Apple Vision Plus and Second Life

[Evah Baxton]

 

[Sorciaa]

time to bring this to market

 

 

[Coffee Pancake]

9 hours ago, diamond Marchant said:

AVP is an early adopter transitional technology. It is a beginning, not an end. Early cellphones resembled WW2 walkie talkies and portable PCs (Compaq) were carry on luggage. At the time, both were considered desirable. 

I perhaps wasn't clear.

Headset sizes are determined primarily by optics. That is, lumps of glass used to bend the light from the screens and direct it into your eyes. Just like regular glasses. There is no magic here. Even with the best materials and tricks, optics will always take up a lot of space.

Yes, smaller thinner AR devices exist, like google glass or those movie viewers I mentioned. They have a ridiculously small active field of vision. Its like a postage stamp in the middle.

VR (or in Apples case, VR masquerading as immersive AR) demands a large field of view. This demands larger screens. This demands bigger lumps of polished glass. This is why every VR headset from the last decade is roughly the same general size, a brick strapped to your face.

 

It's not like phones or computers where the active electrical elements can be shrunk down by ever improved manufacturing.

This whole field of tech is up against hard real word physical constraints. There is nothing to miniaturize.

 

Forever Facebrick. 

[Love Zhaoying]

5 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Even with the best materials and tricks, optics will always take up a lot of space.

What about contact lenses that provide a tiny HUD? Still just Science Fiction, huh?

[Coffee Pancake]

Just now, Love Zhaoying said:

What about contact lenses that provide a tiny HUD? Still just Science Fiction, huh?

Yes. 100%.

A plot mcguffin used to give one character special extra information (or magical powers) to enable bad story telling.

7 hours ago, Evah Baxton said:

Hyper reality vid .. 

when that's the future on offer .. a hyper capitalist hellscape .. that you can escape by not wearing the tech, why would anyone ever wear the tech, least of all out of the house.

[Bree Giffen]

Have you seen the new Meta Quest Pro (MQP) goggles? It's quite small and thin now. More like ski goggles hovering over your face. They even added a headband  and counterweight that takes all the strain off your eye sockets. I think Apple is going the augmentation route with the Apple Vision Pro (AVP) rather than the full immersion route of other VR headsets. 

With Apple setting the bar at $3,500 the $1,000 price tag for the MQP sounds like a bargain. 

T

[Coffee Pancake]

Meta have sunk stupid money into R&D and their headsets are heavily subsidized.

[Love Zhaoying]

I was surprised to see Meta goggles at Target. Didn't Meta completely close their "Metaverse"? If so, the goggles must work with other stuffs too..?

[Coffee Pancake]

2 hours ago, Love Zhaoying said:

I was surprised to see Meta goggles at Target. Didn't Meta completely close their "Metaverse"? If so, the goggles must work with other stuffs too..?

Their metaverse is only a small part of the package, but its the part the media locked onto as it was the easiest thing to use to bash meta. Why bash meta .. because meta didn't pay them not to. Sad, but that's the world we live in.

hur  hur no legs.

[Drayke Newall]

The problem with all these larger form factor AR systems like Hololens and this new Vision Plus is that they are focusing on a person staying in one place either tethered to a charger/computer or giving them some mobility in a short charge timeframe.

This is these companies fundamental flaw in their thinking. They are catering to a small subsect of the population and that subsect dont particularly want it and also not thinking about other possible ways to make the system smaller with more usable time.

Until these companies start looking at the whole AR picture the demand for these systems will not be there.

What they need to start looking at pairing glasses to the phones similar to google glass but on a larger scale. At the moment these devices solely rely on their own internal computing systems and therefore are large and bulky and require huge power. What they need to do is utilise systems that project the images onto a glass screen etc to see the environment that way.

Until this happens all these goggles will be doa as people want mobility.

AR is not VR which is what these companies keep pushing. AR is when I take a walk down the local shopping centre I get a projection of prices in the store which, I can with a imaginary push of a finger button, get a comparison online price of all local stores offering that select good.

It is the way a world of scifi can become reality where holograms and other things that we just cant do or never could do with machines but can on a glass projection. It is me saying to a friend do you want to play a game of zombie warfare where I go with them to the local park and it uses the natural environment around to 'rez' zombies for us to fight, hide behind trees as cover shooting etc.

AR is a system where I can play Second Life using my VR googles and then decide to go out in the real world with AR glasses on that links my second life on my phone with my AR glasses projecting messages from in world on the screen and also allow me to see a persons avatar projected on them rather than their real self. True Augmented Reality not a hybrid form of VR and AR.

[AmeliaJ08]

On 6/11/2023 at 8:11 AM, Evah Baxton said:

 

This is incredible.

It's also almost possible today (at great expense and limited battery life), when augmented reality glasses (or similar) devices become small and cheap enough that everyone owns one in the same way everyone owns a powerful smartphone today this could very well be our hellish future.

