Second Norway is bankrupt

[Juequinaisheley Ichibara]

Ey Ren, has given his Second Norway sims back to LindenLabs. Second Norway is the most East Estate at The Blake Sea. What will happen with the sims, nobody knows. Maybe is LL looking for a new owner? Maybe the sims are gone, next week. 

I must say that sins November 2019 all over The Blake Sea sales got worse, more and more yellow spots on the map... To me a normal reaction of the landlords might had been, lower your prices! But no, 3 L$ a prim stayed as it always was. Even the new snowy sims (Sailors Cove North, around the sim Homewood) of Patrick Leavitt are 5 L$ for 1 prim. I wonder who will rent it? I don't think thats the way to run a rental business these days. So there will go more landlords broke,... Well, the Corona crises might save them

An other reason that the little rentals of second Norway stayed empty the last months is the new continent: Bellisseria. If you put in more then 10.000 new free plots, you break the excising rental economy, Sorry to say. 

 

Edited March 26, 2020 by HP Darcy

[Mollymews]

17 minutes ago, HP Darcy said:

 Bellisseria. If you put in more then 10.000 new free plots, you break the excising rental economy, Sorry to say. 

 

i am always a little bit sad when an estate folds.  I just say as well that Bellisseria parcels are not free. They cost $US99 a year

for sure tho, Bellisseria has made it more difficult for some estates largely catering to the 1024 parcel market.  From a objective markets pov, the estates that offer larger parcels will do better than they have before, better meaning less competition as the mixed parcel size estates drop out of the market

[ChinRey]

1 hour ago, HP Darcy said:

Ey Ren, has given his Second Norway sims back to LindenLabs

Oh no! I love Second Norway and it was the main inspiration for my own Greater Coniston.

I have so much to say about this I don't knwo where to start.

But most urgent perhaps: do yourself a favour and head over to Charlotta Jenkins' store at http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Second Norway/199/130/28

It's all old pre-mesh content but everything is free and much of it is more than good enough for today's SL. The owner hasn't logged on for years so if Second Norway shuts down, the store will probably be gone for good.

[Syo Emerald]

2 hours ago, HP Darcy said:

An other reason that the little rentals of second Norway stayed empty the last months is the new continent: Bellisseria. If you put in more then 10.000 new free plots, you break the excising rental economy, Sorry to say. 

Premium homes have existed for years now and they aren't exactly "free", they are a benefit from a paid subscription. Bellisseria only offers bigger plots and nicer neighborhoods than the old premium homes did. Premium homes have an appeal to a specific set of people on SL estate market: Premium users, who are fine with only 1024qm of land on which they are restricted in what they can do and who mainly do not care to terraform or put up their own houses and who also like the styles currently offered in Bellisseria. 

Anyone else, especially people not willing to get a premium subscription, will still look for rentals from private estates. Or simply buy their own plot of land (what I did). So in essence on could say that an attractive premium subscription kills the rental economy. Of course I'm not saying Belli had no influence on it, but its not all unavoidable death and suffering.

[ChinRey]

32 minutes ago, Syo Emerald said:

Premium homes have existed for years now and they aren't exactly "free", they are a benefit from a paid subscription. Bellisseria only offers bigger plots and nicer neighborhoods than the old premium homes did.

Yes but LL has never marketed them as aggressively before. LL needs to fill up all those new houses with people and those peole have to come from somewhere. I have a feelign this'll only be the first of a series of mid sized estates to go down.

We don't know if Bellisseria is the reason here of course but an estate owner can't afford to keep many vacant plots for long. A hald full region, even a quarter full one, is a dead loss and unless you are incredibly stupi like me, you cut your losses and close down the region. Once you do that at an old established estate, most of the tenants who were still there, are gone from SL for good.

 

51 minutes ago, Syo Emerald said:

Premium homes have an appeal to a specific set of people on SL estate market: Premium users, who are fine with only 1024qm of land on which they are restricted in what they can do and who mainly do not care to terraform or put up their own houses and who also like the styles currently offered in Bellisseria.

