How “viewer adept” are you?

[cheesecurd]

So today I was playing around with other variants of my primary avatar and wanted to use the SL body, mesh addition version. Put everything on and realized that the avatar is nsfw by default. No worries, I have pants.

My pants do not have an alpha and I have 12 L$, so I had mostly broken pants showing my thighs.

So I was going to make an alpha, and had no idea how to do that.

But i figured whatever, I’m a furry, I don’t need pants, I’ll just use the SFW avatar version and go bottomless. 
Well, to make the avatar SFW I needed to move a texture from the avatars accessories folder to change the skin texture I was using. And I have no idea how to do that.

And it was this moment of realization that “oh my god I am a complete brainlet” and can’t figure out these simple things without a guide. 
30 minutes later and yeah, I have a sfw avatar and a custom shorts alpha, but aaaaaaaaaa

Feels like my IQ hit room temperature, and it’s October so that’s pretty low.

But this got me thinking on a point of discussion. How competent are you with the slightly more finicky parts of SL? Do you know how to do stuff beyond adding things to your avatar and running through the world?

 

I once met someone who hadn’t figured out the “add” feature and was just certain they would never have hands and couldn’t wear anything other than shirt + pants + shoes. Dude found hair he liked and decided it was worth not having eyes. Telling him how to “add” things to the same body slot blew his mind.

[Tari Landar]

If it helps, the library has alphas in it

Actually, you should check out the library, because it has tons of stuff in it, a lot of stuff that many (maybe most? I dunno) don't know are in there. I find stuff now and then in there and am like...hmmm, when did YOU get here. 

But, don't feel bad, because even if some people aren't willing to admit it, we have ALL had those "DOH" moments, no matter how long we've been here, no matter how much we know (or think we know, lol), we all have them.  I forget crap I damn well knew I once knew all the time, lol. I also find out things that I should've known but for whatever reason, did not. 

There is a lot I know simply because I'm a  curious lil nugget and there isn't much I can do to actually break anything (break might not be the right word, but hopefully you get my point) so, why not play with all the buttons   I figure it's the best way to learn, just like when I was new and would go around sitting on everything (ok I still do this, but it's mostly for fun now, lol), clicking everything, pushing all the buttons. I also learned how to build not just by throwing prims on the ground, but also taking things apart, especially library and full perm stuff, lol. I'm grateful for people that make copy items for this reason, it's also how I learned lsl-what I do know of it, admittedly little compared to many. 

I'm always finding things I didn't know, reading forums, group chats, just messing about with things inworld. You're never too old to learn new tricks, and you're never too new to find old ones either. 

[LittleMe Jewell]

50 minutes ago, cheesecurd said:

How competent are you with the slightly more finicky parts of SL? Do you know how to do stuff beyond adding things to your avatar and running through the world?

I know quite a bit, but I have no doubt that even after a dozen years here there are still likely some basic things that I never learned because I never needed to.  

We don't know what we don't know............

[Selene Gregoire]

Even those of us who worked viewer support for more than 5 years don't know everything there is to know. Not even the Lindens do. It's an ongoing learning process for all of us. 

[FairreLilette]

It wasn't the viewer so much that baffled me when I arrived here...it was all these appliers everywhere.  I just did not get it.  

I just expected things to go over my Classic avatar until I FINALLY saw there was a full avatar ALPHA.  Duh!   I was kicking myself for that one because I should have realized the Classic has to be covered but I did not at first.  

Sometimes, we do learn things one at a time here.

Never fear asking questions from friends and groups.

I found a lot of groups and that's what gets me through.

And, sometimes I don't read all the notecards or even look through the whole folder like I should.  That I am trying to get better at - actually reading the instructions stuff comes with.  

We do need to read a lot of stuff here.  I'll tell you with building, I write out everything and it takes a long time to write out all the instructions and explain about hover heights, hide and show scripts, and a million and one things.  We need to read everything because there are items in the wrong category.  One which is really bad, is non-full perm items in the full perm category.

