So let's play fair

[miranda Sapphire]

Ok, I get it, I understand the need to protect kids. I really get it because I play a child too. I play because I had a horrible childhood and playing a kid has helped me deal with some issues that no amount of therapy could help with.

With that being said, I think some of these modesty rules are obnoxious. Yes I agree kids should ALWAYS have panties or underwear on. I totally agree with that but having a pelvis to chest modesty layer is just STUPID. If we wanted to wear a swim suit (for example) we won't be able to because the modesty layer from pelvis to chest would make it look hideous. You don't make your RL child wear underwear under their bathing suits, why make us? A strip across the breast area is more than fine. And what about the boys? Boys can go without shirts. They don't NEED a modesty layer covering their chests. That's even more lame and stupid!

Now I'm hearing some talk in the community that LL is talking about making it so we can't even alpha out body parts. Now that is even MORE stupid because there are cases where we HAVE to. There's no getting around it.

While I'm on a role here, if LL is going to start targeting us kids and yes, it feels like targeting regardless what all of you say. If LL is going to make us wear modesty layers then why not start enforcing some of it on you adults? Just tonight I went to a well known full perm mesh store that was on a moderate sim and there was a girl standing there with ALL her bits showing. I mean bits from A-Z. Is that fair to us kids that we have to keep covered yet nasty people like that can parade around on sims we ARE allowed on dressed with everything showing? No it's not right!

I think adults should be made to wear pasties and panties on their skins too because quite frankly, I get sick of seeing butt cheeks, nipples and cooches flopping all over like it's a summer party.

I know I'm not the only one that feels this way and I know I will be attacked for this post but quite frankly my dear, I don't give a rats behind because I'm tired of the kid community getting singled out because some of you adults can't keep your hands and bits to yourselves. You have ALL the adult sims now, stay off ours!

2 nights ago me and another child avatar went to another well known store only to see some male dressed in a furry avi with his (ahem) still attached. SERIOUSLY?????? he couldn't detach it before going to a PG sim???? Yet if we show our bits or go to an adult sim, we get banned. How is this all of this fair to us?

No matter where we go in SL, adults are ALWAYS walking around like they just came off the streets working the corners or worse.

Come on, so let's be fair about all this. If we want SL to be a fun place, we ALL have to work together. Have a little decency and courtesy when you choose your outfits to go out in public because I don't feel like getting banned for being near you because you don't know how to dress appropriately. 

Some of the outfits some of you wear should be for the bedroom only, not for public display and people get sick of seeing it, including adults. You wouldn't dress like that in the real world because you'd be arrested for indecent exposure. Why dress like that in SL? 

I saw someone say it's your SL, make it your SL. Yeah that's a laugh when adults are making it nearly impossible for kids to enjoy it by the way they dress and now LL making us wear modesty layers.

I am angry, VERY angry here because it's totally unfair to the kid community.

Edited May 22 by miranda Sapphire

[Stephanie Misfit]

Did we really need another thread on this topic? There are so many already, and this has been discussed over and over.

[Jaylinbridges]

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

but having a pelvis to chest modesty layer is just STUPID. If we wanted to wear a swim suit (for example) we won't be able to because the modesty layer from pelvis to chest would make it look hideous. You don't make your RL child wear underwear under their bathing suits, why make us? A strip across the breast area is more than fine. And what about the boys? Boys can go without shirts. They don't NEED a modesty layer covering their chests. That's even more lame and stupid!

 I guess you missed the latest FAQ's from LL.  Most of your information is also misinformed.

[Zalificent Corvinus]

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

before going to a PG sim

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

store that was on a moderate sim and there was a girl standing there with ALL her bits showing

Lets correct some of the implied errors in this wall of text of yours right now.

M Rated regions are NOT, I repeat NOT "pg", they are very clearly described by LL as 18+, and non-sexual nudity is allowed, for adult avatars, unless specifically diisallowed by the owner of the parcel.

 

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

I think adults should be made to wear pasties and panties on their skins too because

...you're part of a tiny toxic minority mostly to blame for the scandals, and a sore loser, who wants the 99% of SL that are not part of your gang to be punished for the problem your gang has created, just by existing.

 

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

Come on, so let's be fair about all this

Why the hell should we "be fair" to your gang, when for 17 years your gang have been unfair to everybody else.

