Fees are too high!(?)

[Arielle Popstar]

7 minutes ago, Antonioo Giano said:

The thing is.. I'm not really speaking for myself. I could afford too. The problem is not me wanting to pay less because I can't afford a SIM. I don't get any SIM because I wouldn't know what to do with it, honestly. The problem are people that could make very good stuff to make SL more "entertaining" that aren't willing to rent for the high fees.

People who need lots of land to build on can always go to Opensimulator  and either get land for 1/10 the price or even set up their own sims for free and build there, then just come here for the social aspects.

[Paulsian]

1 minute ago, Antonioo Giano said:

The problem are people that could make very good stuff to make SL more "entertaining" that aren't willing to rent for the high fees.

I think we all would like more official content / activities. Bellisseria has a bunch of new content. Not sure if you're following the progress of Bellisseria the new linden homes project. I can't describe how neat it is seeing official content being added to the world in real time being built by real people and not AI. 

In this world there is so much to do and learn it seems like there's nothing to do. There's everything to do. Maybe start at natoma region learn to build and follow that up with about year later with a 3rd party mesh building program like blender. That would take time to learn. 

You don't know what you would do with a region, would it be entertaining to me or other residents with whatever you come up with? spending the 1 time setup fee and the monthly fees for an entire region for someone with no building experience would be a waste of money. It would take years to learn how to be entertaining to the masses but region filled up with prototypes. 

It would be expensive to get something up and running.

Having the feeling of wasting money even 9 dollars a month feels bad, I feel for the people like oh this is soo neat I'm going to buy a region and people are going to visit, in the end they move on. I'm unsure about region turn over rate but assume it's extremely high and as far as those people returning to SL likely minimal. 

It's one of the greatest puzzles in SL. 

[Antonioo Giano]

Just now, Ceka Cianci said:

It's cheaper to own or rent smaller than a sim.. The sim owner themselves just need to make sure they have enough coming in from the rent to cover the sim.

If they own a bunch of sims, they just need enough coming from all their sims to cover all their sims..

They may get more money from some sims than others that help with the costs..

 

The problem is that everyone answering is speaking about their own experience or speaking like the problem is for a "single" person that wants to make their nice home in SL.
Having a home in SL is a plus and is not necessary for SL to "survive".
I speak more about people making big things that often require a full sim or even more than one.
Is also true that we can barely fill what we have now, but that is also a consequence of high costs.
If you want to make a new rp place with a specific theme and you want to try to rent "homes" or places.. you are "forced"  to keep the price high to pay for your sim.
Plus renting is not guaranteed, if the owner decides to quit the sim, all your stuff is gone and LL will not protect you against that because that is just a private deal you take with another person.


 

[Silent Mistwalker]

13 minutes ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

*inhales* Boating/sailing, fishing, surfing, swimming, scuba diving, horseback riding, motorcycle riding, auto racing, hoverboarding, roller skating, ice skating, exploring, hot air ballooning, gaming, roleplaying, shopping, scripting, combat gaming, wrestling, running a business, clubbing, dancing, DJing, hosting, vampiring, demoning, mermaiding, dragoning, furrying, creating avatars, styling avatars, photography, machinima, fashion modeling, blogging, blogging about fashion, blogging about bloggers blogging about fashion, selling, buying, hunting for freebies, socializing, adult activities, creating art, admiring art, buying art, showcasing art, life sim games (BeYou), breedables, raising pets, raising breedable pets, petting breedables, decorating, landscaping and terraforming, playing house, building houses, selling houses, running dating services, planning weddings, hosting weddings, crashing weddings (in more ways than one!), getting divorced, roleplaying a divorce lawyer and profiting off of divorces... *exhales*

No wonder I'm so bored. The few things that do hold my interest, I've done to death over the years. I need some new ideas. 🤔

[Ceka Cianci]

1 minute ago, Antonioo Giano said:

The problem is that everyone answering is speaking about their own experience or speaking like the problem is for a "single" person that wants to make their nice home in SL.
Having a home in SL is a plus and is not necessary for SL to "survive".
I speak more about people making big things that often require a full sim or even more than one.
Is also true that we can barely fill what we have now, but that is also a consequence of high costs.
If you want to make a new rp place with a specific theme and you want to try to rent "homes" or places.. you are "forced"  to keep the price high to pay for your sim.
Plus renting is not guaranteed, if the owner decides to quit the sim, all your stuff is gone and LL will not protect you against that because that is just a private deal you take with another person.


