1 second Orb timing, is it necessary

[Rowan Amore]

24 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Hoping I top that instant ban list should I ever happen to wander too close. 

Ages ago.  😁

[Rowan Amore]

8 hours ago, Ceka Cianci said:

A friend of mine was wondering if anyone in here knows where someone might be able to buy a really big fridge?

Thanks ahead of time.

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/French-Door-silver-dark-dby/22863431

[Ceka Cianci]

21 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/French-Door-silver-dark-dby/22863431

I was kidding about the fridge, but now I'm really tempted to go grab this one.. hehehe

[AnthonyJoanne]

A perspective:

I have a chunk of mainland. Said chunk is completely parcel-locked and quite a distance from any public space (i.e linden road, water, etc). When I purchased that chunk my neighbours were all private residences. It was peaceful and quiet. We had no ban lines or security orb.

Then one quite large parcel right next to me was sold and the new owner proceeded to put in a stack of skyboxes for rent. No big deal ... except apparently the rent was quite low so there were frequently toons in their skyboxes. Again ... no big deal, IF they had stayed in their skyboxes.

The 'visits' to my chunk suddenly spiked. And they coincided with the times when my family and I were in our chunk. We weren't just being intruded upon occasionally ... we were being spammed with 'visitors'. So I turned on the ban lines. But of course ... ban lines don't cover sky boxes so we were still being 'visited'.

So ... security orb. Set to 30 seconds. The only problem with that ... 30 seconds is more than enough time for an intruder to completely derail the mood when you're in the middle of an intimate moment with someone and suddenly you're joined by someone who thinks that the height of SL-chic is a used-tampon avatar. Who, after having been ejected and banned then arranges four more visits from different accounts in the same avatar. Alts or just five idiots ... don't know, don't care. And no - I am NOT joking about the avatar.

Security orb set to 0 seconds for a couple of days and then we opted for 20 seconds as the new default.

Then that parcel went up for sale ... the sky boxes all went away and we thought we'd weathered the storm.

Until it was bought and turned into an AFK sex region. I don't know how much money the owner of the region was making, but I suspect that it wasn't much given that all his customers seemed to have had a burning desire to suddenly appear in my home.

The orb was set to 5 seconds.

During the height of those visits while the orb was set to  5 seconds, btw, I got a notecard from someone who had tried to fly through my parcel. It was quite vitriolic. So much so that person is now banned. I have little to no tolerance for the entitled.

After a while that AFK sex region went quiet and the intrusions stopped ... so now the orb is set to 15 seconds.

So as you can see ... the settings on the security orb have been reactive to the amount of 'visitors' who chose to violate my family's privacy. When we were being hammered ... the time went down, when people aren't bothering us ... the number went up. Because I understand that people want to fly around. But your ability to fly around is a DISTANT second to my ability to spend time with my family without being harassed. So when we're being harassed ... you don't get to fly through my region. When we aren't being bothered, then I ease the restrictions to give you a chance to get through the region before you are ejected.

But I've seen several mentions of 'reasonable'. Here's the problem with that: You do not control what is reasonable on my parcel. I DO. Just as I don't control what is reasonable on your parcel ... you do.  Don't like it? All you have to do to avoid it ... is stay off my parcel. And if I don't like what you consider reasonable, I'll stay off your parcel. The fact that some of  you think that LL should change the rules so that you can travel through a place you have no right to be ... remember what I said about little to no tolerance for the entitled?

BTW the RL analogies are completely bogus because if someone in RL was able to overfly my house, and then abuse reality to be instantly sitting next to my partner and I while we're busy in bed, you can be damn sure that I'd have ground to air missiles to shoot any encroaching aircraft down.

What people should take away from this is that LL need to make ban lines that actually work, and that don't screw up people who fly/drive/whatever into them. And we all know that is not going to happen.

[Jupiter Hexem]

I don't use security orbs. I use a script I just place into my furniture and set it to group only. Auto-return set to 3 minutes, and if I'm home and some random invades, I politely ask them to leave and if they get salty, they get kicked and banned. Why do I do it this way? Many people like to fly, drive, ride, and generally explore. Most people don't mean harm. Some are very new to SL and don't know you're not supposed to invade homes, they think of SL like a video game in the beginning. I don't want to be the jerk that knocked someone out of their blissful 3 hour flight, or yank people out of their boats. 

There is no privacy in Second Life. You can cam, and do a thousand things to see what's happening. Most people are good noodles. 

If you're trying to hide a kink... honey we've seen it all.

If you're cheating on your partner... lol. That nearby radar will give you right away. "We're just cuddling." Uh-huh.

[Female Winslet]

7 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

There is no such rule on mainland.  The rule applies to Belliseria only.

