What would you do differently if LL starts collecting our data to sell or give it to 3rd parties?

[Silent Mistwalker]

2 hours ago, Katherine Heartsong said:

If you use Google to research the best brand of dog food then go to another website about dog food, Google knows. Use a website like Expedia to research travel and then go independently to that hotel site to book? Expedia knows (and charges the hotel still, and rates from those travel aggregator sites is is outrageous, sometimes 30% or more of that room rate, at least Google only charges about 5% of the posted rate for the referral). And every thing you do is then cross referenced and combined and analyzed to find patterns. The segmentation they'll put you in will be very precise ... age, every socio-economic demographic you can imagine or they can infer, and obviously dog owner. They may get some of the specifics wrong, but it's enough to segment you precisely enough that the people who buy those segment buckets find it good enough. This issue is that you don't specifically know what they know about you. That's what makes you valuable and wanted as a user.

I'll assume LL would be no exception to this basic rules of understanding their users, just not quite the immense scope and scale and end goal of others (i.e., selling you).

That's why Zero Party Data (ZPD) is becoming so popular with brands. That's data you willingly give them to segment and then anonymise you, and in exchange they give you more personalized experiences tailored to exactly to your needs/wants. The main benefit for you with ZPD models is that know what you've given up ... it's not a scoop everything with cookies and trackers and every other insidious hidden method of knowing everything you do online and making broad assumptions that do narrow down as you spend more time surfing (like you actually own a dog ... cause maybe you're just hitting those dog websites cause you're dog sitting for a few days?)

I don't buy dogfood online so why in the world would I do a search for it? I already know where to go to buy it for the best price. I don't need the internet to determine that.

My online footprint is so small it's almost nonexistent. No one is interested in what I do in SL or STO or even The Sims 4. There aren't any patterns to find. lol 

That's not how dog sitting works.

Thing is, I don't give out any data willingly. Before things changed, you would never have caught me giving out my SS# over landlines. That is how small a footprint I leave behind. There is nothing to work with, no "segmentation" that I fit in. That info just isn't there. Any ads I see are not tailored to my shopping habits (or anything else) because I do not shop online. IF I need info I use the phone. Not a cellphone, my landline.

I do not depend on the internet for anything. Well ok, except for a little company. It lets me know the world is still there and I'm alive. Even then, I don't depend on the internet for company. It would be easy enough for me to walk away from the internet for the rest of my life. I'm pretty close to doing just that anyway.

[Paul Hexem]

5 hours ago, Persephone Emerald said:

Honestly, I don't anticipate nefarious behavior from LL (or their daughter company Tilia) in the near future. They may be keeping their options open to change their "We won't sell your data" policy, but I wouldn't expect any changes in the next year.  The apparently small (?), barely  noticable changes to their Privacy Policy may be to accommodate their acquisition of Caspertech SL, but this doesn't mean they're planning to sell our data.

[Jules Catlyn]

On 9/25/2022 at 11:59 PM, Persephone Emerald said:

Would you buy direct from other uses who don't use LL vendors?

You do realize that no matter what vendor a creator uses, the data/info flows through LL servers right?

[Gabriele Graves]

Clearly what is needed is for us all to move the the barter system instead.

[Anicha Heartsong]

If you're worried about privacy, then the greatest threat of having your data sold on comes from the big vendors in SL who insist you open a Discord account if you want any kind of customer service. Discord is almost certainly selling everyone's data down the river. And they now insist that you sign up with your mobile / cell phone number - and you can't use a burner or a voip number. Why? Because they want to tie your real life identity to all that data they are gathering, making it far more valuable.

[Prokofy Neva]

So the Lindens will start pitching me spam emails for buying Persian carpets, if not Camp LeJune lawsuits and calls about auto warranties. That's not so terrible.

Then maybe I can use the images in their emails to decorate my RL home. If I visit one shopping site to look at Persian rugs for ideas on how to decorate my e-home, and forever more, see ads for Persian rugs on every web site I visit. And indeed, this is how I train the Internet, when I am overwhelmed with auto warranty ads and Camp LeJune lawsuit ads, I visit a bunch of rug stores online to fill up the view with pretty patterns again.

