Your approach to SL.

[Jordyn McGregor]

1 hour ago, Amina Sopwith said:

Oh my sweet summer child.

 

I used to get called this all the time on Plurk...back in the days before I saw something shiny and wandered off from it.

[Amina Sopwith]

1 hour ago, Madelaine McMasters said:

I don't doubt your experience with Gor, but I was able to kill a tarsk with knitting needles and deliver the carcass in a U-Haul truck, to the delight and laughter of the denizens of the camp. Not everyone takes the canon seriously.

Oh, sure. And I'm not denying Akane's own reality, though she did once mention a constant "tension" between "lifestylers" and roleplayers, so I think she saw this stuff even if it didn't set off the same klaxon that it did for me. But there are enough True Goreans to drive the overall culture, which is literally founded on the belief that women are inferior and need horrible treatment. Which has to include the ones not playing there. And while it's true that not every single Gorean is a real life horrible misogynist, every Gorean is perpetuating someone who is. Indeed, quite a lot of people who are.

If you want the belly dancing slave girl thing, do it in an Arabian Nights sim. At least until the Gorean Borg descends on it.

 

[Akane Nacht]

25 minutes ago, Amina Sopwith said:

And I'm not denying Akane's own reality, though she did once mention a constant "tension" between "lifestylers" and roleplayers, so I think she saw this stuff even if it didn't set off the same klaxon that it did for me.

Kinda like the tension between para-rpers and one liners, or the tension between SL roleplayers and those who are just themselves in virtual form. We just agree to disagree and don't play with people whose playstyles are not in accordance with ours. Or find some other common ground, eg SL Gor community is an active participant in Relay for Life for many years. I had a small part in decorating one of the displays there last round, though I have not rp'd in Gor for a long while 😊

[Amina Sopwith]

2 hours ago, Akane Nacht said:

Kinda like the tension between para-rpers and one liners, or the tension between SL roleplayers and those who are just themselves in virtual form. We just agree to disagree and don't play with people whose playstyles are not in accordance with ours. Or find some other common ground, eg SL Gor community is an active participant in Relay for Life for many years. I had a small part in decorating one of the displays there last round, though I have not rp'd in Gor for a long while 😊

No, nothing like that tension. One group of people really believes a load of misogynistic screed that denounces women as subhuman, one just wants to act in a way that still perpetuates said screed (and as one can imagine, the line between the two isn't always very sharp). It's a very different kind of tension.

It's great to hear that some Goreans do charity work, though no greater than anyone else doing it. (Never heard a word about it in the months I was there.) I don't see how it makes Gor any better though, or what the connection is. I would wonder why a fine upstanding supporter of womankind would have any investment in perpetuating misogynistic screed.

 

Edited September 1, 2020 by Amina Sopwith

[Syo Emerald]

My avatar isn't human, but I'm not roleplaying a character. One of my hobbies is roleplay, but I don't do it in Second Life, as I have found my community for that elsewhere and have no incentive to seek out RP sims here. I believe good roleplay needs aware/consenting partners anyway in order to be of good quality.

This is basically "Barbies Dreamhouse and Dress up party".

[Nick0678]

It really depends on the time that i was in Second Life.

When i first joined back in 2009 my approach to Second Life was just like any other game. Kept playing for about 7-8 months.

Came back in Second Life in 2011 and my interest was towards LSL and creative aspects. Played for about 6 months.

Then in 2013 i had another look at it and this time the business aspects of it caught my attention. Second Life worked well as a minimal efforts cash machine so it became interesting enough for me to keep logging in.

When it comes to inworld personality it is mostly some form of role play. For example once i dated a woman in SL that was 63 years old,  i wouldn't date her in RL, probably i would treat her as something similar to my mother and she did have daughters same age as me. Another example is my avatar appearance, could be a well dressed humanoid at 12am and by 2pm swapped in some fantasy character or even just a tree to fool around but in RL i do care about my appearance and try to remain fit. I can be a sarcastic a$$hole or even mock SL friends who are overdramatic about their SL dog/cat/house/avatar/dating drama but in RL i do have a tendency to help people/animals even if i don't know them when they have a hard time/hungry/captured or whatever.

