Catwa announces price drop - what do you think?

[Stephanie Misfit]

Prices are now competitive with Lelutka. What do you think, Lelutka users? Will this tempt you to buy an HD Pro head, or are you too hooked on all those Evo X cosmetics you've acquired? I will definitely be trying demos, and for those who are Catwa fans, hopefully this will see skin makers increase support for the products.

 

[Trinity Blakewell]

Too little, too late.

[steeljane42]

Lelutka user here since pre-bento days that never liked Catwa heads even back when they were a market leader. But the whole HDPro line is especially terrible looking in my opinion. Same old caricature-like animations and the general look that you can say "it's a a Catwa head" from 20m away without zooming closer. So 6k or 4k, it makes no difference for me, and it's not amount of EvoX content available as the main reason. If I wanted to swap from Lelutka for some reason I'd consider AK ones first, maybe even Genus (not a big fan of those either), but definitely not Catwa.

Also "lol trying to sell ancient non-bento obsolete heads for 2.25k". Same for the not updated/not supported anymore first bento heads for 2.65k, but especially the non-bento ones. In the current SL those are truly worthless. I suppose they still get some money from newbies (actual ones) who browse MP and that old garbage shows up. Last year I did help a few people to upgrade from that and it was always "It did show up on the MP, so I thought it's a good choice." kind of reason, until they found themselves not being happy with own look compared to what they saw around.

And indeed, like already said above, too late.

Edit:

Given previous Catwa practices (and that overpriced non-bento stuff I've already mentioned) I would also translate that message as: Business has been dead for 2 years, HDPro heads didn't get popular with only one new head released in a year. Time to try and squeeze at least a tiny bit more money until it dies out completely.

Edited March 15, 2023 by steeljane42

[Anna Nova]

Cat who?

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Anna Nova said:

Cat who?

Careful, one of my only bans was for making a Catwa joke! Seriously, go figure!

[Missy Starchild]

I'm good with my Erin head and all the numerous Evo X cosmetics I got for it. I'm not ditching all of that just to go searching for compatible stuff all over again, sorry.

Edited March 15, 2023 by epiclolz

[Anna Nova]

It's really rather sad how the market works these days.  The days of proper free market competition seem to be over both in RL and SL.  There are products that are just so dominant that no one else can get a look in.  Catwa comes from the era of free market competition, but the arrival of EvoX eclipsed it.  Tell me where I can get a cell phone that isn't made by Crapple and running IOS or something paying Alphablot to run Android?  Yes there are niche players, you can even get a Linux phone, but market share 0.0...1%, and profitability zilch.  I'm really sorry Catwa didn't jump on the EvoX bandwagon.  Look what happened to Slink.  But this is the same everywhere, freedom is over folks.

Edited March 15, 2023 by Anna Nova
typos

[Modulated]

Prices may now be competitive, however , quality is not.  I shall pass.

 

 

Edited March 15, 2023 by Modulated

[Sissi Slacker]

1 hour ago, Anna Nova said:

But this is the same everywhere, freedom is over folks.

Both Catwa and Slink did it to themselves, it's how free market works. And that's coming from someone who still likes Catwa's Queen and MajerSoft heads and was hesitant to move on from Slink bodies years ago. If anything, nowadays there is so much more freedom than before the pandemic, when it was either appliers for Catwa and Maitreya or almost nothing at all. 

[Ceka Cianci]

I do like the tools they have for their heads.. I think they are gonna have a harder time getting back at it.. But they do have a lot of Catwa lovers too..

Honestly, I think for them to really make a strong  comeback, they need the Evo X maps on their heads.. If Lelutka  passes their application or not, because of reasons, who knows..

Lelutka is kind of like the Maitreya of the mesh head market right now.. You almost don't even need to look and make sure something has an Evo X version anymore.. It makes for a lot less frustration when looking for something or finding something and seeing it does have or doesn't have your version.. Most times it does..

The price drop is a first good step for sure.. But honestly they are gonna probably have to do more than that to climb back up, if they are even really wanting to get back up there.. they may just be happy with coasting nowadays..

We'll see.. hehehe

Edited March 15, 2023 by Ceka Cianci

[Ajay McDowwll]

I think it's great the prices have been reduced.  EvoX masters the playing field right now, and that's fine -- these things tend to be cyclical -- but decisions that put more options within reach of more SL residents can only be good.  Both the HDPro line and EvoX are gorgeous heads; I own several of each, and enjoy them for their own characteristics.

