Belleza Announcing New Gen.X Body and Event

[Gabriele Graves]

4 hours ago, Janet Voxel said:

If I were to "leave" SL, I'd leave my stuff up, maybe provide a little customer support and log on periodically to collect my money too. I'm pretty sure people are still buying it and using it. I don't want to get any more gossipy than that.

I don't think she's doing anything else with Omega anymore though.

I'm just responding to what you wrote and what appears to be the case.  Providing a little customer support and not "doing anything else with Omega" are completely different from leaving and abandoning your products and customers.  If there is more to it and it's something public then I don't see that it would be gossipy for people to know what the story is.  If it isn't public then is it the best thing to be mentioning in the first place?  Not least of which people will understandably have questions and might be suspicious of motives.

Edited October 3, 2022 by Gabriele Graves

[Ceka Cianci]

I can't help but think they've still kind of shot themselves in the foot by not doing one single thing for their former customers wearing the older bodies..

I just keep kicking it around and thinking, this is going to come back and bite them in the butt..

I was looking at the list of 300 mesh bodies to see how many wearers are wearing the older bodies..

Freya has just over 7300 wearers

Isis has just over 1300

Venus is around 575

That's more combined than Reborn has built up over the past year..

I think if they don't pull a really big chunk of those wearers.. this body may be sitting with Erika keeping her company.

All the things we are seeing for clothes right now are test runs items..  it's gonna be interesting to watch..

I just really think they need their foundation that got them here this far, to get them up there.

My tummy may be reading it wrong, but it has a feeling about it.

Edited October 3, 2022 by Ceka Cianci

[Blaise Glendevon]

1 hour ago, Ceka Cianci said:

I can't help but think they've still kind of shot themselves in the foot by not doing one single thing for their former customers wearing the older bodies..

I don't think that's going to be a problem. Going back to the ecosystem of body/clothes/accessories, leading in with a sale makes people expect to get everything for cheap. That's not going to appeal to designers who want to sell for full price at launch and not at a heavy discount on the weekend sales 3 or 4 months later. And if the designers don't get on board early, you have a paperweight.

It will be more important for the bodies (BOTH BODIES, NOT JUST CURVY, GODDAMN.) to be supported by designers than for a whole bunch of people to jump in for a cheap body and never wear it because they don't have clothes.

[Ceka Cianci]

28 minutes ago, Blaise Glendevon said:

I don't think that's going to be a problem. Going back to the ecosystem of body/clothes/accessories, leading in with a sale makes people expect to get everything for cheap. That's not going to appeal to designers who want to sell for full price at launch and not at a heavy discount on the weekend sales 3 or 4 months later. And if the designers don't get on board early, you have a paperweight.

It will be more important for the bodies (BOTH BODIES, NOT JUST CURVY, GODDAMN.) to be supported by designers than for a whole bunch of people to jump in for a cheap body and never wear it because they don't have clothes.

My concern isn't with having sales for everything there or everyone there.. It's more for the previous customers of the older belleza bodies..

In their last update they gave an apology to their customers for taking so long, saying how they have the best customers in the world,  in so many words and that exciting things are coming (Short version)..

Then didn't do a single thing for them to encourage them to switch over.. They pretty much cut them off in every way with nothing from the former bodies fitting the newer..

No discount  to encouraging them getting one of the new bodies, no anything.

We can see it as they shouldn't complain because they are older bodies, but that's not going to matter if they still do.

Full wardrobe with a body they still like vs a company that just cut me off and a body that doesn't fit anything else other than what's made for it.

I think their numbers are going to matter when it comes to making a push in the ranks against other bodies..

I think they really need to do something to encourage their former customers.. Because wearers buying is what  helps encourage creators creating.

I really think they need a big chunk of their former customer base to come over..

Hopefully I'm wrong in a way and it does move up quickly.. I spent 5500 on it and would love to see that.. but just can't help that the former base could be an anchor that slows them down or even holds them down.. because on top of that , they still have to pull people from the other companies they are going up against bodies.

 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Ceka Cianci

[UnilWay SpiritWeaver]

I know SL is different than normal capitalism and people in SL think that if you bought a Form Model T back in 1907, you should get a free Ford F150 EV now in 2022.

