Geography of SL, or, what is mainland, and what is it good for?

[Coffee Pancake]

3 minutes ago, CaerolleClaudel said:

did not know about the rail systems, those do look interesting! Looks like you can actually ride those?

You can .. to a point. Most of it works most of the time, there are some broken parts that have been broken since they were put in place.

4 minutes ago, CaerolleClaudel said:

First thing I noticed, wow, massive lag and low FPS even though no one else was around.

That's not mainland .. that's SL biggest architectural weakness front and center. We should not be using SL to build large contiguous spaces, we don't have the systems for it and we never will because math.

 

[CaerolleClaudel]

6 hours ago, Ceka Cianci said:

I believe there was more private regions in 2007 than there is now, even in 2006 I think there was..

There was a lot of people trying to build their own home owner communities and would have more than one sim.. It seemed like a lot of people that I knew back then were always talking about their sim or trying to get me to buy their land.. lol

The club I worked for back then  itself, had around 22 sims.. Also where I have lived since 2006 has cut back on the amount of sims they have as well..

I think there was a lot more hope of making  good money back then from SL..

I know I was doing pretty good just working for a place.. hehehe

Mainland is just a variety of everything.. A lot of time, I never even know I'm on it unless I happen to look at the map.  I know it's not as laggy as it used to be, but that could be for a lot of different reasons now..

 

Ah, ok. The things people have said here really jogged my memory and a lot is coming back to me. For example, the places with roads and really ugly copy-and-paste trees are a mainland-only thing, maybe?

I think I did not notice so much when I was on private sims. I am pretty clueless about the details of SL, have always been more interested in the immediate experience. Sadly I am an emotional, impressionistic person. I do know that I lived several places on mainland, though my favorite place ever was on a private island my landlord set up. Sadly, her business dropped off so she closed the island and I had to move to one of her mainland houses. It was ok, but nothing compared with my house on the island.

I'm sorry your SL income has dropped off over the years. True or not, I think the conventional wisdom back in the day was that some people made their entire living from SL and that some of them did really, really well.

[CaerolleClaudel]

5 hours ago, Bree Giffen said:

I honestly forgot where I rented my skybox and zoomed out on the map to find I'm on the Jeogeot continent. I'm next to a road and I will see people traveling along. Businesses have popped up but they haven't caused any problems. I've only rented parcels on the mainland since I've been in SL and haven't encountered many problems.  The one time I had lag was in a home near the border of a region and had to move out because it was so unpleasant.

Did you rent places exclusively on mainland on purpose or it just turned out that way?

[CaerolleClaudel]

4 hours ago, Clem Marques said:

True, Zindra is Mainland by definition, but yes, it's disconnected from all the other Mainland continents. Probably as a safety measure to keep General/Moderate users from unwittingly venturing into the adult-rated content that's all over Zindra by accident while travelling. They have to teleport to get there.

Yeah, wow. As I wrote in a previous reply, that place seems to really, really out there. When I went there years ago to look about I was pretty creeped out sometimes.

[AmeliaJ08]

2 hours ago, SarahThe Wanderer said:

I have a love/hate relationship with mainland, a lot of times I say I'm  giving up on it, and one time I finally did, but few months out of mainland, and i'm already missing it, so I'm back again! 

I don't know what exactly is so charming about it, but it has this unique element maybe inclusivity? it's a bigger world with endless possiblites,  that all other private regions and bellisseria are lacking, I've been literally everywhere in SL , I had lands in every continent in mainland ( expect for the Geata 1 and 2 they never appealed to me, zindra too never had and never will ) multiple lands in private regions, have owned private region and homesteads, tried all themes in belliseria , also lands in horizons, I'v experinced it all, and if I had to choose just one place to be in; I'd choose Mainland above them all!
 Mainland is a challange for your creativity and most important thing your patience, it defnitly not for soft hearts : b

I'm impressed by the people who create beautiful places in mainland more than the ones who had it easy creating in private regions, mainland builders are in my opinion more creative and skilled than private regions ones; because of the challenges they have to deal with.

