That TOS pic

[BadEddy]

Very often I see people with a pic called something like TOS and when you read it you find a message that look like:

 

According to Linden Labs, disclosure of logs without prior consent in a violation of the ToS. I am clearly stating to you, that by IM'ing me, having read or not having read these statements, you consent to being logged and that those logs can be used at my discretion without any further notice beyond these statements in this "Pick".

 

Am I the only one who think this makes no sense at all and can someone confirm if it does, or not. I so hope it doesn't. SL look credible to me but maybe I got this wrong and maybe a simple pic can bypass their rules? I ask cause I saw this pic 100s of time through SL over the years

[Alicia Sautereau]

They are in violation even for having it

[Madeline Blackbart]

If those people actually READ the terms of service they would find that a simple pic can not cricumvent that as terms of service says nothing about that. On top of that by using this program you are agreeing to those terms of service and no magic pic is going to make that change. It's a legal binding contract you sign basically agreeing to follow SL TOS. Those pics are a bit like the random legalize that show up on facebooks every so often. They spread like wildfire but are essentially meaningless.

[Malanya]

I don't know why people can't clearly understand the TOS and CS especially since they probably have read it to put that they can log your chat. It states clear as day that you Can't log chat and as I put in my own picks about that specific disclaimer people that state they can log your chat are nothing but drama seekers and IMO have had many run ins with other Residents and cause trouble, are in the middle of trouble all the time or seek out trouble. I found this out doing rentals for a year and a half all the drama and craziness that people seek out and the headache it causes rental businesses and even businesses in general when people whine about this and that, cheating and all the craziness that goes along with it. I specifically made that pick because trying to manage people that were surrounded by drama in their sl life and others trying to put you in the middle of their battles and personal issues with our tenants drove me crazy. Sorry I went off on a personal rant with that one but yes as Alicia put it simply it's a violation. Sorry for the rant.

[Dillon Levenque]

 

"Am I the only one who think this makes no sense at all..."

No, you are not. Far from it.

"...can someone confirm if it does, or not."

It makes no sense whatever, as you thought. It's total baloney, and as others have suggested or will suggest: by far your best course of action upon seeing something like that in a profile is to say nothing whatever. Not because it can later be used against you, but because anyone who has such a disclaimer is a completely whacko drama queen nitwit.

Of course, if that's your idea of a good time.....:smileywink:

[Drake1 Nightfire]

You can log chat all you want.. What you can't do is share private chat with others in SL. Outside of Sl you can do as you wish. LL has no authority to do anything if I decide to share a chat I have with someone to a friend via e-mail.

The official Second Life viewer has the option to save chat. If its in their viewer, it's obviously ok to do.

[Malanya]

Yes I know that. You can post anything you want outside of SL. I think most viewers allow you the option to save chat, IM and local chat. Usually with chat logging people use it against someone else inside of SL, use it to shame someone or bf/gf partner issues, that's what I was referring to. I was just pointing out to the OP that you can't log and share as all the "disclaimers" I have seen in profiles seem to be the same text copied from one to another and it doesn't mention anything about using it outside of SL. Still a good point to give to the OP that it can be shared outside of SL.

[GothGirl Demonia]

Yep but TOS only applies in SL  and there are many ways to disclose information without consent and nothing LL will do.

Also take a look at Covenant on RP sims they are popular for getting involved in OOC disputes without consent of all parties disclosing logs LL does nothing and even if they do its a 2-3 day suspension unless its RL information disclosed and worse.

In general just don't give out any information you dont want others to know about and always expect a knife in the back its how I live in online community's now and those who feel like Griefing, Botting peeps I know, or backstabbing take an arrow to the knee.

As for actual SL harassment thats easy to get around.

1. Login from different IP address, Hide MAC Address, or change network card.

2. Make new account.

Take a Note-Card with no Creator Name, or someone else name as creator copy/paste log.

Send the NoteCard to everyone you want, Log out of account pretend it never happend with your main.

3. Note remember to clean cache/viewer settings before and after, disable Media, and Voice when logged into SL.

Its a common problem thats happend for years especially in RP Community groups and Yes I wish LL would adapt more security measures to prevent griefing, phishing etc. But they dont.

