Why do I choose Second Life over Meta?

[Kathlen Onyx]

36 minutes ago, Nick0678 said:

I can totally understand how that poor young lady felt. I 've been sexually harassed by women in SL multiple times all these years and it really is annoying especially when you are not in the mood for BS.

Shoot, I've never been sexually harassed. What clubs do you go to?

[Nick0678]

9 minutes ago, Sam1 Bellisserian said:

What clubs do you go to?

Hmm.. why? You want to harass me?

[Caroline Takeda]

On 12/31/2021 at 12:51 AM, Prokofy Neva said:

Legs are important in life.

and not only to spread them, but as well.

[Caroline Takeda]

On 12/31/2021 at 5:07 PM, Nick0678 said:

Pick a place that you like , i 've been and lived in many random places such as London and Swindon(UK), Munich(Germany), Barcelona(Spain), Bucharest(Romania), Ancona(itraly) and of course Greece..  and where have you been?

I understand your point.

But, Its true that Europeans deal with such things a lot more liberal than Americans (or less prude if you want).
I am European btw.

[kevin350]

On 12/31/2021 at 9:39 AM, Arielle Popstar said:

SEX SEX SEX......that seems to work. Why the Seks?

Second Life's Niche is people who are willing to spend money for digital, 3-D social networking.  "Spending Money" being the very unique element.

Monetization (the great quest of the internet / metaverse), is and will always be the nucleus of the digital universe.

LL does not sell packaged content with pre-determined graphics, scripts, quests, challenges, etc., that "gamers" are traditionally willing to pay for.  They sell empty 3-D space (sandbox) with a free "on ramp" for creators and users.

What Second Life was, what it has become, and what it will be in the future is driven by its users and "crowd sourced" creations.

Across the internet, "crowd sourced" content is king.  Every Facebook post, every Tweet, every beautiful piece of mesh clothing in SL, is crowd sourced.

The difference between the mesh clothing and a flat, chain of text messages - is what content people are willing to pay for.

SL's niche, is immersive 3D social networking - that people are willing to pay for.  As such, it attract's adults, who have money and are willing to spend it -- which attracts creators who are willing to create content for money and creative satisfaction.

Because it attracts paying adults, adults do adult things. Sex isn't a byproduct of Second Life, sex is a normal byproduct of adult relationships.   

If my fiancé and I meet on SL (because I travel a lot for work) and we dress up our avatars, go dancing to live jazz, feel beautiful, feel romantic (just as we do when we do it in RL), sex is very possible end to that lovely evening (be it real or virtual).  That's just how relationships work.

SL isn't doesn't begin with sex, it ends with it because it's successful, 3D social networking done well. It allows relationships to happen - be it friendships or romantic.

SL defines what people are willing to pay for on the internet, and when they do, what they want.  It proves that the number of people willing to "pay" is also very small.   It also shows that those who are willing to pay, want their avatars as beautiful as possible - and they are willing to buy expensive, graphics capable computers to achieve that visual goal.

Facebooks "free to play" model places extreme limits on what they will and will not be able to do in the metaverse. Facebook, like YouTube and others, don't like to share their profits. Their promise to create an economy that values content creators is a ridiculous lie at best.

What's important in the coming years is standardization on the metaverse.  Will your SL mesh be able to be worn on an avatar that visits other 3D worlds - which could be possible using NFT technology.   Could your base avatar from SL sign into HALO and be equipped with game armor there while it plays? or log into WOW and do a dungeon with your friends?

While it "could" all be possible, the fact is that there are competing business models, competing game engines, competing Digital entities that all want their very own slice of pie.  

While block-chain evangelists think they have global solutions that will drag corporations into their world, kicking and screaming to some great Digital Utopia, capitalism doesn't work that way.  I-me-mine, doesn't play well with others.

 

 

 

[Heathcliff Harbrough]

This is crazy!

Today I received an email from whom? ... META aka Fakebook.