But that's how Ford goes out of business.

Yes, SL has set a weird expectation of permanent free upgrades. But the body makers can't keep even so much as paying tier on their shops with that model.

 

I got years out of Freya. I think 8 or so. For which I paid about $18 because I bought it full price back in the day when it only came as Venus. So... I've actually already been given 2 new bodies I didn't have to pay for.

I just spent $39 on an upgrade after 8 years. I can't think of anything else I own like that.

Granted this is SL - so in SL that sounds expensive when even for coffee it's cheap.

 

Belleza is hoping they can get enough people to see things even partway like I've just outlined. It is a gamble... but right now they are moving a LOT of bodies.

For them, that's 100% of the commerce - the initial body sale.

For us... it's then what third party people will add to it.

Right now, there's an absurd amount of stuff showing up. Past the events, I joined their discord a few weeks back in advance of this and for the last 3 days the channel noting new items has been dropping more things. Today it started ramping up into spam like levels of content.

Some of which, by the way, is that at least one shop, KC, that makes a lot of shoes, has been going nuts updating old product FOR FREE to Gen.X. KC won't make a dime off of that.

But they're not even most of that spam.

 

Right now the stuff is coming out so fast that the problem is going to be that sales will suffer from people running out of 'SL budget' within days, and having to make lists of what to come back for.

 

Before October 1st we were all saying in the 'Lara' thread that for a body to compete it would have to come out very big very fast. Gen.X has just done that. Obviously it won't overtake Maitreya at this point. BUT it will likely do well. It came out with massive support, a lot of fanfare, and pushed a LOT of copies out of the door really fast.

IF any new body can succeed in today's saturated market - this was how to do it.

 

I'm still not happy that it didn't ship with Mod nor with a lightweight version. But they did do a lot of things right, and if they honor their promise to put those updates out, then the reasons they delayed Mod and the lightweight version will be justified (the excuses they've given were good ones - it's just this IS Belleza and historically their idea of soon... isn't...).

 

Edited October 4, 2022 by UnilWay SpiritWeaver

[UnilWay SpiritWeaver]

11 hours ago, Trinity1776 said:

I am not sure how I feel about the "buy the fatpack in your body type" trend that Just Because and DeadDoll are moving to. For those with multiple bodies

They are almost certainly fishing for which bodies to support and which to cancel.

Polls just get spammed by 'fan armies'. Even surveying the grid for what bodies you see in places risks repeat hits or missing hits due to time and place.

But tracking actual sales is... the best way to know what actually sold.

It sucks for anyone who uses more than one body at a time. Right now I'm buying for both Gen.X Classic and Gen.X Curvy because I haven't made a choice yet...

But even that is a choice the merchant wants data on.

For example, if I saw that everyone who bought a copy for Maitreya also bought for Kupra, and everyone who bought Gen.X Curvy also bought a copy for... Legacy. Just as a weird hypo - that might tell me useful data about customer groupings that I would not have expected.

Any smart merchants should always been sharing a spreadsheet on Google Docs to tell them not just WHAT sells, but what things certain groups of customers buy. If I could find out that people buying my shoes were buying your necklaces - we'd want to talk.

 

[Marianne Little]

What was the marketing for Legacy? Why did they sell so many bodies, so fast?

Did they sell it on "A feeling of higher quality"? 

Did new clothes/shoes get released faster because the brand that was TMP, know their marketing? As I remember it, new stuff was released for it fast. Very fast.

It was not so many bodies when Legacy released theirs. I think it is going to be harder now.

Maybe the competition for Belleza, is not primary Maitreya, but Legacy? 

A customer that want to replace Maitreya , can get better shoulders and all the other details with Legacy. And Legacy has a lot of content made for it.

I think "It's mod" will matter only for a tiny minority. By reading the forum, one can get the impression that modify is the most important part. 

The built in V, may be important for a larger number of buyers. 

 

 

[Ceka Cianci]

30 minutes ago, UnilWay SpiritWeaver said:

I know SL is different than normal capitalism and people in SL think that if you bought a Form Model T back in 1907, you should get a free Ford F150 EV now in 2022.

But that's how Ford goes out of business.