In most cases my inworld persona is adjusted based on what i want to do, the circumstances and how another person plays SL, i always consider it some form of RolePlay and as long as another person doesn't take it seriously, understands that we don't really know each other unless we have met RL and avatars are just avatars (that will expire someday and hopefully we all have good health until then), we have plenty of fun (until we get bored of course).

Edited September 1, 2020 by Nick0678

[Amina Sopwith]

To answer the question...I first came to SL to try out sexual roleplay. My "character" was essentially me, but me in my fantasies. So while I wasn't acting exactly the way I do in RL, I was acting the way I would have acted had I been in an RL maze dedicated to one-on-one capture roleplay (key word here, roleplay) and knowing it was all totally safe and anonymous and everyone else was doing the same thing. After I branched out into more elaborate, plot-based roleplay in other places, I created definitely fictitious characters with specific traits and back stories who were absolutely not me (some were very evil), but again, it was all in a designated roleplay setting. I did spend some time in Gor, but I think we've established that I wasn't impressed with it. 

If I'm not in a roleplay area, then I'm not roleplaying, though I probably write differently to how I speak. I suppose we are inevitably a bit different in SL because the surroundings to which we are reacting are different and frequently don't exist in RL at all, and of course we're mostly anonymous. I suppose I think of that as more a case of the nature of the stimulus; if you're not roleplaying, then you're reacting genuinely to whatever you're in contact with, and it just happens that this isn't something you'd ever come across in RL. But the lines can blur, of course.

Interesting question.

[Adamburp Adamczyk]

My SL Persona is more like the real me, than the real me actually is.

 

In RL we have a lot of pressures to conform, when I log into SL I can goof off as I wish, with my partner in crime Dicky.

 

In SL I can walk down the street in just my underpants whenever I feel like it, in RL I'm sick of trying to explain to the Judge it's just my "freedom of expression"

[Seicher Rae]

12 hours ago, RowanMinx said:

I'll be the first to admit I keep an extremely small circle of friends who view SL in much the way I do.  I'm me.  The person you would meet inworld is the same person you would meet on the street. (minus the 4 inch heels and perfect hair). My question is....do you feel your persona in SL is you or do you think of your avatar as a completely different entity.  I've only done a small.amount of RP but the personality of my character was basically me.  I'm interested to know how one can totally separate the two.  For example, people who play as something other than a basic human.  Is it possible to immerse yourself to the extent that your entire personality is different?

SL persona (and that includes the forums) is the RL persona.  And yeah, sigh, sans wardrobe, hair, makeup, being 25 forever... 

Even when I RP, I am *me* RPing. I don't see how that could be otherwise, really.  I'm the one making the RP choices. Now, in RL I'm not a bipolar, fallen angel with amnesia, but my brain still has to process that role. I do not think it is possible to immerse so deeply that the essential *you* changes. Close, yes, but not entirely.

For example, if the RL you has NO concept of right and wrong, you cannot manufacture an immersion so deep that you suddenly DO know right from wrong. You can play act it, like some very functional sociopaths do, but that's not changing the essential you.

[Seicher Rae]

10 hours ago, Jordan Whitt said:

My persona stays the same inworld, RL and here on the boards.  I'm not able to seperate myself into different personas.  

Right now I in a dark and twisty place where I have completely retreated into my shell and full on introvert mode is on in my RL and that is how I am in SL too.  I rarely talk to anyone inworld, I stay on my skypad when I am logged in and even then, it's not for long.  These boards are probably the only interactions I have with people in SL and that's kinda sad, but it's how I like it.  My trust in people has been eroded.

 

Gives the introvert's version of an empathy hug. I so understand and relate to what you wrote. People, eh?

[Seicher Rae]

9 hours ago, Moira Timmerman said:

     /me wildly swings around a pirate axe/spear weapon thingy she got as a prize on a hunt.  

Yes, Gor did bring Amina to mind.  

After I first heard about Gor, and that it was based on books, and read a few pages of one I found online ...     I was beyond words that not only did people buy the books, but had created all these RP regions based on those books...  

Gor isn't just SL RP... there is a very small segment of the RL BDSM lifetstyle that lives Gor. 

Yeah. I'm not into kink shaming (often) but... yeah, no.

[Amina Sopwith]

12 minutes ago, Seicher Rae said:

SL persona (and that includes the forums) is the RL persona.  And yeah, sigh, sans wardrobe, hair, makeup, being 25 forever... 

