Do you think people look down on "traditional" femininity?

[Arielle Popstar]

3 hours ago, Bree Giffen said:

People of any sex or gender can be toxic, people of any race can be toxic, why can't we just define toxicity as simply toxicity instead of bringing in race, sex and gender.

That is a good point especially in light of something I learned years ago in that toxic people tend to pick toxic people to be in relationship with. An emotionally healthy woman is not going to pick an emotionally dysfunctional man and vice versa, so for every toxically masculine man, the average says there is a toxically feminine woman who is going to hook up with him.

[Arielle Popstar]

48 minutes ago, Gopi Passiflora said:

I didn't intend for this to be trolling...it was a topic that just came to mind when I looked up the term "femininity" on Google.

Think it was *****posting about supposed *****posting. Toxic I tell ya!

[Luna Bliss]

1 hour ago, Arielle Popstar said:

5 hours ago, Bree Giffen said:

People of any sex or gender can be toxic, people of any race can be toxic, why can't we just define toxicity as simply toxicity instead of bringing in race, sex and gender.

That is a good point especially in light of something I learned years ago in that toxic people tend to pick toxic people to be in relationship with. An emotionally healthy woman is not going to pick an emotionally dysfunctional man and vice versa, so for every toxically masculine man, the average says there is a toxically feminine woman who is going to hook up with him.

Sometimes people do pick a romantic partner who is at the same toxic level, but sometimes they have no idea they got involved with a severely toxic person. There are highly manipulative people who don't show their cards until months into a relationship, and they hide their disfunction very well. I don't want these people who are victims to be blamed for their victimization.

But we're not just talking about people in romantic relationships -- after all, not all people are involved in a relationship, and the number of people living alone keeps increasing.

I'd like to be able to not worry about keeping my door locked, or feel fear when I look at the house across the street where a r-a-p-e took place.  I love to walk in the moonlight, but that's simply not safe unless I have a walking partner.

I found a nice park to walk at with private woodsy places along the trail, but then I saw on the news a woman was raped there in broad daylight. So I can't go there anymore. I'm forced to walk the streets in daylight with dangerous and noisy traffic, because at least I'm safe.

Once again, I say this not to trash men or say they're all bad and the only ones responsible for all abuse -- but it's a fact that they are the ones who perpetrate the most violent forms.  We have to know the state of our society in all its details to alleviate the problems that all types of abuse, perpetrated by all types of people, inflicts on society. Abuse is abuse...but the forms differ according to gender, and sometimes race.

Next...after I finish some work...toxic femininity...https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/sex-sexuality-and-romance/201908/toxic-femininity

[Nick0678]

3 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

I'd like to be able to not worry about keeping my door locked, or feel fear when I look at the house across the street where a r-a-p-e took place.  I love to walk in the moonlight, but that's simply not safe unless I have a walking partner.

What you describe that you want to do has to do with criminality and policing. Even if you were a man knowing martial arts it would be unsafe to "walk under the moonlight" (depending on where you live of course).. Regarding the locked door, keep it locked. Even here at my place where criminality is very low a 60 years old man was found brutally murdered in his house 3 weeks ago. 

[Lindal Kidd]

17 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

they are the ones who perpetrate the most violent forms

Because they can.

There was a movie recently, "Promising Young Woman" in which a woman seeks revenge on those who done her wrong. It's scary largely because it turns the trope of the male perpetrating violence on its head.

[Luna Bliss]

18 minutes ago, Nick0678 said:

35 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

I'd like to be able to not worry about keeping my door locked, or feel fear when I look at the house across the street where a r-a-p-e took place.  I love to walk in the moonlight, but that's simply not safe unless I have a walking partner.

What you describe that you want to do has to do with criminality and policing. Even if you were a man knowing martial arts it would be unsafe to "walk under the moonlight" (depending on where you live of course).. Regarding the locked door, keep it locked. Even here at my place where criminality is very low a 60 years old man was found brutally murdered in his house 3 weeks ago. 

I'm talking about r-a-p-e and not homicide. Men, for the most part, don't have to worry about that.

Why do so many men feel they are superior to women, and that women should be owned?  That is the question, and the source of why women are looked down on and taken advantage of.

[Nick0678]

35 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Abuse is abuse...but the forms differ according to gender, and sometimes race.

