New SL-Dedicated Social Media, Blogging, and Photography Platform PrimFeed Opens! What Are Your Impressions?

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

10 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

30 Whole days!

Wow.

Why wouldn't you just add a button on the site for that.

 

How about GDPR requests?

30 days is in full compliance with the GDPR, just look here: https://www.edpb.europa.eu/sme-data-protection-guide/faq-frequently-asked-questions/answer/how-do-i-respond-request-erasure_en

The GDPR states that deletion requests should be answered with no undue delay, but at latest 30 days after reception of the request.

Of course yes, having just such a button in the account management system of the platform would make life easier for everybody.

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

And now for some stuff I do consider as legal pitfalls:

No approval of ToS required to use the system: when creating an account I have to approve the ToS.

When just using "Login with in-world code", which enables me to use the platform using my SL identity without having a prior account on Primfeed, there is no ToS tick mark in that dialogue.

Undisclosed identity: by my understanding of the GDPR the name of data controller must be disclosed. This includes real name including address plus way of contact. Since this is within Luke Rowley's authority he is by my understanding the data controller.

Furthermore also by French law the real name, address and way of contact must be mentioned by my understanding on the web site (Source: https://www.economie.gouv.fr/entreprises/site-internet-mentions-obligatoires).

 

[Aiyumei]

2 hours ago, Bartholomew Gallacher said:

When just using "Login with in-world code", which enables me to use the platform using my SL identity without having a prior account on Primfeed, there is no ToS tick mark in that dialogue.

Actually when you create your account you have to accept the ToS or it wont let you complete the creation process. Afterwards you can login as many times as you want, you've already accepted the ToS

 

2 hours ago, Bartholomew Gallacher said:

Furthermore also by French law the real name, address and way of contact must be mentioned by my understanding on the web site (Source: https://www.economie.gouv.fr/entreprises/site-internet-mentions-obligatoires).

While that may be true according to the document you provided there are multiple internet access services categories stated by the government. Not all require this kind of legal information to be provided from the provider's side. Furthermore aside from the person's first name and email address all other data is considered as PII, which as per GDPR any citizen is not obliged to provide unless requested by legal or government institution. We as international end users are of no right to ask or request that information from Luke for means of contact.

From what I see, aside from RL contact information, Luke has provided everything mentioned in this document in Primfeed's ToS

P.S I didn't think I'd be going through french legal documents outside of my weekdays 

Edited July 7 by Aiyumei

[Kylerky]

Looks great!

[Coffee Pancake]

11 hours ago, Bartholomew Gallacher said:

30 days is in full compliance with the GDPR, just look here: https://www.edpb.europa.eu/sme-data-protection-guide/faq-frequently-asked-questions/answer/how-do-i-respond-request-erasure_en

The GDPR states that deletion requests should be answered with no undue delay, but at latest 30 days after reception of the request.

Of course yes, having just such a button in the account management system of the platform would make life easier for everybody.

The site owner manually deleting an account might not in and of itself comply with GDPR.

[Coffee Pancake]

6 hours ago, Bartholomew Gallacher said:

And now for some stuff I do consider as legal pitfalls:

Don't worry, the site owner totally had a friend with a degree in laws help with everything.

[Quartz Mole]

May I suggest that, if anyone does have concerns about a site's GDPR compliance or otherwise, it would be better to report those concerns to the appropriate data protection authorities rather than argue about it here?

Also, since GDPR is, as I understand it, a highly specialised area of law, I think it would be best if people specify what, if any, professional qualifications they hold when offering advice on it.

[Cinnamon Mistwood]

I have enjoyed Primfeed. I like the pictures and creativity. I haven't had much time to get into any really good discussions, yet. 

Unfortunately I have not yet tried to log in on my phone, so it's usefulness is limited until I do. Otherwise,  I have to login from my laptop at home.  Laptop time is limited by real life responsibilities and a job away from home. I'd rather be inworld when I get a chance to sit at my computer. 

I don't suppose there is an app since this is a clone of several other apps? If there is, I couldn't find it.

 

[Scylla Rhiadra]

Just now, Cinnamon Mistwood said:

I don't suppose there is an app since this is a clone of several other apps? If there is, I couldn't find it.

 

There is. At least for Android. But I also found it worked quite well in my browser on my phone.

[Luke Rowley]

12 minutes ago, Cinnamon Mistwood said:

I don't suppose there is an app since this is a clone of several other apps? If there is, I couldn't find it.

 

In the documentation, I'm explaining the process to install the app: https://docs.primfeed.com/frequently-asked-questions#how-to-install-primfeed-as-an-app-on-my-devices  

[Starberry Passion]

I don't think anything is wrong with the site, still, after using it. It's a refreshing site that have had less drama "yet" than the forums here. You go on there you take photos you share photos, you say what's on your mind and as long as it is about second life then you have nothing to worry about, unless you're trying to openly cause some sort of drama or strife. No one on primfeed, atm, seems to be trying to do that and no one is trying to backseat anyone's avatars, comment on how someone else look as far as I could tell. There hasn't been some sort of judgement protocols because someone disagrees how their face should look, yet. It's just a refreshing Social Platform site. 

