superpeeve Oh my Gawd! - Totally unOfficial Pet Peeve Thread.

[Silent Mistwalker]

21 minutes ago, Orwar said:

   You don't have to go quite that far - bare-skinned will suffice!

[Eddy Vortex]

13 hours ago, Luna Bliss said:

I'm peeved that I can't think of anything to be peeved about atm. Surely I can think of something.

Ask and ye shall receive. How about excessive gesturebating with sound interfering with the live performance?

Thankfully there's a fix so I don't develop carpal tunnel from muting 50+ avatars.

ahhh.....

[Scylla Rhiadra]

17 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

frustrated, undersexed middle class Americans

Wait.

Have I just inadvertently discovered SL's "special sauce"?

(Says the middle-aged white urban professional Canadian woman.)

Edited June 25, 2023 by Scylla Rhiadra

[Ayashe Ninetails]

5 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Now, however, pretty much nothing that they do excites me. It's all the sexed-up soccer mum stuff that seems to proliferate in the mainstream these days. Jeans -- but with slightly provocative holes! -- and tanks, with just a hint of underboob. Now that nice-looking Bob with the SUV and 2.3 children from two doors down will really notice me!!!

No comment. 😂

We've gotta trade shopping links one of these days. I've found so many fun things recently that are...not...that. Warning - there will be glitter.

[Love Zhaoying]

54 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

1 hour ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

frustrated, undersexed middle class Americans

Wait.

Have I just inadvertently discovered SL's "special sauce"?

There's confusion, because I've known someone who did not get any sex but were described by my own mother as "oversexed" (probably meant "h0rny").  Either way, there's business opportunities abound in Second Life to exploit and/or serve that market! 

Edited June 25, 2023 by Love Zhaoying

[Coffee Pancake]

3 hours ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

Peeve: My shopping options keep dwindling because of creators pulling this kind of crap. That's not a sale, that's a rip off. I'm already bare bones on everything and they want to take even that from me.

L$1000 is not a lot of money.

Lets call it $3 after fees and everything when it gets to a creators a bank (its less).

It took a work week, 40 hours, to make, upload, test, iterate, texture, document box and present.

At L$1000 a go, how many need to be sold to earn more than min wage. How many to earn more than the local McBurger.

How many at L$60 a part in one color to make min wage.

 

How many of your favorite creators are on food assistance programs?

How many are disabled?

How many only create things in SL because they could never afford to shop in the first place.

Edited June 25, 2023 by Coffee Pancake

[SilenzZzz Mistwalker]

2 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

L$1000 is not a lot of money.

Lets call it $3 after fees and everything when it gets to a creators a bank (its less).

It took a work week, 40 hours, to make, upload, test, iterate, texture, document box and present.

At L$1000 a go, how many need to be sold to earn more than min wage. How many to earn more than the local McBurger.

How many at L$60 a part in one color to make min wage.

 

How many of your favorite creators are on food assistance programs?

How many only create things in SL because they could never afford to shop in the first place.

there are two sides to this... from creator and the buyer ... like, i do not wish to have 20+ other items / colors cluttering up my inventory i do not want.. so i do not mind buying one or two that are what i want... i do weigh the price per color vs the price of a fatpack .. and if its close enough i buy the bigger pack ... 

 

[Persephone Emerald]

Most of us - creators and consumers - don't have as much disposable income as we'd like to have. This is why we're in SL instead of running around in the Real World, spending money on real clothes and real travel. What can creators do then to give us choices that don't cost them too much time or us too much money?

I suggest limited mini packs that are tintable for a higher cost. Maybe these can be offered along side non-tinable versions at the lower cost? 2 sets like this would take nearly the same cost and time to produce as 1 set, but consumers who are willing to pay more for a tintable set will pay more.

Some furniture creators make tintable furniture and don't complain that their customers don't buy furniture in a bunch of different colors. Some hair creators make tintable hair, even though it comes with color-change HUDs. Why have we been conditioned to believe that SL clothing shouldn't be tintable? When it was mostly system clothing it was. When it became mostly mesh, retexturing was now done with HUDs, but that doesn't keep it from being tintable too.

[Coffee Pancake]

22 minutes ago, SilenzZzz Mistwalker said:

there are two sides to this... from creator and the buyer ... like, i do not wish to have 20+ other items / colors cluttering up my inventory i do not want.. so i do not mind buying one or two that are what i want... i do weigh the price per color vs the price of a fatpack .. and if its close enough i buy the bigger pack ... 