Yes. Check this story..

https://www.keeptalkinggreece.com/2021/09/30/vitriol-attack-victim-ioanna-testimony-court-trial/

 

[Luna Bliss]

23 minutes ago, Lindal Kidd said:

44 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

they are the ones who perpetrate the most violent forms

Because they can.

There was a movie recently, "Promising Young Woman" in which a woman seeks revenge on those who done her wrong. It's scary largely because it turns the trope of the male perpetrating violence on its head.

Yes, I liked that movie. I think it showed very well what happens to women who are r-a-p-e-d, how in many cases their 'soul' is stolen and they never quite recover.  Yes, the revenge at the end felt very justified.

I don't know though, if men perpetrate this just "because they can" (I assume you mean because they have the upper hand in strength and body size). I can't imagine women doing this.

I think there's deeper reasons...like the gender roles and stereotypes I've mentioned that give men permission to commit such atrocities.

Edited October 25, 2021 by Luna Bliss

[Nick0678]

1 minute ago, Luna Bliss said:

I'm talking about r-a-p-e and not homicide. Men, for the most part, don't have to worry about that.

If your only worry is r-a-p-e, you will eventually be found dead, keep the door locked and avoid moonlight walks since it's not safe where you live.

[Luna Bliss]

2 minutes ago, Nick0678 said:

6 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

I'm talking about r-a-p-e and not homicide. Men, for the most part, don't have to worry about that.

If your only worry is r-a-p-e, you will eventually be found dead, keep the door locked and avoid moonlight walks since it's not safe where you live.

I'm not just talking about me though. I don't know why so many women have to endure this. Something is terribly wrong with our society and we need to change it. Nobody should have to live in fear.

I do believe we can change it some.  Hoping anyway. It starts with awareness...with everyone becoming aware of just how many women are victimized. For so long it's been swept under the rug.

[Rowan Amore]

1 hour ago, Luna Bliss said:

Why do so many men feel they are superior to women, and that women should be owned?  

I really hate to.mention it but have you looked at women in SL?  Do you think their 'need to find an owner' mindset translates to.their RL?  How many women feel 'loved' when their partner wants them all to their selves?  I'm not one to blame anyone for violence perpetrated against them but how often do people put themselves into a position, men or women, because they think it's love and not possession?  Many women in SL feed the need for the man to feel superior.

A quote I've had in my profile for ages...

“Love and respect woman. Look to her not only for comfort, but for strength and inspiration and the doubling of your intellectual and moral powers. Blot out from your mind any idea of superiority; you have none.".         ~ Giuseppe Mazzini

[Nick0678]

,

Edited October 26, 2021 by Nick0678

[Nick0678]

  

2 hours ago, Luna Bliss said:

I'm not just talking about me though. I don't know why so many women have to endure this. Something is terribly wrong with our society and we need to change it. Nobody should have to live in fear.

I do believe we can change it some.  Hoping anyway. It starts with awareness...with everyone becoming aware of just how many women are victimized. For so long it's been swept under the rug.

Why rapists ra-p-e? Why murderers kill ? Why thieves steal? We are talking about criminals. 

We have laws that forbid all those actions but some people choose to not obey and do as they like.

There is good and there is evil and it has been like this since forever.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

34 minutes ago, Nick0678 said:

  

Why rapists ra-p-e? Why murderers kill ? Why thieves steal? We are talking about criminals. 

We have laws that forbid all those actions but some people choose to not obey and do as they like.

There is good and there is evil and it has been like this since forever.

Why is it that the vast majority of r*pists, regardless of the identity of their victims, are men? Why is it that, in even the most "developed" and "liberal" countries, women are between 3 and 5 times more likely to be murdered by their partners than men are?

It's not because men are "evil" or inherently more violent. They aren't. There is certainly evidence linking testosterone with particularly aggressive behaviours, and yet the vast majority of men manage not to commit such acts.

This isn't about genetics. It's about social conditioning, and the social construction of a kind of toxic masculinity that validates and even encourages violence. And it's precisely the same culture that has produced laws against r*pe that has produced the conditions that encourage its prevalence. (For a very very long time, r*pe committed against women was defined primarily by the damage it caused to men -- husbands or fathers -- who had a financial stake in the sexual "purity" of the women under their control.)