Yes, SL has set a weird expectation of permanent free upgrades. But the body makers can't keep even so much as paying tier on their shops with that model.

 

I got years out of Freya. I think 8 or so. For which I paid about $18 because I bought it full price back in the day when it only came as Venus. So... I've actually already been given 2 new bodies I didn't have to pay for.

I just spent $39 on an upgrade after 8 years. I can't think of anything else I own like that.

Granted this is SL - so in SL that sounds expensive when even for coffee it's cheap.

 

Belleza is hoping they can get enough people to see things even partway like I've just outlined. It is a gamble... but right now they are moving a LOT of bodies.

For them, that's 100% of the commerce - the initial body sale.

For us... it's then what third party people will add to it.

Right now, there's an absurd amount of stuff showing up. Past the events, I joined their discord a few weeks back in advance of this and for the last 3 days the channel noting new items has been dropping more things. Today it started ramping up into spam like levels of content.

Some of which, by the way, is that at least one shop, KC, that makes a lot of shoes, has been going nuts updating old product FOR FREE to Gen.X. KC won't make a dime off of that.

But they're not even most of that spam.

 

Right now the stuff is coming out so fast that the problem is going to be that sales will suffer from people running out of 'SL budget' within days, and having to make lists of what to come back for.

 

Before October 1st we were all saying in the 'Lara' thread that for a body to compete it would have to come out very big very fast. Gen.X has just done that. Obviously it won't overtake Maitreya at this point. BUT it will likely do well. It came out with massive support, a lot of fanfare, and pushed a LOT of copies out of the door really fast.

IF any new body can succeed in today's saturated market - this was how to do it.

 

I'm still not happy that it didn't ship with Mod nor with a lightweight version. But they did do a lot of things right, and if they honor their promise to put those updates out, then the reasons they delayed Mod and the lightweight version will be justified (the excuses they've given were good ones - it's just this IS Belleza and historically their idea of soon... isn't...).

 

I'm well aware of how things are supposed to work, but my point is , if a lot of those former customers don't come over, it's gonna be harder, no matter how we feel they should think.

I want the new body to be a success, and I don't think giving your former customers some sort of incentive to choose the current product is a bad move.. Many businesses do this because, keeping a good customer base is important to survival..

Also,I never said free, not sure where people keep seeing me say that. 

Treating your existing customers a little bit more special for sticking with ya is just good business.. Cutting them off and treating them like they just got here.. Well you might not get a lot of them back is all and they end up maybe going to your completion.

 

I really hope they get most of them back because I'm really liking this body.. But if they don't well, we'll just have to see how that works out guess.. Because even Ford gives ya something for a trade-in..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[steeljane42]

1 hour ago, Marianne Little said:

What was the marketing for Legacy? Why did they sell so many bodies, so fast?

Did they sell it on "A feeling of higher quality"? 

Did new clothes/shoes get released faster because the brand that was TMP, know their marketing? As I remember it, new stuff was released for it fast. Very fast.

It was not so many bodies when Legacy released theirs. I think it is going to be harder now.

Maybe the competition for Belleza, is not primary Maitreya, but Legacy? 

A customer that want to replace Maitreya , can get better shoulders and all the other details with Legacy. And Legacy has a lot of content made for it.

I think "It's mod" will matter only for a tiny minority. By reading the forum, one can get the impression that modify is the most important part. 

The built in V, may be important for a larger number of buyers. 

 

 

I think primary competition for Belleza is Reborn now, and to get remaining Freya users back instead of waiting until they'd swap to Reborn/Legacy too, like the rest. And yeah, forums are a very tiny minority. I still don't see many mod Reborn versions worn even if it's available, same for the Freya/Jake ever since they got their last update and mod version included.

I'm not even sure the  V is important for too many either. Aside of building my place as usual and shopping I'm often around kinky/fetishy places. Now its not random sex places, but it's still adult activities that often involve it with plenty of naked people around. I'd say even 1/20 doesn't wear/use V, sensations or any other brand. It's not a budget issue for those people too, kinky toys are not cheap either.

Either way, that poster very much reminds of of a certain pro-belleza, pro-mod, pro-sex one from before. It was no use to bring up any points about anything. So I won't bother. Just going to wait and see the numbers when they show up on Lucia's list.