Even when I RP, I am *me* RPing. I don't see how that could be otherwise, really.  I'm the one making the RP choices. Now, in RL I'm not a bipolar, fallen angel with amnesia, but my brain still has to process that role. I do not think it is possible to immerse so deeply that the essential *you* changes. Close, yes, but not entirely.

For example, if the RL you has NO concept of right and wrong, you cannot manufacture an immersion so deep that you suddenly DO know right from wrong. You can play act it, like some very functional sociopaths do, but that's not changing the essential you.

PPs have already mentioned the similarity to acting. Maybe this is like when you have casting auditions and everyone is giving the same lines for the same character, but with their own personal spin on it, and the director looking for the one who can express the character in the way they most like. In that sense, maybe it's not possible to dissociate your character from yourself entirely, as I think Solar said. Many actors admit that there are roles they just can't do; they might be great at some parts but just not have enough range to do all of them.

[Ceka Cianci]

I'm about as me as it can get in SL.. I'll explore RP sims and stuff like that, but I haven't partaken in any yet..

I mean i guess i did when i used to dance back when I first got here.. but even then, it was  me just being silly with people or some  goofy thing where I took  my top off threw it behind me and it landing on guys face that walks into a table knocks over the table  which knocks over a candle that starts a fire..

Stuff like that..People really seemed to enjoy that kind of stuff.. I mean that wasn't all i did, but I just love to make people giggle and I just hate getting bored.. hehehe

[Gem Oxygen]

I role played intensively, a number of char, I took on the persona of each I played, my interpretation of who I wanted that char to be. From buying visual clothing, detailed odds n ends from the market to make my char more believable. I Googles some aspect of the personality or creature habits, studies real instants of my char, I learned how to develop who my avatar was playing, it was like a Hollywood actor but with out the huge paycheck n scripts, all my work was done on the fly with a basic understanding of the story. Sometimes it took on a whole different story, the ideas flowed and free form acting was exciting. you built the story based on what the other wrote. The story could take hours, days and even months if done right and slowly. Sometimes it took a lot out of me to play someone who I really was not, I had to step in a pretend imaginary mindset emotionally, I cried tears, my heart raced, I had to log out take a break  sometimes to calm down. I have raced home from real life work  just to open up my SL and get to my story, it was like turning off a good movie in the middle of the " GOOD part"

But like all good things, you get older in SL and things just seem all the same, and you realize those around you just don't want to role-play like the old times, people looking for instant gratifications, integrating real self's in a fantasy world, making their avatar look like their real self's, forgetting this is a virtual world and treating SL like a FB posts. Forgetting what SL was about they come into the world expecting entertainment" Log in they will come" as some Steam Game, getting bored and logging back out, not even knowing the fun here is right in front of their eyes.   I have been in SL TEN yrs, and always had stuff to do, from chatting in groups to building, exploring, riding horses, boats, motorcycles, dancing with a dragons, spoke to GOD and Satan, had deep meaningful conversations, sprayed unsuspecting  people with silly string, danced dances that would get my tossed out in a RL club.. had several SLationships, got married, had babies, it's all in front of me for the taking...more than what I ever could do in RL.

[Rowan Amore]

17 minutes ago, Seicher Rae said:

Gor isn't just SL RP... there is a very small segment of the RL BDSM lifetstyle that lives Gor. 

Yeah. I'm not into kink shaming (often) but... yeah, no.

Gor was actually the first rp community I observed when I joined and where I saw the profile from some dimwit who said he was Gor in rl.  Could be what put me off any RP.  Since I'm always me regardless of where I am, there was no way I'd be able to tolerate the abuse and not say something.  I've never understood how any woman could actually enjoy that but apparently many do.  I've seen more recently though that a lot of people just do battles/raids so maybe it's turned more into a combat rp?  

I, personally, have no problem with the shaming of any kink that treats any person as less than human.

 

 

 

 

 

[Silent Mistwalker]

8 hours ago, RowanMinx said:

Frankly, it scares the dickens out of me.  A perfect example of how some people fail to separate their SL persona and RL.