They created an account for me without my permission 😲

This is brutal!

 

[BranScanlon]

2 hours ago, kevin350 said:

Second Life's Niche is people who are willing to spend money for digital, 3-D social networking.  "Spending Money" being the very unique element.

Monetization (the great quest of the internet / metaverse), is and will always be the nucleus of the digital universe.

LL does not sell packaged content with pre-determined graphics, scripts, quests, challenges, etc., that "gamers" are traditionally willing to pay for.  They sell empty 3-D space (sandbox) with a free "on ramp" for creators and users.

What Second Life was, what it has become, and what it will be in the future is driven by its users and "crowd sourced" creations.

Across the internet, "crowd sourced" content is king.  Every Facebook post, every Tweet, every beautiful piece of mesh clothing in SL, is crowd sourced.

The difference between the mesh clothing and a flat, chain of text messages - is what content people are willing to pay for.

SL's niche, is immersive 3D social networking - that people are willing to pay for.  As such, it attract's adults, who have money and are willing to spend it -- which attracts creators who are willing to create content for money and creative satisfaction.

Because it attracts paying adults, adults do adult things. Sex isn't a byproduct of Second Life, sex is a normal byproduct of adult relationships.   

If my fiancé and I meet on SL (because I travel a lot for work) and we dress up our avatars, go dancing to live jazz, feel beautiful, feel romantic (just as we do when we do it in RL), sex is very possible end to that lovely evening (be it real or virtual).  That's just how relationships work.

SL isn't doesn't begin with sex, it ends with it because it's successful, 3D social networking done well. It allows relationships to happen - be it friendships or romantic.

SL defines what people are willing to pay for on the internet, and when they do, what they want.  It proves that the number of people willing to "pay" is also very small.   It also shows that those who are willing to pay, want their avatars as beautiful as possible - and they are willing to buy expensive, graphics capable computers to achieve that visual goal.

Facebooks "free to play" model places extreme limits on what they will and will not be able to do in the metaverse. Facebook, like YouTube and others, don't like to share their profits. Their promise to create an economy that values content creators is a ridiculous lie at best.

What's important in the coming years is standardization on the metaverse.  Will your SL mesh be able to be worn on an avatar that visits other 3D worlds - which could be possible using NFT technology.   Could your base avatar from SL sign into HALO and be equipped with game armor there while it plays? or log into WOW and do a dungeon with your friends?

While it "could" all be possible, the fact is that there are competing business models, competing game engines, competing Digital entities that all want their very own slice of pie.  

While block-chain evangelists think they have global solutions that will drag corporations into their world, kicking and screaming to some great Digital Utopia, capitalism doesn't work that way.  I-me-mine, doesn't play well with others.

 

 

 

This. All of this. Like all of it. BraVO, sir. This is such a well thought out explication of not only "what is the appeal of SL over Meta" but also "Why adult content exists in SL" Thank you for it.

Facebook/Twitter/OnlyFans/Instagram have shown time and again that they will court adult content creators for their user base, only to abandon them to "go legit." That speaks volumes about where they view those content creators in a social hierarchy, and the fact those tiers of hierarchy exist within their structure is troublesome to say the least.

I prefer SL over Meta because, even with its pixel-perfect avatars, SL shows all of the warts and gems and dross that are the wide fabric of human experience, while also allowing some of us to explore the very limits of what it means to exist. I don't think Meta, with its cauterized sense of humanity and potential for rank monetization can even HOPE to come close to that.

[Prokofy Neva]

4 hours ago, kevin350 said:

Second Life's Niche is people who are willing to spend money for digital, 3-D social networking.  "Spending Money" being the very unique element.

Monetization (the great quest of the internet / metaverse), is and will always be the nucleus of the digital universe.

LL does not sell packaged content with pre-determined graphics, scripts, quests, challenges, etc., that "gamers" are traditionally willing to pay for.  They sell empty 3-D space (sandbox) with a free "on ramp" for creators and users.

