Is Lindenlab choosing a doomed path for SL ? Tell us if the EEP and PBR introduction changed the way you play SL

[RicDelMoro]

My experience with EEP : I made some very simple skies and I use them everywhere I go. With PBR I try to deactivate the maximum of features as possible.
I hated all these arrogant changes that force us to buy stronger computers. With the PBR it is worse, it puts more strain on the machine and socialization is becoming unfeasible.
Users who like simple things like driving and doing some roleplaying in door don't care at all about these "improvements" that LL introduced.
If you're the type of guy who goes out to buy a new computer every time Lindelab's mood changes, congratulations, but not me, I'm a normal person who plays just for fun and I have thousands of other leisure options on the Web.
As a result of these beautiful news,my gameplay has deteriorated,caused an effect opposite to that desired by LL. It's sad to say, but currently I avoid places with more people and very complex landscapes, I've been playing in a kind of "survival mode". I know if I step outside my box my PC will overheat or crash. And the time I spend online in SL has decreased. I keep logging into SL out of sheer stubbornness, even though my rational side is saying: "go do something else"...This is just my opinion, if you are happy with all these changes tell us here.
 

Edited June 25 by Quartz Mole
removed suicide reference from title

[sirhc DeSantis]

Nope. In all my time in SL I have never had a box that was good enough - you adapt. Learn, explore, take it as far as possible. Took me 2 years to see the first 'materials' thingy and yet still here (I got a bday present vcard that could finally show it). PBR runs like a drunken slug for me but yay its rather good. Having fun with what I can currently do.

Oh and what is this 'gameplay' of which you speak?

[AlbaneClaray]

No, this is not only your opinion. Being a landscaper and estate owner, since yesterday I am seriously thinking to sell all my lands and stop all activities on SL. This new PBR totally ruined my SL. Of course I uninstalled the PBR firestorm version to come back to the previous one but I know it is only a temporarily solution. That is really the badest experience.

[Arduenn Schwartzman]

30 minutes ago, RicDelMoro said:

Is Lindenlab choosing a suicidal path for SL ?

Imagine, years ago, a sinister cabal of Linden Lab board members and developers gathering in the situation room, carefully and meticulously planning the demise of their own livelyhood.

[RicDelMoro]

What Lindenlab doesn't seem to understand: for us, SL is not a problematic member of our family that we have to live with by force, or an arm or a leg of our body that cannot be dismembered...hahahaha, this metaverse is just one more to choose, and we can just log out and forget it forever

[Istelathis]

I don't think they have much of a choice, as technology continues to progress, people are likely to move on to other platforms as they start to provide more services to their user base.  LL could keep the graphics the same, and keep the platform in a maintenance mode, but eventually it might come to be that we find that few people log in.  I know this is regarding graphics, but that is just one facet of it all, they have to keep up with the times or will likely end up like active worlds.

I don't think Linden is trying to destroy itself, or is being short sighted, they are trying to adapt in a changing world.  But, there are TPVs out there that should give your SL an extended life, look for CoolVL as an example, it should keep your computer running for a while yet.

But.. 

That is just my opinion.  

[Sid Nagy]

1 minute ago, RicDelMoro said:

What Lindenlab doesn't seem to understand: for us, SL is not a problematic member of our family that we have to live with by force, or an arm or a leg of our body that cannot be dismembered...hahahaha, this metaverse is just one more to choose, and we can just log out and forget it forever

The sky has fallen so often in Second Life.
PBR is there and will not go away any time soon. Not everybody will take the time and make the effort to learn how to build with it. Same happened with the arrival of sculpties and mesh objects. 

The gab between creators and consumers has gotten a big wider once again with the introduction of PBR for sure. And there will be some creators and residents that will call it a day and trow in the towel. Others will see opportunities and will step in.

I personally let the whole PBR thingy happen and wait and see how things develop.

[RicDelMoro]

[AmeliaJ08]

Getting the impression some people in these forums think GPUs work a bit like how [somebody reportedly] thinks humans work. No, working them harder doesn't kill them faster. GPU utilization is good, SL previously did not utilize hardware properly. Now it only somewhat utilizes it properly.

