Second Life Statistics: Mesh Bodies

[Theresa Tennyson]

27 minutes ago, missyrideout said:

On that subject, since I'm already armchair quarterbacking other people's businesses with no qualifications or background: The reason Slink's market share fell so fast was the BOM update. Not the implementation (although alpha layers only were confusing for many consumers) but the rollout. They should have done what Maitreya did. Free updates for all. The complex convoluted range of products and bundles needed for a free update, a policy that in many cases required contacting the creator to find out how to proceed.  Yes, of course creators want to, and should, get paid for their work. But how many future sales and how much positive momentum did they lose in that moment when BOM was new and fresh and everyone wanted to check it out?

They did give free updates for all, for the product that the customer owned. The only thing that was possibly confusing was the procedure for updating to a free bundled body in addition to what you already owned.

[Lewis Luminos]

One of my girl alts has Maitreya with a Lelutka Evo head, the other is primarily Belleza Freya with Catwa head but recently started using Kalhene (which is really too skinny for her) and still looking for something similar shape to Freya that has BOM properly implemented. Kupra is, well, all booty, and that's not really the look I want for her.

For myself, I have Signature Gianni and recently switched head from Catwa to Lelutka. 

I wouldn't buy a new body until I see how it looks for clothing support a year after launch. I had high hopes for Signature Geralt and Signature Alice, for example, but neither of them have become popular despite the popularity of Gianni. Its no use getting a body that no-one is going to make clothes for, unless it already fits an existing brand's clothes.

Now, if someone came up with a better body than Gianni that fits Gianni clothing, or a lower-poly body that fits Legacy clothing, they'll make an absolute fortune...

[Janet Voxel]

1 hour ago, Theresa Tennyson said:

They did give free updates for all, for the product that the customer owned. The only thing that was possibly confusing was the procedure for updating to a free bundled body in addition to what you already owned.

I think they fixed that. By the time I came around to BoM (The only reason I didn't was because the skin I was wearing wasn't BoM), you would get the whole BoM body hands and feet with an update and a "classic" applier body. So I'm pretty sure they fixed that fast.

What really did it was a lot of creators dropped Hourglass for Legacy. I remember going to a few events where there was nothing for Hourglass, and not in the Freya sense where there still is, but some people keep saying nobody makes anything for Belleza anymore. There are whole events where you can only find a couple of things for Hourglass. It was already the least supported by creators at events, but legacy kind of drove a stake through its heart.

[Pussycat Catnap]

On 2/11/2021 at 5:56 PM, Scylla Rhiadra said:

It's a little disappointing, to be honest, that the two most popular bodies by far are either meh or hugely expensive and not completely (in my view) functional. And neither is as economical or, if you like, "environment-friendly" as Slink. I don't entirely understand how Maitreya gained its dominant position in the market, to be honest, and I'm a bit flabbergasted too by people's willingness to pay so much for the Legacy bodies which, while very nice, have some serious issues.

Maitreya gained massive ground when it came out about a year after Belleza and Belleza, as if often the case, needed and update and was taking their time. During that time Belleza fumbled massively by locking down new creator applications, and very few people had the 'rights' before the lockdown.

There were some other bodies at the time that had some popularity but not much - Eve was one for example.

People were demanding fitmesh outfits, merchants wanted to sell them, and Maitreya was there.

I don't recall the order of things - if TMP was before or after this. But at first they had one of those 'sign over your firstborn child' contracts to get the ability to make outfits for them... and so that only helped Maitreya more.

I've often heard it said, and even stated it myself - that Maitreya used to or maybe even still does have some deal for being exclusive. I'm no sure on this though - if it's true, and if it was easy to get approval if you went for that - at a time when everyone else was making approval difficult - it would help explain things even more.

 

As for Legacy...

There is a very long history in SL of people blaming LLs for lag. So even when people get bodies like Belleza or Legacy, they blame LL if it causes their lag to increase.

There's also a rather long history of people willing to sign up to locked in closed down systems, despite these so often vanishing on the change of winds in the market - like the TMP HUD not working for a few years, and some other AO, Security, and Vendor systems that have just up and vanished on folks. SL users are amazingly lacking in technical literacy, so they keep getting the wool pulled over their eyes time and time again.

Sometimes products improve... I used to be very critical of Maitreya. These days I feel it deserves it's top spot because it's doing things right.