What Second Life was, what it has become, and what it will be in the future is driven by its users and "crowd sourced" creations.

Across the internet, "crowd sourced" content is king.  Every Facebook post, every Tweet, every beautiful piece of mesh clothing in SL, is crowd sourced.

The difference between the mesh clothing and a flat, chain of text messages - is what content people are willing to pay for.

SL's niche, is immersive 3D social networking - that people are willing to pay for.  As such, it attract's adults, who have money and are willing to spend it -- which attracts creators who are willing to create content for money and creative satisfaction.

Because it attracts paying adults, adults do adult things. Sex isn't a byproduct of Second Life, sex is a normal byproduct of adult relationships.   

If my fiancé and I meet on SL (because I travel a lot for work) and we dress up our avatars, go dancing to live jazz, feel beautiful, feel romantic (just as we do when we do it in RL), sex is very possible end to that lovely evening (be it real or virtual).  That's just how relationships work.

SL isn't doesn't begin with sex, it ends with it because it's successful, 3D social networking done well. It allows relationships to happen - be it friendships or romantic.

SL defines what people are willing to pay for on the internet, and when they do, what they want.  It proves that the number of people willing to "pay" is also very small.   It also shows that those who are willing to pay, want their avatars as beautiful as possible - and they are willing to buy expensive, graphics capable computers to achieve that visual goal.

Facebooks "free to play" model places extreme limits on what they will and will not be able to do in the metaverse. Facebook, like YouTube and others, don't like to share their profits. Their promise to create an economy that values content creators is a ridiculous lie at best.

What's important in the coming years is standardization on the metaverse.  Will your SL mesh be able to be worn on an avatar that visits other 3D worlds - which could be possible using NFT technology.   Could your base avatar from SL sign into HALO and be equipped with game armor there while it plays? or log into WOW and do a dungeon with your friends?

While it "could" all be possible, the fact is that there are competing business models, competing game engines, competing Digital entities that all want their very own slice of pie.  

While block-chain evangelists think they have global solutions that will drag corporations into their world, kicking and screaming to some great Digital Utopia, capitalism doesn't work that way.  I-me-mine, doesn't play well with others.

 

 

 

Why do you say that an original act of creation is "crowd-sourced"?

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

4 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

Why do you say that an original act of creation is "crowd-sourced"?

According to the Oxford Dictionary:

Quote

crowd-sourced

1. obtain (information or input into a particular task or project) by enlisting the services of a large number of people, either paid or unpaid, typically via the internet.

I'd say that's a pretty accurate summation of how LL obtained the vast majority of content in Second Life and, while you can argue that it was LL and not the users that built the platform, without that content this little virtual playground of ours would have faded into obscurity in a matter of a few years if not less.

I think most people who aren't familiar with SL make the mistake of viewing it as a platform and the content as little more than data and assets, but to its residents SL is an amalgamation of all the talent and creativity that's been poured into it for the last two decades, a combination that has given birth to an entire new world.  If you mentioned SL to the average resident I'm fairly certain the first thing that sprang into their mind wouldn't be the asset server or the physics engine, it would most likely be their friends or possibly their avatar or some of their favourite locations and content.

In essence SL is a community, and what is a community if not the epitome of crowd-sourcing?

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

On 12/31/2021 at 11:42 PM, Mollymews said:

it may turn out that Facebook vanilla metaverse becomes a rising tide that lifts all boats

It's funny you should use that phrase since I just came from reading an article where the VP of Nvidias Omniverse said very much the same thing about todays release of their new free version.

Quote

As for making it free for individuals, Kerris said, “We look at it as the same context as an operating system. A rising tide lifts all boats. There will be many avenues for commerce on these virtual worlds. We think there is an entire economy coming for these virtual worlds. The more we can make it available, the better all of us can benefit.”