[Amethyst Jetaime]

You cannot join SL and agree to the TOS and then later decide that parts of it don't apply to you because you put an ignorant disclaimer in your profile.

If people record conversations with you and then share them with others without your permission you can AR them in spite of what their silly disclaimer says.  I know this for a fact because I have AR'd someone for doing that and they were suspended.  LL of course doesn't tell you what they do because of privacy, but in this case the defender IM'd me after they were back from their suspension and bitterly complained about it to me.  I just laughed at them and told them that now they see how much that disclaimer is worth.

[Coby Foden]

Nobody can invalidate the TOS by stating something contrary to it in their profile.

It's like putting a sticker on one's car:

"By reading this sticker you agree that I will disregard traffic rules and if you have accident with me it is totally your own fault."

[Nyll Bergbahn]

This comes up regularly in Answers and the Forums. Personally I've only seen it a few times in profiles not hundreds and I'm in SL a very long time. I suspect people see it in another avatar's profile and think 'wow, I should have that in mine too' without stopping to think that it could be total rubbish. If you see that in a profile, you could send a polite note asking if that person is aware that the IM disclaimer is meaningless as nobody can break the TOS and it only serves to highlight that person as a drama queen. If the person is a real drama queen and gets uppity, don't discuss, say bye and mute immediately but some may say thanks, I didn't know, I'll remove it.

To be honest I don't read through the profiles of strangers who may IM me from time to time but then I don't say anything that I would care about if such a drama queen posted it somewhere else. The only people I talk confidentially to are close SL friends whom I've known for years and trust implicitly.

Disclosing IMs frequently rears its head in RP sims where admin/moderators may have to adjudicate and you may have to consent to have your IMs shared with them merely to participate and comply with the sim's rules. You can read the arguments for and against that in this thread. http://community.secondlife.com/t5/General-Discussions/DISCLAIMER-SHARE-IM-or-be-BANNED/td-p/353627

However, even in those circumstances, there is no need for a RP participant to have it in his/her personal profile.

[Drake1 Nightfire]

---

Nyll Bergbahn wrote:

This comes up regularly in Answers and the Forums. Personally I've only seen it a few times in profiles not hundreds and I'm in SL a very long time. I suspect people see it in another avatar's profile and think 'wow, I should have that in mine too' without stopping to think that it could be total rubbish.

If you see that in a profile, you could send a polite note asking if that person is aware that the IM disclaimer is meaningless as nobody can break the TOS and it only serves to highlight that person as a drama queen.

If the person is a real drama queen and gets uppity, don't discuss, say bye and mute immediately but some may say thanks, I didn't know, I'll remove it.

---

In my opinion, IMing someone who has this in their profile to notify them thay are breaking the TOS if they do this is asking for drama. I just LOL to my self and keep on walking. Why open yourself to attack?

As Amethyst said, if they share yor chat, AR them and keep on walking.

[Phil Deakins]

It makes perfect sense. The thing is that, if the person discloses your IMs in an LL property, such as SL and this forum, "at their discretion", and without your explicit consent, they can be penalised by LL if it is reported. In other words, as long as their discretion only means disclosure away from LL properties, then that statement makes perfect sense.

Or to put it another way... whilst making sense, the statement changes nothing - except that those reading it might prefer to stay away from the person because s/he's a dickhead.

[Qie Niangao]

---

... stay away from the person because s/he's a dickhead.

---

Stay away? Show a little respect, Phil! You're talking about the most popular role play community in Second Life.

[Ceka Cianci]

---

BadEddy wrote:

Very often I see people with a pic called something like TOS and when you read it you find a message that look like:

 

According to Linden Labs, disclosure of logs without prior consent in a violation of the ToS. I am clearly stating to you, that by IM'ing me, having read or not having read these statements, you consent to being logged and that those logs can be used at my discretion without any further notice beyond these statements in this "Pick".

 

Am I the only one who think this makes no sense at all and can someone confirm if it does, or not. I so hope it doesn't. SL look credible to me but maybe I got this wrong and maybe a simple pic can bypass their rules? I ask cause I saw this pic 100s of time through SL over the years

---

it's always fun to make up fake disclaimers that mock those that make these false disclaimers..

 

i get some good IM's at times with the ones i have made over the years..