The reality is many were living the "lifestyle" long before SL even existed. It's been around almost as long as the first book. When SL first opened, many if not all of them left AW to come to SL. They're immigrants in a manner of speaking. Maybe LL should invent internet deportation and deport them all back to AW? 🤭

 

[Rowan Amore]

30 minutes ago, Amina Sopwith said:

PPs have already mentioned the similarity to acting. Maybe this is like when you have casting auditions and everyone is giving the same lines for the same character, but with their own personal spin on it, and the director looking for the one who can express the character in the way they most like. In that sense, maybe it's not possible to dissociate your character from yourself entirely, as I think Solar said. Many actors admit that there are roles they just can't do; they might be great at some parts but just not have enough range to do all of them.

Yes, I'm getting the idea that a lot of people into RP think of it as acting which I'll be the first to admit, has never appealed to me.  I didn't join SL with any expectations other than meeting and chatting with people and as I mentioned earlier, RP always seemed like too much work. 

[MelodicRain]

13 hours ago, RowanMinx said:

I'll be the first to admit I keep an extremely small circle of friends who view SL in much the way I do.  I'm me.  The person you would meet inworld is the same person you would meet on the street. (minus the 4 inch heels and perfect hair). My question is....do you feel your persona in SL is you or do you think of your avatar as a completely different entity.  I've only done a small.amount of RP but the personality of my character was basically me.  I'm interested to know how one can totally separate the two.  For example, people who play as something other than a basic human.  Is it possible to immerse yourself to the extent that your entire personality is different?

My SL is pretty much identical to my RL, aside from the appearance as you mentioned. Also like you, I have an extremely small circle of friends I don't mind sharing lots of RL details with, which I believe keeps conversations fresh. I'm not great at keeping "acquaintances" or "casual friends", they all end up getting removed at some point because they don't fit my personality. I'm also not great at making new friends cause 99% of the people I come into contact with seem to have a very rigid definition of what type of person they want to become friends with.

Edited September 1, 2020 by MelodicRain

[Amina Sopwith]

30 minutes ago, RowanMinx said:

Gor was actually the first rp community I observed when I joined and where I saw the profile from some dimwit who said he was Gor in rl.  Could be what put me off any RP.  Since I'm always me regardless of where I am, there was no way I'd be able to tolerate the abuse and not say something.  I've never understood how any woman could actually enjoy that but apparently many do.  I've seen more recently though that a lot of people just do battles/raids so maybe it's turned more into a combat rp?  

I, personally, have no problem with the shaming of any kink that treats any person as less than human.

.

Edited September 1, 2020 by Amina Sopwith

[Silent Mistwalker]

3 hours ago, Adamburp Adamczyk said:

My SL Persona is more like the real me, than the real me actually is.

 

In RL we have a lot of pressures to conform, when I log into SL I can goof off as I wish, with my partner in crime Dicky.

 

In SL I can walk down the street in just my underpants whenever I feel like it, in RL I'm sick of trying to explain to the Judge it's just my "freedom of expression"

Pics or it didn't happen. 😁

[Seicher Rae]

12 minutes ago, RowanMinx said:

Gor was actually the first rp community I observed when I joined and where I saw the profile from some dimwit who said he was Gor in rl.  Could be what put me off any RP.  Since I'm always me regardless of where I am, there was no way I'd be able to tolerate the abuse and not say something.  I've never understood how any woman could actually enjoy that but apparently many do.  I've seen more recently though that a lot of people just do battles/raids so maybe it's turned more into a combat rp?  

I, personally, have no problem with the shaming of any kink that treats any person as less than human.

I'm not gonna turn this thread into a BDSM tutorial or huge debate (I hope) but... "treats any person as less than human" can be part of a consensual kink. As can Gor, which isn't for me, which is kinda what I meant above. I don't see how RL Gor is do-able in the real world, but anyway. Not all of BDSM is about objectifying, but it is a part of it. And yeah, as I mentioned to Scylla in some other post a while back, I'd be one of those kinky types. In its place, in its context, only with my consent. And nope, disapproval of my choices doesn't shame me.

[Seicher Rae]

RE: Acting. Yep, that's how I view RP. Acting and if it is really good RP, then it is like an interactive novel. That's so rare, at least in my experience, and why I so seldom RP these days.

[LittleMe Jewell]

My SL persona is pretty much the same as my RL one.  I don't converse with folks much in either world, nor do I hang out with others much in either place.  I do converse more freely with folks in RL that I know fairly well.  Similarly, I tended to chat a bit more when I was spending lots of time at the hangout years ago with folks that also spent a lot of time there.

