m4cm34t5cr4p5 Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Imagine, for a moment, that Ebbe Linden takes some strong substances and comes up with a radical plan for SL - he will create the first truly inworld democratic system.From now on, LL will simply concentrate on server / sim maintenance. In all other affairs, the residents will govern themselves. A government will be set up, which will determine policy for SL, right down to the wording of the TOS.As the run-up to the handover begins, residents band together and form their own parties, to jostle for power. Two weeks before the election, four parties have emerged - due to size of numbers and support, these are the ONLY credible contenders for power. The parties can be summarised as follows:1) Election promises: to relax the restrictions on gambling and third party $L exchange. Strong on landowners' / creators' rights. Promises an extensive crackdown on copybotters and griefers. Will ban any freebie centre owners (and seize their land) if copybotted items are discovered on the premises. Will also restrict NPIOF residents to a small cluster of sims until they either a) go PIOF b) age 180 days. Not keen on free / public sandboxes.2) Election promises: to lower the age of entry to SL to 12; to increase MP seller fees & use the extra revenue to revamp the infohubs with paid SL mentors; to impose an upper limit on land sales. Will reclaim abandoned land and hand it over to educators / non-profit orgs. Promises to investigate ban lines encroaching on public space and will fine owners deemed guilty of this. Will also remove TOS covering harrassment/abuse, reasoning that that's what the block button's for.3) Election promises: to ban all child AVs; to heavily tax sex clubs and to remove them from search, even within the adult category; will ban any avatar found having sex or swearing in a G/M-rated area. Has no comment on MP issues, but rumour has it that their leader - who is a Christian minister - once attacked a diaper-wearing furry nightclub with viewer crashers. However: he has pledged to bring back SL last names.4) Election promises: to fill SL with bot NPCs.Believes that this will create an upsurge of interest in SL and will also enable residents to let off steam by shooting/shagging robots without TOS consequences. Will also establish a weekly lottery for all residents and promises to fix the vehicle lag issue by 2019.Who would you vote for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnyGlide Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 None of this would be keen, you'd kill SL more then it is right now. so nope. gona pass on these ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordHappycat Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 We've already seen what just a handful of all of these can do in the real world. Not to mention when some people on SL get such a stick shoved up them that they do this stuff to. We don't need more of it and not at that volume. No thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darrius Gothly Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 It does sound reasonable that a generally adult population should be able to self-govern. The reality though .. is that with the anonymity of the Internet, emotions and responses go from zero to infinite in microseconds. Thus politics turns into witch-hunt .. every time. *sigh* But it's still a beautiful dream! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Persephone Emerald Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 If you really want to start a democracy in SL, rent a region for $ 300/ month, invite people to join your land group, then have them elect the leader(s) of your land group. Let all your group members vote on how they're going to pay the tier on their new land, what kind avatars and activities they're going to allow, who's going to have build rights, terraform rights, eject rights, etc. My bet is everyone will want to have all the rights, but none of the financial and administrative responsibilities. Then the sim would get deleted when the tier isn't paid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MishkaKatyusha Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 there is an inate problem with all forms of democracy that im sure i havent been the first one to note: 1.persons can vote,they feel they have rights and/or power,while this goes over well for alot of people a small microcasm of manipulative and uncouth sorts realizes what this implys 2.persons make elections to elect those same manipulative folk.these manipulative folk go for the path of least resistence,playing to the majortiy's base primitive emotions,even if said emotions or there desires are illegal,questionable,or would entail warcrimes (like wanting to banish or malign someone for there race,creed,or religion.or in some cases outright extermination,that actually happened once,a.k.a why we had world war 2) 3.the elected manipulators are voted into power - these people made all the right promises to charge the emotions of the electorate.even technically illegal promises sometimes.but most often what happens is those promises meet reality and the mighty system itself.and so those promises become poison to both there supports and opponents.they harm the supports because those promises are not held up,thus betrayal.they harm the opponents because not only did it not happen,thus the predictions of doom were not rendered,but the status quo itself is carried on,which is even more infuriating 4.this cycle rinses and repeats for quite some time,everytime both the supports and opponents get even more enraged and emboldened.then eventually it reaches critical mass,there is a breakdown and revolution,putting something else in its place.and then this new system falls into the same disrepair as the other ones. 5.this is unfortunately the cycle of human history from beggining up until now.even before the technical "democracy" was made,people got essentially "voted" into power by one way or another.always by the support of others.what needs to actually be fixed is the human beings themselves.