New Linden Lab / Second Life Mesh Avatars!!

[martianjew]

I decided to try out one of these new mesh avatars that the Lindens are now allowing the new joiners to choose from. I have to say that I extremely like the idea behind it, however, (you had to know this was coming) I do feel as though there should be some major adjusting permissions allowed. You are not allowed to edit the shape of the avatar ( I understand new people do not quite understand how to do that when they first join, but still) so that it can be more customized. The shape of the current mesh avatar from the Lindens resembles a bodybuilding man, even if you choose the female avatar. Now this would be great if every person that joined Second Life ( man or woman ) wanted to be that. I just feel as though some editting permissions to the shape would be great.....just saying.

Anyhow, like I said before I really think that the idea is awesome but not everyone wants to be stuck with the default shape.

 

Thanks for reading! :matte-motes-grin:

[Bryce Davenport]

I dont think they made the shape editable because .... the face mophs dont work .... so if you put on another shape ... you still have the same face epic fail ... epic fail ... there is sooooooo much they could have done ... not that hard really ... but it does have to be done in the viewer code for everyone to see. 

[Chic Aeon]

You can change the shape by wearing a different shape and modding it. That does NOT however change the face. LOTS of other differences, some very good, some not so much.

 

My full afternoon of testing and lots of info can be found here:  http://chicatphilsplace.blogspot.com/2014/05/the-new-sl-avatars-how-do-they-rate.html

 

[Sassy Romano]

An excellent write up Chic.

 

I see a world of confusion and frustration ahead with the burden of explaining to the poor newbie customer being dumped into the lap of merchants, to explain why their clothes don't work, why their animations don't work, properly, why their facial emote hud doesn't work.

 

Refunds from marketplace being a pain as it requires a support ticket from the merchant to get refunded commission back from LL.

 

Whether these avatars look good is one thing in isolation from the big picture, one which is clearly not visible to LL.

 

Presumably there's a whole heap of information from LL explaining to the newb why most of the shape sliders don't work, or why their clothing doesn't work and what to do? Or why alphas don't work, etc.?

Thought not.

[Conifer Dada]

Here is one of the new mesh avatars, unadjusted, standing beside me.   

[Coby Foden]

I wonder why they made the female mesh avatars uglier than the male ones?  :smileysurprised: :robottongue:

[Marianne Little]

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Coby Foden wrote:

I wonder why they made the female mesh avatars uglier than the male ones?  :smileysurprised: :robottongue:

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Because men* don't change their appearance from newbies so quick, and then we females can have something better to look at? :matte-motes-tongue:

* Not the men who post in the Vanity thread of course....

[SaraCarena]

"...the poor newbie customer....."

Yep these avatars should all come with a notecard titled........ WARNING!!!

Do not buy any clothes for this avatar from the gazillions of stores you see in second life, they just won`t work.

 

[Theresa Tennyson]

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Sassy Romano wrote:

An excellent write up Chic.

 

I see a world of confusion and frustration ahead with the burden of explaining to the poor newbie customer being dumped into the lap of merchants, to explain why their clothes don't work, why their animations don't work, properly, why their facial emote hud doesn't work.

 

Refunds from marketplace being a pain as it requires a support ticket from the merchant to get refunded commission back from LL.

 

Whether these avatars look good is one thing in isolation from the big picture, one which is clearly not visible to LL.

 

Presumably there's a whole heap of information from LL explaining to the newb why most of the shape sliders don't work, or why their clothing doesn't work and what to do? Or why alphas don't work, etc.?

Thought not.

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I think you're exaggerating the problem, possibly because you came into SL before "starter avatars." When I entered SL my avatar was Female Rocker Outfit, who I had such a deep connection with that she ended up being kicked to the curb in the first twenty minutes when I saw, "Oh, there's a schoolgirl? Kewl." Female Student Outfit lasted three days before I went out and bought a new shape and skin combination, which I thought of as an "avatar," and it was only then that I really got into clothes, etc.

You won't need to explain why shape sliders don't work to a newb with one of the mesh avatars because, with the no-mod shape, the sliders Aren't. Even. THERE. They're inaccessible - try it. As far as clothes, that's why the new Marketplace listings have the "Works With Mesh Avatars/Works With Classic Avatars" category.