Edited October 11, 2019 by FairreLilette

[Mollymews]

i have the standard LL viewer pretty much sussed.  Some of the Debug Settings are a bit obscure tho, and I still have to look those ones up

the TPV viewer I have sussed is Catznip, which I really only use because it allows more than 512m of graphics memory which reduces texture thrashing by quite a bit. If/when the standard LL viewer ever does the same then I would not use Catznip or any other TPV on a regular basis at all

i also have a pretty good understanding of Firestorm, Cool and Black Dragon, but is more from a nosey pov than anything else, see what is/isn't, and I don't use them on any regular basis

[Maitimo]

The only viewer I know well is Firestorm; I don't use any others. I have a pretty good understanding of content creation and modification; I can't make mesh (can't get my head around the software for it) but I can build with regular prims, make system-layer clothing, re-texture mesh items, and I can make my own alphas, with a bit of trial-and-error.

Scripting, on the other hand, may as well be written in Mongolian, for all the understanding I have of it.

[Talligurl]

I am able to figure out what I need to know. I make art so I am able to do the simple task of working with a basic square prim. I can work with pose balls to get pictures, and modify poses when they are not quite right. I read about all sorts of advanced things people do, but it usually just sounds like work to me. I come here to have fun, not to work. I do not understand the whole BOM thing, or why I would even want it. I know people have said it lets you wear old stuff. But I want to wear new stuff.

[Rolig Loon]

2 hours ago, Matty Luminos said:

Scripting, on the other hand, may as well be written in Mongolian, for all the understanding I have of it.

It is, and that's part of the appeal. Someone started another thread the other day, asking what keeps us logging in here day after day.  In my own response, I forgot to mention the obvious: I come here because SL is a gigantic puzzle.  Over the years, I have marveled over the way that some people view the steep learning curve here as a negative, as if it's some fatal flaw.  Say, what?

This Second Life, for crying out loud!  How much of First Life have you figured out? I have been alive for many decades, getting smarter every day, and there are times when I swear that I am pleased that I know how to tie my own shoes.  Why should Second Life be any different?  Would it be as intriguing and challenging without mysterious buttons, unwritten instructions, and scripts in Mongolian?

To put it simply, one of the big reasons I keep coming in world is that I know that I will find a new puzzle every day.  The ones that I solved last year keep changing, too, so I have to go back and relearn them.  It's marvelous.  If I ever get SL so completely figured out that it becomes boring, I'll quit.

Edited October 12, 2019 by Rolig Loon
typos. as always.

[Maitimo]

2 minutes ago, Rolig Loon said:

It is, and that's part of the appeal. Someone started another thread the other day, asking what keeps us logging in here day after day.  In my own response, I forgot to mention the obvious: I come here because SL is a gigantic puzzle.  Over the years, I have marveled over the way that some people view the steep learning curve here as a negative, as if it's some fatal flaw.  Say, what?

This Second Life, for crying out loud!  How much of First Life have you figured out? I have been alive for many decades, getting smarter every day, and there are times when I swear that I am pleased that I know how to tie my own shoes.  Why should Second Life be any different?  Would it be as intriguing and challenging without mysterious buttons, unwritten instructions, and scripts in Mongolian?

To put it simply, one of the big reasons I keep coming in world is that I know that I will find a new puzzle every day.  The ones that I solved last year keep changing, too, so I have to go back and relearn them.  It's marvelous.  If I every get SL so completely figured out that it becomes boring, I'll quit.

I guess I'm just not intelligent enough for that part of SL. I dislike puzzles for the same reason - I'm never smart enough to solve them (unless they're puzzles for kids).

[Rolig Loon]

I can't resist ...  😁

 

[Clara Hollyberry]

16 hours ago, cheesecurd said:

But this got me thinking on a point of discussion. How competent are you with the slightly more finicky parts of SL? Do you know how to do stuff beyond adding things to your avatar and running through the world?

Yup!  Not everything of course, but I make it my business to learn whatever I can wherever I can.  Keep the old sponge-noggin saturated with learnings.  I'm comfortable with two viewers but adept with four, learning two more right now.  (From a user's perspective, not an engineer's perspective)

The quickest way I learn what a viewer can do is to examine the debug settings menu offering; then I play with those until I either break something or improve something about my SL experience.  But, also, learning what the default library equips us with was a giant leap forward, back in the day, in terms of items to use or rip apart and scripts to use or modify.  I am a curious exploratory clicky-find-out type.

[Talligurl]

1 hour ago, Matty Luminos said:

I'm never smart enough to solve them (unless they're puzzles for kids).

But that is one of the beauties of SL, you can just choose to work the kids puzzles if you want, as opposed to RL, that often tells you that today you have to deal with very hard adult puzzles.