 

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

I am angry, VERY angry here because it's totally unfair to the kid community.

I am very angry, that your community has created a problem for all of us, and ass for "fairness" defined as punishing the 99% who are not fake children, guess what, that's coming. Raining on your Tiny Toxic Terror tot parade is just the first shoe to drop, the rest of us get hit NEXT, when they bring in some insane and intrusive "age verification" system, to be allowed to visit the now thankfully fake-child free A rated regions.

 

You want to know why you get so little sympathy from some of us?

Because right from the word  go, some of you have been making suggestions like this.

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

I think adults should be made to wear pasties and panties on their skins too

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

If LL is going to make us wear modesty layers then why not start enforcing some of it on you adults?

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

adults are ALWAYS walking around like they just came off the streets working the corners or worse.

 

You gave up any entitlement you might feel you have to sympathy when you started calling for vengeance against the majority who didn't cause the problem.

 

[Alexander Vorhees]

2 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

M Rated regions are NOT, I repeat NOT "pg", they are very clearly described by LL as 18+, and non-sexual nudity is allowed, for adult avatars, unless specifically diisallowed by the owner of the parcel.

This has not been allowed by sl on moderate sim for the last decade learn your *****. any and all adult nudity is to be taken place on adult only , the only thing that can be out on moderate is 1. in the freedom of your on private parcel to be as adult as you want but not on open moderate sims, the most that can be done is the sale of adult animations, furniture, and clothing. But absolutely never allowed to be nude if its accessible to the public that has only ever been allowed on adult sims. So all those on sl that dont want to comply fine. you will be getting banned cause i have had enough after the almost 2 decades on sl and some of yall cant be decent.  the fact that a lot of the so called adults on sl dont read the tos cause then you would read the same thing that tells you not nudity on open moderate sims on private home ones other wise get you ass to a adult sim and when the app launches LL has already put out a warning that if you keep going out of adult regions like that your gone for good. LL is done.  So how about you and all the other creepos stay dressed appropriately when going out or stay on sims your alloud to look like a *****ing hooker. (thats ADULT by the way)

[Jaylinbridges]

8 minutes ago, Alexander Vorhees said:

This has not been allowed by sl on moderate sim for the last decade learn your *****. any and all adult nudity is to be taken place on adult only

Another "newbie" that never read the TOS for M-rated regions.  Nudity is absolutely allowed in public on M-rated land.  If you are wearing your peenis, it has to be flacid. Community standards.  Nudity is not an Adult act.  Get your mind out of the gutter. 

Looks like the forum has attracted a new wave of alts to spread FUD.
 

Edited May 22 by Jaylinbridges

[miranda Sapphire]

27 minutes ago, Stephanie Misfit said:

Did we really need another thread on this topic? There are so many already, and this has been discussed over and over.

Tough! We have a LOT to say on the topic and we want to be heard. Get over it!

[miranda Sapphire]

10 minutes ago, Jaylinbridges said:

Another "newbie" that never read the TOS for M-rated regions.  Nudity is absolutely allowed in public on M-rated land.  If you are wearing your peenis, it has to be flacid. Community standards.  Nudity is not an Adult act.  Get your mind out of the gutter.
 

First of all, spell the word "Pen*s" correctly if you want everyone to know what you are talking about and 2nd of all, I DO have a screen shot of what I saw tonight. The ONLY reason I did not attach it to my thread is because I wasn't sure if I would get banned but if you want to see it, or anyone else, then by all means, please do IM me in world miranda Sapphire and I'll be happy to share it. The girls genitals, butt cheeks and breasts were completely exposed and were not even covered up even a tiny bit.

The male I was referring about 2 nights ago, his wasn't even covered either and it was huge. I don't want to end up banned because you adults don't know how to keep yourselves covered up in public. Have a little courtesy and brains.

Edited May 22 by miranda Sapphire

[miranda Sapphire]

41 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

Lets correct some of the implied errors in this wall of text of yours right now.

M Rated regions are NOT, I repeat NOT "pg", they are very clearly described by LL as 18+, and non-sexual nudity is allowed, for adult avatars, unless specifically diisallowed by the owner of the parcel.

 

...you're part of a tiny toxic minority mostly to blame for the scandals, and a sore loser, who wants the 99% of SL that are not part of your gang to be punished for the problem your gang has created, just by existing.