(the full article can be found here: Nvidia unveils free version of Omniverse for millions of creators and artists)

Essentially Omniverse is Nvidias metaverse creation platform, which they've already invested hundreds of millions of dollars into.  It incorporates Pixars USD (Universal Scene Description) format which is already being utilized across multiple 3D development platforms and is described as "the HTML of 3D", along with some very cool looking tools for things like creating machinima using assets from various games and an AI powered tool that "instantly animates a 3D face with just an audio track.". 

They also have "Omniverse Connectors" which are basically extensions and asset libraries for a lot of industry standard 3D tools like 3DS Max, Maya, Blender and Unreal Engine.

Nvidia are initially pitching this as a collaboration and simulation tool for industries like "robotics, automotive, architecture, engineering, construction, manufacturing, media, and entertainment." but from the article it's clear that in the long term they envisage it becoming part of a framework for a full blown metaverse which will eventually consist of places like SL too.

It remains to be seen if their attempt to help create the next metaverse actually succeeds, but all this goes to show that the concept of shared virtual spaces is no longer viewed by big business as a quirky little niche product and there are a lot of very large and influential companies willing to throw huge amounts of money and development time into creating the "next big thing".

 

 

Edited January 5, 2022 by Fluffy Sharkfin

[Nick0678]

21 hours ago, Caroline Takeda said:

I understand your point.

But, Its true that Europeans deal with such things a lot more liberal than Americans (or less prude if you want).
I am European btw.

Wouldn't be so sure about it, actually the vast majority of pornographic film studios and magazines are from the U.S. and there's a very good reason why is that.

[Caroline Takeda]

2 hours ago, Nick0678 said:

and there's a very good reason why is that.

Yes, it's called compensation for the lack of. 🙂

In addition, the US is a very big market. Hence the reason I write in English, not in German.

[Mollymews]

On 1/5/2022 at 7:14 PM, Fluffy Sharkfin said:

Nvidia Omniverse

i had a time to look into this. Is quite impressive. The min hardware spec of a RTX 2080 is a bit more than I can afford at this time

but is pretty interesting and also given that NVidia are positioning/looking to the future then I can see why NVidia went with min RtX 2080

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

1 hour ago, Mollymews said:

i had a time to look into this. Is quite impressive. The min hardware spec of a RTX 2080 is a bit more than I can afford at this time

but is pretty interesting and also given that NVidia are positioning/looking to the future then I can see why NVidia went with min RtX 2080

Yes, I'd love to play around with the free version but my PC spec isn't quite up to it either.

I spent a little time reading some of the articles and a lot of the marketing blurb on the official site.  Seeing the ease and speed at which 3D scenes and assets are being shared across platforms in this video clip it looks like the 3D asset equivalent of local textures in SL.

Pretty impressive when you consider how much time and effort goes into transferring content between the applications used for development and the platform it's intended for, not to mention the time that can be saved during development since there is no trial and error and any updates or changes you make are automatically transferred in real-time.

Given that the entire system is modular and you can plug in whichever existing extensions you need for the project at hand or develop your own using the SDK, if Omniverse gains enough attention and popularity it may well end up being one of the building blocks of a fully functioning metaverse.

[Katherine Heartsong]

On 1/5/2022 at 1:40 AM, Nick0678 said:

Wouldn't be so sure about it, actually the vast majority of pornographic film studios and magazines are from the U.S. and there's a very good reason why is that.

And mostly centred, in terms of production and shooting, in California. There's a very good reason for that.

Despite the "red" states being the most avid consumers of porn, it seems the US is so frighteningly puritan that the sight of a nipple freaks censors and most of the US population out, but I can show as much violence as I like. You can't even show a nipple on network TV for Bastet's sake, let alone two men chastely kissing, without every right wing group and puritanical conservative getting all up in arms. But blow the head off some tough dude splashing his brains onto the wall and that's all fine.