My forum persona is a bit more chatty than RL or SL.  Then again, maybe not if looked at from the perspective of 'talking' with people that I feel familiar and fairly comfortable with.  

Edited September 1, 2020 by LittleMe Jewell

[Amina Sopwith]

32 minutes ago, RowanMinx said:

Gor was actually the first rp community I observed when I joined and where I saw the profile from some dimwit who said he was Gor in rl.  Could be what put me off any RP.  Since I'm always me regardless of where I am, there was no way I'd be able to tolerate the abuse and not say something.  I've never understood how any woman could actually enjoy that but apparently many do.  I've seen more recently though that a lot of people just do battles/raids so maybe it's turned more into a combat rp?  

I, personally, have no problem with the shaming of any kink that treats any person as less than human.

Male domination is a kink. Reams of misogynistic hate screed are not. If Nobhead tried this with any other group of people, he'd never get 55 years in mainstream print (as in, not some hideous independent political hate press or equivalent) and an appreciative subculture.

Now to be fair, I do think that what entices most women is the costumes and the rituals. People really, really, really like those. They like them more than the sacks of manure, hamstringing, crappy hessian tunics, negging and shaved heads. The problem, though, is that even when you pick and choose the fun bits (which exist in plenty of other places), you're still perpetuating all the nasty stuff, keeping those books in print and proving to John Nobhead, in his deranged mind at least, that he's right. Especially when you're interacting with a load of True Goreans who will take it all as validation.

I personally never found a Gorean sim that was playing it for lulz with twinkly eyes and tongues in cheeks. Some took it more seriously than others, but even now, the descriptions on those sims are full of By The Book, Truly Gorean and all that. I know what By The Book means and I am seriously not impressed. The culture is driven at its heart by those who take it seriously.

Also, the books are just rubbish on an artistic level. I've seen episodes of Peppa Pig with better plots. They're not so bad they're good, they're just so bad they're bad. Stay away and do it in Arabian Nights sims. They have nicer buildings anyway.

 

ETA: Another reason to hate Gor is that when I go into detail about what men do to women in the books to make them fall madly in love with them, my comments get hidden until a moderator can see them. I'm too impatient for that so I just retry with some edits. I swear these hidden posts are not abusive to anyone except maybe John Nobhead, but I can see why the words I have to use set off the alarm. Make of that what you will.

Edited September 1, 2020 by Amina Sopwith

[Seicher Rae]

9 minutes ago, Amina Sopwith said:

Male domination is a kink. Reams of misogynistic hate screed are not. If Nobhead tried this with any other group of people, he'd never get 55 years in mainstream print (as in, not some hideous independent political hate press or equivalent) and an appreciative subculture.

Now to be fair, I do think that what entices most women is the costumes and the rituals. People really, really, really like those. They like them more than the sacks of manure, hamstringing, crappy hessian tunics, negging and shaved heads. The problem, though, is that even when you pick and choose the fun bits (which exist in plenty of other places), you're still perpetuating all the nasty stuff, keeping those books in print and proving to John Nobhead, in his deranged mind at least, that he's right. 

I personally never found a Gorean sim that was playing it for lulz with twinkly eyes and tongues in cheeks. Some took it more seriously than others, but even now, the descriptions on those sims are full of By The Book, Truly Gorean and all that. I know what By The Book means and I am seriously not impressed. The culture is driven at its heart by those who take it seriously.

Also, the books are just rubbish on an artistic level. I've seen episodes of Peppa Pig with better plots. They're not so bad they're good, they're just so bad they're bad. Stay away and do it in Arabian Nights sims. They have nicer buildings anyway.

You've thought about this more than I have, and it shows.  I tried Gor years ago, for a few days, with an alt, while I was also reading the book(s). Meh. Ick. Bad writing is the least of it. Sure, you get a lot of misogynistic jerks in BDSM, especially in SL, but that's not what it is about for most people in the lifestyle. It is either about kink (like being blindfolded) or it is about power exchange (which isn't necessarily sexual) or both. It also isn't about male dominance, or you wouldn't have all of those dominatrices running about. Oddly, there's a fairly good streak of feminism in the folks I know who are "real" lifestylers. 

So your points about Gor highlight the differences well.

Got any good Arabian Nights sims in mind?

Edited September 1, 2020 by Seicher Rae
had to add sentence because I forgot what I was writing about