 

Why the hell should we "be fair" to your gang, when for 17 years your gang have been unfair to everybody else.

 

I am very angry, that your community has created a problem for all of us, and ass for "fairness" defined as punishing the 99% who are not fake children, guess what, that's coming. Raining on your Tiny Toxic Terror tot parade is just the first shoe to drop, the rest of us get hit NEXT, when they bring in some insane and intrusive "age verification" system, to be allowed to visit the now thankfully fake-child free A rated regions.

 

You want to know why you get so little sympathy from some of us?

Because right from the word  go, some of you have been making suggestions like this.

 

You gave up any entitlement you might feel you have to sympathy when you started calling for vengeance against the majority who didn't cause the problem.

 

Not all of us littles are are "toxic" as you put it. It takes a few bad apples that makes the rest of us look bad and I could say the same for you adults. Because 1 or 2 were seen exposing themselves today does that make the rest of you "toxic"? No because not all of you do it. Just like us kids. Just because some of these little A*sh0les are just that, doesn't mean the rest of us are. Get to know the kid community and you might be surprised at how many of us are 100% genuine. Most of us came from horrible childhoods and know what it's like to be  mistreated, treated like outcasts, abused, and the list goes on and we'd never inflict it on the community RL or SL.

I for one am not "fake" and I go out of my way to help those in need. I wear my heart on my sleeve and I'm always the one that gets hurt because people know that I'm easy to take advantage of. I'm a giver not a taker and that's why people walk all over me. Yes it's my fault but again, it's how you are raised.

Sympathy? nah, I don't want sympathy, I just want fairness. I don't think it's right that adults can go on G & M sims and have all their bits exposed, walk around like street walking hookers but when one of us littles comes on an Adult sim or we show a little too much skin, we get banned. THAT is what I am talking about. THAT is not fair. We go on sims we're allows then see adults standing there half dressed or have all their bits exposed, then we are at risk for being banned when it's the adult that's causing the issue. We're on a sim we're allowed yet we're in danger of losing our accounts because Joe Blow or Sally Sue can't dress appropriate without having their t*ts, a*ss and tw*t hanging all out. It's not right and it's not fair.

If the pedo's and the age players would leave us littles alone, we wouldn't have all these issues.

We get told if we see exposed bodyparts to file an AR so we do that but our AR's go unheard and nothing is done and the offender get's to continue running around with everything hanging out but if one of us kids did it.... Boy, we lose our accounts, no questions asked. Again, this is NOT fair. 

Edited May 22 by miranda Sapphire

[miranda Sapphire]

43 minutes ago, Jaylinbridges said:

 I guess you missed the latest FAQ's from LL.  Most of your information is also misinformed.

Thank you for clearing this up for me

[Zalificent Corvinus]

7 minutes ago, Alexander Vorhees said:

This has not been allowed by sl on moderate sim for the last decade learn your *****

No. YOU need to "learn your ****".

For starters, M Rated land is specifically stated to be 18+ only, not the 16+ for G rated land.

Then there is the fact that LL do not classify nudity as "adult activity", their official info on this states you can have burlesque strip joints on M rated land as long ass no SEX takes place there. Then there is the whole "behind closed doors policy" which allows owners of private residential parcels to have sex beds etc in their M rated residential parcels.

 

31 minutes ago, Alexander Vorhees said:

But absolutely never allowed to be nude if its accessible to the public that has only ever been allowed on adult sims.

Again, totally wrong, you really need to read up on this, if you don't know what the rules are, you might break some by mistake and get your factually incorrect ass banned as a result.

 

33 minutes ago, Alexander Vorhees said:

So all those on sl that dont want to comply fine. you will be getting banned cause i have had enough after the almost 2 decades on sl and some of yall cant be decent

You are the one not reading, and do please remember that it was stated by the Glorious Leader him self at the meeting on Monday, that people who constantly file FRAUDULENT Abuse Reports, will be "dealt with".

 

35 minutes ago, Alexander Vorhees said:

o how about you and all the other creepos

Did you know gratuitous abuse like that can get you banned?

 

 

Quote

Moderate content is accessible by all Resident accounts over the age of 18 by default.

18+, not "pg".