Sigh. Incorrect. The rule in Bellisseria is 15 seconds. You’ll find LL’s explanation of what scripted objects should/should not do elsewhere here under the heading “script use.”

Among other things, the general rule is that scripted objects should “Provide adequate warning to the undesired Resident.” Typically the orb crowd likes to argue that all of them are exceptions to the general rule for some unexplained reason or that no warning at all is “adequate,” which effectively deletes the requirement. No point in having written it if it’s a nonexistent requirement. 

 

Edited June 1, 2022 by Female Winslet

[Gabriele Graves]

https://etherealmind.com/requirements-terminology/

MUST -This word, or the terms “REQUIRED” or “SHALL”, mean that the definition is an absolute requirement of the specification.
MUST NOT – This phrase, or the phrase “SHALL NOT”, means that the definition is an absolute prohibition of the specification.
SHOULD – This word, or the adjective “RECOMMENDED”, mean that there may exist valid reasons in particular circumstances to ignore a particular item, but the full implications must be understood and carefully weighed before choosing a different course.
SHOULD NOT – This phrase, or the phrase “NOT RECOMMENDED” mean that there may exist valid reasons in particular circumstances when the particular behavior is acceptable or even useful, but the full implications should be understood and the case carefully weighed before implementing any behavior described with this label.
MAY – This word, or the adjective “OPTIONAL,” mean that an item is truly discretionary.
FUTURE – This word means that objectives are provided as guidance or expectation and may or may not be accurate.
SEPARATION – This word means the prevention of reach-ability to designated resources.

[Female Winslet]

7 hours ago, Codex Alpha said:

Yep, my account is due up pretty soon, and I'm making a decision about it soon. I've commented before in other topics, how it seems I'm paying more, but for less service and access - and so it's increasingly becoming harder to warrant the Premium sub each year unless real value is added.

I currently have three premium accounts. At least some of them will not be renewed because of the situation with orbs and such. The premium fee is a tiny item in my budget, frankly. But I am tired of funding LL’s refusal to address the situation. 

The great thing about SL is there really is something for everyone. LL says it’s supposed to be a community oriented, social space. But there is ample space for misanthropes who don’t want to participate in that. Just not in the middle of everybody else where their antisocial actions are disruptive. That’s the thing about community. One persons actions always affect others. And it’s always about more than just “me me me me me.”

[Rowan Amore]

12 minutes ago, Female Winslet said:

Sigh. Incorrect. The rule in Bellisseria is 15 seconds. You’ll find LL’s explanation of what scripted objects should/should not do elsewhere here under the heading “script use.”

Among other things, the general rule is that scripted objects should “Provide adequate warning to the undesired Resident.” Typically the orb crowd likes to argue that all of them are exceptions to the general rule for some unexplained reason or that no warning at all is “adequate,” which effectively deletes the requirement. No point in having written it if it’s a nonexistent requirement. 

 

Yes, should being the key word.  It does not say must or required as it does in Belli.

[Female Winslet]

2 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

Yes, should being the key word.  It does not say must or required as it does in Belli.

Ah yes. In addition to the trying to claim they are all special and the rule doesn’t mean anything, I forgot the people who try to nitpick about it and claim it’s not really a rule. Last time I went to a user group meeting and raised this with LL, they agreed it was a rule. Back then they were actually enforcing it as well. 

Edited June 1, 2022 by Female Winslet

[Gabriele Graves]

7 minutes ago, Female Winslet said:

LL says it’s supposed to be a community oriented, social space. But there is ample space for misanthropes who don’t want to participate in that. Just not in the middle of everybody else where their antisocial actions are disruptive. That’s the thing about community. One persons actions always affect others. And it’s always about more than just “me me me me me.”

There are communities in SL, including on mainland who agree to do things a certain way.  It is entirely possible to be part of them.  Mainland as a whole however is definitely not a community.  If LL felt that way about mainland, there would be a covenant in place.  Actions speak louder than words.

Edited June 1, 2022 by Gabriele Graves

[Solar Legion]

Oh for the ...

[Gabriele Graves]

2 minutes ago, Female Winslet said:

Last time I went to a user group meeting and raised this with LL, they agreed it was a rule. Back then they were actually enforcing it as well. 

You do realise that the onus is on you to prove that claim?

[Solar Legion]

1 minute ago, Gabriele Graves said:

There are communities in SL, including on mainland who agree to do things a certain way.  It is entirely possible to be part of them.  Mainland as a whole however it definitely not a community.  If LL felt that way about mainland, there would be a covenant in place.  Actions speak louder than words.

Such an action would say quite a bit ... and it would not be good.

[Gabriele Graves]

A covenant without enforcement is no covenant at all.