Of course, and we all do the same.

Just a reminder that prices in SL are at least 10 times lower than they should be because way back at the dawn of SL, the founding Lindens were so insecure about the idea of people 'buying play money' they decided to make it look like you got loads and loads.

The flip side is it makes it makes items look artificially expensive.

[Quistess Alpha]

20 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Just a reminder that prices in SL are at least 10 times lower than they should be because way back at the dawn of SL, the founding Lindens were so insecure about the idea of people 'buying play money' they decided to make it look like you got loads and loads.

At least they made the conversion ratio (~250:1$) relatively easy to do mental math with, and you don't have to buy L$ in specific denominations that are just less than a useful amount causing you to buy in the next increment. . . Oh wait, I think I'm describing land tier now.

[Sid Nagy]

2 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Of course, and we all do the same.

Just a reminder that prices in SL are at least 10 times lower than they should be because way back at the dawn of SL, the founding Lindens were so insecure about the idea of people 'buying play money' they decided to make it look like you got loads and loads.

The flip side is it makes it makes items look artificially expensive.

There is a difference between in world and in RL.

As a consumer: SL is a hobby and should not cost more than one can afford.
Cute that some want to make a RL living out of it. But that is not my beer in the end.
I have enough shirts, jeans, suits, shoes, hats and what not to dress myself for almost every occasion by now. And decor..... thousands of pieces.

As a merchant: I don't count the hours I put into my marketplace store. And I certainly don't calculate what hourly salary I get out of it 😭. In periods that I make enough, I lease some land for a private sandbox. If not, I do without and go to a public sandbox. I will not put more money into SL than my yearly premium payment. That is the max I can justify for myself at the moment.

Games and social platforms are not there to make reasonable RL returns IMHO. Good that some can, but that is not a given or even realistic for the masses of small potatoes entrepreneurs like me.

Edited June 25, 2023 by Sid Nagy

[Silent Mistwalker]

2 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

L$1000 is not a lot of money.

Lets call it $3 after fees and everything when it gets to a creators a bank (its less).

It took a work week, 40 hours, to make, upload, test, iterate, texture, document box and present.

At L$1000 a go, how many need to be sold to earn more than min wage. How many to earn more than the local McBurger.

How many at L$60 a part in one color to make min wage.

 

How many of your favorite creators are on food assistance programs?

How many are disabled?

How many only create things in SL because they could never afford to shop in the first place.

That would be fine if I had money of my own. I don't.  I am on SNAP. The rest is on a need to know and you don't.

[LittleMe Jewell]

Come on merchants.  In this day and age in SL, why does my Fatpack contain a separate clothing item for each color, rather than a single item with a color HUD?   *sigh*

[Silent Mistwalker]

1 minute ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Come on merchants.  In this day and age in SL, why does my Fatpack contain a separate clothing item for each color, rather than a single item with a color HUD?   *sigh*

Peeved Lil beat me to it.

[Sid Nagy]

15 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Come on merchants.  In this day and age in SL, why does my Fatpack contain a separate clothing item for each color, rather than a single item with a color HUD?   *sigh*

Peeve: As a merchant (generally speaking) one can't win them all, ever.

One wants a HUD, another one hates HUDs until goes no more because of the extra scripts.
One wants single colors, another one mini fatpacks and yet another one wants huge fatpacks for next to nothing.
Some want boxes and bags to add to open, others want to put them on the floor.
Some want the presents from a hunt tucked away, others are peeved that they even have to teleport in to collect an item..... and the list goes on and on.

Question for LittleMe: Do you know how to create a working HUD?

Let me tell you, a lot of merchants don't (me included). Do they really have to go and live under a rock and forget to be a merchant, because the world needs more HUD's?

Edited June 25, 2023 by Sid Nagy

[Persephone Emerald]

2 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

L$1000 is not a lot of money.

Lets call it $3 after fees and everything when it gets to a creators a bank (its less).

It took a work week, 40 hours, to make, upload, test, iterate, texture, document box and present.

At L$1000 a go, how many need to be sold to earn more than min wage. How many to earn more than the local McBurger.

How many at L$60 a part in one color to make min wage.

 

How many of your favorite creators are on food assistance programs?

How many are disabled?

How many only create things in SL because they could never afford to shop in the first place.

$L 1000 costs consumers $ 4 US and gives creators $ 3 US.  This means LL gets $ 1 or 25% percent of our money for providing the platform we're sharing. That's fine, because it cost money to develop the platform, run the servers and pay their employees.