 

Quote

Residents in these spaces should therefore expect to see a variety of themes and content. Stores that sell a range of content that includes some "sexy" clothing or objects can generally reside in Moderate rather than Adult regions. Dance clubs that feature "burlesque" acts can also generally reside in Moderate regions as long as they don't promote sexual conduct, for instance through pose balls (whether in "backrooms" or more visible spaces).

 

Other LL pages mention skin stores, with nude skins, and being allowed to try on demos in the store if the owner allows that.

 

 

[Zalificent Corvinus]

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

Not all of us littles are are "toxic" as you put it

When you start demanding that the ADULT avatars that make up the vast majority of the population be punished for the problem your tiny minority causes, that's "Toxic".

 

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

I don't want sympathy, I just want fairness

Punishing the 99% for the sins of some of the 1% isn't fairness, that's demanding destructive revenge.

 

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

I don't think it's right that adults can go on G & M sims and have all their bits exposed, walk around like street walking hookers but when one of us littles comes on an Adult sim or we show a little too much skin, we get banned.

If you are going to talk about that, get your sodding facts right.

Non Sexual nudity is allowed on M rated land, has been for years., M rated does NOT stand for PG-13. Never has..

 

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

If the pedo's and the age players would leave us littles alone, we wouldn't have all these issues.

Heads up. HALF of every illegal ***-play couple ever seen in SL was one of you not-real-children avatars.

Not "victims" but "participants". If your so called community had ratted them out to Governance years ago, things might have been different, but you closed ranks and blamed it all on "filthy adult avatars".

 

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

We get told if we see exposed bodyparts to file an AR so we do that but our AR's go unheard and nothing is done

That tends to happen when you spam FRAUDULENT AR's for non-sexual nudity on M rated regions, because you can't or won't learn facts.

 

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

We have a LOT to say on the topic and we want to be heard. Get over it!

Then maybe you should have commented in the 250+ page monster thread in which all this was discussed to death.

You'd also have seen posts by the Lindens about clarifications on the "modesty panel" requirements for example and links to the revised FAQ, and learned about M rated land not being PG-13.

 

1 hour ago, miranda Sapphire said:

I for one am not "fake"

You are not a real child, you are an adult, over 18, PRETENDING to be a child, hence "fake children".

 

 

Edited May 22 by Zalificent Corvinus

[Alwin Alcott]

3 hours ago, miranda Sapphire said:

Ok, I get it,...

 

[Chery Amore]

Guess it's time to hangout with more popcorn as the rehashing begins. I'd say I'd hate to see another thread about this but it's just too facinating.
Just going to put in here that the alpha layer cuts are an absolute no go now. It was brought up at the Community Roundtable. They weren't throwing it around as talk. It's not going to be allowed as any sort of modesty layer period.
I do take exception to the ranting that it's all "adults" fault. It takes two to tango and do sexualized *****. Looks like they decided to clean up.

[BilliJo Aldrin]

3 hours ago, miranda Sapphire said:

Some of the outfits some of you wear should be for the bedroom only, not for public display and people get sick of seeing it, including adults. You wouldn't dress like that in the real world because you'd be arrested for indecent exposure. Why dress like that in SL? 

 

Because I can 😂

[BilliJo Aldrin]

1 hour ago, Alexander Vorhees said:

This has not been allowed by sl on moderate sim for the last decade learn your *****. any and all adult nudity is to be taken place on adult only , the only thing that can be out on moderate is 1. in the freedom of your on private parcel to be as adult as you want but not on open moderate sims, the most that can be done is the sale of adult animations, furniture, and clothing. But absolutely never allowed to be nude if its accessible to the public that has only ever been allowed on adult sims. So all those on sl that dont want to comply fine. you will be getting banned cause i have had enough after the almost 2 decades on sl and some of yall cant be decent.  the fact that a lot of the so called adults on sl dont read the tos cause then you would read the same thing that tells you not nudity on open moderate sims on private home ones other wise get you ass to a adult sim and when the app launches LL has already put out a warning that if you keep going out of adult regions like that your gone for good. LL is done.  So how about you and all the other creepos stay dressed appropriately when going out or stay on sims your alloud to look like a *****ing hooker. (thats ADULT by the way)

Lets everyone AR everyone else and we can all get banned.

I would never ever go nude on a G sim, THAT is forbidden, but non sexual nudity out on the open on a M sim is allowed.

