So what changed in the Terms of Service?

[Arielle Popstar]

5 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

Their presence on A rated land is now an Abuse Reportable Offence.

Are you suggesting SL Criminals should be allowed to continue openly  violating the LL ToS?

Be a good "community building" citizen, and ARR the criminals.

 

The tools given by SL are meant as defensive options to help you feel safe. Do you feel unsafe? May I suggest an alternative where you won't be at risk from the little people? One can use the tools for defense or one can use them aggressively to the point one becomes the criminal one is so afraid of.

[Theresa Tennyson]

2 hours ago, Madi Melodious said:

I'm starting to find your comments both inflammatory and offensive.   

"Starting"?

[Arielle Popstar]

4 minutes ago, brodiac90 said:

You can change your settings to block certain content. In Firestorm mine are set to only access G and M. Even if someone sends me a TP to adult land it won't go through. My mom tested it on her avi to make me feel better. 

I also got that panic button Hud that Madi posted about it does the above but will also TP you home to safe land if the G or M sim you're currently on suddenly changes to A land while you're on it. 

I'm a child avatar and if you see kids on Adult land you should AR them. I'd probably AR myself if I ever accidentally ended up on A land if the above fails just to make it very clear to LL that it was very much an accident. 

Don't you think to AR is a little aggressive? It risks the other losing all of one's investment and years of virtual life. 

[Zalificent Corvinus]

10 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

May I suggest an alternative where you won't be at risk from the little people?

The pint sized anti-adult-activities griefer visited an A rated region with intent to disrupt and destroy the adults SL.

Abuse Report, mute, derender, punt kick and ban ARE defensive measures.

If the walking ToS violation hadn't violated the ToS, no defensive action would have been needed.

 

7 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Don't you think to AR is a little aggressive? It risks the other losing all of one's investment and years of virtual life. 

They risked that themselves when they deliberately violated the LL ToS. You always talk about "taking personal responsibility".

They broke the rules knowing it could cost them their account, they should accept that they are responsible for getting their account AR'd and banned.

 

Edited May 5 by Zalificent Corvinus

[Arielle Popstar]

2 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

The pint sized anti-adult-activities griefer visited an A rated region with intent to disrupt and destroy the adults SL.

Abuse Report, mute, derender, punt kick and ban ARE defensive measures.

If the walking ToS violation hadn't violated the ToS, no defensive action would have been needed.

 

I asked once before in another thread a while back wondering how you attract so many ToS violaters. I guess I see why now. Good luck with that.

[AmeliaJ08]

1 hour ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I think it's unfortunate, but yes . . . for at least a while, until the furor dies down a little, I'd likely be a little extra cautious.

It'll be interesting . . . I have a "realistically" proportioned avi -- 180 cm -- with small breasts. And, although I don't wear anything that I think could be construed as "Lolita" or even anime, I DO wear things occasionally that are somewhat "younger" looking, as part of a fashion associated with the Riot Grrrl movement of the 90s.

I've never been questioned as to my age. I wonder if I will be now?

Reminds me of my avi. Still not entirely sure I want to log in, could be any age from 16-25....

I really don't know how we navigate this safely.

 

Edited May 5 by AmeliaJ08

[Love Zhaoying]

30 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Oh yes, because you're ever going to give up being a furry .. come on. demanding people surrender self-identification when you wouldn't even consider the same for split second if it was your fluffy hide on line.

remind me to shrug if and when they come for the furries.

You've got it, finally! The same goes for kink and Adult activities.

[Roxy Couturier]

4 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

You've got it, finally! The same goes for kink and Adult activities.

They already did. The result is called 'Zindra'.

[Dorientje Woller]

13 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

The pint sized anti-adult-activities griefer visited an A rated region with intent to disrupt and destroy the adults SL.

Abuse Report, mute, derender, punt kick and ban ARE defensive measures.

If the walking ToS violation hadn't violated the ToS, no defensive action would have been needed.

 

They risked that themselves when they deliberately violated the LL ToS. You always talk about "taking personal responsibility".

