Persephone Emerald Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 (edited) 1 hour ago, Love Zhaoying said: But 1 human year is approximately 7 dog years! A dog or wolf is a teen in their 2nd year, a young adult when they enter their 3rd year. Edited May 10 by Persephone Emerald 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scylla Rhiadra Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 14 minutes ago, Madi Melodious said: How long is temporary? A month, six months, two years? By the time that rolls around the one who thought up the policy or is a proponent of it might have been shown the door. I'm optimistic that it will turn out this way. Besides, most of us have figure out how to meet the new requirements even with old bodies. 12 minutes ago, Sydelle Zanzibar said: I honestly thought she meant till the June deadline, but then it sounded like it might depend on how much content creators put out there. We can't all buy new skins that aren't yet for sale, so I think its them just trying to be reasonable. 8 minutes ago, Madi Melodious said: That is actually more reasonable. As more skins and bodies come online or meet the new requirements, I really doubt there will be to much push back on this topic. Let's be honest, how are they going to enforce this? Go around to every child avatar and ask them to remove their pants for modesty inspection? I thought it was telling that Keira didn't repeat in a dogmatic way "the end of June," but rather spoke much more vaguely about a deadline for this. My guess is they are rethinking the original deadline. It's even possible they may be reconsidering the original policy. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MoiraKathleen Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 10 minutes ago, Madi Melodious said: That is actually more reasonable. As more skins and bodies come online or meet the new requirements, I really doubt there will be to much push back on this topic. Let's be honest, how are they going to enforce this? Go around to every child avatar and ask them to remove their pants for modesty inspection? In terms of enforcement, I can't imagine avatars being checked by LL governance unless there was an AR for something more serious being investigated. I would hope that the average resident isn't going to be going around checking and submitting AR's just for the lack of proper modesty skins - that would be kind of creepy, if so, and if there was a pattern of an individual doing that, I would hope that Governance would take that up as an issue with that individual. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sadvhi Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 I identify as a baby kitten when I'm wearing my Dinkie baby avatar, but it would be so silly to have to buy new fur with modesty layers. Though I'm sure I'd look super cute in a onesie 🤣 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arwyn Quandry Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 Someone said this in the video: Quote [14:49:40] Name Redacted: There was a really important and well written document sent out to the team from important creators from the community via the forum, is that going to be addressed today? Anyone have a link to what they're talking about? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Persephone Emerald Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 36 minutes ago, Sammy Huntsman said: Also, what is up with having the back removed on Female Child avatars? 35 minutes ago, Sydelle Zanzibar said: What is sexual about a thin strip on a females' back that the rest of the back wouldn't be? The issue is that a bra-like upper body garment will show through many styles of clothing. Of course a bra-like garment on a baby or toddler would also look ridiculous and make SL a huge laughing stock in the gaming and virtual world culture. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaerolleClaudel Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 2 minutes ago, Persephone Emerald said: The issue is that a bra-like upper body garment will show through many styles of clothing. Of course a bra-like garment on a baby or toddler would also look ridiculous and make SL a huge laughing stock in the gaming and virtual world culture. 🤐 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee Pancake Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 1 hour ago, Love Zhaoying said: Do we know yet if Tinies and Dinkies are "presenting" as under 18? The last ones I saw were following a human around and calling her mommy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madi Melodious Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 13 minutes ago, MoiraKathleen said: In terms of enforcement, I can't imagine avatars being checked by LL governance unless there was an AR for something more serious being investigated. I would hope that the average resident isn't going to be going around checking and submitting AR's just for the lack of proper modesty skins - that would be kind of creepy, if so, and if there was a pattern of an individual doing that, I would hope that Governance would take that up as an issue with that individual. This thought has occurred to me. I would like to think the lindens are above prowling the grid derending children's cloths. Also want to think they would react in just the opposite way if someone filed a AR report after derending a child av and found while the child was wearing cloths and properly alpha there was no modesty patch. Who would you rather have on your grid? A fully dressed and alpha'ed child av just doing her thing, or a pervert roaming around derending children's clothing? 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Persephone Emerald Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 31 minutes ago, Sydelle Zanzibar said: I honestly thought she meant till the June deadline, but then it sounded like it might depend on how much content creators put out there. We can't all buy new skins that aren't yet for sale, so I think its them just trying to be reasonable. As a reminder, skins with built in underwear already exist in the Inventory Library. I'd guess there must be some PG skins on MP too. I have several saved from old skin fairs and Fantasy Faire (pre-mesh bodies days). 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sydelle Zanzibar Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 2 minutes ago, Persephone Emerald said: As a reminder, skins with built in underwear already exist in the Inventory Library. I'd guess there must be some PG skins on MP too. I have several saved from old skin fairs and Fantasy Faire (pre-mesh bodies days). Honestly, i didnt check the library. I did look for a skin with undies the day the TOS dropped and could only find one. I was able to buy one today meant for the purpose, so creators are already busy. Not much out there, but it exists. