Help settle a debate with a friend (Land rental method)

[DSkywere]

Soo here’s the context: I brought a friend in to help with a sim build (I already regret that decision lol) and he spent the first 30mins of his arrival basically telling me my idea is terrible and no one in second life ever rents land in the way I’ve got it set up 

and here’s how I’ve got it set up: it’s a private island region that is themed, I’ve carved out plots and intend to sell those plots to other residents (buying the plot gives the person land rights without being added to a group) then on the same plot I have a rental box that charges a weekly stipend and a covenant that states the rules and theme 

 

what my friend demands I do instead is keep control of the land, build prefabs on the plots and then place a rental box inside the prefab, not allowing people to make their own build at all or have any land rights

 

Soo settle our debate - what rental method is preferred and why? 

[Alwin Alcott]

19 minutes ago, DSkywere said:

 what rental method is preferred and why? 

what you as owner want.

Your system isn't wrong, if you are the real estate-region owner( not renting or just estate manager)  you always have control over the land.

[DSkywere]

6 minutes ago, Alwin Alcott said:

what you as owner want.

Your system isn't wrong, if you are the real estate-region owner( not renting or just estate manager)  you always have control over the land.

Yep I’m the real owner, got the sim directly from Linden Labs  

[Qie Niangao]

Of course you can do it either way, and both are common.

Thing is, if the region owner also owns all the buildings and merely rents out occupancy of prefabs, they better be able to draw tenants. And what draws tenants today ain't gonna cut it when everybody has a PBR viewer and all new builds flood the market. 

On the other hand, if rentals are just a sideline to grander ambitions for the region (e.g., roleplay), then you gotta build what the region needs and maybe somebody will want to rent some of it. 

[Rowan Amore]

I've always preferred to rent an empty plot but then I like to decorate.  Since you do have a themed area, it could be a good idea to actually have homes available that you've chosen that would fit your theme so renters can either have you place it or they can purchase one themselves.  This would avoid someone putting up a home you may not feel is in theme and the ensuing drama.

On the other hand, you could set up and decorate one or two plots yourself stating the items can all stay if the renter chooses.   Some people prefer to have a ready to live in space.  

ETA...I would also never rent a spot without land rights.  Just be sure to shut off terraforming on parcels and don't allow ban lines.  It actually might be a good idea to have a group set up for renters only.  I've always been in one when renting on private estates.

Edited April 30, 2023 by Rowan Amore

[Krystina Ferraris]

There are tons of places renting land as you intend to do, I had a house on one for over two years.

[Lindal Kidd]

Krystina is quite right and your friend is not. This system is in wide use.

Right off the bat, Desmond Shang's Caledon estate comes to mind. He's one savvy estate owner. Caledon has a Victorian Steampunk theme, but he rents out the land parcels only, not putting any builds down himself. He leaves that up to his residents...much like Linden Lab, come to think of it.

Some estate owners put the rental boxes in a separate "office" location, which I actually prefer, because I don't have to worry about the location of an on-parcel rent box when I'm building my home. But the on-parcel system works fine, and it's what Caledon uses.

[Ceka Cianci]

An empty lot with land rights for me, is the best way to do things.. I'm already thinking of going back to where my old land was in the Skybeam community, because they do it that same way..

I can then build my own home or buy it, as well as terraforming where I need to.

How they do things where I had mine is.. They buy the land just like you would any land, by right clicking the land and  buying it.. then they have a building off on it's own where all the lots have their tier boxes that they can pay anywhere from a week at a time all the way up to a month or more..

They get the use of all the land impact for that lot..plus you can even give them more prims if you section off areas like the gaps between lots.. you can set those prims for the lots.

For me it was much much better than having a lot with pre-built things on it.. it really let me get creative with things and made it feel much more like home..

I had my older land  for most of my second life and have been away for  maybe 4 months and already wanting to go back to where I was, which more than likely is going to happen.. because a linden home just doesn't feel like a home and doesn't have the freedom I had on my old empty land..

That's just how I like things for myself.. I can't speak for others on how they feel.

 

ETA: This thread Inspired me to get off my butt and get back to my old land.. I couldn't get the same exact place, but it's the same size and same community, so that will do until my old one opens up.. I want my old one because I do have a friend that lived next door, so it would be nice to move back next to her again.. We really got along well for neighbors.

Edited April 30, 2023 by Ceka Cianci

[Rolig Loon]

I have managed my region the way that you plan to run yours for almost ten years now.  It works fine for me. Other landowners may be more comfortable renting parcels the way your friend wants to.  It's your choice.  You should always take advice; you are under no obligation to follow it.

[Laylah Yaseotoko]

The whole prefab renting thing really only works if you build a while community around it with landscaping, amenities and other things. If you just want to rent the land to people and give them rights and not deal with all the rest your way is the way to go. Personally.. I'd never rent in a prefab community myself.