They broke the rules knowing it could cost them their account, they should accept that they are responsible for getting their account AR'd and banned.

 

For every nitwit that causes troubles on an A rated sim, there are a bunch that keep themselves to the books. And then there is the aspect of courtesy, which you seem to lack: Ask, if a child avatar ends up on an A rated place, to change to an adult form.

[BilliJo Aldrin]

6 hours ago, Stephanie Misfit said:

I guess it depends on whether or not you can expect to see nudity on those sims. If the answer is yes, then change avatars before sailing as you would if you were going to a Moderate region store that sells adult things. Maybe some sailors could provide you with information about whether nudity is common on the Blake Sea.

I always sail the Blake Sea nude with my friends. There are General sims on the Blake Sea, we always stear clear of them so that WE don’t getARed 😂

[BilliJo Aldrin]

2 hours ago, JUSTUS Palianta said:

Linden can remove items from your inventory.  Every single object has a number just like an avatar.  Not the first time they have done it and it won't be the last.  I think they call that life.

it will actually be death if that happens, death of second life 😂

[Alwin Alcott]

1 hour ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Why not, you're doing the same for everyone who isn't getting over this already
 

 nowhere i said to everyone who has problems with it to go somewhere else, you drag issues in that aren't part of the discussion.

 

[BilliJo Aldrin]

2 hours ago, JUSTUS Palianta said:

I feel like the new rules help to keep adults safe from that situation.  Although it won't stop really determined tiny trolls, it will help.

lol lets keep adults safe by banning child nudity? thats funny as heck 😁

[BilliJo Aldrin]

2 hours ago, brodiac90 said:

One of the really good things about the change in rules is it makes it very clear what G and A land is meant for. 

I personally would like to see more G land. If it's not already a thing then I think it would be benificial if LL offered Belli homes on G land. 

Lastly I would like to see better policing of G land too. While many in here have expressed that they are very conscious of what they wear, say and do in G land, that has not always been my experience unfortunately. 

G land is full of sex stuff too, don’t kid yourself. people buy G land because its cheap then put all their adult stuff in a skybox. Perhaps LL should do a sweep of all G sims, then ban everyone that has adult stuff rezzed.

Hey its for thr kids, gotta keep them safe 😂

Edited May 5 by BilliJo Aldrin
spelling

[BilliJo Aldrin]

My infamous 50 prim tower on a 16 sqm parcel is on moderate land, but it butts up against a general sim. Im often nude there. If i see a kid on the general sim can I report them for being close to nudity? 😁

[Qie Niangao]

6 hours ago, Qie Niangao said:

This could go either way. There are definitely businesses on Adult-rated land that will leave for G or M now because their Adult stuff (if any) can't justify inconveniencing some child avatars who never even realized they'd visited an Adult region. Many Adult-rated locations have little or no "adult" content nor activities, and until now, that didn't matter much. Now it might because more residents will exclude Adult from Search and content maturity preferences. That was something merchants feared back in 2007 but it turned out not to be a big deal (until now).

And on the other hand, yeah, some will now choose to site on an Adult region to avoid child avatars.

Point is, this isn't a mere policy clarification, it's a real change in the definition of Adult land, and will cause disruption. Nothing like 2007, but disruption nonetheless.

6 hours ago, Vivienne Schell said:

I do not think that it causes disruption. Do not overestimate the impact of child play. There are not so many people running child avatars, and the ToS changes basically do not change anything for the est. 95 percent users who never did and never will use a child avatar or actively interact with one. I doubt that more than a "handful" of child players ever really "resided" on A rated sims, and if, these can easily move to M rated sims, without much fuss, or change their sim to M if they really own one. The entire thing will pass almost unnoticed by the vast majority of users, no need to worry.

1 hour ago, Phil Deakins said:

I did, and I came to the same conclusion, that child avatars are a very small minority. They are certainly not the majority or equal so ...

