rent land-fraud

[Hultaj]

hello

I paid for the land rent 14.01.21 no reaction from the plot owner (http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Astarte/4/78/30)

Despite the fact that I wrote no answer several times,what should i do in this case?

I wrote to the support, then answer

 

Thank you for contacting us and for your patience. We are sorry to hear that you've had an issue with a transaction with another Second Life user. 

 

The Second Life economy functions on connections between resident-creators and resident-customers such as yourself. Much as the Internet allows customers to find the products they want, Second Life exists to allow individuals to share their creations and services with those who wish to purchase and enjoy them. As a result, the transaction between residents is a personal one—direct and without a middle man. When purchasing content or making other transactions, including land rentals, within Second Life, you, as a customer, create an agreement with the person from whom you've purchased. As such, the only person who can assist with the product or service that you've purchased is the other party in your agreement—the seller.

 

Contacting the Resident directly is the best and only way to resolve a problem with a purchased item or service. Please be certain to do so as soon as possible.

 

Best Regards,

[Rowan Amore]

1 hour ago, Hultaj said:

hello

I paid for the land rent 14.01.21 no reaction from the plot owner (http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Astarte/4/78/30)

Despite the fact that I wrote no answer several times,what should i do in this case?

I wrote to the support, then answer

 

Thank you for contacting us and for your patience. We are sorry to hear that you've had an issue with a transaction with another Second Life user. 

 

The Second Life economy functions on connections between resident-creators and resident-customers such as yourself. Much as the Internet allows customers to find the products they want, Second Life exists to allow individuals to share their creations and services with those who wish to purchase and enjoy them. As a result, the transaction between residents is a personal one—direct and without a middle man. When purchasing content or making other transactions, including land rentals, within Second Life, you, as a customer, create an agreement with the person from whom you've purchased. As such, the only person who can assist with the product or service that you've purchased is the other party in your agreement—the seller.

 

Contacting the Resident directly is the best and only way to resolve a problem with a purchased item or service. Please be certain to do so as soon as possible.

 

Best Regards,

Does the land show as owned(rented) by you in the about land tab?  If so, you may have to wait for them to come online if you're having a problem.  

[LittleMe Jewell]

1 hour ago, Hultaj said:

hello

I paid for the land rent 14.01.21 no reaction from the plot owner (http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Astarte/4/78/30)

Despite the fact that I wrote no answer several times,what should i do in this case?

I wrote to the support, then answer

 [ Support ticket response] ]]

Yep.  LL does not get involved in Resident to Resident stuff.  It pretty much is "Buyer Beware".

Did you read the landlord's profile carefully in case they have special instructions for contacting them?  You can continue trying to contact the landlord or simply accept the lost money and move on.

[Hultaj]

I tried contact several times to no avail

[Hultaj]

32 minutes ago, RowanMinx said:

Czy ziemia jest wyświetlana jako należąca do Ciebie (wynajęta) na karcie Informacje o gruntach? Jeśli tak, być może będziesz musiał poczekać, aż przejdą do trybu online, jeśli masz problem.  

I've been waiting for a week

[Rowan Amore]

Did you get a group invite when you paid for the land?  It does say you will be sent one as soon as you paid. 

[MoiraKathleen]

2 hours ago, Hultaj said:

hello

I paid for the land rent 14.01.21 no reaction from the plot owner (http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Astarte/4/78/30)

Despite the fact that I wrote no answer several times,what should i do in this case?

You could try contacting the owner of the group that owns that parcel (If you go to the parcel and look at the "About Land" you will see the link of the group, and clicking on that will bring up the group profile showing the owner of the group, which is a different person in this case than the owner of the rental box).  It's a private group, so you won't be able to join or see other info about the group, but the group owner is always displayed with a link to their profile.   (If the group owner was the one you contacted, then try contacting the owner of the rental box, instead.)

It's possible that the owner has become ill or had some other RL issue that has kept him from logging in.  It's also possible that they are new at land renting and didn't set up everything correctly that they should have.  It looks like they created their own rental box, which is not bad in itself, but they need to have the scripting in it to redisplay as rented once someone has paid rental, a way for the renter to either join the land group or an automated system for adding the renter and sending the group invite, and so forth.  