When you identify a disease, an important first step in determining a cure is to nail down its characteristics, to define it. Well, we can do that in this case: we have statistical evidence that violence by males is, on the whole, not only more prevalent, but different than that perpetrated by women. (Men, for instance, are statistically more likely to use firearms, and their violence is much more likely to be lethal.) A next step is discovering the pathology -- what causes this?

Simply shrugging off an easily identifiable kind of toxic social behaviour as the work of "criminals" is a bit like suggesting that cancer is just a disease, and should be treated like any other disease.

Edited October 26, 2021 by Scylla Rhiadra

[Scylla Rhiadra]

One of the truly amazing things about SL from its inception has been the freedom it has afforded its users to build for themselves the kind of identities that seem most authentic to them. The fact that the disclosure of RL details about someone else is a violation of the ToS and CS, toothless though it may be in reality, is of enormous importance on a symbolic level, because it underscores the degree to which individuals are empowered by the platform to represent how they wish to represent, free of the constraints imposed by RL biology and culture.

Every act of self-representation here is a kind of "performance": choosing to wear such and such a body, or this style of clothing, choosing to communicate this interest or that, or represent one perspective or another. And in that sense, identity here is dynamic and ever-changing: we express ourselves not in a static way, but by being what feels most authentic to us about ourselves.

And that can change. Many people here have different avatars that they use to represent different sides of themselves, different self-identities. I am relatively static here myself: I am pretty much always representing what I am in RL, a cishet white woman. But even I make choices, within those self-imposed constraints, that "change" who I am. I have folders of outfits that are theoretically organized by "type" of garment, but that more realistically represent particular moods, particular modes of self-representation. I can be grungy and urban one day, and ultra-feminine the next. Indeed, I can represent as three or four different "Scyllas" within the space of single log-in.

And, actually, in that sense SL mirrors, or maybe clarifies a reality about RL too, because there also we are always performing who we are. In some cases, as in my own, the differences in performances, in self-representations, might be relatively subtle and nuanced. In other instances, the transformations can be radical. It is entirely conceivable that someone who is gender neutral one day, might be male the next, and female on subsequent days. Possibly you only ever make love to people of one particular biological sex, but that doesn't mean that you can't, at the same time, be bisexual. We are what we do, and the enormous open potential for any of us to choose alternate performance, and so alternate identities, is there in RL too.

So, I'm not actually sure how useful it is to define ourselves in a static way: "this is the kind of person I am." And that's particularly true because most often how we represent -- "masculine," "feminine," "gay," or whatever -- are scripted by our culture. When I say I am sometimes "ultra-feminine," I really mean that I am performing in a way that our society has decided is "ultra-feminine." Wearing makeup, flipping my hair, coyly posing, choosing frilly or close-fitting dresses; these are performances that have all been arbitrarily assigned to "the feminine." They are cultural markers, not genetic or biological ones, and they are in that sense not really "me" in a fundamental sense: they are part of a performance in which I choose to engage.

And I love how SL has made this aspect of identity, its dynamic, ever-changing, empowering power, so much more evident. And little by little, slowly and painfully, we are beginning to embrace this kind of enabling, self-determined power in RL as well.

TL;DR -- I am not one kind of person only. I am a multitude. Catch me on a bad day, and I'll demonstrate.

Edited October 26, 2021 by Scylla Rhiadra

[Nick0678]

You already know the answer.

That happens because men are physically stronger than women. Those actions you described are crimes,  people who do crimes are criminals.

In the same "developed" countries, when it comes to parent killings, women are similarly able to commit murder against their children.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

26 minutes ago, Nick0678 said:

That happens because men are physically stronger than women.

Shotguns are great equalizers, Nick: they don't require greater physical strength. And yet, interestingly, it is men much more often than women who employ firearms in intimate partner homicide.

Are men also more biologically adept at pulling triggers?

[Nick0678]

16 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Shotguns are great equalizers, Nick: they don't require greater physical strength. And yet, interestingly, it is men much more often than women who employ firearms in intimate partner homicide.

Are men also more biologically adept at pulling triggers?

Like i said all those are criminal acts. Regardless of gender, race or age anyone who decides to do the crime should be put to jail and do the time.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

19 minutes ago, Nick0678 said:

Like i said all those are criminal acts. Regardless of gender, race or age anyone who decides to do the crime should be put to jail and do the time.

Well, I think we can agree that all criminals should be subject to the law. But that wasn't what I asked you, was it? You claimed that there was more statistically verifiable male violence because men were physically stronger, and I noted that much of the violence has nothing do with physical strength. And you apparently have nothing to say in response to that?