[Silent Mistwalker]

On 9/30/2022 at 5:52 AM, Anicha Heartsong said:

If you're worried about privacy, then the greatest threat of having your data sold on comes from the big vendors in SL who insist you open a Discord account if you want any kind of customer service. Discord is almost certainly selling everyone's data down the river. And they now insist that you sign up with your mobile / cell phone number - and you can't use a burner or a voip number. Why? Because they want to tie your real life identity to all that data they are gathering, making it far more valuable.

Vendors who do this have lost this customer. Discord is... the worst chat platform/messenger service I have ever encountered, and I've been on quite a few. I do not have and refuse to ever have a Discord account. I do not shop on Discord. I do my shopping either inworld or on the MP. If the info I need isn't in either place, NO SALE. 

 

[Coffee Pancake]

If we do see data being sold, it will be mostly be search and shopping keywords. If you’re buying dresses and shoes and buttplugs here, maybe you could be buying them from Amazon or seeing related adverts on Twitter. 
 

That said, big tech are getting very good a taking a conversation log, converting that into a personality map with likely interests and then selling you product. 
 

Don’t for one second think that just because this is all pixels there isn’t valuable data. 

[Gabriele Graves]

I think we can assume that LL wouldn't want to sell our data to competing services, however I could see ancillary accessory,  computer products and services for aimed towards users virtual worlds and gaming could very well be interested in access to that data.

[Coffee Pancake]

They wouldn’t, it would be sold to a broker, and then to whoever would pay for it. (Probably after significant processing)

Edited October 5, 2022 by Coffee Pancake

[Gabriele Graves]

7 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

They wouldn’t, it would be sold to a broker, and then to whoever would pay for it. (Probably after significant processing)

Yes, it's the "who would be interested part" I was mainly addressing but you are right, LL wouldn't necessarily have control over where the data went.

Edited October 5, 2022 by Gabriele Graves

[Paulsian]

On 9/30/2022 at 7:52 AM, Anicha Heartsong said:

If you're worried about privacy, then the greatest threat of having your data sold on comes from the big vendors in SL who insist you open a Discord account if you want any kind of customer service. Discord is almost certainly selling everyone's data down the river. And they now insist that you sign up with your mobile / cell phone number - and you can't use a burner or a voip number. Why? Because they want to tie your real life identity to all that data they are gathering, making it far more valuable.

Ylands' moderators suggest using discord for official support & bugs. There's a trend with Roblox called cookie logging used to hack accounts by posting links in chat other users click (like click bait) and somehow their account becomes compromised.

What would you do differently if LL starts collecting our data to sell or give it to 3rd parties?

That was a big no go for me with Sansar, after making login and password, this very large popup prompted me over the login button / area saying something like "If you log in we will install cookies on your hard drive." I was like no your not and uninstalled and restored computer because likely those were installed before popup prompted me. 

Anything that wants me to click yes or no in order to proceed with viewing content I back out and clear browser cache and cookies. 

I would be more careful and report anything unusual to LL as I have always done. 

 

[Wulfie Reanimator]

2 hours ago, Paulsian said:

Ylands' moderators suggest using discord for official support & bugs. There's a trend with Roblox called cookie logging used to hack accounts by posting links in chat other users click (like click bait) and somehow their account becomes compromised.

What would you do differently if LL starts collecting our data to sell or give it to 3rd parties?

That was a big no go for me with Sansar, after making login and password, this very large popup prompted me over the login button / area saying something like "If you log in we will install cookies on your hard drive." I was like no your not and uninstalled and restored computer because likely those were installed before popup prompted me. 

Anything that wants me to click yes or no in order to proceed with viewing content I back out and clear browser cache and cookies. 

I would be more careful and report anything unusual to LL as I have always done.

If you log into this forum, how does LL know who is and isn't you so they don't show your account page to someone else, or let somebody else make posts from your account?

They need some way to keep track of you with something unique. They could remember your IP, since that's where you logged in from, but what if there's another person in your network or you're in a public cafe or you want to log into multiple accounts at the same time?

To be more specific, LL needs to give something unique to the app you used to log in, like a secret code that your browser can keep and show every time you try to make a post or enter the account page.