 Mainalnd also in my opinion mostly apeal to explorers and builders, the normal resident who only want to have a beautiful home may strugle there!

I genuinely like just living on an actual street. There's occasional traffic, sometimes a train comes by, sometimes the surrounding parcels change a little with new buildings, my neighbour is always out there growing his weeds... it's kinda comforting.

 

Edited September 15 by AmeliaJ08

[CaerolleClaudel]

3 hours ago, Rufferta Mainlander said:

The SL Wiki has info on Mainland, although I don't always agree with it. https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/List_Of_Continents

A great help to me has been the "Continent Locator" you can pick up at the International Bazaar in Ross. Wear it, and it will tell you what continent you are on. The script has not been updated, so it doesn't recognize most of Bellisseria. http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Ross/40/229/57

Random locations on each 'Mainland' continent.

• Heterocera Explorers' Info Centre http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Rivata/34/196/86
• Nautilus - The Market - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Nautilus - Shalim/231/112/25
• Jeogeot - Han Loso - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife//136/199/46 or http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Han Loso/136/199/46
• Sharp, or TSL (Old Teen Second Life) - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Lodestone/85/108/56
• Corsica - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Laserlight/74/53/66
• Gaeta 1 - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Kamalakara/39/10/21
• Gaeta V -- http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife//185/189/47 -  or http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Demorgan/185/189/47 - Pod Tour Station - take a ride and get a list of pod tour stations for more in-depth coverage
• Sansara - Linden Playground - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife//134/120/35  
  In Sansara there are sub-areas such as the "Color Sims" - about 30 regions where more extreme terraforming is allowed. http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Mauve/224/185/43There are also areas where the land has double-prim capacity (More LI per parcel) like Bay City http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Daley Bay/233/24/25 or Horizons. http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Horizons Elara/155/182/23
• Satori -(Sometimes called Maebaleia) http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Soulgiver/154/56/60
• Zindra - Pengallen Park - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife//141/92/55  or http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Pengallen Bridge/141/92/55

As for Bellisseria being a continent - If you consider a 'continent' to be a large land mass, it qualifies; however, while using your Premium benefits to claim a home in one of the subdivisions there is a great way to start out in Second Life, you cannot re-sell or terraform the parcel, and the Covenant restrictions can hamper your creativity. Great bargain, though. http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Wandering Eyes/55/58/22

The Four "Old Premium Continents" or 'First Generation' homes are separated from each other and from the larger Mainland, but there is still much of interest there. Each of the First Generation continents are almost cooky-cutter versions of each other, with some special places that only show up on one of the continents - like the Dragon Quest at Cape Ekim - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Cape Ekim/199/146/41 

Some Infohubs on the First Generation continents.

Tahoe Infohub http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife//169/149/28

Elderglen Infohub - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Elderglen/128/128/29

Shareta Osumai - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife//138/137/87

Meadowbrook Infohub - http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Meadowbrook/64/173/41

Hope this is some help. There is also a 'Mainland' discussion board in the Land Forum.

Wow, thanks for all the links! I am going to bookmark this post!

One of the first things I did trying to understand mainland was to search for SL mainland map ( think?). I got a link to a wiki page, but it appeared to be massively out of date so I thought I would ask here. Now of course I cannot find that page to show it to you lol.

Anyhow, lots of stuff to explore! The downside is that walking on mainland, at least the few places I went last night, is even slower than I am used to, which is pretty slow. I usually just run when I need to cover distance, but even that is pretty slow lol.

Thanks again!

[CaerolleClaudel]

1 hour ago, animats said:

Here's a Drivers of SL video. A somewhat random trip around parts of Mainland.

There's one of these drives each week. See the Drivers of SL group.

Thx!