 

[Pussycat Catnap]

On 2/17/2021 at 11:34 AM, missyrideout said:

On that subject, since I'm already armchair quarterbacking other people's businesses with no qualifications or background: The reason Slink's market share fell so fast was the BOM update. Not the implementation (although alpha layers only were confusing for many consumers) but the rollout.

Slink was slowly vanishing long before that.

Slink didn't collapse in popularity so much as deflate. Like a tire with a small leak that loses a little bit of air over time, and you never get it filled back up - after a year or two, you've got a flat.

I've not followed them enough to know why. But they haven't had the top spot since before even Belleza came out. And they never seemed to regain any 'wind in their sails' as time went on. I was not a fan of the look of their designs, and maybe others weren't as well. I just didn't like the style. BUT that doesn't seem to be enough of a reason given how we all have different tastes.

One thing to note is that among all the popular bodies out there - they all have a lot of 'smooth curves'. Be they slim like Maitreya or extreme like Kupra. They all seem to fit what you find when you see those clickbait website links with titles like '20 things prefer in women'... And slink... doesn't. Slink feels like the 'soviet woman' in comparison. And not the real Russian women, but the western stereotype in propaganda films that always seemed to be named 'Olga' and have a mean look... At least, that was my mental thought everytime I demo'd it. Various "In Communist Russia, Car drives you" jokes kept popping into my head...

 

[Paul Hexem]

4 hours ago, Pussycat Catnap said:

I've not followed them enough to know why.

I suspect it has to do with getting the dev kits. I tried once a while back.

Despite filling out their silly form and checking all the boxes, I was still denied. 

In contrast, other body makers have dev kits for free in vendors right next to their bodies. 

[FairreLilette]

On 2/17/2021 at 12:31 AM, Monica Querrien said:

If your body is not as popular, you run the chance of seeing something you really like, only for it to not made for your body. If you don't change your clothing a whole lot, then that's fine. If you like wearing the latest fashion, then that would suck.

In terms of being unique, the only thing people can own is their style. Everything else can be copied. Just because two people have Maitreya does not mean they can't be unique.

Yeah THIS 

If applying the same rule the original poster used, then all the Legacy bodies would look the same which many do now because of the veins in the breasts which are a certain give-away, and thus Legacy would look more all the same rather than Maitreya because I have made very curvy shapes for Maitreya and you cannot tell if it's Maitreya or Legacy once in a skirt.  I CAN even make the pony thighs on Maitreya.  So, there isn't that much difference.  The Legacy has more details on the belly which I like plus the hip bones on certain skins I've seen for Legacy bodies and I would love that for Maitreya as well.  A lot has to do with the skin too.  Plus, the gloss on the photos for Legacy are a dead give away as well.  

I like certain Legacy features on the new Legacy but I am fearful of the HUD being pulled if Legacy servers go down.  But, heck, if I decide to get one in the future, $20 dollars would not break me - I'd get over it.  

The best thing about Maitreya though is you can have or not have BECAUSE YOU DON'T LIKE IT just about every clothing or shoe.  Not so with other bodies.

I think LoveMomma has a chance here to do well also.  Better than those tummy talkers.

 

Edited March 19, 2021 by FairreLilette

[Rowan Amore]

The veins on the breasts are an addition and I've seen people with Maitreya use them also.  I did on my Maitreya when I used a lighter skin.  I also never use the gloss feature.  Those are all options.  I've seen more gloss since Kupra came out than on Legacy.  

[FairreLilette]

6 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

The veins on the breasts are an addition

I thought I saw on the Legacy demo it comes with breast veins.  Hmmmmmmm?  Now, I cannot remember for sure.

[Rowan Amore]

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Izzies-Breast-Veins-Stretch-Marks/15405395

[FairreLilette]

23 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Izzies-Breast-Veins-Stretch-Marks/15405395

Those aren't for Legacy, so Legacy does come with breast veins available then.  The only time I ever saw breast veins was when I saw that Legacy had that option but never before.  

[Rowan Amore]

9 minutes ago, FairreLilette said:

Those aren't for Legacy, so Legacy does come with breast veins available then.  The only time I ever saw breast veins was when I saw that Legacy had that option but never before.  

She's updated them.to BOM so they work on any BOM body.

[FairreLilette]

27 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

She's updated them.to BOM so they work on any BOM body.

Okay, just to get this correct...so the Legacy body nor the Perky comes with a breast vein option where you don't have to purchase additional veins or not?  I'm not talking additional purchases of veins...I'm asking if the Legacy or Perky version come WITH a vein option because why wouldn't I attribute breast veins to Legacy only if you had to buy something in addition?