[Teagan Tobias]

I tried to try it but I can't get a “People” avatar. I got the toolbox button and opened it and clicked on an avatar under people and nothing happens. I get a circle of dots blinking and then nothing. Is there a trick to getting one of the avatars?

[Coby Foden]

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Teagan Tobias wrote:

I tried to try it but I can't get a “People” avatar. I got the toolbox button and opened it and clicked on an avatar under people and nothing happens. I get a circle of dots blinking and then nothing. Is there a trick to getting one of the avatars?

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Sometimes it happens, nothing shows up at all. Must be some loading issue I guess. Then again, sometimes they do work. Keep trying, maybe in a different location. For me yesterday all avatar selections showed nothing. Today everything shows - the new mesh avatars as well the old ones.

[Sassy Romano]

We will see, time will tell.

 

The problem with the marketplace "works with" type of avatar is that it is poorly implemented, restrictive and exclusive.

 

Items can work with both classic and fitted mesh avatars and also different brands but no way to accurately set all of the details in the listing,

 

I'm just getting tired, really tired of repeating lack of foresight and coherent development.

[Innula Zenovka]

Open the Library section of your inventory and simply drag the appropriate sub-folder onto your avatar.    They're all identified as being mesh.   They're all subfolders under "Clothes" I think (I can't get in to check) -- they are in the Library somewhere but you do have to look for them a bit.

[Teagan Tobias]

I had to turn on NoInventoryLibrary to get the avatar. I have had it off for years. But setting it to false and then clicking on the avatar, it loaded in my inventory and worked right away. And the modify shape is unusable.

I logged after setting it, don't know if that was needed or not but I did.

[Bryce Davenport]

There is a bug with Advanced graphics ... This video I made shows the issue ... 

[Pierre Ceriano]

What to say without the risk of being kicked out from Second Life ?

As it sounds a newcomers repellent, and for the future of the game, I sincerly hope the Linden team will quickly improve these avatars, especially the female ones (first time of my second life I see a lady with divergent squint breast). I love this game and sincerly trust the Lindens but this is a totally mess ; I don't have the shadow of a positive feedback from my friends.

Please review your plans, put the matter back on the drawing-board or hire professional CGs !

One thing is certain , creators of mesh avatars don't have to worry about it !

The picture for the new divergent squint breast ; left a new Second Life avatar, right a new generation avatar made by a creator of fitted mesh avatars :

 

 

[Rhys Goode]

OMG.  A female avatar that looks even worse than the default avatar.  And this is meant to help retain newbies?

My first impulse was to look for the UV maps and have some fun. But the female avatar is copy only, so no such luck.  Then I undressed it had a close look. The shoulder joints - they look like they were done with pipecleaners.  And the crotch area reminds me of nothing so much as gumby.

A nice enough demonstration of the technology, but coyote ugly is not the best base for it. 

 

[Conifer Dada]

I emphasise again - it would be much better to improve the existing system avatar mesh in such a way that texture layers still fit.  Then there would be no need for fitted mesh avatars.  

If an improved 'system' avatar is developed, then it might be possible even to create more realistic obese avatars, with a slider setting for arm angle, so that hands don't disappear into hips.

 

[Phil Deakins]

I just tried them all - male and female (except vampires) - and I have to say there are some seriously ugly faces there. In fact, almost all of them are. The only female one that got even close to being alright is Sara, and she doesn't quite make it as high as 'only alright'. Nevertheless, I'm using her for my alt at the moment because my alt doesn't have a decent skin-shape combination. She's just an alt that doesn't go out. It may not last, though, because I use her for positioning animations and she may be too short for that.

I don't see the clothes differences between original and mesh avatars becoming significant, simply because I can't imagine anyone wanting to stay with one of these mesh efforts after they've seen some of the lovely faces that there are, and that they could have, in SL.I see the actual use of these mesh efforts as being very short-lived by each individual who starts out on one.

QUESTION: Are the Wolfman's pants supposed to have the skin showing through, or is it that the pants simply don't fit right?

[Theresa Tennyson]

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Pierre Ceriano wrote:

One thing is certain , creators of mesh avatars don't have to worry about it !

 

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That's the whole point - would you rather that a company that has an interest in their members selling things gave away free things that would kill an already existing market?

