Is Lindenlab choosing a doomed path for SL ? Tell us if the EEP and PBR introduction changed the way you play SL

[Rowan Amore]

9 minutes ago, DevlinMcDermott said:

factory-built, custom-made

Isn't that an oxymoron?

[Jase Devin]

13 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

For the EXACT same reason most fulkl estate regions are only 40-50 avatars, more lags like molasses in wintertime.

And before you say something like "But Infamous Noob Pit, Laghole City is set to 70", yeah that's called being bloody stupid.

Before you say "But the Shop n hops are 65" those are not "standard full regions", those are the deluxe high capacity "Event" regions.

 

Event regions were launched at 900 bucks a month, and a claim they could hold 200 avatars. LL admitted they hadn't ACTUAL:LY tested them with 200 avatars, but had only PRETENDED to test them.

They tended to crash and burn long before the 200 limit claimed.

So rebranded as 175 avatar regions, for 450 bucks a month, sales improved, a certain well known mesh head brand rented a couple for an xmas giveaway. They tended to crash and burn of you went over 110 avatars.

The Moles using them for the shop n hop that year set them to 65.

 

Just because some wiki page says "100 avatars max allowed on a full region" doesn't mean it's a good idea to try.

 

I have a Private Sim, its set to 100 and I've had 100. I think that's the norm for private regions.

That's why my guess is that mainland is 1/3 cpu with the 40 av max.

Homestead 1/4 cpu with 20 av max.

[Ayashe Ninetails]

10 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Insofar as any of my whining has been about ME, personally, it's with regards to how old EEPs look (i.e., mostly absolutely terrible). As I say, though, I'm building up a library, and will be spending some time teaching myself how to tweak my custom ones to make them work. But there are some good ones becoming available (although there are also some not very good ones.)

I'm super low maintenance when it comes to Firestorm, so it may turn out I wind up making my own EEP setting. The ones you linked looked a tad dark in the marketplace photos, but perhaps they aren't that bad in-world. I'll give them a shot, and if I don't like them, I'll see if I can just throw something together myself.

 

12 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

For the moment (and indeed for the foreseeable future), however, I'll be using an older version of BD for snaps, as I really don't want to be bothered struggling with the lighting for those right now.

This right here is the big challenge, though. I have my BD maxed to the max to the max. Ultra, shadows, DoF, all settings cranked, and a bunch of custom EEPs. Getting that to play nicely with PBR while keeping my system happy AND adjusting all of my favorite EEPs is going to be a thing.

[DevlinMcDermott]

5 minutes ago, Modulated said:

If any of them are using only integrated graphics, that's probably why. Post some specs, please.

Example

The latest Dell 4 months old

16g Ram
CPU Intel i5
Intel Iris Xe Graphics

Completely empty of programs other than factory installed. 

I've tried running Firestorm, Second Life's even Cool LV. It either lags for 15-20 minutes until the fan goes hyperspeed OR renders half of everything gray.

[Ceka Cianci]

7 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

socks, socks, everywhere socks!

All the ones that escaped in the dryer met up some place and organized!! \o/

[Scylla Rhiadra]

12 minutes ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

This right here is the big challenge, though. I have my BD maxed to the max to the max. Ultra, shadows, DoF, all settings cranked, and a bunch of custom EEPs. Getting that to play nicely with PBR while keeping my system happy AND adjusting all of my favorite EEPs is going to be a thing.

For me, DoF is the potential killer. Sometimes it works amazingly well, and sometimes it crashes me. I have no idea what the variables are that cause that difference, although I'm sure that being in a busy scene doesn't help.

I've never really quite understood, either, why BD not only takes better pics than Firestorm, but actually also performs better than FS. Were it not that I hated the UI so much, I'd consider making it my everyday viewer.

Edited Tuesday at 10:36 PM by Scylla Rhiadra

[Modulated]

2 minutes ago, DevlinMcDermott said:

Example

The latest Dell 4 months old

16g Ram
CPU Intel i5
Intel Iris Xe Graphics

Completely empty of programs other than factory installed. 

I've tried running Firestorm, Second Life's even Cool LV. It either lags for 15-20 minutes until the fan goes hyperspeed OR renders half of everything gray.

Integrated graphics I had thought, you're not going to have a good time with PBR, but someone else was claiming that Xe graphics will run it, probably have to fiddle with settings a bit to turn a lot off.

[Zalificent Corvinus]

16 minutes ago, DevlinMcDermott said:

Example

The latest Dell 4 months old

16g Ram
CPU Intel i5
Intel Iris Xe Graphics

Completely empty of programs other than factory installed. 