That's how LL can be sure it's you and nobody else, and that's what cookies are used for by any online service you use. If you delete your cookies, you'll have to log in again because your browser no longer has the secret code it needs to prove who you are!

The Roblox thing you mentioned applies everywhere, if somebody steals your cookies (those secret codes for your login session), they can lie to LL and basically become you (until you log off, which is when LL will stop using that secret code).

That's also why many sites (like your bank or government services, probably) will automatically log you off after a few minutes of inactivity, so you won't have an active login in case somebody manages to steal your cookies.

Edited October 6, 2022 by Wulfie Reanimator

[Paulsian]

3 hours ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

If you log into this forum, how does LL know who is and isn't you so they don't show your account page to someone else, or let somebody else make posts from your account?

They need some way to keep track of you with something unique. They could remember your IP, since that's where you logged in from, but what if there's another person in your network or you're in a public cafe or you want to log into multiple accounts at the same time?

To be more specific, LL needs to give something unique to the app you used to log in, like a secret code that your browser can keep and show every time you try to make a post or enter the account page.

That's how LL can be sure it's you and nobody else, and that's what cookies are used for by any online service you use. If you delete your cookies, you'll have to log in again because your browser no longer has the secret code it needs to prove who you are!

The Roblox thing you mentioned applies everywhere, if somebody steals your cookies (those secret codes for your login session), they can lie to LL and basically become you (until you log off, which is when LL will stop using that secret code).

That's also why many sites (like your bank or government services, probably) will automatically log you off after a few minutes of inactivity, so you won't have an active login in case somebody manages to steal your cookies.

I'm cool with LL knowing who I'm am. It's hard to believe how much damage can be done by pressing a hyperlink. Would think someone would have came up with some sort of link verification or something. Link hosts that are protected that can actually help everyone. 

[Cali Souther]

On 9/26/2022 at 2:37 AM, colleen Criss said:

I tired for years to set my mom up on the net for emails, games, she loved to play match games. She refused saying "I don't want my personal information out there" . I laughed and told her you have a social security number, everyone knows where you are, you bank online for pete sake.  She never got that part.

I found an old letter from a friend of mine in the military (from way back in the day) and their SS# was written on the outside of the envelope to identify them.    😲  

 

 

On 9/26/2022 at 1:07 AM, Akane Nacht said:

I used to mind such things but now everybody's doing it, so I'll just be happy as long as my credit card number doesn't end up on the dark web. 

^^^  Pretty much sums it up.    If I could stop them,  I would - but I don't think I can. 

 

[EnCore Mayne]

just noticed the new privacy link on the main webpage today. odd how their addresses for comments or questions is different from new to old. neither is from the brick and mortar building on Battery. even stranger, the San Francisco address is a mail box depot while the West Hollywood location is boarded up.

 

[AmberJoyBliss]

Probably delete the account. Here is something about Google that surprised me and the YouTube algorithm:

Their recommendations come from EVERYTHING you do on any google platform. Gmail, Maps, Google Earth, all of it. Not understanding this entirely, I would assume that overlapping data is probably very valuable for marketing databases.

Now, imagine you have been sneaking around in SL and a family member starts watching YouTube the next day you are signed in on your google account and forgot about it. Good luck explaining your feed and ads to your RL folks.

I did hear about some companies (TikTok) key logging your phone as well.

My point is, do you want your inventory, profiles & picks you look at, IMs TP history etc., to be fed to marketing databases, affecting your RL, potentially, forever?

We are strict about this in Europe, but LL are a US based company, so my trust in them is of course very low.

[AmberJoyBliss]

Additionally: The SL user count is so small, that if we end up in some bundle bought by a data mining company, there is no way they will be investing in filtering our most awkward NSFW moments in our personal data file.

If your most corrupted alts feed your marketing profile and it ends up in your YT feed, like on Christmas Eve with the entire large family listening and some not so decent ad suddenly blasts loud and people blame it on you, say this: “First time I hear about this, so I must ask you experts. What are they advertising and what will you use it for?”

Edited October 9, 2022 by AmberJoyBliss
Replaced boredom with entertainment.