I think, Luke have created something positive for Second Life, instead of creating something that is like "Virtual Secrets" and it's looking like it's a place where people can feel like they belong, outside of Second Life World but it's still about your Second Life.

Edited July 8 by Starberry Passion

[Kore Jardberg]

On 7/7/2024 at 11:55 PM, Quartz Mole said:

May I suggest that, if anyone does have concerns about a site's GDPR compliance or otherwise, it would be better to report those concerns to the appropriate data protection authorities rather than argue about it here?

Also, since GDPR is, as I understand it, a highly specialised area of law, I think it would be best if people specify what, if any, professional qualifications they hold when offering advice on it.

Hello Quartz Mole. I don't immediately understand why you would encourage people to report a website to the authorities (especially since said website does not provide RL contact information) rather than discussing their experience/opinion here. Is there a specific rule on this forum that prevents users from discussing privacy concerns? And could you comment on Linden Lab implicit endorsement of this service since it appears the company created an account there? Thank you.

[Starberry Passion]

8 hours ago, Kore Jardberg said:

Hello Quartz Mole. I don't immediately understand why you would encourage people to report a website to the authorities (especially since said website does not provide RL contact information) rather than discussing their experience/opinion here. Is there a specific rule on this forum that prevents users from discussing privacy concerns? And could you comment on Linden Lab implicit endorsement of this service since it appears the company created an account there? Thank you.

People people have concerns and he is presenting a solution that will put people's worries to rest.

Why would you not want to be informed about it, if people will constantly criticize and or attack someone, over a site they created?

If you have suspicions, worry, concerns then you should know the tools to make your worries quelled out.

Some people have thrown accusations and personal opinions about this whole thing, this entire time. You want to say things but when someone give you a solution, you get upset about it? It's a tool to use so you can understand and think more clearly, and less emotionally.

Edited July 10 by Starberry Passion

[Bartholomew Gallacher]

On 7/8/2024 at 1:17 PM, Starberry Passion said:

I don't think anything is wrong with the site, still, after using it. It's a refreshing site that have had less drama "yet" than the forums here.

Well when running such a site there are always several different aspects you need to pay attention to.

Technical wise it is a really great achievement Luke has done here, no doubt about it. Also the way he's steering it, and quite transparent about changes and developments is great.

But that's only one of the important aspects when doing such a thing. The other most important one is to abide the law. ToS looks to be resolved by now, just tested it with a new account.

The other thing are legal mentionings. Here I strongly disagree with the identity being shrouded in a mist of obscurity. This site is meant to be a social network, so lots of sensitive data is being saved and accumulated over the time here.

There's a reason why law is like it is. And the least thing people can expect is to know who is running the show, not by avatar name only but how the law requires it to be by my understanding.

Going with this to authorities would be just *****ting on the carpet, and malicious. I've adressed my worries, that's enough for me. Take it or leave it.

[rasterscan]

On 7/1/2024 at 9:11 PM, Extrude Ragu said:

It's a lot more cheery than browsing the forums I'll give it that

I'll second that !

[Aiyumei]

21 hours ago, Bartholomew Gallacher said:

Going with this to authorities would be just *****ting on the carpet, and malicious. I've adressed my worries, that's enough for me. Take it or leave it.

If it comes to such moment where he needs to be contacted, they know how to do it. 

[discussionbot]

21 hours ago, Bartholomew Gallacher said:

Here I strongly disagree with the identity being shrouded in a mist of obscurity. This site is meant to be a social network, so lots of sensitive data is being saved and accumulated over the time here.

That's an interesting point, surprised no one is concerned about this.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

23 hours ago, Bartholomew Gallacher said:

The other thing are legal mentionings. Here I strongly disagree with the identity being shrouded in a mist of obscurity. This site is meant to be a social network, so lots of sensitive data is being saved and accumulated over the time here.

1 hour ago, discussionbot said:

That's an interesting point, surprised no one is concerned about this.

I think this is a fair point, although I think Cathlea is also not wrong:

1 hour ago, Aiyumei said:

If it comes to such moment where he needs to be contacted, they know how to do it. 

He does, after all, have an SL account, and an SL business. I suspect that he's "findable" should that ever become necessary from a legal perspective.

I'd also be somewhat more worried were there much in the way of useful data to collect on the site. The accounts are all connected with SL accounts, and payment, if one goes Premium or whatever he calls it, is made in-world, rather than through banks, Paypal, or other RL payment method. I suppose that, if he were to link data scraped from his site to info harvested via bots in-world, he'd have a fair bit about our accounts. But the threat level seems pretty low.

