Requesting an LGBTQ+ sub forum.

[Silent Mistwalker]

16 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

You missed the.point of my post...on purpose?

As I've said repeatedly, I have no issue with the proposed sub forum.  Or any of the sub forums I mentioned.  Thinking this or any specific sub forum will be monitored in such a way as to eliminate things that have happened in this thread, is a pipe dream.  LL will more than likely, police said thread as they do all others.  As they see fit.  

The point of my post being...if you allow one, you will have to allow them all.  Closely monitoring 5 or 6 or 10 different sub forums that specifically is asking a lot.  They already do the bare minimum with what they already have.

Please show me where someone has asked for special moderation of the proposed subforum?

[CarlaWetter]

8 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

And therein lies the problem.  If this were the case already, we wouldn't need moderation at all.  Hoping somehow this happens in a dedicated sub forum is...?

A naíve dream indeed. But that's no reason for not trying again and again. You can't give in to trolls and haters as a prophylaxe. Then you just stay where you are, in a white patriarchal society where it's perfectly fine and normal to beat up the minority blamed for the demise of traditions, family and the quality of weather reports until it's quiet again. Somehow I don't like this thinking too much. Weird that I'm sitting here and tell that to you of all people.

[Rowan Amore]

On 4/13/2022 at 2:26 PM, Coffee Pancake said:

I would like to see a clean up focus to moderation in this forum that aims to preserve ongoing discussions between community members.

@Silent MistwalkerIn OP.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 16, 2022 by Rowan Amore

[Silent Mistwalker]

22 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Y'all could volunteer to be moderators..

There'd only be a handful or two of you left. 🤭

[Coffee Pancake]

I honestly think forum moderation wouldn't be an issue, LL are for the most part reactive to reports (rather than proactively policing threads), and it's not like we're expecting a tidal wave to descend on every single thread. The vast majority of the forum will respond the way they have responded to this thread - by not getting involved.

My request in the OP was specifically to address threads getting locked. Favoring clean up and allow the discussion to continue where possible, much like we see in many long standing threads (such as peeves).

[Silent Mistwalker]

4 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

In OP.

 

 

 

 

 

How is that different from the cleanups they already do in all threads?

 

Edit: What was asked, the way I read it, was for LL to not delete threads to just lock or cleanup posts. That isn't any different than what they do now in all sections of the forum.

Edited April 16, 2022 by Silent Mistwalker

[Rowan Amore]

1 minute ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

How is that different from the cleanups they already do in all threads?

It wouldn't be but the request was for moderation more so in the specific sub forum which is my one and only issue.  

[Silent Mistwalker]

3 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

It wouldn't be but the request was for moderation more so in the specific sub forum which is my one and only issue.  

I edited my post. Sorry. Not a ninja today. 

I think you misread what she said. 

Edited April 16, 2022 by Silent Mistwalker

[Rowan Amore]

6 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

I honestly think forum moderation wouldn't be an issue, LL are for the most part reactive to reports (rather than proactively policing threads), and it's not like we're expecting a tidal wave to descend on every single thread. The vast majority of the forum will respond the way they have responded to this thread - by not getting involved.

My request in the OP was specifically to address threads getting locked. Favoring clean up and allow the discussion to continue where possible, much like we see in many long standing threads (such as peeves).

With the more specific explanation of your moderation request, I agree.  Cleaning up is always better, usually, than deletion.   

[Coffee Pancake]

2 minutes ago, Rowan Amore said:

It wouldn't be but the request was for moderation more so in the specific sub forum which is my one and only issue.  

Threads in General or Lifestyles have a far broader interpretation of what considered off topic from a set starting point than many other sub forums, as such threads can get into the weeds with broader range of opinions and that's fine.

[Kathlen Onyx]

30 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

Moderation hasn't been under question since no one wanting the subforum is asking for more or special moderation. Kind of makes the moderation point moot.

 

Wrong.

On 4/13/2022 at 1:26 PM, Coffee Pancake said:

Our threads elsewhere on the forums routinely draw attacks, trolling, transphobia, homophobia and biphobia, causing them to invariably get shut down and locked.

I would like to see a clean up focus to moderation in this forum that aims to preserve ongoing discussions between community members.

From the OP

[Rowan Amore]

3 minutes ago, Sam1 Bellisserian said:

Wrong.

From the OP

She explained more in-depth her request here...

29 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

I honestly think forum moderation wouldn't be an issue, LL are for the most part reactive to reports (rather than proactively policing threads), and it's not like we're expecting a tidal wave to descend on every single thread. The vast majority of the forum will respond the way they have responded to this thread - by not getting involved.

My request in the OP was specifically to address threads getting locked. Favoring clean up and allow the discussion to continue where possible, much like we see in many long standing threads (such as peeves).