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalificent Corvinus Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 4 minutes ago, Madi Melodious said: I would like to think the lindens are above prowling the grid derending children's cloths. The Lindens don't NEED to derender your clothes. They can LOOK IN YOU INVVENTORY at the current outfit folder, and check the properties of what you are wearing, including creator name and date produced. They check you out because somebody filed an AR against you for anything, and hmmm, skin currently worn "Toxic AR Clickbait Inc NAKED Kid Skin No. 5" created 2017, that's not a post 2024 ToS compliant skin. BANHAMMER! 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diamond Marchant Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 Speculation on WHY the Clarification of policy disallowing ***** happened... I believe that the timing of the scandal-that-shall-not-be-named verdict and the announcement of changes to the child-avatar policy is COINCIDENTAL. The later is driven by the first topic in Enhancing Our World Together: Important Updates for the Second Life Community, the Second Life Mobile App. In order to be accepted into the Apple App Store, an app must adhere to Apple's App Review Guidelines. Sections 1.1 and 1.2 address "objectionable" and "user-generated" content. An app must adhere to the guidelines by default. I speculate that the recent changes are necessary to meet this requirement. The timeline is determined by when Linden Lab expects to place the SL Mobile App in the Apple App Store. There will be NO compromise on this policy, only innocuous tweaks. 1 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animats Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 Sigh. This is a huge headache. It might get much worse after January 20th. I dislike having to quote something this political here, but it is, unfortunately, relevant. The quote below is from "Project 2025", a planning document for the next conservative Presidential administration. This is the consensus position of the party and campaign leadership. There are plans already written and people recruited to make this happen. This is not a fringe position. "The next conservative President must make the institutions of American civil society hard targets for woke culture warriors. This starts with deleting the terms sexual orientation and gender identity (“SOGI”), diversity, equity, and inclusion (“DEI”), gender, gender equality, gender equity, gender awareness, gender-sensitive, abortion, reproductive health, reproductive rights, and any other term used to deprive Americans of their First Amendment rights out of every federal rule, agency regulation, contract, grant, regulation, and piece of legislation that exists. Pornography, manifested today in the omnipresent propagation of transgender ideology and sexualization of children, for instance, is not a political Gordian knot inextricably binding up disparate claims about free speech, property rights, sexual liberation, and child welfare. It has no claim to First Amendment protection. Its purveyors are child predators and misogynistic exploiters of women. Their product is as addictive as any illicit drug and as psychologically destructive as any crime. Pornography should be outlawed. The people who produce and distribute it should be imprisoned. Educators and public librarians who purvey it should be classed as registered sex offenders. And telecommunications and technology firms that facilitate its spread should be shuttered." That's all I'm going to say about this, that being the part relevant to Second Life. Wikipedia has a summary. 7 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalificent Corvinus Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 3 minutes ago, diamond Marchant said: Speculation on WHY the Clarification of policy disallowing ***** happened... I believe that the timing of the scandal-that-shall-not-be-named verdict and the announcement of changes to the child-avatar policy is COINCIDENTAL. The later is driven by the first topic in Enhancing Our World Together: Important Updates for the Second Life Community, the Second Life Mobile App. In order to be accepted into the Apple App Store, an app must adhere to Apple's App Review Guidelines. Sections 1.1 and 1.2 address "objectionable" and "user-generated" content. An app must adhere to the guidelines by default. I speculate that the recent changes are necessary to meet this requirement. The timeline is determined by when Linden Lab expects to place the SL Mobile App in the Apple App Store. There will be NO compromise on this policy, only innocuous tweaks. Yeah, SL will NEVER comply with the Awful Mac App Store guidelnes. Never. "1.1.2 Realistic portrayals of people or animals being killed, maimed, tortured, or abused, or content that encourages violence. “Enemies” within the context of a game cannot solely target a specific race, culture, real government, corporation, or any other real entity." That rules out the WWIII Combat stuff. "1.1.4 Overtly sexual or pornographic material, defined as “explicit descriptions or displays of sexual organs or activities intended to stimulate erotic rather than aesthetic or emotional feelings.” This includes “hookup” apps and other apps that may include pornography or be used to facilitate prostitution, or human trafficking and exploitation." Goodbye Zindra. And since SL is almost entirely User Generated Content. "1.2 User-Generated Content Apps with user-generated content present particular challenges, ranging from intellectual property infringement to anonymous bullying. To prevent abuse, apps with user-generated content or social networking services must include: So massive restrictions on what creators can create. "Apps with user-generated content or services that end up being used primarily for pornographic content, Chatroulette-style experiences, objectification of real people (e.g. “hot-or-not” voting), making physical threats, or bullying do not belong on the App Store and may be removed without notice." They deleted the SL app again. LMFAO. Zindra and Skill Gaming regions. There are other clauses in there that would make Clubs in SSL problematic, because "Music Streaming Services", in-game currency, even the Premium subscription would have to meet a bucket load of restrictions. possibly including LL guaranteeing members will get regular content updates. Even "Charitie" in SL might havve problems. "Unless you are an approved nonprofit or otherwise permitted under Section 3.2.1 (vi) above, collecting funds within the app for charities and fundraisers. Apps that seek to raise money for such causes must be free on the App Store and may only collect funds outside of the app, such as via Safari or SMS." Making SL 100% compliant with Awful Mac App rules will basically destroy SL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ineffable