Of course though I think there will always be a group that resist and make the best of it. Look at the lengths some (geeky) people go to rid the internet of ads, trackers, spam and assorted waste today, the hackers and tweakers will always be looking to get all the benefit of a technology while bypassing the bull*****.

 

Edited June 12, 2023 by AmeliaJ08

[Arduenn Schwartzman]

On 6/11/2023 at 7:54 AM, gwynchisholm said:

That's a lousy argument for claiming that some tech that has not yet widely adopted will be in the future.

How long have these VR goggles been the next big thing now? I'm not saying they won't be in the future., not that I wouldn't want them to. I've seen a whole spectrum of failed and revolutionary tech, to an extent that I'm not holding my breath anymore. All the next big things I've seen over the years have desensitized me quite a bit.

                                 Back in the day, they knew how to make stuff.

Edited June 13, 2023 by Arduenn Schwartzman

[Love Zhaoying]

In favor of the new Apple AR/VR goggles..they have the big advantage of using no "controllers", so they basically fulfill the Science Fiction movie / show version where people use their hands to move and select things.

It will be interesting to see the first version of VR goggles that use hand gestures to "build" virtual worlds, move and resize objects, etc. using your hands as controllers.

I hope Apple is making a provision for those without hands or cannot use their arms and hands.  Simple example, a version that Stephen Hawking could use.  (If he was still alive, of course.  AR/VR goggles "for the dead" is probably a ways off.)

From the Wikipedia article on Hawking https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Hawking: 

Hawking gradually lost the use of his hand, and in 2005 he began to control his communication device with movements of his cheek muscles,[288][289][290] with a rate of about one word per minute.[289] With this decline there was a risk of his developing locked-in syndrome, so Hawking collaborated with Intel Corporation researchers on systems that could translate his brain patterns or facial expressions into switch activations. After several prototypes that did not perform as planned, they settled on an adaptive word predictor made by the London-based startup SwiftKey, which used a system similar to his original technology. Hawking had an easier time adapting to the new system, which was further developed after inputting large amounts of Hawking's papers and other written materials and uses predictive software similar to other smartphone keyboards.

[InnerCity Elf]

On 6/5/2023 at 10:40 PM, Paul Hexem said:

I paid less than that for my last motorcycle.

I for my last car. However, I know that I will be interested, when glasses that aren't much bigger and heavier than some ugly bling sunglasses will afford me floating, invisible to others, screens and keyboards to type in the air, singing 'I wear my sunglasses at night'. I'm weak. Also, I should dedicate an account space to this and start saving. 😎

[Blaise Glendevon]

I have yet to wear a goggle that doesn't make me profoundly motion sick. 

If they can figure that one out. . .eh? 

[Drayke Newall]

13 hours ago, Love Zhaoying said:

In favor of the new Apple AR/VR goggles..they have the big advantage of using no "controllers", so they basically fulfill the Science Fiction movie / show version where people use their hands to move and select things.

Apple have no such advantage at all despite them claiming they do. Seems Apple's marketing spin once again is in full swing and working.

You have been able to use hands instead of controllers with Oculus and other VR goggles for years.

Everything Apple have used to create these goggles has been possible and used before for years. There is nothing new about them except that they stuck an internal camera in the googles to show your eyes on the outside of the screen 'to be different' and made them have a small computer in them increasing their weight etc. Even their battery time is the lowest of all the VR and AR goggles available.

Microsoft hololens have hand tracking, head tracking, eye tracking and everything Apples Headset does except the two aforementioned things. Seeing that Hololens uses a link to an actual computer using bluetooth also makes it better than Apple's goggles as it allows for far more processing power and future potential to link to smartphones for on the move stuff. Additionally, I would prefer not to have a screen 1 inch away from my eyes as that is going to cause nothing but eye trouble in the future.

Hololens is the only mainstream and true usable AR/MR goggles available as they project the Augmented reality into transparent lenses meaning that the real world IS the actual world, not a reflection of it created on a screen by a camera like Apple's goggles. In other words think of all those movies which show you holding a piece of see through glass as a phone, that is the tech that hololens uses as their screen. The only downside at the moment of Hololens is the field of view and resolution as pointed out earlier in the thread with true AR glasses/goggles.

Hololens is far more Science Fiction movie stuff than Apples new shinier version of Goggle Cardboard.

Edited June 14, 2023 by Drayke Newall

[Lindal Kidd]

I think everyone has it wrong. The new Apple goggles won't be used for VR/games/Second Life. They'll be used to control the electric self-driving iCar.

[Love Zhaoying]

40 minutes ago, Lindal Kidd said:

I think everyone has it wrong. The new Apple goggles won't be used for VR/games/Second Life. They'll be used to control the electric self-driving iCar.

If AI takes away my iJob, I won't be able to afford my iCar, let alone the iGoggles! 

I'll be kicked out of my iHome, and forced to live in the iStreet.