Event being busy and hype is all good, but then again I went there twice to grab demos and then buy some stuff too, and I have zero intentions to get Gen X now. Also at the time of writing (2:30AM SLT) event already has 6 people in Belleza sim. Peak hours in 9-10 probably gonna get busy, but considering it's not even full 4 days since it's open... not really that great. Hentai fair was packed 24/7 for a week, for example.

[CalypsoJewel]

1 hour ago, steeljane42 said:

I think primary competition for Belleza is Reborn now, and to get remaining Freya users back instead of waiting until they'd swap to Reborn/Legacy too, like the rest. And yeah, forums are a very tiny minority. I still don't see many mod Reborn versions worn even if it's available, same for the Freya/Jake ever since they got their last update and mod version included.

I'm not even sure the  V is important for too many either. Aside of building my place as usual and shopping I'm often around kinky/fetishy places. Now its not random sex places, but it's still adult activities that often involve it with plenty of naked people around. I'd say even 1/20 doesn't wear/use V, sensations or any other brand. It's not a budget issue for those people too, kinky toys are not cheap either.

Either way, that poster very much reminds of of a certain pro-belleza, pro-mod, pro-sex one from before. It was no use to bring up any points about anything. So I won't bother. Just going to wait and see the numbers when they show up on Lucia's list.

Event being busy and hype is all good, but then again I went there twice to grab demos and then buy some stuff too, and I have zero intentions to get Gen X now. Also at the time of writing (2:30AM SLT) event already has 6 people in Belleza sim. Peak hours in 9-10 probably gonna get busy, but considering it's not even full 4 days since it's open... not really that great. Hentai fair was packed 24/7 for a week, for example.

I think many Freya users already had jumped to Reborn with how dead the market was becoming for Freya. Reborn was/is also a good price. I don't know that the Curvy body is going to steal Reborn's spot for a while, if at all.. but Classic might steal some thunder from someone else. When I eventually get one down the road I know i'll go for Classic. Reborn is curvy enough for me.

As someone who is taken irl and lives with their spouse, the built-in V does nothing for me as I don't need SL to.. satisfy anything like that. I'm sure it's great for some, but i'd imagine those in to it already had the V from Sessions, so would it really had been worth going to a body with one built in? Unless you really like the body, then sure.

Still think it would had done better at a lower price point.

Now I get to sit and wonder if Legacy "X'd" it's X body upgrade they touted at the Skin Fair(either this year or last year. Was in with Lelutka's stuff). It was to be a free upgrade, but mention of it was removed from the Fair about halfway through and now it looks like even the web page for it is gone.

[JulsToffy]

Finally got my hands on the demo and compared it to my Freya. The new body is quite lovely, but also for me it doesn't warrant paying the price for what is essentially an upgraded version of Freya with an addition of "downstairs" that I don't care for.

I think my biggest issue here is that most of my wardrobe would become redundant if I switch. Sunk cost fallacy, yadda yadda, but I do love my old clothes, and having to re-buy it over and over while support for my fav body goes away is depressing. I tried wearing some Freya-shaped clothes and quite a few fit the new body, but not as many and with some issues, obviously. I'll try out demos for the new body and see if I can play around with alpha layers to still be able to buy nice new clothes that would fit Freya.

But yeah, for now... Skipping on this purchase. Thinking of switching to Maitreya or Legacy when discounts hit in upcoming months though!

[AmeliaJ08]

6 minutes ago, JulsToffy said:

Finally got my hands on the demo and compared it to my Freya. The new body is quite lovely, but also for me it doesn't warrant paying the price for what is essentially an upgraded version of Freya with an addition of "downstairs" that I don't care for.

I think my biggest issue here is that most of my wardrobe would become redundant if I switch. Sunk cost fallacy, yadda yadda, but I do love my old clothes, and having to re-buy it over and over while support for my fav body goes away is depressing. I tried wearing some Freya-shaped clothes and quite a few fit the new body, but not as many and with some issues, obviously. I'll try out demos for the new body and see if I can play around with alpha layers to still be able to buy nice new clothes that would fit Freya.

But yeah, for now... Skipping on this purchase. Thinking of switching to Maitreya or Legacy when discounts hit in upcoming months though!