Mote Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 (edited) Grown adults playing with toddler avatars in second life can figure out how to wear shirts or swim tops. Mostly this is a bunch of users not wanting to follow new rules knowing that if they make holes and water as much of it down as they possibly can get away with, giggles and all, it'll be back to status quo in no time. I give it 18 months tops, but 6 sounds more probable. I'm not sure how relevant the app store thing is, given the amount of "objectionable" content in SL even without child avis. Although guidelines are just guidelines and look good on paper, I'm sure arrangements could be made. Edited May 10 by Ineffable Mote typos 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalificent Corvinus Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 4 minutes ago, Ineffable Mote said: Although guidelines and just guidelines and look good on paper, I'm sure arrangements could be made. Remember the previous SL mobile App, the one made exclusively for Awful Mac whyPhones that they submitted to the app store, then "mysteriously" abandoned? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madi Melodious Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 (edited) 44 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said: They check you out because somebody filed an AR against you for anything, and hmmm, skin currently worn "Toxic AR Clickbait Inc NAKED Kid Skin No. 5" created 2017, that's not a post 2024 ToS compliant skin. BANHAMMER! Where you are the meeting? I didn't think so. As I've said, we are already finding ways to bring old inventory into compliance. We have even come up with a way to bring my body up to date. I'm sure we'll all be fine. I would suggest you touch grass but I doubt that would help, but don't worry I'm sure someone out there someone will love you one day. And I hope the hatred that seems to run so deep in your heart doesn't destroy your soul. 💖 Be well, and may the Goddess bless you. 💖 Edited May 10 by Madi Melodious 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee Pancake Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 (edited) 43 minutes ago, diamond Marchant said: Speculation on WHY the Clarification of policy disallowing ***** happened... I believe that the timing of the scandal-that-shall-not-be-named verdict and the announcement of changes to the child-avatar policy is COINCIDENTAL. The later is driven by the first topic in Enhancing Our World Together: Important Updates for the Second Life Community, the Second Life Mobile App. I would hope in that case that @Linden Lab could be open and honest with us. We did our best when we work together. We drove the early adoption of SL and its massive initial growth. We evangelized. We pivoted our entire online identities to match our SL names. We brought everyone we knew here and more besides. We felt involved with the leadership, direction and vision for the platform. They were on the ground with us. We don't do those things anymore. We stopped doing those things when Philip & Cory moved on, when the leadership and culture went cold and corporate. When CEO after CEO took the wealth we generated and ploughed it into endless side quests. We watched in silent horror as they tried to shove us aside for business customers who never came, as they bought and fumbled desura and avatars united. The vision got lost, the culture changed and a persistent adversarial undertone has become as much of the platform as the prims left out to rot. We turned inward to protect the bonds we had made here, there has been no growth since. No matter what LL have tried. Nothing moves the needle. Even the world breaking didn't reverse the malaise. We're not bringing people in, we're holding on for dear life. We need leadership providing vision, hope and confidence for the future. Not reacting to chaos, putting out fires and herding kittens. Our bard, Philip has moved on and is an impossible act to follow. Patch is a glass canon, Grumpity weaves spells in secret. We need a tank and a paladin front and center, and for grids sake don't forget a healer. Figureheads matter. Edited May 10 by Coffee Pancake 2 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalificent Corvinus Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 Just now, Madi Melodious said: Where you are the meeting? I didn't think so. Of course I wasn't, I was in bed asleep. Did you forget that not all SecondLifers are like you? We live different lives, in different corners of the world. And my point wasn't about the dumb meeting. It was about your foolish assumption that the only way a Linden can tell you not ToS compliant is by "derendering your clothes". 4 minutes ago, Madi Melodious said: I would suggest you touch grass The moron who invented that claptrap should be given an enema with a flamethrower. 5 minutes ago, Madi Melodious said: And I hope the hatred that seems to run so deep in your heart doesn't destroy your soul Religious debate is against the rules here, and I don't believe in souls or other superstitious mumbo jumbo. 6 minutes ago, Madi Melodious said: Be well. Be smarter. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee Pancake Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 19 minutes ago, Ineffable Mote said: I'm not sure how relevant the app store thing is, given the amount of "objectionable" content in SL even without child avis. Although guidelines and just guidelines and look good on paper, I'm sure arrangements could be made. iOS includes a web browser. Our evil is small and weird next to the content that can deliver. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpiritSparrow Skydancer Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 (edited) The Karate kid character was 17. He practiced karate. He spared with many opponents and he overcame the bullies by practicing and using the lesson of Mr Miyagi. Danial son was hurt many times but he prevailed. Edited May 10 by SpiritSparrow Skydancer This is in response to a post about kid combat. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madi Melodious Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 5 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said: *snipped and not read* If you say so. 💖 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalificent Corvinus Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 4 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said: iOS includes a web browser. Our evil is small and weird next to the content that can deliver. Nobody ever accused Awful Mac of abiding by their own rules for others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalificent Corvinus Posted May 10 Share Posted May 10 Just now, Madi Melodious said: If you say so. 💖 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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