[FairreLilette]

5 hours ago, Matty Luminos said:

 

Scripting, on the other hand, may as well be written in Mongolian, for all the understanding I have of it.

I thought I would NEVER be able to understand scripts.  Then, an idea popped into my head last Halloween.  

It took me two months to do all the scripts I have for my Haunted House.  I even have chairs you can ride on, like an invisible ghost is moving you around.

However, if you don't have an idea....maybe it's not necessary.

But, I also can say, scripting is not for everyone.  It gave me a literal headache.  It's terrible beginning.  Builder's Brewery helped me inworld a lot!  Now I belong to the inworld group called SCRIPTS and they have scripting schools too to direct you too.

But, again, scripting is something you have to want to undertake.  There is Blender and I feel it is just not for me yet plus there are things I have wanted to learn in Photoshop for fifteen years.  So, I'm learning the Photoshop stuff now.  It's a lot of fun!  

[Selene Gregoire]

3 hours ago, Matty Luminos said:

I guess I'm just not intelligent enough for that part of SL. I dislike puzzles for the same reason - I'm never smart enough to solve them (unless they're puzzles for kids).

No Matty. You are intelligent enough. The problem is LSL is unique to SL and isn't anything like any other "coding system" in use. I've been considered a "genius" since I was a child but even I can't wrap my brain around LSL enough to script. I can tweak, sometimes I get lucky and can add something and it works (usually not) but actually scripting an object from scratch? Never going to happen.

[Maitimo]

14 minutes ago, Selene Gregoire said:

No Matty. You are intelligent enough. The problem is LSL is unique to SL and isn't anything like any other "coding system" in use. I've been considered a "genius" since I was a child but even I can't wrap my brain around LSL enough to script. I can tweak, sometimes I get lucky and can add something and it works (usually not) but actually scripting an object from scratch? Never going to happen.

It's not just LSL. I can't understand any kind of programming. I just can't seem to think in the right way or understand how to put any of it together.

[Selene Gregoire]

29 minutes ago, Matty Luminos said:

It's not just LSL. I can't understand any kind of programming. I just can't seem to think in the right way or understand how to put any of it together.

I know the feeling all too well. Many people can't. It's just that there are enough of them that can't ever admit it or are never in a position to need to admit it that we never know about so we end up looking like the unintelligent few when that is really not the case. 

Even the forums I used to own... I could never do what I really wanted because I couldn't code. So I learned how to change the skins, starting with just learning how to change colors. Start with the "easy" things. If you can learn to tweak a little it will help to start understanding some of it. Just don't set your sights on ever actually being able to write one from scratch. It's the same method I used to drop the 50+ pounds I had gained. I set my first goal to lose 30 pounds. Once I was down to 150, I set my next goal at 140, then 130, then 125. I am now down to what I weighed before I ever had to prove to other half that the amount of food I ate was more than enough and to eat like he wanted me to I'd pack on the pounds fast. Which is precisely what happened. I went from 120 to 180+ in just a few months and it took years to get it all off. Not the best decision I ever made but it got him off my back about it which relieved a good bit of stress on me.

When I log in later today, I'll try to remember to send you a swing script I have and you can play with how high it swings. Maybe something will click for you and open up more tweaking possibilities for you. Like making the movement smoother. If you start getting frustrated with it, walk away for a while, or go do something else in SL for a while, then come back to it with a fresh mind and try again. And if you need help, it's just a post or IM away. 

Edited October 12, 2019 by Selene Gregoire

[Conifer Dada]

After 13 years in SL I think I know my way around the LL viewer . . . . .or do I ??

I sort of know what I know, but there are probably lots of other things that I don't even know that I don't know !!

Edited October 12, 2019 by Conifer Dada

[Lyssa Greymoon]

I can usually get it started.

[FairreLilette]

3 hours ago, Matty Luminos said:

It's not just LSL. I can't understand any kind of programming. I just can't seem to think in the right way or understand how to put any of it together.

OFF TOPIC:

 

@Matty Luminos try using SAVE instead of EDIT to save the changes you make in the script.

EDIT will take you to an external editor.  If you are not using an external editor, just hit SAVE after making changes.  

Mostly what you are going to change are numbers and in decimals which is difficult for (some) Americans because we did not even learn decimals in school when I went to school.