I was hoping that the new avatars would have been made by consultation with avatar makers to develop a de facto standard, but I can understand how that would anger those who felt shut out. I suspect the goal was to make the new starter avatars just good enough to get people interested in something better.

[Pussycat Catnap]

A lot of comment on the new avatars in various places.

One good thing from them: notice how far your arms go down the hips on them. Then go back to a 'classic avatar' as they are now being called and look at the same thing.

That will help people trying to improve their shape - try to copy the same length on your "classic" avatar... While you can't, the closer you can get, the more natural you'll start to feel (but at first it will look weird... takes a day or two to get used to).

It would be nice if the shapes for the new ones were mod so this wouldn't be a guessing game.

I'll hold my peace on other criticisms.

[Bryce Davenport]

There was a group of Mesh designers asked to join a privet forum ( we had to sign a NDA)  we saw numerous problems with Fitted Mesh, we commented, offered our help, asked for UV maps, asked for more information, told them all the issues we saw as well as our concerns about future problems.... extremely very little was convey back to us. Even the files that we where suppose to use for fitted mesh are NOT the same as the new avatars even though we where supposedly going to make items for the new fitted mesh avatars.... which would have made rigging to fitted mesh a ton easier. Alot of the current issues with these avatars as well as fitted mesh in general could be fixed rather easily ... I just dont understand why LL will not use some of the suggestions proposed by the community. For one .. the issue with the mesh heads not being able to to use the face sliders such as for the eyes, nose and lips.. there is already Morph target parameters in the avatar_lad.xml etc... why not add a few more lines of code to include the new meshes. The original default avatar is a mesh... I dont understand why they can not include the new ones. (I am not a programmer, I do realize the abovt statement might require more than what I have just said.) Secondly they really need to give out the UV maps of the new avatars so skin and tattoo designers can give people more options. These are just a few examples. 

[Coby Foden]

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Theresa Tennyson wrote:

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Pierre Ceriano wrote:

One thing is certain , creators of mesh avatars don't have to worry about it!

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That's the whole

point

- would you rather that a company that has an interest in their members selling things gave away free things that would kill an already existing market?

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I wonder, is it so that Linden Lab refuses to make a new - more detailed, good topology, good proportions - default avatar for all to enjoy, just because it would affect the business of those designers who make all kinds of mesh body add-ons and even complete mesh avatars - which only purpose for consumer is to hide the bad default avatar?

I start to suspect that there is a secret plot going on - between some designers and Linden Lab. Personal financial gain for some designers go before the good for everybody. :smileysurprised: :smileysad: :smileywink:

Wouldn't it be much better if the default avatar shape was very good - even excellent? Then there would be no need for all the crazy mesh add ons-to hide the default avatar. No problem in buying new clothes and skins - like with mesh avatars which all need their own specific accessories.

Would the mesh designers be out of job with no income if the default avatar was excellent? Of course not, they could use their talent in creating awesome clothes, skins, animations, animals, houses, vehicles, furniture, and what not. Personally I consider all the avatar body mesh add-ons and complete mesh avatars a very bad route to go to. Everything is incompatible in them with other creators' similar items. There is no standard - like there is with default avatar.

 

[Coby Foden]

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Phil Deakins wrote:

 - and I have to say there are some seriously ugly faces there. In fact, almost all of them are.

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Yes, the new starter mesh avatars are really ugly, especially the female ones. Yuck!

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Phil Deakins wrote:

The only female one that got even close to being alright is Sara, and she doesn't quite make it as high as 'only alright'. Nevertheless, I'm using her for my alt at the moment because my alt doesn't have a decent skin-shape combination. She's just an alt that doesn't go out. It may not last, though, because I use her for positioning animations and she may be too short for that.

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Yeah, I'm sure that Sara, being 1.85 meters [6 feet 53/64 inches] tall female, is way too short for your furniture. :smileywink:

 

Anyway, you can wear a modifiable shape with all those mesh avatars, instead of the provided no mod ones. Wearing modifiable shape you can adjust the shape of the mesh avatar in many ways, even the height to fit your furniture. What you cannot do is to modify the frozen face.

[KarenMichelle Lane]

Is Sara the new Ruth?