[Ceka Cianci]

17 minutes ago, CaerolleClaudel said:

Ah, ok. The things people have said here really jogged my memory and a lot is coming back to me. For example, the places with roads and really ugly copy-and-paste trees are a mainland-only thing, maybe?

I think I did not notice so much when I was on private sims. I am pretty clueless about the details of SL, have always been more interested in the immediate experience. Sadly I am an emotional, impressionistic person. I do know that I lived several places on mainland, though my favorite place ever was on a private island my landlord set up. Sadly, her business dropped off so she closed the island and I had to move to one of her mainland houses. It was ok, but nothing compared with my house on the island.

I'm sorry your SL income has dropped off over the years. True or not, I think the conventional wisdom back in the day was that some people made their entire living from SL and that some of them did really, really well.

Mine didn't really drop off.. I left  doing what I was doing well before that.. It just wasn't fun anymore.. I never really did it for the money, but it was fun to see how much I could make.. hehehe

[CaerolleClaudel]

1 hour ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Mainland is the heart and soul of SL, but it's also an outdated concept that with hindsight, hasn't ever functioned as imagined or intended.

Land occupancy has always been spotty. People have always wanted to live by roads or water. No one cares for mountain sides.

The infrastructure, roads and the like, varies from "maybe fine" to "historical prim cack".

There has always been at least twice as much as was actually desirable.

Land barrons and scumlords have long since destroyed any possibility of recovering it.

Funny, I have considered buying land several times, and actually did once. One of the times I was looking for a place in the mountains with snow, but could not find any place suitable that I could afford. Plain mountains? Probably not so popular I would guess. Finding affordable land on the side of a continent where the ocean flows in instead of out or sidewise was almost impossible, and that is why I bought some in an at the time undeveloped part of some ocean. I loved living there, but before long people bought other plots next to me and I finally sold it for IIRC less than I paid for it just to get rid of it.

Yeah, land barons. They made life really difficult for a long-time landlord I had, and she finally just gave up.

[CaerolleClaudel]

So, a couple of things I recall now. Once upon a time there was beautiful princess named Caerolle, and she became infatuated with a peasant girl from a rival kingdom...oh wait, wrong story, sorry!!

Actually, she looked to buy a place in Bay City for some reason. Way pricey, partially because of the double prims (which she did not need, she was used to having nice furniture and decorations with limited prim allotments), so she did not buy a place.

However, recently she was trying to understand the new user experience a bit and went to the Welcome Hub. Bay City had a booth there, so she went back an poked about Bay City. Found it interesting in a way but could not understand why past Princess Caerolle ever wanted to live there lol.

The End.

[Bubblesort Triskaidekaphobia]

2 hours ago, CaerolleClaudel said:

OK, so I did go there last night (this morning? what is late and what is early when it is 5AM and you have been up all night lol). I saw something similar a long, long time ago somewhere else, but good to find this place, thx!

First thing I noticed, wow, massive lag and low FPS even though no one else was around. I seem to recall lag was a bigger issue with mainland, anecdotal in this case but still seems to hold.

I did not know about the rail systems, those do look interesting! Looks like you can actually ride those? That might be something I would at least try, walking is too slow and not going to do the car thing lol. I am not really sure how to find places to get on all those lines, but there was a map and sign outside the building that mentioned a place in SL where you can at least find out about the Bellisseria one, I think, as well as a website.

Zindra, OH.MY.GODDESS. I was just randomly clicking on places of the Japan-looking mainland continents and on the Zindra continent to see what came up, and yeah Zindra seems not just Adult rated, but like extreme XXX rated. Now I do remember going there a few times just to check things out and it was too much for me. Some of the places that popped up put me in mind of the Reavers in the series Firefly and the movie Serenity, if you are familiar with either of those.

I don't notice higher lag there, but I"m on pre-PBR Firestorm.