Edited March 20, 2021 by FairreLilette

[Rowan Amore]

They do not come with breast veins.

[FairreLilette]

13 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

They do not come with breast veins.

Okay, then I got that mixed up somehow.  

[RunawayBunny]

  I have Maitreya because it is cheap nicely done and many clothes available for body type yay! 🎉

[Pussycat Catnap]

19 hours ago, Paul Hexem said:

I suspect it has to do with getting the dev kits. I tried once a while back.

Despite filling out their silly form and checking all the boxes, I was still denied. 

In contrast, other body makers have dev kits for free in vendors right next to their bodies. 

Yeah.

Especially in the early days a lot of brands were very 'protective' of their dev kits. Which was amazingly foolish as it just hindered their growth.

Imagine being a car maker, and you won't let any tire companies see the specs for your wheels... folks are gonna buy a different car.

I think that's gotten better now. Not in know though. But it always baffled me. If I'd been a mesh body maker I'd have been like they furry makers do it - put my body out mod and with a notecard in it that had a download to a DAE file with everything third party folks would need, and maybe even some links to learning blender in the hopes I could get more of my customers into making stuff.

- you'll notice that when a new furry body comes out, it's always like that, and they have a tendency to take off super fast and get a LOT of support really quickly. Limited only by the fact of how much smaller the furry community is.

 

[Florence Millar]

On 2/11/2021 at 4:52 PM, Nethya Emor said:

From a bunch of different SL sims, mostly just using Search and going around simhopping to gather all the data.

 

 

I can tell Ive never been to any of the sims you have, never seen one person I know with a legacy.

[True Vortex]

I'm just exploring the idea of giving SL a second chance. This article means a lot to me because I do enjoy making clothing in world. I was under the impression from FB and MarketPlace that many more used Belleza and Slink. I'm glad I saw this article before I committed a bunch of hours to texturizing clothes for mesh bodies no one actually bought. It turns out that photographers are the only ones who actually bought these bodies and unfortunately a bunch of people thought a market was there that wasn't. 

[Chris Corvinus]

On 2/11/2021 at 3:23 PM, Arduenn Schwartzman said:

8.5% of these... That's a lot of Arnolds out there on the grid. Where do they all hang out?

MC sims. 

[Beatrice Voxel]

So, first off, I use four mesh bodies "regularly", in order of preference/usage:

Slink Hourglass - my 'comfortable' body, one that fits my sense of proportions the closest.

Maitreya Lara - when there's clothes I REALLY like, but aren't available for Slink (and I've told designers this, I'm getting to the point where I will stop buying from them if they can't support but more than one or two bodies, I get that they have limited time and resources, but ... I have limited Lindens to spend, too.)

Belleza Freya - for SL pregnancies and BBW 'play', it seems to hold the best 'shape' when you expand certain proportions.  Not sure why the others go all egg/torpedo, I guess the rigging is a bit off.

DEV Nana - a GORGEOUS "fitness"body, not musclebound, but nicely defined.  "Muscle" skins that are made for it bring out the UV map really nicely, but normal skins still have a nice toned look to them.  THIS BODY NEEDS MORE ATTENTION as an everyday body, seriously.  It reshapes well (see above) and exudes a lovely confidence.  It comes with its own head, hands, and feet, but these can be swapped for Slink hands/feet decently well (there's a bit of clip) and with a decent neck blender works well with other bento heads.  Sadly, you can count the number of clothing makers that support it and not run out of fingers.  (This may be due to the body designer being a non-English speaker, and also being the creator/administrator of the SML Fitness mini-game - they do not have a lot of bandwidth for support issues.)

 

Bodies I refuse to buy, either because they're not well supported, because they're not well made, or because they're straight-up too expensive:

Kupra - I've tried the demo, it looks nice if you want the latest style of thicc, but frankly, it looks like a slightly toned down SKING Brazilia, and it does not respond to tummy changes hardly at all, why is that? 

Legacy - I was around during the TMP days.  The big gripe was that anything made for TMP (skins, clothing appliers, etc) all had to be uploaded to a third party server and thus give up chain of custody of your work.  That, and it's really pricey, and if you want a 'pregnant' version, you pay the same price again for slightly tweaked rigging and a different UV.  

LoveMomma - As above, it seems a lot of money to pay for a specialized body, and then pay again for an 'egg' to put thru their in-house 'system' to end up with a Zooby.  I'd rather just get the Zooby at the end, tbh.