It's fine, just learn something new today and even if you refuse to the absolute most you would have to do is use a different EEP or crank up the intensity of your lighting. You can also run this just fine on hardware from around 2016 onwards so I'm really not sure where this idea that you need a 4090 is coming from, people need to stop being so ridiculous. It runs great on GPUs you can pick up for less than $100 on ebay.

Even if you steadfastly refuse to just learn anything you can disable it all and aside from a few extra features in the Build window texture tab you won't see much difference.

 

 

 

 

Edited June 23 by Quartz Mole
Moderator redacted reference to First Life figure

[Sid Nagy]

One thing is for sure, on the SLB sims that hold LL builds one can see how easily one can overdue with PBR effects.
With region settings the builds are .... eh.... overdone?
Ugly? 
Nasty?
Well. let's be friendly and I'll say, it's not my style. 
PBR possibilities should be used way more sparsely and subtle IMHO.

[AmeliaJ08]

16 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

One thing is for sure, on the SLB sims that hold LL builds one can see how easily one can overdue with PBR effects.
With region settings the builds are .... eh.... overdone?
Ugly? 
Nasty?
Well. let's be friendly and I'll say, it's not my style. 
PBR possibilities should be used way more sparsely and subtle IMHO.

I was very impressed by the PBR Winter Wonderland build last year, it looked great! not seen the SL21B builds yet, I always take forever to visit these things.

 

[Arduenn Schwartzman]

38 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

PBR possibilities should be used way more sparsely and subtle IMHO.

I wholeheartedly agree with this.

PBR is like word processors. While you can assign to every word in your text another font, color or style, it doesn't mean you have to.

[Qie Niangao]

49 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

One thing is for sure, on the SLB sims that hold LL builds one can see how easily one can overdue with PBR effects.
With region settings the builds are .... eh.... overdone?

The region EEP seems garish, at least parts of the day cycle, but it's no way to see the exhibits anyway. That does make the SLB exhibition showcase challenging because you really can't cam anywhere to see anything properly, you must be on the specific exhibit parcel to get the intended effects. It's been like that forever if you count parcel audio and media, but it's hard to see PBR from outside the EEP (and reflection probes) for which it was built.

[ETA: Oh, sorry, I now recognize you said "LL builds" and I've hardly peeked into those yet. I guess those PBR effects can't be blamed on the "wrong" EEP.]

Edited June 22 by Qie Niangao
oops, misread the post I quoted

[Jackson Redstar]

if SL creators follow the usual course with PBR now, soon every other texture we will see will either be shiny or a mirror surface! lol Shiny sand at the beach, mirror finish on the asphalt roads, brick building gleaming in the sunlight,,,,,

[sirhc DeSantis]

Funny really. I am not an FS user (as weapon of choice) but had a play and some of the effects are fascinating. I may be getting negative FPS but for me that is fine for exploration. See no reason to not provide my clients with the best even if it slows me to a crawl. Oh and yes I run a gt 620 - so olde skool it pre dates Stonehenge.

Of course, I am a terrible person - not here to entertain anyone else.

[Love Zhaoying]

2 hours ago, Istelathis said:

I don't think they have much of a choice, as technology continues to progress, people are likely to move on to other platforms as they start to provide more services to their user base.  LL could keep the graphics the same, and keep the platform in a maintenance mode, but eventually it might come to be that we find that few people log in.  I know this is regarding graphics, but that is just one facet of it all, they have to keep up with the times or will likely end up like active worlds.

I don't think Linden is trying to destroy itself, or is being short sighted, they are trying to adapt in a changing world.  But, there are TPVs out there that should give your SL an extended life, look for CoolVL as an example, it should keep your computer running for a while yet.

But.. 

That is just my opinion.  

Even if it looked great and was seamless (no "work" required for it to look great) many would hate it merely if it looks different. People hate change.