[Female Winslet]

14 minutes ago, Gabriele Graves said:

There are communities in SL, including on mainland who agree to do things a certain way.  It is entirely possible to be part of them.  Mainland as a whole however is definitely not a community.  If LL felt that way about mainland, there would be a covenant in place.  Actions speak louder than words.

My point exactly. And the reason I’ve been cutting what I pay to LL over the last few months. As you say, actions do speak louder than words. And LL says they want to have a community. Their actions say otherwise. And I‘ve been voting with my $$$. I’m sure others will too.

Edited June 1, 2022 by Female Winslet

[Gabriele Graves]

32 minutes ago, Female Winslet said:

Sigh. Incorrect. The rule in Bellisseria is 15 seconds. You’ll find LL’s explanation of what scripted objects should/should not do elsewhere here under the heading “script use.”

Among other things, the general rule is that scripted objects should “Provide adequate warning to the undesired Resident.” Typically the orb crowd likes to argue that all of them are exceptions to the general rule for some unexplained reason or that no warning at all is “adequate,” which effectively deletes the requirement. No point in having written it if it’s a nonexistent requirement. 

 

Let's just suppose for an instant that this knowledge base article was really something that must be obeyed or you risk your account being sanctioned in some way.  Exactly how many places are residents expected to go to find out what the rules are?  For years we have been told ToS/CS and any land covenant are all you need to follow.  That's already quite a few places and a lot of rules.

It would be exceptionally unreasonable to expect the masses of SL to also have to trawl through the knowledge base looking for additional rules that might apply as well.
 

Edited June 1, 2022 by Gabriele Graves

[Rowan Amore]

25 minutes ago, Female Winslet said:

Ah yes. In addition to the trying to claim they are all special and the rule doesn’t mean anything, I forgot the people who try to nitpick about it and claim it’s not really a rule. Last time I went to a user group meeting and raised this with LL, they agreed it was a rule. Back then they were actually enforcing it as well. 

No, if it were a rule, they would have worded it as such.  ALL scripts MUST allow a minimum of X seconds before ejecting.  They didn't.   Nice try though.

[Paul Hexem]

6 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

This is how.it is on Horizons.  There's the road, the sidewalk and a buffer between the sidewalk and where my property starts.  Quite a bit of leeway for anyone driving by.  Not that many people do.as it's not actually "mainland" mainland.  

It should be that way everywhere. While it wouldn't solve the problem of rude people being creeps, it would help both sides of the vehicle argument.

6 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

I propose that "explorers" take a moment to find out if the parcel they are about to enter is a public or private space, and if the later, respect the owner and avoid it entirely.

Unfortunately, there's no surefire way to tell at region crossings, particular the laggy ones that send you off course. By the time you have any indication that the empty parcel ahead actually has a skybox and a 4096 0 second orb, it's too late. Which is why it's best to stick to the LL roads- but again, region crossings don't always make that possible.

[Mollymews]

2 hours ago, AnthonyJoanne said:

What people should take away from this is that LL need to make ban lines that actually work, and that don't screw up people who fly/drive/whatever into them

at a recent-ish SUG meeting, Linden mentioned that they were looking into this. Bouncing vehicles off banlines. So is some hope for the future

[Jennifer Boyle]

FWIW, I think the Lindens got right in the Bellesaria covenant a lot of what they got wrong in the rules for the mainland.

[Love Zhaoying]

A good pattern for an effective "Orb" is the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch. If I recall correctly, it has a "3 shall be the count" setting.

[Alwin Alcott]

1 hour ago, Jennifer Boyle said:

FWIW, I think the Lindens got right in the Bellesaria covenant a lot of what they got wrong in the rules for the mainland.

it's no right or wrong. LL always been "just" (except TOS) the provider of the platform with if possible as less ruling as possible.
The call from the residents about "more" changed that during a very long period of time, and got excecuted in Belliseria.
Mainland is a sort of "grandfathered" product. .. with limitations compared to modern times and desires of some groups of residents. Many mainlanders however, like it the way it is. 

[Love Zhaoying]

Any security orb time limit over 3 seconds does a great disservice. How are users to succeed at Linden Realms if they cannot cross a parcel in 3 seconds? Short orb times provide Linden Realms training.

[Kimmi Zehetbauer]

The couple times I had an orb up, it was set for 90 seconds and edited the greeting on it too.  I can't remember exactly what I had put down but it was something like "Old Landmark, flying through, etc? Hopefully 90 seconds is enough to let you pass through" or something close to that.

I also used to have one running at my old venue --- not to boot avatars out but it had a great visitor log built in. I changed the warning greeting to "Welcome to So-So club" and had the timer set as high as possible, which I think calculated to 2 million years!