They're a minority, but not by any stretch a "very small" minority. Minorities of residents make up the whole population if we dice up their attributes finely enough. Let's not get too eager to declare minorities dispensable. (I expect points here for refraining from quoting Niemöller.)

It's not 2007-level disruption (as I noted) but we really do ourselves no favors by pretending nobody worth consideration is affected. This is a policy change; let's not deny it affects people. As one tiny example, until this week, landlords could remain child avatars while they visited rentals they own on Adult land. It's not the end of their world that they now need to wear another avatar, but were it me I think I'd just sell the land to avoid the hassle, wouldn't you? Again, it's not 2007, but it's not nothing.

(Also consider, if it's such a negligible minority, why all the fuss about them? Because suddenly that minority—in fact a tiny minority of that minority—makes people so uncomfortable. Now they're not so negligible, huh?)

2 hours ago, Drayke Newall said:

Clearly from the FAQ not being updated to answer this question but updated to clarify others, and the multiple tags requesting confirmation shows that LL are in an oh-oh situation and dont themselves know how they are going to fix and enforce it without a big staff meeting to discuss.

I think that's correct. It seems pretty obvious they didn't get all the right Lindens thinking about how this can actually work and what different approaches will do to the Governance workload.

4 hours ago, Piper Kelly said:

Maybe LL should think about banning the people that go around derendering a child av's clothing.       Just saying.

Maybe not this, exactly, but something needs to be communicated about consequences of filing falsified or frivolous reports. I'd start by saying that Governance will only review reports of content visible in the standard Linden viewer using normal viewer settings. Residents accept all responsibility for anything they see when they derender.

1 hour ago, brodiac90 said:

As a child avatar I'm allowed on M land but I'm not allowed near nudity for obvious reasons. I do not want to go to a beach and suddenly find out it's a nude one and be AR'ed and banned. 

1 hour ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I am pretty sure that the vast majority of nude beaches clearly advertise themselves as such.

There are self-proclaimed nude beaches, but I have some nice M-rated beachfront, casually open to the public, where nudity can break out at any time and occasionally does. I'm not going to tell anybody they can't get nude there. But nor am I going to tell child avatars they can't visit. They can report each other all they want, but I sure hope Governance has a way of efficiently ignoring all those whiny ARs.

[BilliJo Aldrin]

42 minutes ago, Dorientje Woller said:

For every nitwit that causes troubles on an A rated sim, there are a bunch that keep themselves to the books. And then there is the aspect of courtesy, which you seem to lack: Ask, if a child avatar ends up on an A rated place, to change to an adult form.

Thats the point though, owners of adult venues wont ask the the kid to change, they will simply AR them with a guaranteed ban before kicking them

[lambskin]

2 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Why not, you're doing the same for everyone who isn't getting over this already.

A lot of people are asking some very searching questions at the moment and feeling broadly unwelcome and under-attack in a place they have called home for years.

Yes. Fully gown adults are shedding real tears over all this.

and here the peanut gallery, entirely unaffected, but with an opinion none the less .. wow.. just that...wow
 

 

1 hour ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Oh yes, because you're ever going to give up being a furry .. come on. demanding people surrender self-identification when you wouldn't even consider the same for split second if it was your fluffy hide on line.

remind me to shrug if and when they come for the furries.

I support attacking people who demand to look at naked kids. If your identity you won't give up involves looking at naked kids then I support discrimination against it.

[Qie Niangao]

26 minutes ago, lambskin said:

I support attacking people who demand to look at naked kids. If your identity you won't give up involves looking at naked kids then I support discrimination against it.

[Extrude Ragu]

2 hours ago, lambskin said:

I support attacking people who demand to look at naked kids. If your identity you won't give up involves looking at naked kids then I support discrimination against it.

Your inworld profile pic is of Suika Ibuki, one of Touhou's 'cute and funny' characters

You partner similarly describes themselves as a cute anime girl.

Hey, I'm not judging, I grew up on 2hu myself.