I'm not going to argue on this further, as I doubt that there is any point. For one thing, these posts are quite likely to be deleted tomorrow by the mods; LL doesn't like this kind of conversation when it gets too "real" and gritty.

And, more to the point, you seem to have decided that male violence is just kind of "natural" (it's because men are stronger!) and part of the "order of things," and, despite implicitly acknowledging that there is a gendered imbalance here, you seem pretty ok with that.

I'll just leave you with a bit of an appeal. Historically, society has, in the past, identified a great many injustices, built around racism, sexism, homophobia, etc., that it has sought to address. It has by no means done so perfectly, but there have been incremental improvements. And those have only happened because we acknowledged the problems, and agreed, collectively, to address them, not as generic "crimes," but as culturally and contextually specific problems with specific root causes that can be tackled.

Take a moment, please, to consider the victims, and not just the perpetrators. I'm pretty sure I am safe from violence from my own RL significant other, but the fact is that I, as a woman, am much more likely to die at the hands of my partner than is a man, despite the laws that you cite.

Does that not bother you? Shouldn't it? Why doesn't it?

Edited October 26, 2021 by Scylla Rhiadra
Clarity

[Eggy UwU]

10 hours ago, PermaRuthed said:

It's more than just looking down on femininity.  Society outright hates females and we're already past the point where we got women and girls internalizing misogyny within themselves and spreading it further outwards. There is just no winning with this world where simply existing as a female is a catch-22 with no sweet spot for approval of our existence.

 

 

this is beyond true.
i just wish people could mind their business. nuff said. lmao.

[Ceka Cianci]

Wanna see someone look like a deer caught in headlights?

See what happens when a guy goes to slap your ass and feels a holster.. hehehe

[BjorJlen]

13 hours ago, Luna Bliss said:

It's great you managed to get so in touch with your feelings.  You know I actually thought you were a woman until you mentioned your gender!

   Holy... crap...! 😲
   You actually thought I was a... woman...? Like... wow. I'm not taking this bad or with offence mind you, but I am a bit surprised to be honest. Why would you think that exactly if I may ask? Is it because I am a unique person who does not fit into any stereotypes, or is it because you think I communicate here like a "woman" would? If it's the former, cool, but if it is the latter, that don't speak very highly of the men you have encountered in your life, or the women whom you might be "profiling" or stereotyping inadvertently.
   Men, guys, come in all forms, minds, hearts, and sizes Luna, just like you awesome women. Which is why I dislike labels of any kind, even though I have used them myself from time to time. It tends to put things in a box so to speak, and speaking of myself only, I like thinking and living outside the box. Now I am NOT in any way feeling disrespected by your words Luna, please believe me on that. It just confuses me is all (which is easy I know lol). So please clarify if you can, for curiosity sakes.
   Otherwise I might have to beat my chest like a dumb caveman and act like a ape to show you I'm a guy lol (cause isn't that the viewpoint sometimes too with some people? lol 😉).

Peace...

[Maryanne Solo]

This household, (two entirely separate residences), which I share with one sister and mother is of course, all female.
Much to the chargrin of "innocent" salespersons attempting to spruik their wonky wares or guys enquiring about two
unused, but number plated and excellent condition vehicles we don't use anymore at the front of the property.
The plentiful number of advanced security system cameras give me a heads-up and out I go in full "wtf are you doing here!?"
mode quoting this law, that law, or "Oh my brother knows about that he can be here in two minutes but he WONT be happy 😛
and the Police area commanders name lol.
Works a treat. (simple weapons hidden here and there too, just in case).
 

[Nick0678]

6 hours ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Does that not bother you? Shouldn't it? Why doesn't it?

Yes criminals bother me. All those are criminal acts, any person who performs such criminal acts  regardless of gender, race, age or social status should be handed over to the Police and taken to court.

(btw regardless of the crime performed i am against capital punishment)

[Nick0678]

6 hours ago, Ceka Cianci said:

Wanna see someone look like a deer caught in headlights?

See what happens when a guy goes to slap your ass and feels a holster.. hehehe

I am sure they are surprised but those are just silly a**holes.

(When it comes to personal protection, practicing martial arts is also a good idea, usually a fight doesn't last long so it's good to know how to react.)