[EliseAnne85]

3 hours ago, DSkywere said:

Soo here’s the context: I brought a friend in to help with a sim build (I already regret that decision lol) and he spent the first 30mins of his arrival basically telling me my idea is terrible and no one in second life ever rents land in the way I’ve got it set up 

and here’s how I’ve got it set up: it’s a private island region that is themed, I’ve carved out plots and intend to sell those plots to other residents (buying the plot gives the person land rights without being added to a group) then on the same plot I have a rental box that charges a weekly stipend and a covenant that states the rules and theme 

 

what my friend demands I do instead is keep control of the land, build prefabs on the plots and then place a rental box inside the prefab, not allowing people to make their own build at all or have any land rights

 

Soo settle our debate - what rental method is preferred and why? 

My preferred would be to have land right's and to own the land myself.

The thing with buying some land stuck in the middle of a hodgepodge of weird builds is it's to difficult to block out all that weird stuff.  

I looked at a land recently to buy and the builds around it were quite ugly and weird and me putting a beautiful dream house there would not look good as those ugly builds right next to my dream house would still be right there.

I would not want prefabs though, I'd prefer to pick out my house.  But, if you could make it someway so the plots are somewhat cohesive and not a mish-mosh of all sorts of weird things, how would you do that?  Any ideas?  I thought the land I was thinking of buying was a good price but the surrounding builds were just awful.  

Edited April 30, 2023 by EliseAnne85

[DSkywere]

8 minutes ago, EliseAnne85 said:

My preferred would be to have land right's and to own the land myself.

The thing with buying some land stuck in the middle of a hodgepodge of weird builds is it's to difficult to block out all that weird stuff.  

I looked at a land recently to buy and the builds around it were quite ugly and weird and me putting a beautiful dream house there would not look good as those ugly builds right next to my dream house would still be right there.

I would not want prefabs though, I'd prefer to pick out my house.  But, if you could make it someway so the plots are somewhat cohesive and not a mish-mosh of all sorts of weird things, how would you do that?  Any ideas?  I thought the land I was thinking of buying was a good price but the surrounding builds were just awful.  

If you are referring to the mainland then that's always the risk as the mainland doesn't have any themes really, My region has a theme and I reckon people would for the most part honor the theme (its a blend of cyberpunk, dystopian, and realism - (stuff along the lines of black mirror) and so the builds would be somewhat cohesive and at a minimum be urban/modern

Of course, they'll always be griefers and I'm sure someone at some point will make a tower that looks like a certain appendage but my plan is once the sim is fully ready I'll have some admins/mods making sure that sorta stuff gets dealt with pretty quick

 

In other news, I'm taking notes because the responses here have been epic and have given me a ton of inspiration 

[Ceka Cianci]

20 minutes ago, DSkywere said:

If you are referring to the mainland then that's always the risk as the mainland doesn't have any themes really, My region has a theme and I reckon people would for the most part honor the theme (its a blend of cyberpunk, dystopian, and realism - (stuff along the lines of black mirror) and so the builds would be somewhat cohesive and at a minimum be urban/modern

Of course, they'll always be griefers and I'm sure someone at some point will make a tower that looks like a certain appendage but my plan is once the sim is fully ready I'll have some admins/mods making sure that sorta stuff gets dealt with pretty quick

 

In other news, I'm taking notes because the responses here have been epic and have given me a ton of inspiration 

The theme sims I've been involved in, have mostly been to keep to the theme  if you build or set something on the ground.. But up above a certain height, it was allowed to build things off theme.. Like having a separate home or build platform above and out of site of the theme.. That's always a nice thing to have that also goes against their own prim count..

Myself, I'm usually anywhere from 3k to the 4k's meters up in the sky myself for a platform or out of the way place...

Edited April 30, 2023 by Ceka Cianci

[EliseAnne85]

25 minutes ago, DSkywere said:

If you are referring to the mainland then that's always the risk as the mainland doesn't have any themes really, My region has a theme and I reckon people would for the most part honor the theme (its a blend of cyberpunk, dystopian, and realism - (stuff along the lines of black mirror) and so the builds would be somewhat cohesive and at a minimum be urban/modern

Of course, they'll always be griefers and I'm sure someone at some point will make a tower that looks like a certain appendage but my plan is once the sim is fully ready I'll have some admins/mods making sure that sorta stuff gets dealt with pretty quick

 

In other news, I'm taking notes because the responses here have been epic and have given me a ton of inspiration 

That sounds cool.  I think you should try it.

The land I looked at to buy a plot actually, the neighbors didn't even really have houses or buildings...just strange, ugly stuff that didn't even look like anything.  It turned me off.  

SL themed places that I've rented looked nice but we didn't get land rights.  It might work out good for you because that is a very cool theme. 