I've tried running Firestorm, Second Life's even Cool LV. It either lags for 15-20 minutes until the fan goes hyperspeed OR renders half of everything gray.

NO graphics card!

And being a dell, you probably payed about 4 times what I spend for the parts to build a desktop with the same ram, a 1650 nvidia card, and almost certainly more drive space.

You'd have poor performance running optimised modern games on that dell box, never mind a hot mess like SL.

Edited Tuesday at 10:42 PM by Zalificent Corvinus

[Vivienne Schell]

2 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

Yeah, just looked those numbers up and there wasn't anywhere near 50000 total Sims ever.  Around 31K in 2011 and 28K now.   Would that be considered gaslighting?  Asking for a friend.

Oh, you checked? Fine. 38 k is the correct number pre-mesh. Then i declined down to 24 k, and slowly got better over the pandemy. Now it´s 28 k. If someone tells me that mesh imports were a success in regards to help SL grow I must laugh. Apparently it might have helped to keep the ship afloat somehow, but it undoubtedly was not (and still is not) the positive gamechanger many cheerleaders proudly predicted. Nor was windlight or any other tech "improvement" LL came up with over the years. Sl is in it´s niche of die hards and most of all is a virtual, social meeting place or virtual social club where "high tech"  is not really wished nor really demanded nor really needed by the vast majority of users.

[Ayashe Ninetails]

5 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

For me, DoF is the potential killer. Sometimes it works amazingly well, and it sometimes it crashes me. I have no idea what the variables are that cause that difference, although I'm sure that being in a busy scene doesn't help.

I've never really quite understood, either, why BD not only takes better pics than Firestorm, but actually also performs better than FS. Were it not that I hated the UI so much, I'd consider making it my everyday viewer.

That's weird about DoF. It's also very finicky for me and I always have to play with it foreeeeever to get something I'm happy with. I could solve a lot of these issues and save so much time if I did any post-processing, but naaaaaah. 😂

Oh, and the instant I first tried the BD viewer, I was so, so tempted to make it my every day viewer. Everything looks SO good in it and I adore the EEP tools (Firestorm has that trackball-lookin' mechanic for sun position I think it is, and I am not a fan, lol). It does work my system a teensy bit more (nothing unusual - just fans/heat, which is entirely normal running around on Ultra but Firestorm runs cooler for me), but other than that, it's so good. 

Not having that old version of Search (unless it just needs to be enabled somewhere) is what killed it for me, though, so I use Firestorm for my shopping sessions and BD for photos. I'm definitely okay with running both.

[Vivienne Schell]

1 hour ago, Irina Forwzy said:

First, Linden Labs has investment. Those investors and the finance team will be reviewing the numbers for the next quarter and the subsequent next.  They won't go back, despite what everyone thinks and remove PBR. That's a lot of project development cost.

They sold Sansar. Millions of development cost. They probably will not go back. They probably will do worse.

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

It's also very finicky for me and I always have to play with it foreeeeever to get something I'm happy with.

* blushes *

[Theresa Tennyson]

On 6/22/2024 at 11:35 PM, BriannaLovey said:

Obviously if the clients/users know you are doing this outright, they will throw a fit. Thankfully for you, the dishonest person, you can use allegations of simulated pedophilia to turn all the clients/users into useful idiots who agree to absolutely anything as long as it gets rid of the accused. Funny how that works out.

Makes me wonder, who did Robert Bartos/dantesedmond1844 work for?

Who knows? For all we know he could have been a middle-aged paperboy who lived with his mother.

[Zalificent Corvinus]

2 minutes ago, Vivienne Schell said:

They sold Sansar. Millions of development cost. They probably will not go back. They probably will do worse.

More like 50 - 70 million USD

Based on a rough estimate from the 70 staff / 6 years / San Fran pay scales.

 

[Scylla Rhiadra]

7 minutes ago, Ayashe Ninetails said:

Oh, and the instant I first tried the BD viewer, I was so, so tempted to make it my every day viewer. Everything looks SO good in it and I adore the EEP tools (Firestorm has that trackball-lookin' mechanic for sun position I think it is, and I am not a fan, lol). It does work my system a teensy bit more (nothing unusual - just fans/heat, which is entirely normal running around on Ultra but Firestorm runs cooler for me), but other than that, it's so good. 

Not having that old version of Search (unless it just needs to be enabled somewhere) is what killed it for me, though, so I use Firestorm for my shopping sessions and BD for photos. I'm definitely okay with running both.

Keeping this on topic, the PBR-enabled BD viewer works pretty well, if you haven't tried it yet, at least performance wise.