The rails are fun to ride!  I have a few trains, but here is my favorite train, and it's only L$1.  It's not historically accurate, and it doesn't have all the features, but it's nice and simple and easy to use.  Try taking it to a train station, and rezzing it on the tracks at a rez point.  I like to rez at Red Hook, at the southern tip of the Victoria region of Bellisseria.  It's a nice easy ride from there, not too many switches or turns.  If you want to go left or right when the rail splits, there's a switch you can click to change the tracks left or right, just like rail switches in real life.  You will see what I mean.  It's pretty simple.  More simple than driving or sailing.

I believe that Zindra's monorail system is unique.  You might want to check that out, if you are into trains.  IIRC, with the monorail system, you ride the train that is rezzed, rather than riding your own train.

Edited September 15 by Bubblesort Triskaidekaphobia
Forgot to put in a link to my favorite train

[CaerolleClaudel]

52 minutes ago, Bubblesort Triskaidekaphobia said:

I don't notice higher lag there, but I"m on pre-PBR Firestorm.

The rails are fun to ride!  I have a few trains, but here is my favorite train, and it's only L$1.  It's not historically accurate, and it doesn't have all the features, but it's nice and simple and easy to use.  Try taking it to a train station, and rezzing it on the tracks at a rez point.  I like to rez at Red Hook, at the southern tip of the Victoria region of Bellisseria.  It's a nice easy ride from there, not too many switches or turns.  If you want to go left or right when the rail splits, there's a switch you can click to change the tracks left or right, just like rail switches in real life.  You will see what I mean.  It's pretty simple.  More simple than driving or sailing.

I believe that Zindra's monorail system is unique.  You might want to check that out, if you are into trains.  IIRC, with the monorail system, you ride the train that is rezzed, rather than riding your own train.

Thx, I will look into those!

[Bree Giffen]

7 hours ago, CaerolleClaudel said:

Did you rent places exclusively on mainland on purpose or it just turned out that way?

I didn't rent on mainland on purpose. I just searched for land that met my needs. Since I use a skybox I don't need my parcel to look pretty or be close to water. I also didn't need any existing houses or furniture. I believe mainland rental prices are also lower. 

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

7 hours ago, CaerolleClaudel said:

Sadly, her business dropped off so she closed the island and I had to move to one of her mainland houses. It was ok, but nothing compared with my house on the island.

This is why I don't like renting.,I've always had a mainland plot. And as a very old sl resident, I dunno , maybe I'm more inclined to stick with it for some reason. When I started in sl,  there weren't any private regions. Just mainland.

Actually maybe there was ONE and it was called Avalon. 

[CaerolleClaudel]

6 hours ago, Bubblesort Triskaidekaphobia said:

I don't notice higher lag there, but I"m on pre-PBR Firestorm.

The rails are fun to ride!  I have a few trains, but here is my favorite train, and it's only L$1.  It's not historically accurate, and it doesn't have all the features, but it's nice and simple and easy to use.  Try taking it to a train station, and rezzing it on the tracks at a rez point.  I like to rez at Red Hook, at the southern tip of the Victoria region of Bellisseria.  It's a nice easy ride from there, not too many switches or turns.  If you want to go left or right when the rail splits, there's a switch you can click to change the tracks left or right, just like rail switches in real life.  You will see what I mean.  It's pretty simple.  More simple than driving or sailing.

I believe that Zindra's monorail system is unique.  You might want to check that out, if you are into trains.  IIRC, with the monorail system, you ride the train that is rezzed, rather than riding your own train.

I got the train and rode from Red Hook! Quite interesting and peaceful. Train worked well once I read the instructions, the horror, lol. I started off at 50% speed, but noticed that through some twisty places the train seemed to get rattly and unsettled, so I thought maybe if I increased to 100% I could derail it. Sadly, disaster did not ensue lol.

I actually found a place close to a station on the Zondra monorail pretty easily, and had a go on it. Not as fun as the train, but interesting. After a bit it crashed my viewer, but that's SL.