Edited March 15, 2023 by Ajay McDowwll

[Ayashe Ninetails]

Couple of things as a semi-frequent HDPro user.

I'm wondering about the timing for the announcement. I'm about 95% sure (please someone correct me if I'm off) that the heads were full-price 5900L-ish when added at Skin Fair, with Emerald being 25% off. The price announcement maybe could have come before - even used as a way to bring old and new users back over to the brand at the event. This is only my opinion of course, and I'm sure she's got her reasons, but event timing is everything these days.

Secondly, I think the HDPro price is pretty good and on par with most brands for the features included. I happen to love the animations, but I'm always rocking fantasy characters, so they work for me and I find them fun. I don't do smolder runway super srs faces when I'm just running around on the grid. I love my eyerolls and goofy smiles and tongue sticking out and random acts of silliness. That's just my thing. I enjoy the personality I can get with HDPro. That said, though, the eyes have always been my favorite feature, and the fact that I don't need to fiddle with Omega eyes to rock two separate mesh eye appliers. They just work (Lel requires the third-party eyes have the S M L dropdowns/buttons for that to take effect on a single eye, which I think is an Omega thing).

Third, shopping for SLUV hasn't been the hardest thing I've ever had to do (I wear heads with eyes in wonky places, long snouts/noses, one with a vertical mouth, many with custom UVs, etc., so I know the pain of shopping waaaaaaaay off-brand). I have a list of stores in my head that still make skins and layers and effects and makeup for SLUV, and it's not been a hassle getting what I want. That said, it is definitely a challenge to find more, especially for those without a lot of time or interest or experience in running around the grid like that, so I get the hesitation to deal with it.

Edited March 15, 2023 by Ayashe Ninetails
Added stuffs

[Trinity Blakewell]

I liked the HD Pro animations, too. but not enough to keep me from switching to EVO and then EvoX

 

[EmmaAsht0n]

Catwa price drop or not, I'll keep using Lelutka heads on both my avatars.

[BelindaN]

Changing heads is expensive. My first decent head was an old Lelu, way back, but I liked Genus better. I was influenced on the forum in that respect. So Genus it was for a Loooong Time. I tried Catwas back then as demos but never managed "my look". I would have stayed with Genus "forever" but was influenced into demoing a new Lelu which I liked a lot. Over time my alts got Lelus, some got the freebies, and I switched to BoM, and EvoX, with all the cosmetics. 

So for me, it has been a slow and expensive journey  and I'm not likely to buy a new head anytime soon. I might demo a Catwa or a new Genus, but right now I have nothing planned.

Edited March 15, 2023 by BelindaN

[Katherine Heartsong]

I do own three (?) Catwa Heads, but after finding Lelutka, won't be going back. Even my male alt wears Lelutka.

[Coffee Pancake]

The price might be competitive .. but the heads and supporting ecosystem aren't.

If we had a Catwa update with EvoX UV mapping support, maybe.

[Love Zhaoying]

Since I've only used Catwa, I need to go the OTHER direction and try Lelutka.

[Ayashe Ninetails]

Just now, Love Zhaoying said:

Since I've only used Catwa, I need to go the OTHER direction and try Lelutka.

Lelutka for male heads is really, really good. If you have any of their freebies (Alain, Quinn, etc.), definitely start there. Quinn is more flexible on the shaping front than most I've tried, but I'll always adore Ford.

I don't like Lel's female line for human/semi-human avatars. I use my freebies to get a few different face options on the fantasy spectrum, but I won't wear them with human skins at all.

I don't have much experience with Catwa's male line, but I've seen some pretty nice avatars made with them. I find the female heads easier to shape than other brands, but I can't speak for the male heads.

This is, of course, highly dependent on the type of avatar you're making, of course. Full human, neko, lion, etc. You've got lots of options in the same price range for all of those.

[Maitimo]

I wouldnt buy another one because I already have a Catwa HDPro head that I absolutely love. The only reason I switched to Lelutka is because cosmetics makers aren't making anything for Catwa any more. It's all EVO-X only these days.

If they would resume making stuff on the standard head template instead of EVO-X, I'd switch back to it in a heartbeat.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

2 hours ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

I'm wondering about the timing for the announcement. I'm about 95% sure (please someone correct me if I'm off) that the heads were full-price 5900L-ish when added at Skin Fair, with Emerald being 25% off. The price announcement maybe could have come before - even used as a way to bring old and new users back over to the brand at the event. This is only my opinion of course, and I'm sure she's got her reasons, but event timing is everything these days.