 

one was..

Disclaimer!!:

If you IM me..

It gives me the right to go to your house

sit on your couch

eat all your popsicles

while watching your tv

ringing up big bills

on your pay per view..

Lub Ceka<3

 

my current one has been on there for about a year and is due for a change..

it says..

Disclaimer..

If you IM me it gives me the right to all your RL stuffs

 

 

just have fun with these things..it pisses the serious world off..and gives a giggle to the not so serious world.. hehehehe

 

[Syo Emerald]

There are even groups for people who hate these picks. I joined one of them, just for the nice title. But also, those picks are a clear sign to who I'm better not talking to. Also as soon as I see someone on my friendlist with this pick, I defriend them.

[squashy Beeswing]

I do the same, Syo.   That pick is but one indicator amongst many that the person is someone i'm not going to enjoy.   The TOS is crystal clear, yet for some reason they either don't get it or they think they're so super-smart that they can circumvent it.  Whether it's idiocy or arrogance, i'm staying well clear. 

[Ceka Cianci]

i saw in one guys profile while at help island that said.. because he was from 2006..the TOS didn't even apply to him..

LOL

 

i have no idea how to even start up a conversation after reading that load of buzzard puke..

 

 

[Syo Emerald]

You could ask him, if he states that because he wants to do griefing, f** a child or else. I bet thats an interesting start for a vivid conversation!

[Azanor]

When I see such a thing in somebody's profile I never IM them. I wonder how long those pick enteries would last if nobody would IM them either. 

[Melita Magic]

I just laugh at those 'disclaimers.' They are saying they dictate LL policy. They don't. 

What's more no 'contract' can be enforced with the line "having read this or not read this" - that in itself makes me wonder if they lost their mind.

Having read this post or not read this post, everyone in SL owes me 10,000 $L. There, that makes just as much sense, doesn't it?

[jwenting]

---

Ceka Cianci wrote:

i saw in one guys profile while at help island that said.. because he was from 2006..the TOS didn't even apply to him..

LOL

 

i have no idea how to even start up a conversation after reading that load of buzzard puke..

 

 

---

I'm usually divided between blocking them, ignoring them, or filing an AR against them for their TOS violation.

Usually end up doing at least the second, and sometimes the first and last as well.

[Nyll Bergbahn]

---

jwenting wrote:

I'm usually divided between blocking them, ignoring them, or filing an AR against them for their TOS violation.

Usually end up doing at least the second, and sometimes the first and last as well.

---

By all means block or ignore residents who have that silly disclaimer in their profiles but why waste Linden Lab's time submitting an AR when a TOS violation only occurs if they actually do disclose chat without consent in-world or on Linden Lab's website and in that instance, it would be the aggrieved party who would submit the AR, not you (unless you were the aggrieved party). Simply having the disclaimer is not a TOS violation.

 

[ColonelObvious]

---

Nyll Bergbahn wrote:

---

jwenting wrote:

I'm usually divided between blocking them, ignoring them, or filing an AR against them for their TOS violation.

Usually end up doing at least the second, and sometimes the first and last as well.

---

By all means block or ignore residents who have that silly disclaimer in their profiles but why waste Linden Lab's time submitting an AR when a TOS violation only occurs if they actually do disclose chat without consent in-world or on Linden Lab's website and in that instance, it would be the aggrieved party who would submit the AR, not you (unless you were the aggrieved party). Simply having the disclaimer is not a TOS violation.

 

---

Agreed.  The best course of action would be to mute them and place a note in the comment tab of their profile explaining why they are muted so you'll remember later if you cross paths again.  There is no reason to submit an AR for someone else's ignorance which can just as easily be remedied by a well-worded explanation from you or someone else who has the time.

Carry on.

[Phil Deakins]

---

jwenting wrote:

---

Ceka Cianci wrote:

i saw in one guys profile while at help island that said.. because he was from 2006..the TOS didn't even apply to him..

LOL

 

i have no idea how to even start up a conversation after reading that load of buzzard puke..

 

 

---

I'm usually divided between blocking them, ignoring them, or filing an AR against them for their TOS violation.

Usually end up doing at least the second, and sometimes the first and last as well.

---

It's not a ToS violation. ARing non-violations may be though