 

[InnerCity Elf]

As you have a whole sim and a covenant stating the theme, you could also try both and see what's more popular. Maybe have a "green zone", park, forest, or something, a river with a bridge to cross, and do prefab on one part, and themed but free building on the other. 

[EliseAnne85]

1 hour ago, Laylah Yaseotoko said:

The whole prefab renting thing really only works if you build a while community around it with landscaping, amenities and other things. If you just want to rent the land to people and give them rights and not deal with all the rest your way is the way to go. Personally.. I'd never rent in a prefab community myself.

I have lived in pre-fab communities and loved it.  The best one I had was a large vintage style 2-story house with a lake behind the house.  It was beautifully landscaped all around and I honestly believe I could never landscape like that.  I'm pretty terrible at landscaping.  I'll stick some trees and bushes here and there, but this person must have been gifted the way she built the lake behind the house and the neighbor's houses were lovely with smoke coming out the chimneys and we could all just kick back and relax in the lake on floaties and listen to Classical music.   It was an overall gorgeous build and the lake so relaxing.  I can't build like that.  I tend to be in the sky because of it.  My landscaping just sucks.  There are people in SL I think who would appreciate this kind of building already done for them.  In the sky, landscaping doesn't matter to me because I often bypass it altogether.  But, if I live on the ground, I want to enjoy some aesthetics of a 3D world, and some of us just aren't good at doing it ourselves.  We may do other things in SL well, however.  

[Bree Giffen]

I don't look at prefabbed rentals but I've seen several landlords who offer to remove the prefab. They mention it in their profiles. These are usually not part of a themed community though so removing the building doesn't change anything.  There are pros and cons on both having themed prefabs or open parcels. I think people do appreciate a theme on private parcels but people also want to build their own homes and may have a lot of their own items from a previous rental. If you leave an open parcel for rent you may not like what people build. 

[Lewis Luminos]

On 4/30/2023 at 11:52 AM, DSkywere said:

Soo here’s the context: I brought a friend in to help with a sim build (I already regret that decision lol) and he spent the first 30mins of his arrival basically telling me my idea is terrible and no one in second life ever rents land in the way I’ve got it set up 

and here’s how I’ve got it set up: it’s a private island region that is themed, I’ve carved out plots and intend to sell those plots to other residents (buying the plot gives the person land rights without being added to a group) then on the same plot I have a rental box that charges a weekly stipend and a covenant that states the rules and theme 

 

what my friend demands I do instead is keep control of the land, build prefabs on the plots and then place a rental box inside the prefab, not allowing people to make their own build at all or have any land rights

 

Soo settle our debate - what rental method is preferred and why? 

Your method is absolutely a standard model of operation. The Chungs have been doing it that way for years, as do many others. This method has two major advantages for the tenant; first, that the tenant can have full control of their parcel; rename it, set the media stream, control access, terraforming etc. Second, they don't have to hang around waiting for a group invite, they can dive right in and use the land right away.  Purchase the land for an amount equal to the first week's tier, and the rest is paid via a rental box. It's the only way I would ever consider renting land. And, no disadvantage to the estate owner; you're still getting the same amount of money whether that first week's payment is a rental or a purchase.

This method only works on private estates, it can't be done on mainland because there, Linden Lab is the estate owner and the land baron is just the middleman. But on private islands, the land baron is the estate owner. 

The only drawback is that the tenant may choose to ignore your theme, but provided that you set up your Covenant to incorporate all of your requirements, then you're good, and within your rights and your ability to evict tenants who don't comply.  Doing it your friend's way has no advantages to you, as an estate owner, and many disadvantages to your tenants, who will be put off and expect much cheaper rent as a result. 

[Crim Mip]

On 4/30/2023 at 5:52 AM, DSkywere said:

Soo here’s the context: I brought a friend in to help with a sim build (I already regret that decision lol) and he spent the first 30mins of his arrival basically telling me my idea is terrible and no one in second life ever rents land in the way I’ve got it set up 

and here’s how I’ve got it set up: it’s a private island region that is themed, I’ve carved out plots and intend to sell those plots to other residents (buying the plot gives the person land rights without being added to a group) then on the same plot I have a rental box that charges a weekly stipend and a covenant that states the rules and theme 

 

what my friend demands I do instead is keep control of the land, build prefabs on the plots and then place a rental box inside the prefab, not allowing people to make their own build at all or have any land rights

 

Soo settle our debate - what rental method is preferred and why? 

One of the older multi-estate regions on the grid does it exactly the way you describe. I bought my parcel for a token amount (100L) and pay a rent box that goes to the owner of the regions to cover tier and such. I have full control over my parcel within the bounds of the rules for the realm. It works well. The very smallest parcels have prefab cottages on them, otherwise it's up to the parcel owner to make sure any structures follow the theme (they can be pre-approved).