It's not easy to make a living in SL, but it's not easy for most people to make a living in RL either. Customers should be considerate of SL creators, but we're not responsible for paying their bills in SL or RL. Buy from creators who make stuff you love. Tell your friends and everyone to support them too. That's the most we can do really. We know most SL creators won't be able to make enough money to live off their SL income.

[LittleMe Jewell]

56 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

One wants a HUD, another one hates HUDs until goes no more because of the extra scripts.

Do you really get folks that would rather have 15 individual dresses, rather than one dress and a HUD?  Even if they are worried about scripts, you could always put a script killer into the HUD so they can save a copy of said dress in exactly the color they want without any scripts.

Obviously those folks have not been in SL long enough to accumulate a massive inventory.

[LittleMe Jewell]

1 hour ago, Sid Nagy said:

Question for LittleMe: Do you know how to create a working HUD?

Let me tell you, a lot of merchants don't (me included). Do they really have to go and live under a rock and forget to be a merchant, because the world needs more HUD's?

Actually, no I don't, but I've also never looked into trying.  There are so many freebie and cheap scripts on the market, and tools that merchants can buy to use, and lots of youtube content out there that teaches all sorts of things for SL.  I honestly can't imagine, at the very least, not being able to buy something to help create a HUD, if one cannot find appropriate tutorials and materials to make one on their own. 

Yes, I will admit to being a bit naive on many creation topics, but I also see so many helpful posts in these forums, helpful tutorials on youtube (and possibly elsewhere) and all sort of classes being taught.  So, yes, I assume that if a creator wanted to put in the effort, they probably could learn to create HUDs.  If they don't want to, that is their choice.

As a consumer, I still don't feel bad about making my wishes known.

[Persephone Emerald]

1 hour ago, Sid Nagy said:

[snip]

Question for LittleMe: Do you know how to create a working HUD?

Let me tell you, a lot of merchants don't (me included). Do they really have to go and live under a rock and forget to be a merchant, because the world needs more HUD's?

Obviously you can't please everyone. You can only try to please the majority of your customers and you can only do what you can do. If you can't make your own HUDs (I certainly couldn't), can you buy adaptable full-perm ones? If you don't want to use texture HUDs, are your items tintable?

[Sid Nagy]

4 minutes ago, LittleMe Jewell said:

Do you really get folks that would rather have 15 individual dresses, rather than one dress and a HUD?  Even if they are worried about scripts, you could always put a script killer into the HUD so they can save a copy of said dress in exactly the color they want without any scripts.

Obviously those folks have not been in SL long enough to accumulate a massive inventory.

You forget simply one thing: The vast majority of merchant are one person businesses. And if a thing is deligated to staff, it is mostly customer service.
The creative process of designing and producing is in 99% of the time in the hands of 1 single person.
They can't be experts in everything. It is as simple as that.

And for to big inventories: dump what you don't use.
A pair of jeans in 12 colors and you only use 3 of them?  Dump the other 9.
Old prim stuff you never display these days: dump it.
Etc. etc. etc.

It is so easy to write a peeve about merchants. They deserve better IMHO.
 

[Silent Mistwalker]

1 hour ago, Sid Nagy said:

Peeve: As a merchant (generally speaking) one can't win them all, ever.

One wants a HUD, another one hates HUDs until goes no more because of the extra scripts.
One wants single colors, another one mini fatpacks and yet another one wants huge fatpacks for next to nothing.
Some want boxes and bags to add to open, others want to put them on the floor.
Some want the presents from a hunt tucked away, others are peeved that they even have to teleport in to collect an item..... and the list goes on and on.

Question for LittleMe: Do you know how to create a working HUD?

Let me tell you, a lot of merchants don't (me included). Do they really have to go and live under a rock and forget to be a merchant, because the world needs more HUD's?

I'm not saying any merchant that doesn't use HUDs should rush out and start buying but the MP does have quite a few full perm HUDs (except scripts might be no mod, of course) that really aren't that hard to set up and include with your own products. 

I wanted a seasonal HUD for my own stuff so when I could I bought one of the lesser expensive but still good quality ones and after a few false starts, it now allows me to do what I wanted. Changes different parts of plants and things to match the seasons.

I'm just saying it is doable.

[Silent Mistwalker]

5 minutes ago, Persephone Emerald said:

Obviously you can't please everyone. You can only try to please the majority of your customers and you can only do what you can do. If you can't make your own HUDs (I certainly couldn't), can you buy adaptable full-perm ones? If you don't want to use texture HUDs, are your items tintable?