It's always good when renting from someone for the very first time to only pay 1 weeks worth of rent - that way, if it doesn't work out, you're only out the lindens for 1 week.  I'm not sure how you came across this particular rental, but you might want to check in the   Parcels for Rent: Mainland - Second Life Community section of the forums.  Check the profiles of those renting out land - if it is their main purpose, you will see info in their profile and profile picks about their rental business, how to contact them, the location of their main rental office if they have one, and so on.  The more info available about their rental business, the better I would feel about the legitimacy of their rental business practices (but still, only pay for 1 week at first). 

 

Edited January 21, 2021 by MoiraKathleen
changed 'bad' to 'not bad'

[Rowan Amore]

41 minutes ago, MoiraKathleen said:

You could try contacting the owner of the group that owns that parcel (If you go to the parcel and look at the "About Land" you will see the link of the group, and clicking on that will bring up the group profile showing the owner of the group, which is a different person in this case than the owner of the rental box).  It's a private group, so you won't be able to join or see other info about the group, but the group owner is always displayed with a link to their profile.   (If the group owner was the one you contacted, then try contacting the owner of the rental box, instead.)

It's possible that the owner has become ill or had some other RL issue that has kept him from logging in.  It's also possible that they are new at land renting and didn't set up everything correctly that they should have.  It looks like they created their own rental box, which is not bad in itself, but they need to have the scripting in it to redisplay as rented once someone has paid rental, a way for the renter to either join the land group or an automated system for adding the renter and sending the group invite, and so forth.  

It's always good when renting from someone for the very first time to only pay 1 weeks worth of rent - that way, if it doesn't work out, you're only out the lindens for 1 week.  I'm not sure how you came across this particular rental, but you might want to check in the   Parcels for Rent: Mainland - Second Life Community section of the forums.  Check the profiles of those renting out land - if it is their main purpose, you will see info in their profile and profile picks about their rental business, how to contact them, the location of their main rental office if they have one, and so on.  The more info available about their rental business, the better I would feel about the legitimacy of their rental business practices (but still, only pay for 1 week at first). 

 

I stopped by the parcel and the name said "Legit Rentals".  Right there made me wonder.

[Hultaj]

ani właściciel działki, ani założyciel grupy nie są dostępni.I wrote to each of them several times,unfortunately not all are honest.

Thank you for all your help and best regards

 

[MoiraKathleen]

Just now, RowanMinx said:

I stopped by the parcel and the name said "Legit Rentals".  Right there made me wonder.

Yes. I stopped by there also - and the land group is different than the business name, and different than the owner of the rental box, and the land group was private with only 2 members - a lot of things that would make me wary.

[Polenth Yue]

Sometimes you'll find the remains of rentals from defunct companies on the mainland. It's a good idea to contact the owners to ask a question before you rent. The question can be anything, like if they have any rules about what you build that you need to know about or something based on the posted rules. Whether they answer tells you if they're active and how they answer gives you a feel for whether you really want to rent from them.

Once you've paid, there's nothing you can do if they turn out to be inactive.

[Axel Naxos]

Unfortunately a quick search and you would not fall for it.
My opinion is that the land is abandoned waiting for LL to retake it.
Both members of the group do not have payment information.
Rental is very mediocre and has the name "object" and its script called "script".
The worse the presentation of the service offered, always doubt!
The price is out of market standards!
Although I live in a place that is also cheap, the owner is known in the community, uses a quality rental system. It doesn't have to be the most famous! Make it clear!

[iamyourneighbour]

Always rent via Casperlet boxes only

I have smartbots invite. I used to do manual invites which proved infeasible, people will 100% rent from you when you are away, the bots aren't that expensive always use smartbots

Edited January 27, 2021 by iamyourneighbour

[Prokofy Neva]

On 1/26/2021 at 8:38 PM, iamyourneighbour said:

Always rent via Casperlet boxes only

I have smartbots invite. I used to do manual invites which proved infeasible, people will 100% rent from you when you are away, the bots aren't that expensive always use smartbots

I never use Casperlet:

o Too many unnecessary scripts.

o They have access to all your information and your customers.

o They break down fairly often and paralyze business.

