Zoey Winsmore Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 (edited) 17 minutes ago, never Franizzi said: I get what I pay for from gachas... one of the items listed on the photo... its not like i put the lindens in and expect something from the photo and then get a turtle instead... i get what I paid for... I know what I am getting when I play a gacha. Anyone who can't grasp that concept needs to not be handling money. Maybe, that logic goes up for you... But it doesn't for anyone else, that maybe does not want all of the items that gacha has showing on the picture. You can try to bend it all you want, in the end, it is one random item of about, 20+ other items you might get. And take into account, you ending up with so many duplicates as well. And the duplicates, is probably the whole issue of debate next to all this being random why Linden Lab wants to end gachas. You do not go to a store and buy 20 of the same dress or whatever, or do you? Edited August 4, 2021 by Zoey Winsmore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romy Writer Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 4 minutes ago, Scum Pond said: Because a drop-in vendor script replacement for gatchas that is within the proposed rules is easier then breaking everything apart and making it all separate. Must be more complicated than I think then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scum Pond Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 Just now, Romy Writer said: Must be more complicated than I think then. Breaking apart means separate vendors for each item (with all the configs like item name and price), possibly new pictures (and the editing) if the maker cares about how they are perceived, possibly making multiples if they want to allow different permissions, changing all the items to copy/no-trans to align with the rest of their store, etc. Or else they just take the items away from being sold, which is work and future money down the drain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
never Franizzi Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 11 hours ago, Emilie Muggins said: I am sorry but you are not making any sense, the difference is obvious, when you buy your top you get a top in the exact color you chose. I have no idea how the difference is not evident to you my post was to the fact that someone said they didnt want to pay a gacha over and over just to get all the pieces in a set... where i compared it to going to a shop and having to pay for each piece in a set one by one or end up buying a fatpack for a highly inflated price and getting about ten things in it you dont want just to be abled to get the two tops and skirts etc you do want... I am not sure why that isnt clear to you but I can't speak for your comprehension as I don't know you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee Pancake Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 gacha with extra steps is still gacha gacha knowing you have to buy something you know you don't want in order to reroll is worse. You get that .. right? It's still gacha. Please ban them all and get to making individuals or packs, that's what customers actually want. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathly Fright Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 Just now, Coffee Pancake said: gacha with extra steps is still gacha gacha knowing you have to buy something you know you don't want in order to reroll is worse. You get that .. right? It's still gacha. Please ban them all and get to making individuals or packs, that's what customers actually want. then what is the difference to the proposed new gatcha system like in the video versus a one of a kind vendor? which I don't think anybody would consider a gatcha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romy Writer Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 1 minute ago, Scum Pond said: Breaking apart means separate vendors for each item (with all the configs like item name and price), possibly new pictures (and the editing) if the maker cares about how they are perceived, possibly making multiples if they want to allow different permissions, changing all the items to copy/no-trans to align with the rest of their store, etc. Or else they just take the items away from being sold, which is work and future money down the drain. Basically what I thought, change the perms, maybe the name and drop into a compliant vendor, possibly new pic with updated text. Does not seem over complicated to me. But of course I'm not the one doing it. Like I said, I hope Silas and all the creators of gacha can find a solution they are comfortable with moving forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucia Nightfire Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 1 hour ago, Deathly Fright said: then what is the difference to the proposed new gatcha system like in the video versus a one of a kind vendor? which I don't think anybody would consider a gatcha. It still perpetuates the gacha mechanic. Randomizing on a timer or after a purchase. Does not matter if what is currently displayed is what you get. LL can simply make such a statement to doom any such "workaround". 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Mistwalker Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 33 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said: True but the thrill of a gacha is in possibly getting that thing you really want on the first try. Or the second. Or maybe the third. No one.in there right mind pays for things they KNOW they don't want in order to get what the do want. The device might be legal but it's asinine. I agree. Now get off muh lawn. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scum Pond Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 Just now, Romy Writer said: Basically what I thought, change the perms, maybe the name and drop into a compliant vendor, possibly new pic with updated text. Does not seem over complicated to me. But of course I'm not the one doing it. Like I said, I hope Silas and all the creators of gacha can find a solution they are comfortable with moving forward. Having had a store a while ago, it's a royal pita. Especially if you have a ton of items to make vendors for, and care about your brand. Using the key for the new vendor would look like crap and would even be false advertising. And don't forget the MP listings... jesus.. the MP listing alone would drive me crazy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
never Franizzi Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 11 hours ago, Mireille Massiel said: Sellers, an even better idea for you. Have everything you make available for purchase at what you deem a fair price. And let me, the customer, decide what i wish to purchase. Retailing 101, it's not hard. Or, retail 100, let the creator sell what they want how they want... i mean.... thats not hard either..I didnt want the little silver ring from the quarter machine that left a green ring around my finger when i was a kid at the supermart but i mean.. I knew it was a possiblity when I put the money in. Even as a kid I understood that, if I put my money in, I am going to get one of these items shown, I might not get the one i want though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathly Fright Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 1 minute ago, Lucia Nightfire said: It still perpetuates the gacha mechanic. Randomizing on a timer or after a purchase. Does not matter if what is currently displayed is what you get. LL can simply make such a statement to doom any such "workaround". I'm sure they could. all I'm saying is that they might not have to, which would make the creators that rely on gatchas happy. I'm not saying that right, but I can see this causing a lot of good experienced SL creators to just leave and roll up shop. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silas Merlin Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, Romy Writer said: Silas, why not sell the items singly or as a set or groups? It is almost the same as what you have here if you sell them singly. Your art and creativity are amazing and inspiring. Some of the most unique and best art I have seen in virtual. I do hope you can find a solution you are comfortable with going forward. Romy, I did try all sorts of things. It just doesn't do. I stopped making gachas for a very long time, because of all the whining, hate, insults, begging (generally in that order in a single conversation). It turned out that all those people who said "I would buy your items individually at a fair price" suddenly vanished, poof! gone! when I stopped making gachas. This month I decided to make one and I am glad I did, because it turns out it was my last opportunity to do so, and it confirmed the difference : for me this mechanism is the only one that makes creating these statues even remotely worthwhile. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoey Winsmore Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Deathly Fright said: then what is the difference to the proposed new gatcha system like in the video versus a one of a kind vendor? which I don't think anybody would consider a gatcha. I really do dislike that new kind of vendor even more where I have to buy every item that shows up randomly. In hopes that finally, finally maybe after 20 items I don't want to have, need to be bought, so the item I do like, comes. That is no difference to any current gacha out there right now. It is the same way. Edited August 4, 2021 by Zoey Winsmore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
never Franizzi Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 8 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said: gacha with extra steps is still gacha gacha knowing you have to buy something you know you don't want in order to reroll is worse. You get that .. right? It's still gacha. Please ban them all and get to making individuals or packs, that's what customers actually want. you shouldnt speak for "customers" when you are really just speaking for yourself. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathly Fright Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 3 minutes ago, Silas Merlin said: Romy, I did try all sorts of things. It just doesn't do. I stopped making gachas for a very long time, because of all the whining, hate, insults, begging (generally in that order in a single conversation). It turned out that all those people who said "I would buy your items individually at a fair price" suddenly vanished, poof! gone! when I stopped making gachas. This month I decided to make one and I am glad I did, because it turns out it was my last opportunity to do so, and it confirmed the difference : for me this mechanism is the only one that makes creating these statues even remotely worthwhile. I hope a good solution for you creators is found. 💕 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romy Writer Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, Silas Merlin said: Romy, I did try all sorts of things. It just doesn't do. I stopped making gachas for a very long time, because of all the whining, hate, insults, begging (generally in that order in a single conversation). It turned out that all those people who said "I would buy your items individually at a fair price" suddenly vanished, poof! gone! when I stopped making gachas. This month I decided to make one and I am glad I did, because it turns out it was my last opportunity to do so, and it confirmed the difference : for me this mechanism is the only one that makes creating these statues even remotely worthwhile. ah yes, I see. Moving forward no one will be able to sell gachas, and hopefully you will see a difference because of it. I mean, the shopping experience will be different for most of us in a month. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
never Franizzi Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 I just read the FAQs on the inital LL post and I am confused as to why they believe the 7seas fish are non-trans? Have Lindens never played 7seas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Mistwalker Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 10 minutes ago, Deathly Fright said: then what is the difference to the proposed new gatcha system like in the video versus a one of a kind vendor? which I don't think anybody would consider a gatcha. Well for starters, you keep calling it gacha so it's gacha. Gachas are going away. Period. No workarounds allowed. Sucks for those who play a lot but that's how LL has deemed it needs to be in order to keep the grid open for all of us. Legally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowan Amore Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 1 minute ago, never Franizzi said: I just read the FAQs on the inital LL post and I am confused as to why they believe the 7seas fish are non-trans? Have Lindens never played 7seas? No, because the purchase of bait to go “fishing” is a purchase being made of a known item, and also the fish you catch while playing the game are non-transferable. To be clear, if they are not currently, they must be going forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathly Fright Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said: Well for starters, you keep calling it gacha so it's gacha. Gachas are going away. Period. No workarounds allowed. Sucks for those who play a lot but that's how LL has deemed it needs to be in order to keep the grid open for all of us. Legally. this is semantics... I only refer to them as gatchas, but only because there's no term for them now... random vendors I guess? I can go back and edit all my previous posts if you want. Edited August 4, 2021 by Deathly Fright Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Komarimono Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 Requiring a customer to purchase something they do not want, to get to the product they do want, is still a Gacha. This is covered in the laws that were passed. Choosing to bypass those laws with this method will not work. Gacha are greed, that simple. Why is exists to begin with. Show the items you can get, but don't let you get that item you want unless invest more then you should have to. Those claiming that without Gacha their business would go down, are admitting they were exploiting others, that simple. If you think your products are worth the L, then raise the price. But please don't say that you were not exploiting others, since that's simply not true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathly Fright Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 (edited) actually I have a question... what's the difference between a person that is selling a ton of their items randomly through one vendor and a ... random vendor (previously known as a gatcha but tells you what's up next)? sure the person selling all their inventory like that is dumb, but there's no difference. Edited August 4, 2021 by Deathly Fright Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoey Winsmore Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, Deathly Fright said: this is semantics... I only refer to them as gatchas, but only because there's no term for them now... random vendors I guess? I can go back and edit all my previous posts if you want. You don't have to edit all your previous posts about this. This new kind of vendor, still acts the same like a gacha. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathly Fright Posted August 4, 2021 Share Posted August 4, 2021 Just now, Zoey Winsmore said: You don't have to edit all your previous posts about this. This new kind of vendor, still acts the same like a gacha. please answer this question I just asked above: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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