I find the US to be a sexually repressed (and intellectually stunted) country. People banning books in high schools merely acknowledging that gay and trans kids exist? Anti-trans laws all over the place? Anti-science folks? And don't get me started on QAnon or the psychopathic version of capitalism run amok that is able to warp governments, along with the so-called libertarians who conveniently forgot the fourth pillar of social libertarianism that holds back people's individual choices is the free market and capitalism.

A freaking nipple. OMG. 

There is no way in Bastet's green litterbox that any of the so-called major players in this newest thinking about the meta verse will even consider adult activities because "think of the children". Or in their case, the profits.

[Theresa Tennyson]

On 1/5/2022 at 1:40 AM, Nick0678 said:

Wouldn't be so sure about it, actually the vast majority of pornographic film studios and magazines are from the U.S. and there's a very good reason why is that.

"Pornographic film studios and magazines"? Could be dangerous for someone of the age that would think that's how pr0n is distributed in this millennium.

[Nick0678]

4 hours ago, Katherine Heartsong said:

You can't even show a nipple on network TV for Bastet's sake, let alone two men chastely kissing, without every right wing group and puritanical conservative getting all up in arms.

I was watching Star Trek Discovery the other day and there are plenty of men kissing in that, although it's supposed to be some silly childish Sci-Fi series, on the other hand i don't remember any men kissing each other in UK's Dr.Who.

 

On 1/5/2022 at 11:15 AM, Caroline Takeda said:

Yes, it's called compensation for the lack of. 🙂

One thing is certain,  2nd in the list is the UK and 3rd is Germany when it comes to pron production, which sounds normal cause i wouldn't expect to find an Arab country on it.

Edited January 6, 2022 by Nick0678

[Mollymews]

5 hours ago, Fluffy Sharkfin said:

Seeing the ease and speed at which 3D scenes and assets are being shared across platforms in this video clip it looks like the 3D asset equivalent of local textures in SL

yes I think the best thing about this is the Pixar USD format for assets, as a common protocol

not that USD is better or worse than any other protocol, just that a major company like NVidia has chosen to go with it, and being that Nvidia has taken this on, I think USD has every chance of becoming the 'standard'

having a standard is a  good thing

i think too that Linden may/should/will look at USD as a asset upload option (in addition to  dae)

also too I notice that the RTX renderer appears to automagically handle LOD (subdiv), which I think is a very good thing

Edited January 6, 2022 by Mollymews
typs

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

1 minute ago, Mollymews said:

yes I think the best thing about this is the Pixar USD format for assets, as a common protocol

not that USD is better or worse than any other protocol, just that a major company like NVidia has chosen to go with it, and being Nvidia I think USD has every chance of becoming the 'standard'

having a standard is a  good thing

i think too that Linden may/should/will look at USD as a asset upload option (in addition to  dae)

also too I notice that the RTX renderer appears to automagically handle LOD (subdiv), which I think is a very good thing

100% agree!

It would be nice to think that LL will consider adopting the USD format at some point, if only in some limited capacity for importing assets, but in order for SL to be fully compatible with the type of metaverse Nvidia is envisioning it would require existing SL content to be transferable to other platforms and, aside from the logistical headaches, I imagine there would be some opposition from content creators given previous incidents where the ownership of content uploaded to SL has been called into question.

Still it's nice to look at platforms like Omniverse and dream of what the next multiverse may look like, perhaps by the time it comes into being I'll have been able to afford a hardware upgrade! 😄

[Sprout Evergarden]

I don't use Meta for the same reason I don't use regular Facebook, Google, Microsoft or Apple these are all companies that sell you something and have contracts you are forced to accept to use. Contracts that allows those companies to turn you into a product.