I use an open source script that has been modified and adapted many times and holds up fairly well.

If you mean a bot that has to be logged on land, then that's taking up an avatar space. That's one reason I don't use them, plus

People can join an OPEN group on their own with group joiners. You can set permissions so that they can immediately start building so they aren't waiting a day for a landlord to come on to send them an invitation, nor do you have to use a more complicated (and vulnerable to breakdown) system. Then you add powers to them so that they themselves can then turn off build for everyone, control the ban list, etc.

While they idea is compelling of having your rentals ka-ching all day without your presence, eventually some tenants need attention.

 

[Jules Catlyn]

1 hour ago, Prokofy Neva said:

I never use Casperlet:

o Too many unnecessary scripts.

o They have access to all your information and your customers.

o They break down fairly often and paralyze business.

- The system uses literally one script per meter/box

-Caspertech does NOT have access to all user info and what info they do have falls under the GDPR regulation https://blog.caspertech.co.uk/gdpr-is-coming-and-it-affects-you/?fbclid=IwAR2N9LIo3N03va74wtfgZW47d45bn-fUBMTt6jkE4tOlmMByOBGf23DPzvA

-What would you consider fairly often? A handful of occasions in the time i have been with them. Which is since 2015

Caspertech is more reliable than most Linden Lab systems. And this with only one developer/owner and a crew of volunteers for customer support. I know you have your opinions but they are mostly based on assumptions created in your own mind and less on facts.

[Prokofy Neva]

5 hours ago, Jules Catlyn said:

- The system uses literally one script per meter/box

-Caspertech does NOT have access to all user info and what info they do have falls under the GDPR regulation https://blog.caspertech.co.uk/gdpr-is-coming-and-it-affects-you/?fbclid=IwAR2N9LIo3N03va74wtfgZW47d45bn-fUBMTt6jkE4tOlmMByOBGf23DPzvA

-What would you consider fairly often? A handful of occasions in the time i have been with them. Which is since 2015

Caspertech is more reliable than most Linden Lab systems. And this with only one developer/owner and a crew of volunteers for customer support. I know you have your opinions but they are mostly based on assumptions created in your own mind and less on facts.

Do you work for Caspertech? 

I think it's more than fine that if someone is touting them, that they can also be criticized.

1. One script per box of this type of script, multiplied by many on a sim, means more lag. I have checked this with script radars.

2. It's not about access to user info, which is what GDPR regulates in the UK. That's not the point AT ALL. It's about access to BUSINESS info -- how many customers, where, at what location. GDPR does not regulate THAT inside a virtual world economy! Anyone with that information can corner the market in the land business or other various content businesses and benefit from the information. We have only their word that they don't. 

I have asked Caspertech directly about this and been told that it doesn't matter, they don't look at this flow of information  -- but they don't deny they have access to it.

I should note that even before I asked Caspertech about this, for reasons that are obscure, the maker put my name in all the ban lists of his teleporters as a "sample griefer". I encountered this when I went to shops I have gone to for years and spent thousands of Lindens. The shop owners were puzzled to discover this and removed my name. I confronted Capertech with this egregious abuse and they claimed to withdraw it. But it's damn weird, as everyone can agree. I still occasionally encounter this ban on TPs. Obviously I'm not a griefer, I have been in business for 16 years. 

The economy in SL should not be hostage to just one monopolist, even if that monopolist has a good product that most people like. This is a demonstrable fact, and not an opinion "created in my own mind". The Lindens should think more about what this mean. It might even make sense for the Lindens to take over the function of vendors for this very reason, or at least provide an alternative. The reason I don't recommend this is because they might be tended to put a tax into such a function. They took over the LindEx, and the Marketplace, and this may make sense as well. Some of the outages are caused by the same real-world outages that affect everyone and LL as well. But not all.

No economy should have only one vendor, it's not normal and contains inherent problems. 

Edited January 28, 2021 by Prokofy Neva

[Wulfie Reanimator]

3 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

1. One script per box of this type of script, multiplied by many on a sim, means more lag. I have checked this with script radars.

You've just explained the system you currently use.

[Prokofy Neva]

46 minutes ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

You've just explained the system you currently use.