 

I was just responding to,How is it cheaper to rent land..

I thought that covered more than just my experience.

[Ayashe Ninetails]

1 minute ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

No wonder I'm so bored. The few things that do hold my interest, I've done to death over the years. I need some new ideas. 🤔

I got like that for a bit. I dipped out of SL for yeaaaaaaaaars. But that's because some of my closest friends left and I was feeling the lonely! 

But when I came back in 2020, I realized...not a whole lot had changed, really. The same stuff I used to do I could still do. Now with mesh and better lighting! 😂 

[Paulsian]

8 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

No wonder I'm so bored. The few things that do hold my interest, I've done to death over the years. I need some new ideas. 🤔

I have one relax. Not that you need to just a general activity everyone can try to do. 

Edited June 12, 2022 by Paulsian
clarification

[Antonioo Giano]

Just now, Ceka Cianci said:

I was just responding to,How is it cheaper to rent land..

I thought that covered more than just my experience.

Yes but my "question" (which wasn't a question) was meant for a full SIM, not for a parcel, which of course.. is cheaper to rent
As I said my focus is not about what I do in SL, or to get a sim cheaper to make my home. But to make people that are able to build amazing things that can improve the experience in SL for everyone.
But hey if the majority of people are ok with how SL is now and they think it could last longer-term and LL thinks that everything is good, i'm not here to make anyone change their mind, is just a discussion topic and I was expecting the majority of people would disagree with it. But I want to clarify what the focus of my topic was.
If I want a home for myself I just pay 99usd per year and get my 1024 sqm Linden Home which is totally affordable for everyone. But again. Is not that the problem I'm pointing at

[Silent Mistwalker]

1 minute ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

I got like that for a bit. I dipped out of SL for yeaaaaaaaaars. But that's because some of my closest friends left and I was feeling the lonely! 

But when I came back in 2020, I realized...not a whole lot had changed, really. The same stuff I used to do I could still do. Now with mesh and better lighting! 😂 

Me, too. I was gone for 5 years, I think. Long time. Came back in 2018. There have been improvements. Even the people have somewhat improved. 🤭

[Silent Mistwalker]

2 minutes ago, Antonioo Giano said:

If I want a home for myself I just pay 99usd per year and get my 1024 sqm Linden Home which is totally affordable for everyone.

No, it isn't.

[LittleMe Jewell]

2 hours ago, Antonioo Giano said:

I remember back in time when SL was a thing (2008-2009.. around those years)

Ahhh, nostalgia.   So often, our memories distort the past and we try to hang on to what we think was a better time.  Tis a common misconception, held by many.

[LittleMe Jewell]

4 minutes ago, Antonioo Giano said:

If I want a home for myself I just pay 99usd per year and get my 1024 sqm Linden Home which is totally affordable for everyone.

Besides yearning for the past, you apparently have little understand of today's real world finances.  There are many, many people in SL that cannot afford to pay $99 a month for a piece of virtual property with a virtual house on it.  In some countries, $99 is a literal fortune.

Edited June 12, 2022 by LittleMe Jewell

[Antonioo Giano]

Just now, LittleMe Jewell said:

Ahhh, nostalgia.   So often, our memories distort the past and we try to hang on to what we think was a better time.  Tis a common misconception, held by many.

I don't think. It personally was.
Just as an example, back in time (and speaking just about my country) we were having a football (soccer) tournament, sponsored from a real life company with something like 10-15 teams made from 15-20 players each.
Today it would be totally impossible: 1 the RL companies are gone. 2 People are way less than that.
I'm not that old to have nostalgia.. My life is much better now and i'm in my 30s SL was better back then and there were more people and stuff to do. For me is a fact.
But yeah. That's personal. The point is.. Real Life companies are going into stuff like Decentraland and the Sandbox that are like 1/100 of what SL is (SL is waaay better in any aspect). Why LL can't make this happen also for SL? Why not improve as a company and adapt to 2022 and web 3 era?
But we will see in future how things will go if they decide to keep the "old style" way.