[Mollymews]

10 minutes ago, Fluffy Sharkfin said:

It would be nice to think that LL will consider adopting the USD format at some point, if only in some limited capacity for importing assets, but in order for SL to be fully compatible with the type of metaverse Nvidia is envisioning it would require existing SL content to be transferable to other platforms and, aside from the logistical headaches, I imagine there would be some opposition from content creators given previous incidents where the ownership of content uploaded to SL has been called into question.

this is the problem for everyone

at the moment, outside of SL, assets are typically sold as use-licensed objects. Can use as many copies as you want in your own scene.  In some cases (depending on license) can also sell the use-license to another person, but can't retain a copy for your own use once the license has been sold/transferred to another person

which poses a problem for Linden (and every other world/experience provider), how to honour the use-license model thru the platform

i am not sure if there is an answer for this, without there being  some kind of asset registry system to which world/experience platform providers subscribe. And I am not sure who would administer and pay for this

this said I think that for now is going to left to the creators to deal with this themselves as individuals, having to use the DMCA process, and/or making it a condition of the use license that a purchased asset can't be uploaded to some platforms Which is pretty much the current situation

[Mollymews]

ps add

just thinking about this a bit more: "how to honour the use-license model thru the platform

i think some kind of CMT permission flags in the asset file might be how it ends up.  The CMT permissions are set by the creator when they make their models

a buyer can then upload their purchased model to SL say and the platform respects the CMT permissions in the file. Applying the CMT permissions and the name of the creator in the file to the uploaded asset. Should the creator not have a platform account then the upload is rejected

this can be subverted of course by rippers, but this is not a new problem, is an existing problem which is typically dealt with by DMCA

i think tho that most people generally observe licenses, so I think in the main a CMT like permissions in the file will suffice 

Edited January 6, 2022 by Mollymews

[kevin350]

26 minutes ago, Mollymews said:

 

… without there being  some kind of asset registry system to which world/experience platform providers subscribe. And I am not sure who would administer and pay for this

 

This is exactly what NFT technology provides and solves. 

[Fluffy Sharkfin]

17 minutes ago, Mollymews said:

this is the problem for everyone

at the moment, outside of SL, assets are typically sold as use-licensed objects. Can use as many copies as you want in your own scene.  In some cases (depending on license) can also sell the use-license to another person, but can't retain a copy for your own use once the license has been sold/transferred to another person

which poses a problem for Linden (and every other world/experience provider), how to honour the use-license model thru the platform

i am not sure if there is an answer for this, without there being  some kind of asset registry system to which world/experience platform providers subscribe. And I am not sure who would administer and pay for this

this said I think that for now is going to left to the creators to deal with this themselves as individuals, having to use the DMCA process, and/or making it a condition of the use license that a purchased asset can't be uploaded to some platforms Which is pretty much the current situation

It's definitely a huge can of worms and having a standardized format for assets is only really useful if the platforms you're sharing assets between have compatible licenses for the assets being transferred.

I found this part of the article from my earlier post interesting.

Quote

New support for the Omniverse ecosystem provided by leading 3D marketplaces and digital asset libraries gives creators an even easier way to build their scenes. TurboSquid by  Shutterstock, CGTrader, Sketchfab and Twinbru have released thousands of Omniverse-ready assets for creators, all based on USD and available in the Omniverse Launcher. Reallusion’s ActorCore, Daz3D and e-on software’s PlantCatalog will soon release their own Omniverse-ready assets.

Depending on the type of license that these assets are provided under it may be that the various marketplaces of the worlds that comprise this theoretical metaverse are completely separate from the worlds themselves and the content licensed across the entire metaverse rather than tied to a single world or platform.

[Mollymews]

15 minutes ago, kevin350 said:

This is exactly what NFT technology provides and solves. 

it actually doesn't

a copy of the asset itself has to be uploaded to each respective platform for it to be rendered on the platform for all people in the view

that copy for upload has to be stored somewhere that the platform owners and creatives trust

edit:

sorry, I gave a wrong steer in my previous post.  I should have said repository rather than registry in my earlier

Edited January 6, 2022 by Mollymews