And you should know personally the type of system I use.

If your snarky point is that Casper doesn't have a script in every box (that's not what I've seen, but whatever) but ties to the web instead -- see my other point, about providing your business information to this company. I don't see that I need to do that, or that it's a good thing for anyone.

It's good when there is competition with different choices. That's not the situation we have now with a monopoly.

[Love Zhaoying]

Can I opt-out from rent fraud? I mean, it doesn't sound much fun.

[Wulfie Reanimator]

45 minutes ago, Prokofy Neva said:

And you should know personally the type of system I use.

If your snarky point is that Casper doesn't have a script in every box (that's not what I've seen, but whatever) but ties to the web instead -- see my other point, about providing your business information to this company. I don't see that I need to do that, or that it's a good thing for anyone.

It's good when there is competition with different choices. That's not the situation we have now with a monopoly.

That's right, I do know personally the type of system you use, because I've rented from you.

My snarky comment is not to say that CasperTech doesn't have a script in every box. It does, you're correct.

My snarky comment is to say that the rental system you yourself use does, just the same as CasperTech, have a script in every box. You were implying that CasperTech was more laggy because it needed a script in every box, but clearly they are the same on that aspect.

I absolutely agree that competition is good.

Edited January 28, 2021 by Wulfie Reanimator

[Prokofy Neva]

20 hours ago, Wulfie Reanimator said:

That's right, I do know personally the type of system you use, because I've rented from you.

My snarky comment is not to say that CasperTech doesn't have a script in every box. It does, you're correct.

My snarky comment is to say that the rental system you yourself use does, just the same as CasperTech, have a script in every box. You were implying that CasperTech was more laggy because it needed a script in every box, but clearly they are the same on that aspect.

I absolutely agree that competition is good.

You of all people as a scripter should grasp that scripts have different usages of time, and hence some can be laggier than others. Lag is cumulative as you know.

So go and measure the script times of different rental systems and I won't have to keep explaining this.

PS Just re-confirmed this. Go and take any measurements you like. Sometimes scripts have different times on different channels of the Lindens code. I don't know why that is. It's not that they are in different states. In the same state. You'd have to do a lot more investigation. But the variation is not that huge, and even with that, you can draw the conclusions.

Edited January 29, 2021 by Prokofy Neva

[Theresa Tennyson]

On 1/28/2021 at 12:32 AM, Prokofy Neva said:

People can join an OPEN group on their own with group joiners. You can set permissions so that they can immediately start building so they aren't waiting a day for a landlord to come on to send them an invitation, nor do you have to use a more complicated (and vulnerable to breakdown) system.

 

And you never, ever have problems with griefers taking advantage of the open group to rezz offensive statues of you either.

[Prokofy Neva]

45 minutes ago, Theresa Tennyson said:

And you never, ever have problems with griefers taking advantage of the open group to rezz offensive statues of you either.

Very seldom. It's vastly exaggerated. I wouldn't be in business for 16 years if it was as pervasive as you imagine or wish, in fact, against me. Interesting that you should focus on the statues. Something you know you're not telling? In any event, I have not seen those grotesques statues of my RL self in various poses of death and destruction for some 3 years now. Of course, you can always whistle and make them come back. But it's easy enough to return them and AR them. Eventually the accounts and alts are banned.

The convenience of joining and starting to decorate right away, invite your friends over and have them help you, and not queue up waiting for a dilatory landlord to come online, your meter running -- this far, far outweighs the rare griever, who is easily enough dealt with.

[bigmoe Whitfield]

what lag? you are not physically lagging the server side at all.    but hey,  whom am I,  yep I'm the guy that spent years learning and studying with real impacts to sim performance to gain info about how and what affected sims.  

[Prokofy Neva]

10 minutes ago, bigmoe Whitfield said:

what lag? you are not physically lagging the server side at all.    but hey,  whom am I,  yep I'm the guy that spent years learning and studying with real impacts to sim performance to gain info about how and what affected sims.  

You have GOT to be kidding me. Scripts in rental boxes and vendors, like any scripts on a sim, add up and eventually lag it. They don't have zero impact. So study away, but I also study in the field with actual scripted objects on various sims, with various types of scripts and numbers of scripts.