I just hope you realize that under the new rules if you or your partner were to try to visit an adult region you would be sent home and possibly have your account reported, assuming the av matches the profile pics, regardless of whether you are wearing clothes or not under these rules. The rules don't just cover nudity.

Edited May 5 by Extrude Ragu
dont type whilst sleepy

[Innula Zenovka]

1 hour ago, Qie Niangao said:

There are self-proclaimed nude beaches, but I have some nice M-rated beachfront, casually open to the public, where nudity can break out at any time and occasionally does. I'm not going to tell anybody they can't get nude there. But nor am I going to tell child avatars they can't visit. They can report each other all they want, but I sure hope Governance has a way of efficiently ignoring all those whiny ARs.

This is covered in  the FAQ:

Quote

Q: If someone is walking through a region wearing exposed genitalia and walks past me (a child avatar), will I be in trouble if someone takes a picture and reports me?
A: No, our investigative process can determine accidental exposure. Again, child avatars should not be engaging or participating in any event or location where nudity and/or sexual activity is present, encouraged and/or expected. The presence of adult content does not warrant the expectation of use.

More generally, this might go some way to reassuring people who are worried about a permaban because of an innocent mistake or trivial infraction:

Quote

Q: Will Residents be immediately terminated if it is determined they are violating any part of the new policy?

A: Not all violations of the policy will result in an immediate termination. Depending upon the nature and severity of the violation, Governance has a suspension tree that is utilized to make attempts to educate the Resident first. However, if those attempts fail and the behavior is continued, it will result in termination. For the more severe offenses, the immediate action will still be to terminate their access to Second Life.

 

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

LL are clearly intent on keeping child avatars and adult content separate, and I suspect everyone in this thread agrees with the spirit of their intentions if not their current methods.

My issue with their current approach is that it seems to be completely one-sided and only addresses the issue by limiting the use of the platform and the areas in which a portion of its user base can access.

Perhaps it would be a little fairer if they also attempted to ensure that the areas which are currently "grey" are safer to access for everyone in the community?

For instance, since we have a mixture of both G and M rated sims on a lot of the mainland why not reclassify all areas aside from Zindra to G rated only?  There are plenty of adult parcels that people could move their adult content to.  They would be safe from the scary little people and could run around naked and do whatever they please to each other!  Do we really need to have people running around naked with their genitalia out on the mainland anyway, how does that improve SLs reputation as a platform?

Sure, do something to keep child avatars away from adult content, but how about doing something to keep adult content away from child avatars too?

[BilliJo Aldrin]

5 minutes ago, Fluffy Sharkfin said:

LL are clearly intent on keeping child avatars and adult content separate, and I suspect everyone in this thread agrees with the spirit of their intentions if not their current methods.

My issue with their current approach is that it seems to be completely one-sided and only addresses the issue by limiting the use of the platform and the areas in which a portion of its user base can access.

Perhaps it would be a little fairer if they also attempted to ensure that the areas which are currently "grey" are safer to access for everyone in the community?

For instance, since we have a mixture of both G and M rated sims on a lot of the mainland why not reclassify all areas aside from Zindra to G rated only?  There are plenty of adult parcels that people could move their adult content to.  They would be safe from the scary little people and could run around naked and do whatever they please to each other!  Do we really need to have people running around naked with their genitalia out on the mainland anyway, how does that improve SLs reputation as a platform?

Sure, do something to keep child avatars away from adult content, but how about doing something to keep adult content away from child avatars too?

Better idea, have entire G continents and entire M continents, totally separated from each other. Of course a lot of people are gonna be upset about having to move, but its a small price to pay for keeping adults and children safe from each other

Edited May 5 by BilliJo Aldrin
added words

[BilliJo Aldrin]

Just had a thought. Since all LL homes are on Moderate land, and adult content is allowed on Moderate land, can child avis safely own a Linden Home?

Or do they have to wear an adult form before they tp home?

[Juliett Beaumont]

2 hours ago, Roxy Couturier said:

They already did. The result is called 'Zindra'.

The result after that result were thousands adult estates. This is how "strict rules" always fail.