 

2 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

I'm not saying any merchant that doesn't use HUDs should rush out and start buying but the MP does have quite a few full perm HUDs (except scripts might be no mod, of course) that really aren't that hard to set up and include with your own products. 

I wanted a seasonal HUD for my own stuff so when I could I bought one of the lesser expensive but still good quality ones and after a few false starts, it now allows me to do what I wanted. Changes different parts of plants and things to match the seasons.

I'm just saying it is doable.

Now you know. 😁

[Sid Nagy]

12 minutes ago, Persephone Emerald said:

Obviously you can't please everyone. You can only try to please the majority of your customers and you can only do what you can do. If you can't make your own HUDs (I certainly couldn't), can you buy adaptable full-perm ones? If you don't want to use texture HUDs, are your items tintable?

Yes everything is possible. But most merchants are parttime in this game, have things to do in RL as well.
But it is what you say: one can't please everyone.

But it is the tone that makes the music (French proverb).
And the tone that I read out of LittleMe's post got me started.
Notice the difference between
- Peeve: merchant should have huds by now 
- It would be nice when more merchants would adapt the HUD system

@LittleMe Jewell :  💐

Edited June 25, 2023 by Sid Nagy

[Ayashe Ninetails]

20 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

You forget simply one thing: The vast majority of merchant are one person businesses. And if a thing is deligated to staff, it is mostly customer service.
The creative process of designing and producing is in 99% of the time in the hands of 1 single person.
They can't be experts in everything. It is as simple as that.

I imagine it's far worse now, but back when I used to run in-world and MP shops, the creative process was a good 5% of my time, if I was lucky. Setting up and testing scripts, creating templates and ads, boxing, set up in store and online, writing descriptions and notecards and oh my gosh...all the NOT fun stuff - a good 95% of the time. And that doesn't even cover any customer service afterwards. Fortunately, I didn't have much. I wasn't making anything too complicated to use.

I'm always in awe of what some people are able to accomplish by themselves - the ones with well-organized stores with a wide variety of stuff and reasonable prices. Yeesh...I had to resist the urge to make every item 30,000L. 😄

 

20 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

And for to big inventories: dump what you don't use.
A pair of jeans in 12 colors and you only use 3 of them?  Dump the other 9.
Old prim stuff you never display these days: dump it.
Etc. etc. etc.

A trick I use is to "color code" my avatars. This wears "sunny" summer colors, this avatar wears shades of purple and gold, that one wears pink, that one wears black & white, that one rocks silver glitter, etc. That way, I can avoid buying fatpacks entirely and just choose which avatar I'm buying for. Oh, this would look fantastic on my dragon - great, I'll grab that in gold, off we go.

Doing that has saved me so much time and money (and inventory space!).

Edited June 25, 2023 by Ayashe Ninetails
Grammaring

[Persephone Emerald]

41 minutes ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

[snip]

A trick I use is to "color code" my avatars. This wears "sunny" summer colors, this avatar wears shades of purple and gold, that one wears pink, that one wears black & white, that one rocks silver glitter, etc. That way, I can avoid buying fatpacks entirely and just choose which avatar I'm buying for. Oh, this would look fantastic on my dragon - great, I'll grab that in gold, off we go.

Doing that has saved me so much time and money (and inventory space!).

I do this with my 2 female alts too. If you don't introduce some kind of limiting factors on alts, it's too easy for them to become clones of your primary avatar, - and then what would be the point of having them?

My male avatar is limited by the overall sparsity of nice free male items.

Alycia is goth, so she wears predominately black, grey, purple, dark red, and some blue tones. She wears dark hair or colorful hair and has pale skin. She's younger and thinner than Persephone, so she wears more short skirts.

Tasha, when she's not a wolf, wears white, cream, some beige, some gold, and some light grey. When she's a wolf, she's white. When she's human, she's thin with pale skin and light blonde hair. She usually wears jeans with sneakers or boots. She only rarely wears short dresses with heals.

Persephone wears a Freya body, which is limiting in itself. Because she's more like RL me, she's heavier, middle aged, and likes the kind of clothes I'd like. Usually she's in jeans or a longer skirt and a modest top. When I don't feel like being a normal human, then she wears fantasy tone skins and sometimes skimpier clothes.

Sometimes I buy the same outfit in different colors for my 3 girls. Sometimes they get entirely different outfits. They have different interests, so they have different kinds of objects in their inventories too.

Edited June 25, 2023 by Persephone Emerald