[Ayashe Ninetails]

1 minute ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

Me, too. I was gone for 5 years, I think. Long time. Came back in 2018. There have been improvements. Even the people have somewhat improved. 🤭

I was gone for close to 12 years! I came back out of pure curiosity - does it still exist? Did they ever make SL2? LOL. Then I was told about mesh and was completely freaking lost! Had to learn that whole entire thing from the ground up (and it was right when Omega was being phased out, so stores were a weird mix of appliers vs. BOM and that was a whole other thang to try and figure out!).

I can say now though that things look a lot better than they used to. Incredibly inefficient on the avatar/shopping side, but hey. At least we look kinda cute in our confusion!

[Antonioo Giano]

3 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Besides yearning for the past, you apparently have little understand of today's real world finances.  There are many, many people in SL that cannot afford to pay $99 a month for a piece of virtual property with a virtual house on it.  In some countries, $99 is a literal fortune.

Yeah. I'm sure you can teach me how real life economy works.
In case I can teach you how to read 99usd PER YEAR and not 99usd PER MONTH.

Deal?

[Chic Aeon]

We already know that Premium Plus will increase 'free tier" -- most are assuming to a  2048. So in another week or so depending on how many folks opt into Premium Plus some of that empty mainland should disappear.

 

From Inara's run down on the last meeting.

 

Owning a region (sim still works for me by the way and many old-timers) is a LUXURY and not a necessity. 95  percent of folks creating can do fine without a sim so it is not a requirement to creativity or marketing. We each get to choose which luxuries we incorporate into our lives -- well most folks get to; some are working on supplying food and shelter.  If a person gets more enjoyment out of a big hunk of virtual land than they do from a fancy restaurant, drinks, and a show with friends -- then that is their choice.  As things get more expensive many folks will have fewer luxuries and fewer choices. 

 

The current world economy wasn't of The Lab's making but it was easy enough to see that "stagflation" was coming -- at least in the US where most of SL folks are from. So hopefully the board has been planning for the long term all along. That hasn't appeared to be their method in the past, be there are new folks in the mix now.  

Each typist gets to make their own choices. Second Life can still be enjoyed without spending ANY money.  So personally I don't see much to talk about.

[Antonioo Giano]

Short term talking. Everyone is right.
Long term.. who knows. But if I speak about bring companies, money and interest into SL and the answer I get are about "in SL you can sail" we are speaking about two different things and is hard to keep a conversation.

[Silent Mistwalker]

10 minutes ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

I was gone for close to 12 years! I came back out of pure curiosity - does it still exist? Did they ever make SL2? LOL. Then I was told about mesh and was completely freaking lost! Had to learn that whole entire thing from the ground up (and it was right when Omega was being phased out, so stores were a weird mix of appliers vs. BOM and that was a whole other thang to try and figure out!).

I can say now though that things look a lot better than they used to. Incredibly inefficient on the avatar/shopping side, but hey. At least we look kinda cute in our confusion!

That was the longest I was gone at any one given time. I've taken years long breaks before, just not quite that long. lol

Compared to how things looked in 2004, it's fantastic now! 🤣

[Orwar]

28 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

Even the people have somewhat improved. 🤭

   Blasphemy! 

[Ayashe Ninetails]

4 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

That was the longest I was gone at any one given time. I've taken years long breaks before, just not quite that long. lol

Compared to how things looked in 2004, it's fantastic now! 🤣

Right?! I've recently teleported places and stopped and stared like damn...windlight is straight up gorgeous sometimes. That happened at a cyberpunk store that was pitch black outside with neon signs and lights reflecting all over the place - the pavement, the building, the metal railings, my own leather pants!!! I think SL is so so much better than it used to be - both visually and "stuff to do" wise.