I haven't tried building in it yet, but I usually build in FS anyway because the tools are so much better.

ETA: Oh, and along with only the "new" search, BD doesn't have Area Search. I know that it's supposedly a resource hog, and a GOOD person would never use it, but I absolutely depend upon it when shopping. And occasionally, when I lose something.

Edited Tuesday at 10:51 PM by Scylla Rhiadra

[Daniel Voyager]

Second Life mobile has now moved into the Public Beta phrase now for all Premium/Premium Plus members. General public launch expected later on. 

The Second Life Grid Survey reports regularly with the latest regions stats and concurrency levels. 

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Daniel Voyager said:

Second Life mobile has now moved into the Public Beta phrase now for all Premium/Premium Plus members. General public launch expected later on. 

The Second Life Grid Survey reports regularly with the latest regions stats and concurrency levels. 

Yes. Any "doomed path" EEP and/or PBR relevance? Just asking.. 🙂

My own opinion (until it was limited to "G" regions) has been that "Mobile" will lead Second Life "away from doom".

We. Shall. See.

[Theresa Tennyson]

25 minutes ago, DevlinMcDermott said:

Example

The latest Dell 4 months old

16g Ram
CPU Intel i5
Intel Iris Xe Graphics

Completely empty of programs other than factory installed. 

I've tried running Firestorm, Second Life's even Cool LV. It either lags for 15-20 minutes until the fan goes hyperspeed OR renders half of everything gray.

What are your settings? I've got a laptop that's a bit older than that with Intel graphics and less RAM and it's usable with the PBR viewer. You'll need to lower your settings quite a bit but I imagine you were running non-ALM before.

[Zalificent Corvinus]

1 minute ago, Daniel Voyager said:

Second Life mobile has now moved into the Public Beta phrase now for all Premium/Premium Plus members. General public launch expected later on. 

And that has what, exactly, to do with the topic of "has LL messed up".

MobileLife Fail-Viewer is a fail.

No access to a 1/3rd of the grid, no inventory access, etc., etc., its not going to be some miracle cure and bring in some mythical "vast untapped new market".

 

 

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

And that has what, exactly, to do with the topic of "has LL messed up".

MobileLife Fail-Viewer is a fail.

No access to a 1/3rd of the grid, no inventory access, etc., etc., its not going to be some miracle cure and bring in some mythical "vast untapped new market".

 

 

I tried to ask that too, just a little kinder. LOL

[Ayashe Ninetails]

10 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Keeping this on topic, the PBR-enabled BD viewer works pretty well, if you haven't tried it yet, at least performance wise.

I haven't tried building in it yet, but I usually build in FS anyway because the tools are so much better.

ETA: Oh, and along with only the "new" search, BD doesn't have Area Search. I know that it's supposedly a resource hog, and a GOOD person would never use it, but I absolutely depend upon it when shopping. And occasionally, when I lose something.

Thanks for that! I need to try BD's PBR version soon. I'm glad performance is good. I don't use it much these days, but I really don't want to lose it as an option just in case. 

No Area Search I could live with. I'll save myself the embarrassment and won't tell you how many years it took before I learned that was even a thing. 😒😄

And same - I do all my building and decorating and dressing and prep in Firestorm, so I'm glad to find that it's still performing well for me, even if my EEP is a bit blinding at the moment...

[Extrude Ragu]

4 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

And that has what, exactly, to do with the topic of "has LL messed up".

MobileLife Fail-Viewer is a fail.

No access to a 1/3rd of the grid, no inventory access, etc., etc., its not going to be some miracle cure and bring in some mythical "vast untapped new market".

SOOO I was at the round table today, and it turns out that android users will  be able to access adult regions.

Apple users are Tim Cooked though.

[Zalificent Corvinus]

4 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

I tried to ask that too, just a little kinder. LOL

Yeah, well, LOL

I was basically asking a "Rhetorical question" as I already knew the answer was "Sod All"

[Vivienne Schell]

6 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

MobileLife Fail-Viewer is a fail.

Give it a chance! aybe there is a not so unsignificant number of bored pre-puberty kids who love to play barbi in 3D, embedded in some sandbox environment, on their school tablets. PBR with it´s fantastic oversaturation would provide the perfect surroundings there.

[Istelathis]

4 minutes ago, Extrude Ragu said:

SOOO I was at the round table today, and it turns out that android users will  be able to access adult regions.

Apple users are Tim Cooked though.

🤣

That's what people get for getting apple products!  😉🪿 

(I'm sorry, I have a long standing feud with apple products.. I can't help myself . I'll behave now.)