It's a good point, you can probably switch to Maitreya or Legacy since most people likely already own those sizes if they've bought clothes in the past however many years.

 

[AmeliaJ08]

20 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

Eridita is the store that sells the deformers...

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/stores/209664

Thanks, I must have been unable to find it due to not being logged in and unable to view adult rated stuff

[Ceka Cianci]

20 minutes ago, JulsToffy said:

Finally got my hands on the demo and compared it to my Freya. The new body is quite lovely, but also for me it doesn't warrant paying the price for what is essentially an upgraded version of Freya with an addition of "downstairs" that I don't care for.

I think my biggest issue here is that most of my wardrobe would become redundant if I switch. Sunk cost fallacy, yadda yadda, but I do love my old clothes, and having to re-buy it over and over while support for my fav body goes away is depressing. I tried wearing some Freya-shaped clothes and quite a few fit the new body, but not as many and with some issues, obviously. I'll try out demos for the new body and see if I can play around with alpha layers to still be able to buy nice new clothes that would fit Freya.

But yeah, for now... Skipping on this purchase. Thinking of switching to Maitreya or Legacy when discounts hit in upcoming months though!

One thing I would keep an eye on is, seeing what gets updated to the new body from your current wardrobe..

It may be worth waiting until the holidays when bodies and heads usually go on sale, then see what's made for it..

You may be able to get a decent wardrobe for the new body just from redeliver of a lot of things you already have and not have to spend much at all on clothes. Plus the body itself may go on sale as well.

Edited October 4, 2022 by Ceka Cianci

[JulsToffy]

4 minutes ago, Ceka Cianci said:

One thing I would keep an eye on is, seeing what gets updated to the new body from your current wardrobe..

It may be worth waiting until the holidays when bodies and heads usually go on sale, then see what's made for it..

You may be able to get a decent wardrobe for the new body just from redeliver of a lot of things you already have and not have to spend much at all on clothes.

That is a good idea, I always forget that updates bring the fun stuff 😁 But also it might be quite nightmarish do update my entire inventory lol! Still, I'm definitely watching - and waiting for any updates that will come soon! I think come discount season, there will be a lot of interesting offers out there!

[Ceka Cianci]

4 minutes ago, JulsToffy said:

That is a good idea, I always forget that updates bring the fun stuff 😁 But also it might be quite nightmarish do update my entire inventory lol! Still, I'm definitely watching - and waiting for any updates that will come soon! I think come discount season, there will be a lot of interesting offers out there!

plus it will give a better idea of how the bodies are being picked up by creators by then..

I know when I got the reborn, I had completely forgot about blueberry and went there  like last week or when they had their big sale recently.. They have a lot of things that were updated to reborn.. so that was like a nice shopping trip that didn't cost a dime.. I was in heaven.. hehehe

Then just started checking through all my brands to see who had updated and  am getting a lot of stuff for my body for the same low price of , not a dime spent but the time to get it.  hehehehe

Edited October 4, 2022 by Ceka Cianci

[Psyche Starling]

1 hour ago, Ceka Cianci said:

One thing I would keep an eye on is, seeing what gets updated to the new body from your current wardrobe..

It may be worth waiting until the holidays when bodies and heads usually go on sale, then see what's made for it..

You may be able to get a decent wardrobe for the new body just from redeliver of a lot of things you already have and not have to spend much at all on clothes. Plus the body itself may go on sale as well.

That's what I did when I picked up Legacy on sale--massive redelivering spree, didn't really need to buy a lot right away. 

I've been demoing the Gen X bodies, and right now I don't think the Classic is different enough from Freya to make the switch right away, though I suspect it will be the final death knell of anything new being made for Freya. Still, my older clothes aren't going away, and I have more than enough bodies (lol) and can wait for a sale.

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

This is probably a really stupid question but I've had a Maitreya body with a sizeable Maitreya clothing inventory. My clothing won't fit another Maitreya body even if it's from the same body maker right?

Oof that's going to be a sad day. 

