So what changed in the Terms of Service?

[Madi Melodious]

7 minutes ago, Sparkle Bunny said:

I'd like to think that LL would ban the perv who derendered the child's clothing, rather than the child.

 

Derendering is entirely a client side feature and is only featured on TPV.  There is no way that LL can know that the perv derendered the child's clothing to start with.    

[Arielle Popstar]

6 minutes ago, Starberry Passion said:

No one said you said LL bans all, You interjected yourself  to tell me "you can be this and that for looking 16" When I never said you couldn't, into a reply that I was replying to someone else that was worried about people throwing them under the bus for being young adults AND I assured them they will not have anything done to them by Linden Lab for being 18+.

Which is still an incorrect assumption. Anyone can be AR'ed for being an underage avatar. The question being will Governance actually investigate in spite of their assurances they will now start doing what they apparently up to now haven't been.

[Starberry Passion]

Just now, Rowan Amore said:

Nope but anyway...

 

 

How does an avatar turn 18?  What determines an 18 year old in SL?   If you say your avatar just turned 18 but you still look 16, are you an adult just because you say so?

Getting my point yet?  NVM.  🙄

 

I don't want to get your point because you're not trying to get mine. I never said anything about turning, just stop talking to me. 

[brodiac90]

1 minute ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

You're just enabling a silly tantrum from people who don't have to do anything but wear undies

No one is opposed to wearing undies. I actually wear BOM underwear now anyway because I know if I go to a busy sim my clothes may not rez in before my body does. 

I'm opposed to my avatar being banned and years / $$$ of content being trashed for something I haven't done. 

Like I said earlier, give us a chance to comply. 

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

6 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Too many in this thread are trying extra hard to cover up by pointing fingers and making sweeping accusations.

Memories are long. Remember that.

Vaguely threatening. Nice.

Remember for as long as you want idgaf.

[Branduff Bisnovat]

I do have sympathy for people who want to but don't know how to comply with these standards. I remember when BOM was implemented I got the impression that LL expected creators to go through their back catalog and update all their appliers to BOM, which of course didn't happen. This is a much higher stakes situation by comparison and the clock is ticking.

[Rowan Amore]

1 minute ago, Starberry Passion said:

I don't want to get your point because you're not trying to get mine. I never said anything about turning, just stop talking to me. 

 

1 hour ago, Starberry Passion said:

When you turn 18, you are an adult. How would one get thrown under the bus for being an adult? I don't understand.

 

[AmeliaJ08]

Well this thread turned predictably awful, well done everyone.

Now I admit I skimmed through the last 20 or so pages but a recurring theme is people asking for a definition of a child avatar and It's still apparently not forthcoming.

Nobody needs to be told that a baby wearing a diaper is a child but it might be helpful to give people an idea of what a 17 year old (and thus subject to new rules) looks like. Of course though I think the unavoidable and sad truth is that 18-21 avatars - played by adults - are probably not going to be able to enjoy all of SL any more.

 

[Starberry Passion]

1 minute ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Which is still an incorrect assumption. Anyone can be AR'ed for being an underage avatar. The question being will Governance actually investigate in spite of their assurances they will now start doing what they apparently up to now haven't been.

I know that people can be AR'd for being underaged but it was said "even for being young adult to late 20s" if you look 18, 19, 20. I don't see a problem.

[Love Zhaoying]

2 minutes ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

SL doesn't exist in a vacuum, and I would expect that most logical adults understand that it's not always about them. You're just enabling a silly tantrum from people who don't have to do anything but wear undies

I will defend Luna on this one point: while it appears to be paradoxical, she is reminding us to be empathetic.

I suppose to some, the "injured party" seems like a victim, rather than someone caught with their hand in a cookie jar. Quite a different perspective. 

[Starberry Passion]

1 minute ago, Rowan Amore said:

 

 

zzz, that was for IRL, when you turn 18, you are considered an adult irl. 

[Novelistic]

2 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

Nope but anyway...

 

 

How does an avatar turn 18?  What determines an 18 year old in SL?   If you say your avatar just turned 18 but you still look 16, are you an adult just because you say so?

Getting my point yet?  NVM.  🙄

 

imagine what you guys look like at the age of 13 look at your old high school photos, then look at you 18 year old photos, there's no difference all one has to do is pretend to be under 18. Most avis I seen would be close to what I seen in high school and college age. Some people think my rl look I look 17 or 18 when I'm 27 rl. it's a slippery slope when determining age all you have to do is not look at the avatar but look at the intent of the avatar user by simply communication.

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Starberry Passion said:

I know that people can be AR'd for being underaged but it was said "even for being young adult to late 20s" if you look 18, 19, 20. I don't see a problem.

Edge cases will get AR'd. Governance will review the AR's and ignore them. That's how the system works.

[Luna Bliss]

@Stephanie Misfit

Really?  I mean I expect this with some others who want to paint child avatars as in it for kinky sex, but you?  What do you have to base this on, because it's sure not my experience having interacted with numerous child avatars.  Pests they may be at times (mommy, mommy pay attention to me..lol), but seeking sexual kinks?  Just no.