Again, though, "pretty low" is not non-existent.

Edited July 12 by Scylla Rhiadra

[Aiyumei]

1 hour ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I think this is a fair point, although I think Cathlea is also not wrong:

He does, after all, have an SL account, and an SL business. I suspect that he's "findable" should that ever become necessary from a legal perspective.

I'd also be somewhat more worried were there much in the way of useful data to collect on the site. The accounts are all connected with SL accounts, and payment, if one goes Premium or whatever he calls it, is made in-world, rather than through banks, Paypal, or other RL payment method. I suppose that, if he were to link data scraped from his site to info harvested via bots in-world, he'd have a fair bit about our accounts. But the threat level seems pretty low.

Again, though, "pretty low" is not non-existent.

Hence why I raised security concerns about the amount of data that's exposed since day one. My report still remains "Under Review".

[Kore Jardberg]

On 7/10/2024 at 7:06 PM, Starberry Passion said:

People people have concerns and he is presenting a solution that will put people's worries to rest.

Why would you not want to be informed about it, if people will constantly criticize and or attack someone, over a site they created?

If you have suspicions, worry, concerns then you should know the tools to make your worries quelled out.

Some people have thrown accusations and personal opinions about this whole thing, this entire time. You want to say things but when someone give you a solution, you get upset about it? It's a tool to use so you can understand and think more clearly, and less emotionally.

I don't see how your answer has anything to do with my comment. Please read more carefully.

[Kore Jardberg]

On 7/11/2024 at 11:04 AM, Bartholomew Gallacher said:

Well when running such a site there are always several different aspects you need to pay attention to.

Technical wise it is a really great achievement Luke has done here, no doubt about it. Also the way he's steering it, and quite transparent about changes and developments is great.

But that's only one of the important aspects when doing such a thing. The other most important one is to abide the law. ToS looks to be resolved by now, just tested it with a new account.

The other thing are legal mentionings. Here I strongly disagree with the identity being shrouded in a mist of obscurity. This site is meant to be a social network, so lots of sensitive data is being saved and accumulated over the time here.

There's a reason why law is like it is. And the least thing people can expect is to know who is running the show, not by avatar name only but how the law requires it to be by my understanding.

Going with this to authorities would be just *****ting on the carpet, and malicious. I've adressed my worries, that's enough for me. Take it or leave it.

I concur. And since Quartz Mole asks for credentials but denies a proper answer when asked to clarify, I am a RL company owner in France (which is Primfeed's creator country of residence) and I am familiar with my legal duties when it comes to operating a website. These laws are designed to provide consumer protection and since Primfeed is not just a free service between friends, but instead provides paid membership plans, it falls under the same obligations as any other business. To take an example of how things should be done, Avastar is also ran by a Second Life resident but her website complies with laws. Now, some people are prompt to extrapolate that because we point at problems we reject the entire project. This is not the case. We are pointing at problems that can be solved and would make more people comfortable with this platform since it is at the intersection of IP addresses, Second Life usernames and private communications (soon instant messaging, if I understood correctly).

[BilliJo Aldrin]

Finally signed up, it seems cool 😁

[Kore Jardberg]

18 hours ago, discussionbot said:

That's an interesting point, surprised no one is concerned about this.

Yes.

[InnerCity Elf]

On 7/12/2024 at 8:47 AM, discussionbot said:

That's an interesting point, surprised no one is concerned about this.

I think that many people who are concerned, didn't and won't sign up to a site like that in any case, or not, after scanning for the "footer things". To me, it's highly astounding, to say it nicely, that it's allowed to have a public site like that without an actual legal site notice. If I want to have a website here, even a personal one with, let's say, about my hobby of collecting 17th century thimbles, not selling anything at all, no commercial purpose at all, with nothing even remotely like sign-up options for newsletters, etc., I need to disclose full name, address, way of communication. Even when people just browse your site, you're already "collecting" data about them, whether intentionally, or even ever looking at such data, or not.

The downside being that this probably robs the world of a few 17th century thimbles fan sites, as they won't all want to expose themselves to the Pandora's box of cyber crimes, stalking, identity theft, site notice shark lawyers, etc., but it probably also has its good sides.

I wonder how long it will take until things like that are universally, or lets say globally, for now :), ruled, or if they ever will be, it's an intricate ocean and rough waters to surf for any site operator with international customers or even viewers, for sure.

[Starberry Passion]

On 7/12/2024 at 9:18 PM, Kore Jardberg said:

I don't see how your answer has anything to do with my comment. Please read more carefully.

I Disagree, that is exactly why he put that as an option, He didn't tell anyone to do anything, he gave a suggestion to do that, if they have concerns. It's very obvious that that is the reason.