The hooker look is very popular in SL, what can I say? 😁

[InnerCity Elf]

3 hours ago, miranda Sapphire said:

If we wanted to wear a swim suit (for example) we won't be able to because the modesty layer from pelvis to chest would make it look hideous. You don't make your RL child wear underwear under their bathing suits, why make us? A strip across the breast area is more than fine. And what about the boys? Boys can go without shirts. They don't NEED a modesty layer covering their chests. That's even more lame and stupid!

Well, personally, while obviously, I did not make my RL child, a boy, wear underwear under his bathing suit, but I did make him wear a UV protection swimsuit that only left face, arms from just above elbows and legs from just above knees, because I did not want him to develop skin cancer, and applying and reapplying sunscreen everywhere all the time would have annoyed him far more. He looked very cute, like a mini surfer, and we always had other parents admire it and ask where we got that swimwear (long ago, online shopping wasn't that ubiquitous yet). 

Anyway, from the pics someone kindly posted in this thread, too, it seems that children, girl's included, can still get away with minimal coverage swim wear, so everyone should be happy.

If my own hypothetical SL child would want to wear that, fine, if I were to choose their swim clothes, which, for the younger ones certainly would be more realistic play, actually, they'd not get away with that, a boy would get surfer shorts kind of pants, and a girl some cute wrap skirt stlye bathing suit that would cover her whole rear. Teens could choose themselves, might have to "fight me", though But that'd just be my personal preference, of course.

What I actually wanted to say before I saw the swim wear pics, is about the "modesty layer below swim wear will look hideous issue" - I'm aware that every version of something will be more work, but we're living in a virtual world, after all, and once those additional versions are done, they're done, so, why not make a few choices of "modesty layer" bodys/skins (wherever they need to be incorporated), including some neutralish underwear AND swim wear, which will be able to cover the modesty areas, and ideally be pretty enough that they aren't so hideous that everyone wants to run shopping right away, and has enough time to wait for the child swim wear designers to publish nice things?

[BilliJo Aldrin]

@miranda Sapphire ,Just to make this clear, even though it shouldn't need to be stated again, all the new rules about child avis are NOT to protect kids, They're to mollify LL's new partners, make SL more attractive to whoever buys it,  and to cover LL's butt over legal issues arising from kids engaging in questionable activities

[Coffee Pancake]

2 hours ago, Stephanie Misfit said:

Did we really need another thread on this topic? There are so many already, and this has been discussed over and over.

Linden have no social media reach to inform people of changes. So .. everyone is still finding out, reacting, freaking out, and coming here with questions.

They will be doing that for MONTHS.

"Oh no not this again lets get hostile and territorial" defeats the purpose of the forums, which contrary to local belief, aren't supposed to be an end in and of themselves.

[Sid Nagy]

I can only think of this after all those threads about the by now same old story:

 

[Alwin Alcott]

6 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Linden have no social media reach to inform people of changes. So .. everyone is ...

everyone gets the TOS pop up, so everyone that agrees has read it.
Didn't? Own choice to get in trouble.

 

[Ceka Cianci]

How are people confusing, that a modestly layer cannot be transparent. That it cannot be see through  for that layer itself.

With an alpha layer that hides everything under it and is a separate layer itself?

In other word a modesty layer cannot be transparent to where it shows what's underneath it. 

Where do they say anything about not allowing alpha layers to be worn?

[Coffee Pancake]

16 minutes ago, Alwin Alcott said:

everyone gets the TOS pop up, so everyone that agrees has read it.
Didn't? Own choice to get in trouble.

You keep telling people that.

If you weren't wrong, you wouldn't need to repeat yourself, or even mention it.

But here we are.

[Caitlin Tobias]

5 hours ago, miranda Sapphire said:

Ok, I get it, I understand the need to protect kids.

 

No. It is to protect Second Life.

[Jaylinbridges]

The new TOS agreement only popped up once for me to check the box.  I actually read all the TOS after I logged in, not before, because, well I had a job schedule to meet, and didn't have 2 hours to waste reading more rules before I agreed.  No where did they ask me to agree again after I read them.  And now they tell us they are constantly changing the FAQs as more complaints arrive.  I didn't get a new login screen when they modified the FAQ.  I plead ignorance of the ever changing rules. 

I suggest the new peeps use this argument, and inform LL that their communication technology to all members really sucks.

Edited May 23 by Jaylinbridges