Thanks for tips, and for the link to the train and to the tracks!

[CaerolleClaudel]

26 minutes ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

This is why I don't like renting.,I've always had a mainland plot. And as a very old sl resident, I dunno , maybe I'm more inclined to stick with it for some reason. When I started in sl,  there weren't any private regions. Just mainland.

Actually maybe there was ONE and it was called Avalon. 

Overall, I like renting better because what I rent is far cheaper than paying for a Premium account of some sort and then buying land. Also, if it is just a plain flat piece of ground or whatever I have no interest in trying to get it in shape to suit me. I did buy a piece of ocean once and put an island on it and a house and all that, but that seems a lot simpler than land-land.

I also set up a platform on someone else's land once and put a house on it. I didn't do much to the platform, just left it flat and put some grass down and a white fence and flowers around the edges. I wasn't going to live there, I had a skybox I liked, I just set it up to decorate and furnish with some stuff I wanted to show the person who owned the land. After they had a look I took it all down.

The two places I really loved the most, the place I rented and lost when the landlord gave up the private region or whatever it was, and the place I made on the water, I would have stayed with if possible. I would have bought the land where the house was that I rented, that was my fave place ever, but it wasn't mainland, so I couldn't buy a parcel and stay there. I never found another piece of land on which I could recreate that, either, or I might have done it. The ongoing cost would have constantly nagged at me though.

[CaerolleClaudel]

14 hours ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

This is Heterocera (or Atoll Continent) is the second historical mainland continent. It has lots of roads and it's fun to explore. There are actually some really nice neighborhoods along those roads. 

I tried flying around this place, and OMG, I don't think I have experienced such lag in like 15 years. My viewer finally just locked up and I had to end the task to close it.

[InnerCity Elf]

It's good for... people living in squatter and other high-change-y zones irl and want a homely feeling in SL.

Personally, I like the hunt for a nice plot on a sim with a nice name, that you don't need to IM anyone for anything, the wildness and randomness, that it's "the original SL", and some other things. I also like non-mainland, though, for other reasons. 

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

9 hours ago, CaerolleClaudel said:

I tried flying around this place, and OMG, I don't think I have experienced such lag in like 15 years. My viewer finally just locked up and I had to end the task to close it.

Wow it locked up? I "live" there and haven't experienced that on my plot. I've encountered laggy spots on the mainland but even laggier places on private regions that are highly decorated or clubs and event venues. I guess it all depends on what someone decides to put on their land. 

[Qie Niangao]

41 minutes ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

Wow it locked up? I "live" there and haven't experienced that on my plot. I've encountered laggy spots on the mainland but even laggier places on private regions that are highly decorated or clubs and event venues. I guess it all depends on what someone decides to put on their land. 

Yeah, the only times I've had a viewer "lock up" like that is during a heavy griefer attack, which are a lot rarer now than in the past (and viewers are a lot more robust to those events, too), but they still happen on Mainland more than Estates because it can take a while to get a Governance response.

Couple things about the rail system. First, the Zindra monorail is quite different in implementation from any of the other rail systems. One of the boarding locations was "roped off" for years but it seems to be operational in a quick test, although the pod I was riding did eventually get "stuck".

In all these vehicles, there are occasional troubles when crossing region borders, and one can make that especially risky by wearing a lot of scripts (or using a vehicle with a lot of scripts). Also, separating the cam from the avatar as the avatar moves far away, like studying an attraction as an autonomous vehicle takes the avatar elsewhere, will eventually cause a crash; it's just a matter of time and distance.

The Heterocera Atoll continent still has by far the most elaborate rail network, the SLRR, but it's most suited for those with their own locomotive to "drive" the tracks. It's easy enough when you get the hang of it, but meanwhile there are autonomous "pods" and "SLGI" and other vehicles that will take passengers some distance before transmogrifying into some non-rail transport to distant lands. (You can see where vehicles are and how they're moving shown on some traffic maps scattered around Virtual Railway Consortium sites on the SLRR.)