 

[Paul Hexem]

32 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

Moderation hasn't been under question since no one wanting the subforum is asking for more or special moderation. Kind of makes the moderation point moot.

No, you're right, no one is asking for special moderation. The thing is, the suggested reasons for this proposed subforum would require different moderation than we see from LL currently, or it's just General but with troll mode dialed up. 

Imagine fishing in an ocean vs fishing in a small curated pond where your bait is guaranteed to land in front of the fish.

It's perfectly reasonable to question if LL is up to the task, whether you agree or disagree with the content. We're 16 pages in here, and haven't seen anything from them.

[So Whimsy]

1 hour ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Y'all could volunteer to be moderators..

[Sid Nagy]

@Paul Hexem There is not much to moderate in this thread IMHO.
Having different opinions about something and discuss it is one of the main purposes of a discussion forum, besides sharing information, no?

Edited April 16, 2022 by Sid Nagy

[So Whimsy]

43 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

 

My request in the OP was specifically to address threads getting locked. Favoring clean up and allow the discussion to continue where possible, much like we see in many long standing threads (such as peeves).

Unfortunately, the fact that the mods don't do this as it is, speaks volumes of their work ethic. Doing the bare minimum by simply locking a thread instead of cleaning it up

[Paul Hexem]

2 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

@Paul Hexem There is not much to moderate in this thread IMHO.
Having different opinions about something and discuss it is one of the main purposes of a discussion forum, no?

And yet we've already seen accusations of trolling and worse flung at the differing opinions.

[Silent Mistwalker]

2 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

the suggested reasons for this proposed subforum would require different moderation than we see from LL currently, or it's just General but with troll mode dialed up. 

How so? What would have to be different? Can you name 5 specific things that would have to change just to add one subforum somewhere?

The trolling isn't going to get any worse or better due to a subforum being added. That's really reaching. Unless you are stating that because of the LGTB+ that would use the subforum the usual trolls will be more inclined to attack and invite their friends to attack? When has that kind of thing not happened on these forums?

If the ones who are so adamantly opposed to it were to stop and think through their objections, they'd soon realize they aren't objecting for the reasons they have stated. Some of us can see through all that.

[Coffee Pancake]

Just now, So Whimsy said:

Unfortunately, the fact that the mods don't do this as it is, speaks volumes of their work ethic. Doing the bare minimum by simply locking a thread instead of cleaning it up

I think that's more a case of threads ending up too far gone, my only real ask is that they might step in sooner due to the tighter topic of an LGBTQ+ sub forum, much like they already do on many other more focused forums.

 

[Sid Nagy]

25 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

And yet we've already seen accusations of trolling and worse flung at the differing opinions.

If one finds that disagreeing is the same as trolling, that is not a problem of a forum moderator, is it?
Nor should the other posters take that stance too seriously.

The unique thing of internet forums is, that people from all over the world, with different cultural and lingual backgrounds can discuss with each other. That is a handicap at the same time as well.
Although all communicate in English here, that doesn't mean per definition that we all get our messages expressed in the way we intend it all the time.
 

Praise the forces that I don't have to moderate for a living.

Edited April 16, 2022 by Sid Nagy

[Paul Hexem]

55 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

How so?

I said it literally in that post- it's a curated location for trolls to get the results they want.

56 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

The trolling isn't going to get any worse or better due to a subforum being added. 

That's my point exactly. If it's not going to change anything, we don't need it. If it is, that can only happen through moderation- which brings us back to the special moderation argument.

[Paul Hexem]

52 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

much like they already do on many other more focused forums.

I haven't seen them do that. Have they really?

[Silent Mistwalker]

7 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

I said it literally in that post- it's a curated location for trolls to get the results they want.

That's my point exactly. If it's not going to change anything, we don't need it. If it is, that can only happen through moderation- which brings us back to the special moderation argument.

Please stop with the circular reasoning fallacy.

I'm just tired of people thinking I fall for them just because I don't bother to rebut them. 

Edited April 17, 2022 by Silent Mistwalker

[Coffee Pancake]

11 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

That's my point exactly. If it's not going to change anything, we don't need it. If it is, that can only happen through moderation- which brings us back to the special moderation argument.

But it changes everything. An LGBTQ+ forum is not intended to act as a replacement for General or Lifestyles where all views and topics are granted equal standing. It provides a specific place to raise LGBTQ+ topics without the room to debate the existence or validity of an individuals identity & experiences from a *phobic or culture war stand point.

Expressly LGBTQ+ spaces are important.

[Kathlen Onyx]

1 hour ago, Coffee Pancake said:

It provides a specific place to raise LGBTQ+ topics without the room to debate the existence or validity of an individuals identity & experiences from a *phobic or culture war stand point.

 

So in other words...control what people post. Who will be determining what is considered a *phobic or culture war stand point?