As for real life companies making an appearance, well, count me among those who aren't into that at all. I hated it when they all piled in simultaneously back in 2006 or 2008 or whenever it was. It seemed so...forced.

[Antonioo Giano]

1 minute ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

Right?! I've recently teleported places and stopped and stared like damn...windlight is straight up gorgeous sometimes. That happened at a cyberpunk store that was pitch black outside with neon signs and lights reflecting all over the place - the pavement, the building, the metal railings, my own leather pants!!! I think SL is so so much better than it used to be - both visually and "stuff to do" wise.

As for real life companies making an appearance, well, count me among those who aren't into that at all. I hated it when they all piled in simultaneously back in 2006 or 2008 or whenever it was. It seemed so...forced.

"As for real life companies making an appearance, well, count me among those who aren't into that at all. I hated it when they all piled in simultaneously back in 2006 or 2008 or whenever it was. It seemed so...forced."

I agree and I personally don't even care to have my Adidas shoes in SL.
But nowadays we are going always more and more into a world that is moved by big companies. Adidas is going into theSandbox (just an example, is full of companies going into thesandbox and decentreland) which is an ugly "metaverse" not even ready with block graphics. For Adidas would be way better to make cool shoes in SL but since SL didn't update things to how the "web 3" is going to be (or how the big techs want to it to be) they go there and not in SL.
Now if I personally like or not.. is not the point. I talk more in a business-oriented way. Maybe is because I'm a business owner also RL so my head goes more in that direction if we talk about something where money are involved (like in SL) and that needs money to work.

[LittleMe Jewell]

30 minutes ago, Antonioo Giano said:

In case I can teach you how to read 99usd PER YEAR and not 99usd PER MONTH.

You missed the point.  You said that the $99 per year was "totally affordable for everyone".

In RL, there are varying levels of affordability.  Some people can afford $99 per year, some can afford $99 per month, and others can afford many hundreds per month.  That is called LIFE.

[Antonioo Giano]

2 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

You missed the point.  You said that the $99 per year was "totally affordable for everyone".

In RL, there are varying levels of affordability.  Some people can afford $99 per year, some can afford $99 per month, and others can afford many hundreds per month.  That is called LIFE.

*for everyone that WANTS to have a parcel in SL. Is better now?
If I can't afford 99 PER YEAR I don't even think to get a parcel in SL.
But still your answer was so focused on the 99 per month because is what you read while I was mentioning the price of a premium with Linden Labs (99 per YEAR) Just admit the mistake and move on. We aren't here to talk about the different levels of income of people in the world. From a side people gets bothered if I say the prices are too high and now I get attacked because I say they are affordable? lol

Edited June 12, 2022 by Antonioo Giano

[Alwin Alcott]

1 hour ago, Antonioo Giano said:

It can be cheaper just if the owner has a GF SIM (ops.. region) but whatever.

no again .. as EU citizen i have to pay VAT on tierlevels, companies are, or cán be, free of VAT, or other countries, no VAT at all, so their rents are lower than my actual costs, including $ 99 yearly for being premium.

[Antonioo Giano]

I try to resume my point of view because is a bit "annoying" to get answers that are not related to what I mean.

My problem is not personal. Thankfully I'm in a good financial position (for my country) and I would be able to afford a Sim (or a region if you don't like to call Sim) a parcel or anything else I want in Second Life.
So is not about me wanting to pay less to get my SL home. I'm talking about looking at the "bigger picture"

Making lands more affordable > Making people create more interesting stuff in SL > Bringing more people that are willing to stay instead of logoff and leave forever because they get bored > Increase the userbase > Marketing more with your big numbers > Get Real Life big companies interested into SL again > Attention and money from big companies brings even more people in  AKA adapt your business because SL is going down in numbers and interest.
Then the fact I can sail, I can go to a club or date someone tomorrow in SL... is not the point. I talk looking longer term, SL is not adapting to the new things, is not giving anything new to make people stay, to bring the interest of the "youngsters".

Do you disagree? Fine. But let's talk about the same thing at least

Edited June 12, 2022 by Antonioo Giano