(i had a theory once that i could do this with an adenovirus genetically altered to increase the particular genetic factors that raise intellect to the point where the behaviours that lead to this problem would self abolish) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Persephone Emerald Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 So what we get if we try to change SL to a Democracy is something like this: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbie Faulds Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 m4cm34t5cr4p5 wrote: Imagine, for a moment, that Ebbe Linden takes some strong substances and comes up with a radical plan for SL - he will create the first truly inworld democratic system. From now on, LL will simply concentrate on server / sim maintenance. In all other affairs, the residents will govern themselves. A government will be set up, which will determine policy for SL, right down to the wording of the TOS. As the run-up to the handover begins, residents band together and form their own parties, to jostle for power. Two weeks before the election, four parties have emerged - due to size of numbers and support, these are the ONLY credible contenders for power. The parties can be summarised as follows: 1) Election promises: to relax the restrictions on gambling and third party $L exchange. Strong on landowners' / creators' rights. Promises an extensive crackdown on copybotters and griefers. Will ban any freebie centre owners (and seize their land) if copybotted items are discovered on the premises. Will also restrict NPIOF residents to a small cluster of sims until they either a) go PIOF b) age 180 days. Not keen on free / public sandboxes. The gambling isn't LL. It's the local government and the restrictions LL would have to meet to have gambling. Too much fraud with the TP $L exchanges. Public sandboxes really are needed as not everyone is premium and has a place to open the boxes their purchases come in. 2) Election promises: to lower the age of entry to SL to 12; to increase MP seller fees & use the extra revenue to revamp the infohubs with paid SL mentors; to impose an upper limit on land sales. Will reclaim abandoned land and hand it over to educators / non-profit orgs. Promises to investigate ban lines encroaching on public space and will fine owners deemed guilty of this. Will also remove TOS covering harrassment/abuse, reasoning that that's what the block button's for. Had the teen grid. If you think copybotting is bad in regular SL you should have seen it on the teen grid. Educators really aren't interested in SL. It was tried. At one time a lot of educators and corporations had sims. They closed. 3) Election promises: to ban all child AVs; to heavily tax sex clubs and to remove them from search, even within the adult category; will ban any avatar found having sex or swearing in a G/M-rated area. Has no comment on MP issues, but rumour has it that their leader - who is a Christian minister - once attacked a diaper-wearing furry nightclub with viewer crashers. However: he has pledged to bring back SL last names. I'm not a fan of child avis, more because the people behind the keyboard insist on speaking in a way that no child I've ever know speaks and it drives me nuts. Sex on a G sim is already not allowed and has to be behind closed doors on an M sim. You see it, AR it. 4) Election promises: to fill SL with bot NPCs.Believes that this will create an upsurge of interest in SL and will also enable residents to let off steam by shooting/shagging robots without TOS consequences. Will also establish a weekly lottery for all residents and promises to fix the vehicle lag issue by 2019. Vehicle lag, there's not a lot you can do about it since it's caused by moving from one sim to another, usually. You have to understand that even if sims are side by side, they aren't on the same server. In fact one may be on the SL server, the next on Blue Steel, the next on Le Tigre, etc. They may be on different floors in the same building. Computers may be fast but there is still some lag when transferring from one server to the next. Who would you vote for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theresa Tennyson Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 m4cm34t5cr4p5 wrote: Imagine, for a moment, that Ebbe Linden takes some strong substances and comes up with a radical plan for SL - he will create the first truly inworld democratic system. From now on, LL will simply concentrate on server / sim maintenance. In all other affairs, the residents will govern themselves. A government will be set up, which will determine policy for SL, right down to the wording of the TOS. As the run-up to the handover begins, residents band together and form their own parties, to jostle for power. Two weeks before the election, four parties have emerged - due to size of numbers and support, these are the ONLY credible contenders for power. The parties can be summarised as follows: 1) Election promises: to relax the restrictions on gambling and third party $L exchange. Strong on landowners' / creators' rights. Promises an extensive crackdown on copybotters and griefers. Will ban any freebie centre owners (and seize their land) if copybotted items are discovered on the premises. Will also restrict NPIOF residents to a small cluster of sims until they either a) go PIOF b) age 180 days. Not keen on free / public sandboxes. 2) Election promises: to lower the age of entry to SL to 12; to increase MP seller fees & use the extra revenue to revamp the infohubs with paid SL mentors; to impose an upper limit on land sales. Will reclaim abandoned land and hand it over to educators / non-profit orgs. Promises to investigate ban lines encroaching on public space and will fine owners deemed guilty of this. Will also remove TOS covering harrassment/abuse, reasoning that that's what the block button's for. 3) Election promises: to ban all child AVs; to heavily tax sex clubs and to remove them from search, even within the adult category; will ban any avatar found having sex or swearing in a G/M-rated area. Has no comment on MP issues, but rumour has it that their leader - who is a Christian minister - once attacked a diaper-wearing furry nightclub with viewer crashers. However: he has pledged to bring back SL last names. 4) Election promises: to fill SL with bot NPCs.Believes that this will create an upsurge of interest in SL and will also enable residents to let off steam by shooting/shagging robots without TOS consequences. Will also establish a weekly lottery for all residents and promises to fix the vehicle lag issue by 2019. Who would you vote for? One of the reasons for the developing of Project Sansar is to allow groups to create their own large spaces that can have separate rules. All these parties could form a confederation with the rules they favor being in place in their own sub-worlds. Meanwhile, there's already a group of democratically-run private regions in SL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buttacwup Float Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 To me this doesn't seem like democracy, which SL can't have, but rather like a list of things you like/dislike about SL and how you would change them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikka Luik Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 The only one off the top of my head would be the CDS so would be interesting to hear of others. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BilliJo Aldrin Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 I'd use the same criterion i'd love to do in rl, namely vote for whichever party promises to sit on their hands and do absolutely nothing. Apparently politicians have never heard of the law of unintended consequences, meaning when you pass a law to fix a "problem", it often has the exact opposite effect, thus making things worse than they were before. Another thing to consider is that many laws are the result of lobbying by special interest groups, which means your hard earned dollars will go into the pockets of the special interest groups. Yay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theresa Tennyson Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 mikka Luik wrote: The only one off the top of my head would be the CDS so would be interesting to hear of others. That was the one I had in mind. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vulpinus Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well armed sheep. (...and yes, SL is fubar'd again right now so I'm looking for alternative amusement...) Seriously though, democracy is the biggest, most vile confidence trick ever in human history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MishkaKatyusha Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 agreed,most people live so far removed from the glitzy money politic that it makes little difference who rules as long as there is food,hearth,home and my family,i really dont care who rules (also as a sidenote i dont own a firearm,not allowed to due to schizoid personality disorder) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amethyst Jetaime Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 I think we'll get more than enough of that type of insanity in RL in the coming 300 or so days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syo Emerald Posted January 10, 2016 Share Posted January 10, 2016 I rather have SL as it is, instead of being forced to chose between 4 kinds of stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bree Giffen Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Ebbe would have to be taking some seriously strong substances to hand over control of SL to a group of residents. I'd vote for this guy though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perrie Juran Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 All four of your choices seem to fall under the definition of Dictatorships. Can you democratically elect a Dictator????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhonda Huntress Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 Considering how the "Best in denim" voting went in the last contest I saw, I don't think SL is ready. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canoro Philipp Posted January 11, 2016 Share Posted January 11, 2016 for a Democracy, we would have to choose which person we would like as a candidate, my vote would be for Torley. if SL would be governed by the people, the people would decide which rules would apply. such as the price of tier, taxes on everything sold, the rights of the users, such as being banned unfairly, how the griefers would be handled depending on level of abuse and frequency of it, and how art and creativity should be encouraged and preserved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MishkaKatyusha Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 illogical,and ill explain why the system of SL admin ,the company that is,is whole.everyoen of the employees no matter how innocuous on there own,contributes to the whole,which we can agree has some large flaws. thereby,it also logically follows that if there were such a thing,electing a part of said system to lead said system in the hopes for change would only produce the same,a.k.a. "right back to square one" we would need a selection of non-company candidates in order to effect any real change Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MishkaKatyusha Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 also another thing,i have a relatively straightfoward answer to greifing greifers: enable a new set of data tools that in particular tracks each users whereabouts and there item use in a straightfoward way.greifing often involves a pattern of massive repetition against another to effect the greif.thus,this would make such people easy to spot.and the course of action is simple,destroy & ban them without mercy,without chance for appeal.if it happens to be a long chain of greif and counter greif,the law of vengeance would dictate that the person who took the first greifing action would be held responsible and thus be publicly destroyed.if the actions of counter greifing effected the group the first greifer belonged too,those who did not participate in the greifing would be compensated according to the amount of damage inflicted by the counter greifing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canoro Philipp Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 users are not the best choice to lead the company to a certain direction, because they lack information, an informed decision is always better, althought some minor decisions can be granted to the users to have more impact on them, they have years of experience using the product, some from earlier versions, their input should be valuable to where to mold the product, the users who most appreciate the product have that passion for it, and want it to succeed, some are very knowledgeable, in certain aspects of SL, they could be trusted to guide themselves as a democracy. the anti griefing method seems plausible, I like the detection system based on certain patterns, altought I would still grant the chance to appeal, some users are persuaded into griefing by experienced griefers, such as this case https://community.secondlife.com/t5/General-Discussion-Forum/Tried-to-RP-think-I-might-have-griefed/m-p/2970867, some may unknowingly worn certain griefing items, it is important to preserve a system of appeal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MishkaKatyusha Posted January 12, 2016 Share Posted January 12, 2016 i shouldve made it clear.im mean no mercy for people who are confirmed to have greifed maliciously.the investigatory process should reveal who is guilty,plausibly guilty,or tricked. the mechanism for data is not meant to be automated,its meant as a divine hammer.smash all of the bads at once. the appeals process is for the occasional but still possible erroneous ban. i meant to say the ones who maliciously greifed should not be given mercy nor allowed to appeal no matter the length of time since and as for outside of company candidates,i dont mean users.i mean different executive types,ceo's,etc.but not from inside the company we would get to choose from people with vast business experience.and we could decide upon there track record meritocracy by democracy,i like it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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