[Gabriele Graves]

There is only one Maitreya body.  There are other bodies such as the Lucy body and I think there are some deformers for Legacy that allow you to wear some clothing for Maitreya but the Lucy body is a lesser quality Maitreya clone that does fit most clothing and the Legacy gets deformed into a Maitreya-like shape to be able to wear them.  It is probably possible to wear some items on other bodies by using alpha-cuts/layers too but that would generally work only for circumstances where most of the body is covered and is the most hit-and-miss approach of them all.

So either any way you look at it you end up with a Maitreya shape whilst wearing that clothing even if it is possible.

[Orwar]

1 minute ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

This is probably a really stupid question but I've had a Maitreya body with a sizeable Maitreya clothing inventory. My clothing won't fit another Maitreya body even if it's from the same body maker right?

   It depends on what a new Maitreya body might be, which we can only speculate about. So far, Lara has been kept up to date and there isn't 'technically' any real need for a new one, there aren't any new ground-breaking features in SL which would require it to be made from scratch. If Maitreya releases a new body I figure it's more likely that they either want to appeal to a new body type (such as curvy) or that they want to make a differently shaped body (a lot of people don't like the shoulder area of the Lara). In the latter case, certain things such as trousers may still work, whereas tops mightn't. But again, that's purely speculative, and even if they do release a new body there's nothing stopping anyone from continuing using Lara. 

[Nika Talaj]

9 hours ago, Ceka Cianci said:

Because even Ford gives ya something for a trade-in..

If anyone from Belleza is reading this thread, here's a simple idea for how to gift your previous customers something, without plowing through ancient purchase records.

 list llGetAttachedList( key avatar );

It should be quite easy to tell if the avatar who touched a box is wearing a Freya body, for example, and either sell them a discounted body, or give them some stuff for a new body.

I could do this for you, just shoot me a couple bodies as payment, lol!

[Gabriele Graves]

17 minutes ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

This is probably a really stupid question but I've had a Maitreya body with a sizeable Maitreya clothing inventory. My clothing won't fit another Maitreya body even if it's from the same body maker right?

Oof that's going to be a sad day. 

Maitreya is still 30%+ of the market share as is possible for residents to determine.  It's going to be around for a good long time.  None of the other recent releases have manage to attain even half the numbers.  If Lara needs to be updated it will most likely to incorporate new SL features and there is no sign that Maitreya intend to stop doing that.

Edited October 4, 2022 by Gabriele Graves

[Rowan Amore]

3 minutes ago, Nika Talaj said:

If anyone from Belleza is reading this thread, here's a simple idea for how to gift your previous customers something, without plowing through ancient purchase records.

 list llGetAttachedList( key avatar );

It should be quite easy to tell if the avatar who touched a box is wearing a Freya body, for example, and either sell them a discounted body, or give them some stuff for a new body.

I could do this for you, just shoot me a couple bodies as payment, lol!

There used to be a male attachment that did this years ago IIRC.  It was for updates but in order to receive the update, you had to be wearing it when you touched the kiosk.  Lotus, maybe?

Edited October 4, 2022 by Rowan Amore

[Gabriele Graves]

I thought a while back when the Maitreya Petite was released that it would have been wonderful if owners of both the body and the add-on could click something at the Maitreya store and get a complete body that incorporates the add-on.  So if Maitreya are reading, you could consider this too.

[Cinos Field]

After a lot of testing (and rescripting my tail to be animesh instead of bento... :P) I have some final opinions on the Gen X Classic:

1) The shape is really good. If it had the support older bodies have, or even Legacy levels, I'd probably switch. However...

2) It's a bit excessive in triangle count. The shape shouldn't take more than maybe half of what it does right now. (almost a full 500k)

3) There just isn't enough clothing support for it yet even with the event. If you have any kind of personal style you try to maintain it's probably too early. Also, very few of the clothes at the event are moddable which is odd since the body's going to be mod.

4) The built in adult parts are just perfect, however I really don't see why they had to be bento (and specifically bento rigged to the VERY commonly used tail bone!). The problem with a version that doesn't come with them attached is that I'd have to wait longer for Sensations to provide a "V".

5) Probably the best use of materials I've seen on a human body, at least from the box.

6) Too expensive. It offers nothing really significant that Maitreya doesn't, in the end, even if it looks great.

 

Edited October 4, 2022 by Cinos Field