[RicDelMoro]

"Overengineering can kill your product"  I suggest you guys take a look at this interesting article here :

https://www.mindtheproduct.com/overengineering-can-kill-your-product/

[Theresa Tennyson]

3 hours ago, RicDelMoro said:

My experience with EEP : I made some very simple skies and I use them everywhere I go. With PBR I try to deactivate the maximum of features as possible.
I hated all these arrogant changes that force us to buy stronger computers. With the PBR it is worse, it puts more strain on the machine and socialization is becoming unfeasible.
Users who like simple things like driving and doing some roleplaying in door don't care at all about these "improvements" that LL introduced.
If you're the type of guy who goes out to buy a new computer every time Lindelab's mood changes, congratulations, but not me, I'm a normal person who plays just for fun and I have thousands of other leisure options on the Web.
As a result of these beautiful news,my gameplay has deteriorated,caused an effect opposite to that desired by LL. It's sad to say, but currently I avoid places with more people and very complex landscapes, I've been playing in a kind of "survival mode". I know if I step outside my box my PC will overheat or crash. And the time I spend online in SL has decreased. I keep logging into SL out of sheer stubbornness, even though my rational side is saying: "go do something else"...This is just my opinion, if you are happy with all these changes tell us here.
 

Every minute you spend complaining is a minute you could be using to make things better for yourself.

[Love Zhaoying]

49 minutes ago, Arduenn Schwartzman said:

I wholeheartedly agree with this.

PBR is like word processors. While you can assign to every word in your text another font, color or style, it doesn't mean you have to.

Gen Z: Grandpa, look at the pretty fonts and colors!

Gen X: Kids these days can't read or write cursive.

Baby Boomers: I wrote a letter, help me scan it into the computer. "A fax?" No, a PDF.

[Love Zhaoying]

3 minutes ago, Theresa Tennyson said:

Every minute you spend complaining is a minute you could be using to make things better for yourself.

Yes! 

[Love Zhaoying]

54 minutes ago, Qie Niangao said:

The region EEP seems garish, at least parts of the day cycle, but it's no way to see the exhibits anyway. That does make the SLB exhibition showcase challenging because you really can't cam anywhere to see anything properly, you must be on the specific exhibit parcel to get the intended effects. It's been like that forever if you count parcel audio and media, but it's hard to see PBR from outside the EEP (and reflection probes) for which it was built.

[ETA: Oh, sorry, I now recognize you said "LL builds" and I've hardly peeked into those yet. I guess those PBR effects can't be blamed on the "wrong" EEP.]

But how much of SL21B is actually "LL Builds", not "built by users for SL21B"?

[RicDelMoro]

3 minutes ago, Theresa Tennyson said:

Every minute you spend complaining is a minute you could be using to make things better for yourself.

 I log in SL to have some fun, not to work, I already have my job in real life . By the way, I guess I will watch some TV now.

[Ceka Cianci]

I haven't tried the PBR too much really.. The only viewer I have that has PBR on it right now is Black Dragon and I haven't been on that one in a bit.

Myself I kind of did like the Windlight better than the EEP. But That could be because it messed up my structure that I already had in place, with windlight.

I'm sure I'll adjust to PBR, just like anything else that changes here..

The only thing that really changed for me at all with the windlight and EEP changes was  taking pictures, but I got used to it and put in a new structure.. It just sucked having to restructure again is all..

Over all for the rest of my second life, I doubt PBR will make too much of a dent and might even be a little better once I figure it out.. hehehe

[Extrude Ragu]

3 hours ago, RicDelMoro said:

I know if I step outside my box my PC will overheat or crash

If your computer is overheating it's likely drawing too many frames.

Avatar -> Preferences->Rendering->Limit Framerate

Also, blast the insides with a can of compressed air to remove dust.

Aside from usual lowering graphics settings, one can also set the debug setting RenderResolutionMultiplier to like 0.7 and that will reduce the work of the gpu without reducing visuals too much. If your screen zooms in to one side you need to disable anti-aliasing.

 

Edited June 22 by Extrude Ragu

[Love Zhaoying]

"My Barbie house is the wrong shade of pink now, and everybody else is shiny too. I'm supposed to be the shiniest!"