Edited August 11, 2021 by Beatrice Voxel
adding a 'do not want' section

[Marianne Little]

@Pussycat Catnap, TMP came out before Maitreya. I remember how I bought my bodies. First it was WowMeh, but that one disappeared for legal reasons. Slink came out in June 2014. I did not like it so much but I bought it. Then TMP in July (I think) 2014, and I bought it because it looks so much better than Slink. I used TMP until Belleza Venus came out in Sept 2014 and I used it 1 week because it had some serious issues with hands, bouncing vayayay and neck fit. I don't remember why I had all that hate, but it became my massive buyers remorse in record time. The updates was so slow. I went back to TMP until Maitreya came out Christmas 2014.

@Theresa Tennysonto get a Slink female bundle, you had to own minimum 4 feet heights. The Kitten and Pointe was not used much, and paying 675 L as an addition just to get the bundle was not worth it for me. Slink had updated their feet to a DeLuxe pack in 2016 with 5 feet heights and HUD menu so we did not have to take feet on and off to get different heights. This DeLuxe feet pack was sold to a high price even if you had bought all previous 3 feet. No reduced price, pay up. I seem to remember it was 2600 L after a week of half price.

Slink did not send out a bundle update automatic as Maitreya did. And Maitreya just added 2 new feet heights without a higher cost. I think I had to update an alts male body by notecard. Men had paid only for 1 set of feet, of course.

I believe Maitreya did it right with their BoM upgrade too. Instead of choosing either a BoM body without alpha cuts or the body with alpha cuts and additional layers, Maitreya kept the Alpha Hud, took off the layers and let them be add-ons.

 

[Vanity Fair]

Interesting survey results, and a good, recent snapshot of the mesh head and body market. I’m so glad someone decided to step into the void left by Strawberry Singh!

The rapid rise in popularity of the Inthium Kupra body explains why vendors such as Kalhene are coming out with thicker, curvier bodies (Erika). Obviously there’s a market there, although I’m not sure how any new body maker is going to convince fashion designers to rig for YET ANOTHER mesh body. (By the way, the Kalhene Analexa body is 99% compaible with Maitreya clothing and footwear, and you get a head, skins, hair, and a starter wardrobe as part of the package. All you need to add is an AO and you’re all set to stroll the grid! Flat chested and petite chested and transgendered versions are also included, you don’t have to pay extra for them. I think it’s a great deal!)

Over the years, I myself have used the following male and female mesh bodies:

WOMEN: Maitreya Lara, Meshbody Legacy, Belleza Freya, Altamura (both free and paid), eBody regular and curvy (free versions), Lucybody Atenea (free via Midnight Madness board in the store; Maitreya-compatible for clothing, Slink-compatible for shoes), and Kalhene Analexa (also Maitreya-compatible). I have found that most clothing designed for Maitreya fits Altamura bodies with a minimum of fuss (tops fit better than bottoms, though).

My favourite is Maitreya Lara because everybody designs for them! Kalhene Analexa would come second, because I can wear almost all my Maitreya clothing and shoes on them, and the developer often issues updates to the bodies (she’s already on version 4.1, I think). 

MEN: Signature Gianni, Belleza Jake, Meshbody Legacy, Niramyth Aesthetic, Altamura (free and paid), plus a bunch of freebie and dollarbie mesh bodies over the years. I’ve also used EXMACHINA (free and paid), but it’s hard to find clothing for them. 

As for heads, I have picked up and tested literally every possible free and inexpensive mesh head on the grid over the past 4 years I’ve been blogging (male, female, and unisex), and I have no particular favourites (although I have bought male and female heads from Catwa in the past). I quite like Logo, LAQ, and LeLutka, though! And of course, you can’t beat the free Strong Face head group gift from Genus; I turn to it time and again when styling a freebie alt. 

[WereBeast Alpha]

Signature is my favorite male mesh body as for Female I like Maitreya Lara is what I have on my female account I used Aesthetic but I didn't like how giant size it was and I have tweaked signature to look less muscle and more lean.

[SpiritSparrow Skydancer]

On 2/11/2021 at 10:14 PM, Paul Hexem said:

The problem with mesh bodies is you're stuck wearing a body based on the clothes you want vs the body you actually like.

Bodies that are more affordable and more superior on a technical level have much lower market shares because no one makes clothes for them, for some reason.

because if you make for lara, 10 people will buy. If you make from Erika 2 people buy.  Those 2 people are not worth their time so, they do not bother.