I'm sure it exists, and more so in the circles you run around in within SL, but by far it's not the majority, and I certainly don't get a sense it's the case for those child avatars seeking understanding on this thread.

[Miho Eton]

17 minutes ago, Blush Bravin said:

I wore a 32D bra at age thirteen. I WAS a child at 13! Honestly, by age 13 I was at my full adult height and shape except that my hips may have gotten a little bit wider in my 20s. You'd be hard pressed to distinguish my 20 something shape from my 13 year old shape.

Some woman can get breasts that big a much older age so idk. 

Edited May 4 by Wincil

[Vivienne Schell]

8 minutes ago, brodiac90 said:

Under the new rules I think it would probably be both. The kid for not having a modesty layer and the adult for trying to look in a kid's pants. Gross.... It's actually ironic in a way. LL, by enforcing these rules will actually be green lighting some residents (that's how they'll see it) to conduct that sort of behaviour, subjecting kid avis to the sort of behaviour they're trying to protect us from.

Don´t you think that some pedos derendered your attachments before the rule changes? Nothing will change, except that you are reuired to discourage the pedos now - by not offering anything they would want to get a glimpse at. That´s the little price to pay for impersonating a child in Second Life as you do. Be grateful that you can do it all, cause you cannot do it anywhere else on the planet like that.

[Rowan Amore]

3 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Which is still an incorrect assumption. Anyone can be AR'ed for being an underage avatar. The question being will Governance actually investigate in spite of their assurances they will now start doing what they apparently up to now haven't been.

And that was my point.  How one is perceived by others will determine if they are ARed or not.   I could be reported for being a child (under 18) avatar in an adult region.  Until LL gives some clearer definitions of what is and isn't considered too young looking, I think some region owners will still err on the side of caution.  Will it be fair?  Probably not but that's been the case for years.  Governance might have a lot more work going forward without much benefit overall.

[Arielle Popstar]

1 minute ago, Starberry Passion said:

I know that people can be AR'd for being underaged but it was said "even for being young adult to late 20s" if you look 18, 19, 20. I don't see a problem.

And my point is that I can be ar'ed for appearing under 18 when it wasn't my intention to be. Many of those creators you listed above I won't use because their products would give my avatar an even greater risk of appearing underage.

[Arielle Popstar]

4 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Edge cases will get AR'd. Governance will review the AR's and ignore them. That's how the system works.

Maybe

[Rathgrith027]

16 minutes ago, Blush Bravin said:

I wore a 32D bra at age thirteen. I WAS a child at 13! Honestly, by age 13 I was at my full adult height and shape except that my hips may have gotten a little bit wider in my 20s. You'd be hard pressed to distinguish my 20 something shape from my 13 year old shape.

It's almost as if.. people don't mature the same way, or at the same time.

Someone call Bixyl Shuftan, the people need to hear this one.

[brodiac90]

2 minutes ago, Vivienne Schell said:

Don´t you think that some pedos derendered your attachments before the rule changes? Nothing will change, except that you are reuired to discourage the pedos now - by not offering anything they would want to get a glimpse at. 

I already wear BOM underwear so they would see nothing? My BOM underwear actually exists though and so won't result in my avatar being banned. LL's new TOS requires something that doesn't currently exist and may never exist effectively banning child avatars. 

[Luna Bliss]

10 minutes ago, Ingrid Ingersoll said:

18 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

I've only said that I understand how some child avatars are feeling when they are being forced to make the changes that a sick society has actually caused

SL doesn't exist in a vacuum, and I would expect that most logical adults understand that it's not always about them. You're just enabling a silly tantrum from people who don't have to do anything but wear undies in a virtual world.

No, I'm listening to their side of things (child avatars). Allowing them to have a voice in all this is a good thing. And it sounds like many are quite confused at the moment, and it would help if we let them voice their confusion. It's especially unhelpful to accuse them of being in this (their roleplay as a child) only for sexual kinks.  Pretty degrading, really, blaming the victim is never a good thing.

[Blush Bravin]

Just now, Wincil said:

Some woman would get breasts that big much older age so that can be something genetic. 

Growth of breasts is a hormonal thing, so the onset of puberty controls that unless someone is getting a boob job later in life. The other situation controlling breast size is weight gain, which isn't necessarily age related. 

Most females will start puberty when they're 8 to 13 years old.  *sourced from google

[Starberry Passion]

1 minute ago, Arielle Popstar said:

And my point is that I can be ar'ed for appearing under 18 when it wasn't my intention to be. Many of those creators you listed above I won't use because their products would give my avatar an even greater risk of appearing underage.

How would they make you appear underage? All of those creators I listed make adult clothing, they just look cute.

For example, Lunar creates cozy yet adult outfits that are sexual and appealing to an adult audience. 

[Ingrid Ingersoll]

10 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

I will defend Luna on this one point: while it appears to be paradoxical, she is reminding us to be empathetic

I've got very little empathy for anyone complaining about having to wear virtual undies and villainizing a company that seems to finally be taking significant  steps to solve a pedophile problem in their platform.

Let me break out the tiniest violin for them. 

Edited May 4 by Ingrid Ingersoll