On the Sansara continent, the Snowlands have a rail system ("ONSR") as do the color regions ("GSLR"), not to mention Bay City's and Nova Albion's trolleys. They're all a bit different from each other, but overall, non-Bellisseria Mainland does not lack for rail transport.

[Prokofy Neva]

On 9/15/2024 at 10:15 AM, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

This is Heterocera (or Atoll Continent) is the second historical mainland continent. It has lots of roads and it's fun to explore. There are actually some really nice neighborhoods along those roads. 

Note that Ingrid's House isn't at the center of the maelstrom, and that center is actually a big, empty lake where a lot of GTFOs clustered counterintuitively and actually drove people like me with nice rentals off the sim. There's no zoning on the Mainland and that's why you got the flight to islands and Bellisseria. I happened to go to that lake yesterday to get the old Linden swag from a hunt underwater there and it's not as bad as it was but still not attractive. 

But Ingrid is right, there are some really nice areas there which are like the best-kept secret of SL. I recently picked up some abandoned land in Tethea sadly let go by someone with a nice cafe with a BBB stamp due to RL issues and I tried to fit in with the wonderful builds there. I flew all around up and down the roads there and was amazed how good it is. I try to keep my own areas nice as do some of my long-time neighbours but I often feel I'm on an oasis in a sea of blight consisting of large tracts of abandoned land dotted by giant pieces of plywood, huge towers no one lives in, strange box clubs with no traffic, huge breedable barns, etc. Some people have gone to great expense (not me, anymore!) to save Hector Lake which absurdly went on sale for cheap, didn't sell, got chopped, and was in danger of becoming a sea of "cities" (!) with cheap stacked-up sky homes and Brutalist architecture on the water mixed with ad farms -- but fortunately did not. It's a struggle.

[SarahKB7 Koskinen]

If, like me, you can travel this whole route only by boat in under 3 hours 23 minutes , you can call yourself a mainland expert! (No teleporting, no flying, no cheating!).

Start: Giuseppe (NE corner of GaetaV).
Mid-point: Lordshore (Southern-most connected Jeogeot water region).
Finish: Fillip (Northern tip of Heterocera).
Total time: 3 hours, 23 minutes, 12 Seconds.
Sims: 699.
Distance:  154.98 KM (96.3 miles)

Vehicle: Boat.

Edited Tuesday at 04:00 PM by SarahKB7 Koskinen

[Rowan Amore]

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

2 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

Some people have gone to great expense (not me, anymore!) to save Hector Lake which absurdly went on sale for cheap, didn't sell, got chopped, and was in danger of becoming a sea of "cities" (!) with cheap stacked-up sky homes and Brutalist architecture on the water mixed with ad farms -- but fortunately did not. It's a struggle.

I still find it absurd that LL didn't designate all water "protected LL land". But that just one of many mistakes they made with the mainland. Hippie concepts don't work, they found out the hard way and basically had to start over with Belli. 

I don't think we will ever seen a new mainland continent, unless it's another Belli type. 

Edited Monday at 06:46 PM by Ingrid Ingersoll

[Clem Marques]

3 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

Couple things about the rail system. First, the Zindra monorail is quite different in implementation from any of the other rail systems. One of the boarding locations was "roped off" for years but it seems to be operational in a quick test, although the pod I was riding did eventually get "stuck".

The only thing that really bothers me about the Zindra monorail is the sheer speed of it. Not enough time to really enjoy the view as you attempt to look around, sometimes the surroundings don't really rez in time, and having to pick left or right during every turn, at very fast speeds, can be mildly stressful. Region crossings in quick succession are also risky on slower computers like mine. Is there any way to make that vehicle go slower? Not sure if it's possible at all, but thought I'd ask anyway.