The timing of this is interesting -- it must surely be in response to sales at the Skin Fair. It would have been cleverer, perhaps, to have changed the pricing for that event, and made a big noise about it. I'm also wondering if the rumour (I'm not sure it qualifies as "news" yet) that Genus will be dropping updates and new heads this month didn't factor in a bit as well.

These changes it seems to me merely bring Catwa in line with the pricing for other, now more popular heads: I don't know, for that reason, that's it going to do much to re-establish Catwa as a leader.

I don't entirely get the abuse that Catwa gets hurled at it. I don't like the Catwa "look" myself, and have never used it, but I know a few people who still do, and have achieved lovely looks. I expect that Genus, when it does introduce new product, will similarly come under attack for the Grievous Sin of Not Being LeLutka.

And that's unhealthy and unfortunate, because the market for mesh heads is now a near-monopoly for LeLutka. And however much you may adore LeLu, monopolies are never a good thing, whatever your ideological position on free markets and economies. They stifle innovation and mean that one creator has far too much power, not merely over consumers but also over other creators. So, while I have zero intention of buying a Catwa, I hope this succeeds, as I also hope does the new line from Genus. We need some competition out there.

Edited March 15, 2023 by Scylla Rhiadra
Missing word

[Lewis Luminos]

Too little, too late.

The only thing that can save this brand now is for them to release both Catya and Daniel as permanent freebies (like Genus did with one of theirs). Doing this might encourage more creators to go back to including Catwa and/or standard template content. 

Or, Catwa could include EVO-X in their newer heads.

Without content available for Catwa heads, no-one is going to buy them at any price-point.

[Ayashe Ninetails]

There are creators who still make for Catwa, or at least keep their older SLUV BOM products out for purchase. I don't particularly need brand new releases nonstop since I mix and match and layer everything like crazy to create my own looks anyway, but there's still a lot out there. You may have to experiment with Genus or old Evolution BOM fits, but that's never been an issue for me (combined with the occasional lip or eye corrector from Izzie's).

Off the top of my head, in case anyone is hunting for Catwa products (makeup, skins, etc.)...

Zibska, Nuve, Alaskametro, Samia, Izzie's, Top1Salon, Pumec, Dotty's Secret, YS&YS, Sintiklia, Warpaint, The Skinnery, 7 Deadly Skins, Moccino Beaute, #Adored, StunnerOriginals, Booty's Beauty (upstairs), Amara Beauty (upstairs), Trend, Reed Skins, Glam Affair, Beaumore (marketplace only), and ND/MD.

That takes care of a portion of my makeup/skin inventory, at least. I'm sure I missed a few buried in there somewhere, but hopefully that helps. 😂

[Modulated]

Just now, Ayashe Ninetails said:

There are creators who still make for Catwa, or at least keep their older SLUV BOM products out for purchase. I don't particularly need brand new releases nonstop since I mix and match and layer everything like crazy to create my own looks anyway, but there's still a lot out there. You may have to experiment with Genus or old Evolution BOM fits, but that's never been an issue for me (combined with the occasional lip or eye corrector from Izzie's).

Off the top of my head, in case anyone is hunting for Catwa products (makeup, skins, etc.)...

Zibska, Nuve, Alaskametro, Samia, Izzie's, Top1Salon, Pumec, Dotty's Secret, YS&YS, Sintiklia, Warpaint, The Skinnery, 7 Deadly Skins, Moccino Beaute, #Adored, StunnerOriginals, Booty's Beauty (upstairs), Amara Beauty (upstairs), Trend, Reed Skins, Glam Affair, Beaumore (marketplace only), and ND/MD.

That takes care of a portion of my makeup/skin inventory, at least. I'm sure I missed a few buried in there somewhere, but hopefully that helps. 😂

I don't think catwa uses the standard SLUV for its head, correct me if I am wrong.  This is exactly why they went after another creator for trying to make their heads compatible with theirs I think. And this is why I do not see them ever offering an EvoX option.  Short of a ground up overhaul, I think the glory days are over for them.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

Can Catwa offer an EvoX option? Surely only LeLutka has the rights to that -- which is why the special arrangement with AK was kind of a big deal?