that.

34 minutes ago, Orwar said:

If you're a land baron with a dozen or more regions with no intention of lowering the rent for the increased strain on the majority of your tenants' means of acquiring L$ to pay to you - sure! 

Been a while, but the cut before the last one when I was still renting parcels (and thus bothered to check for the good options/alternatives) had most big/known land barons adjusting their prices within a few days. We'll see if they got more greedy since then or not sometime soon.

26 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

but I can tell you want I wont be doing .. buying and burning L$ and I've already had friends state the same

No one likes fee increases, but if an extra 2.5% increase makes the difference between "buying and burning" and not buying anything, then perhaps buying and burhing L$ wasn't such a good idea in the first place. It's 2.5$ extra per 100$. And in my opinion if someone has spare 100$ to spend at entertainment stuff, such as games, SL and so on, then extra 2.5$ won't make a difference for them. If they don't, which is understandable especially in the recent years with everything that's going on in the world, then they already had a way better use for those 100$.

Edited by steeljane42
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ItHadToComeToThis

ItHadToComeToThis

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, Orwar said:

   If you're a land baron with a dozen or more regions with no intention of lowering the rent for the increased strain on the majority of your tenants' means of acquiring L$ to pay to you - sure! 

   If you're a mere mortal who can't quite understand why a virtual region costs as much as the rent for your first apartment, $20 this way or that probably won't make you consider becoming a large scale virtual land owner. I'd think. 

It would have to be in the region of 150 and below before I bought one. 209 is so much better than it was but it would have to be cheaper with a cheaper setup fee, times are hard xD

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Quistess Alpha

Quistess Alpha

Posted
Posted

The more I think about this, the more it seems like "trickle down economics" or, "tax the poor and give to the oh so benevolent rich".

As has been pointed out above, it's still infeasible to own a full region unless you're a land baron or representative of an active community. L$ "taxes" will effect the cost of everything, and an increased cash out fee is going to lead to L$ price inflation.

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Quistess Alpha

Quistess Alpha

Posted
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Yes, there's no fee now for using L$ to pay tier (that's the point). But just up to 1 Region. 

Here's the fine print:

Quote

What is the L$ for Land Beta program?

The L$ for Land beta program is the trial of a system to allow Residents who own private regions to pay for their region’s maintenance fees in Linden Dollars (L$) instead of using the automated US Dollar billing system. This program is launching on March 6, 2023, and is planned to run for at least six months until September 6, 2023. Residents interested in participating in the trial of this system must be Premium Plus subscribers who own at least one private region. Please see our blog post for more information.

you have it backwards, at least one region, not up to. I.E. land barons please apply.

Edited by Quistess Alpha
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Love Zhaoying

Love Zhaoying

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, Quistess Alpha said:

Here's the fine print:

you have it backwards, at least one region, not up to. I.E. land barons please apply.

Quote from the post: 

Q: How much land can I pay for in L$? How do I pay for Land in L$?
A:  You can pay for up to one private region (some restrictions apply) in L$ as long as you maintain a Premium Plus subscription. See this article for details.

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