See below...where it says 5.0...let's say you want to change it to 60 seconds...then you just type in there the number 60 and take 5.0 out and then hit SAVE.  Selene is right, you need to start with some easy ones.  And, you don't need to type the zero such as seconds 60.0...I don't know why that extra zero is in there with the 5.0?  It doesn't need it a lot of times.   

_____________________________________________________

float TIME = 5.0; //This number sets your timer in seconds.
//▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ 

Edited October 12, 2019 by FairreLilette

[Tari Landar]

3 hours ago, Matty Luminos said:

It's not just LSL. I can't understand any kind of programming. I just can't seem to think in the right way or understand how to put any of it together.

Programming is not easy and anyone that tells you otherwise-even if it's seemingly their forte, is lying to you. You are literally having to learn a whole new language, even if you use similar enough programming languages, you're still learning new languages every single time. I will flat out tell anyone that asks that programming is a royal PITA, it can take years and years to master-assuming you ever actually do (I believe no one that says they're an expert in it, to be honest, lol). I love it-I also hate it, I'm pretty damn good at it-but I also suck at it, a couple of my degrees are programming degrees.. it's still a royal PITA, loi. (and lsl, despite my programming knowledge, has always thrown me for a loop, and I really can't explain why, lol). 

I love puzzles too, though I am way better at ones for kids-or at least, less complicated ones, and I'm not always very good at them either, giving it a try is better than most, though. Not everyone is cut out for ANY kind of programming and that's perfectly okay. I bet you're amazing at things I couldn't possibly ever understand. Some of my favorite creators in sl couldn't script their way out of a paper bag with 99% of the script written for them...but they're still amazing creators. That's why we have folks that write scripts for us  

[Rolig Loon]

2 minutes ago, Tari Landar said:

Not everyone is cut out for ANY kind of programming and that's perfectly okay. I bet you're amazing at things I couldn't possibly ever understand. Some of my favorite creators in sl couldn't script their way out of a paper bag with 99% of the script written for them...but they're still amazing creators. That's why we have folks that write scripts for us  

This is certainly true.  We tell kids that they can be anything that they set their minds to, but that's baloney (and any kid can see through that).  Some people have a talent for words, some can draw, some have a mind for numbers, and some are way more coordinated physically than the rest of us.  Just because you're not the best at something, though, doesn't mean you're totally out of the game. 

I have always felt that I have a knack for math.  It's one of the things that drew me into a career in the sciences and helps me be -- speaking humbly -- a pretty good scripter in SL.  Still, I have known a few people who are really good at math and can run circles around me, and I have known a few truly impressive scripters (like Void Singer, who held my hand as I tiptoed into LSL years ago).  It's very humbling.  If I had let that discourage me from doing the best that I can, though, I would have missed out on a lot of fun research and wouldn't being having nearly as much fun in SL.  The point is that we not only have different talents but we all have our own limits, and what we end up being able to do depends on how much we decide to exercise the talents we have.

[Gabriele Graves]

I have gained a certain amount of proficiency during my time.  I am often discovering and learning new things with it though.

[Maitimo]

1 hour ago, Rolig Loon said:

This is certainly true.  We tell kids that they can be anything that they set their minds to, but that's baloney (and any kid can see through that).  Some people have a talent for words, some can draw, some have a mind for numbers, and some are way more coordinated physically than the rest of us. 

I think a lot of this is genetic.  Take me for example; my strongest talents are art. And nearly everyone in my family is talented at art in some way. My dad was a professional photographer and a cartoonist, among other things. My mum could draw portraits in pencil to near-photographic quality. My sister is a graphic designer. My grandfather was a signwriter (painted signs for shops and pubs). Musical ability is another thing that runs in the family too, though I missed out on that particular gift.

Edited October 12, 2019 by Matty Luminos

[Rolig Loon]

47 minutes ago, Matty Luminos said:

I think a lot of this is genetic.

That's one of those heavily researched questions.  If I read the current literature correctly, you are at least partly right.  There probably is a genetic component.  Of course, in your case, you also had the advantage of growing up among talented artists who encouraged you, showed you how to polish your latent skills, and were there to commiserate when things went wrong.   So it's a little of both genetics and the home environment.  In my case, I grew up with a father and sister who were very talented artists and a mother who was not, and nobody with a particular interest in math or the sciences.  What this tells us, of course, is that (1) the influences of genetics and environment are hard to untangle and (2) you really can't reach much of a conclusion by looking at just two cases.