I quite like the style of Bellisseria even though it's not my cup of tea paper cup of Starbucks but it is only one style. It's the small and medium sized estates that provide the variety of experiences SL needs to cater for its international clientele and there is no way LL can cover all of that themselves.

[Juequinaisheley Ichibara]

4 hours ago, Mollymews said:

i am always a little bit sad when an estate folds.  I just say as well that Bellisseria parcels are not free. They cost $US99 a year

Well you get 52 x 300 L$ = 15600 L$ back. That is 60 USD. Am I right?

[Mollymews]

1 hour ago, HP Darcy said:

Well you get 52 x 300 L$ = 15600 L$ back. That is 60 USD. Am I right?

if people ever do cash out their stipend then yes

 

[Chic Aeon]

13 minutes ago, Mollymews said:

if people ever do cash out their stipend then yes

 

Many people "save" their stipend and then use that money to pay for the next year's premium -- especially for alts.  In the past the weekly reimburses have paid for the premium membership OR (in case of the 300 stipend) --  almost paid.   That doesn't work as well now with the price increase. 

The idea that the "shelter" lockdowns will help SL is still to be tested. It is important to remember than many of the folks in lockdown are ALSO out of work. It is very unlikely they they will be spending food and rent money on frivolous items.  Plenty of folks will not be paying out the 99 USD in April and May and likely onward and that of course means giving up mainland parcels.   

The next year is going to be very difficult for almost everyone. So the best we can hope to do is adapt and hang on.  Most likely mainland sims that are abandoned will remain in maintenance as they have been in the past. 

 

And yes, Belli was indeed a trade-off so far as mainland parcels go --- especially water and sailing access plots. I am sure LL understood that from the beginning. It has been talked about here often. 

[Garnet Psaltery]

1 hour ago, Mollymews said:

if people ever do cash out their stipend then yes

 

Somehow I just can't make sense of that sentence.  

Sorry to hear about Second Norway but I agree the prices were too high.

[Mollymews]

6 hours ago, Garnet Psaltery said:

Somehow I just can't make sense of that sentence.

what I am meaning is that we have to pay a Premium subscription to get a Belli parcel. With the Premium stipend only a few people cash this out, most of us spend it on stuff. We can treat the stipend as either a parcel subsidy or as a stuff subsidy.  Either way it still costs the amount of the subscription

[Garnet Psaltery]

1 hour ago, Mollymews said:

what I am meaning is that we have to pay a Premium subscription to get a Belli parcel. With the Premium stipend only a few people cash this out, most of us spend it on stuff. We can treat the stipend as either a parcel subsidy or as a stuff subsidy.  Either way it still costs the amount of the subscription

I'm sorry, I meant that I never have any stipend left to cash out.  

[Paul Hexem]

I've seen the prices the landlords ask around the Blake Sea.

They deserve to go bankrupt. 

[ChinRey]

13 hours ago, Gadget Portal said:

I've seen the prices the landlords ask around the Blake Sea.

They deserve to go bankrupt. 

That's very easy to say when you're not the one who had to take all the risk and spend all the time and effort developing one of those estates.

[Garnet Psaltery]

14 hours ago, Gadget Portal said:

I've seen the prices the landlords ask around the Blake Sea.

They deserve to go bankrupt. 

 

44 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

That's very easy to say when you're not the one who had to take all the risk and spend all the time and effort developing one of those estates.

I took Gadget's comment as referring to greedy Blake Sea landlords*, who don't actually do any developing.

*Not all of them, of course.

[ChinRey]

2 hours ago, Garnet Psaltery said:

I took Gadget's comment as referring to greedy Blake Sea landlords*, who don't actually do any developing.

*Not all of them, of course.

None that I'm aware of although to be fair, I don't know them all.

I can't find the info about estates connected to mainland right now but you have to accept some seriously strict condition if you want one. There's a considerable non-refundable application fee (with no guarantee your application is accepted), there are limits to how many and how few region you can have and you have to keep a certain amount of the land open to public so you can't rent out everything. Linden Lab really, really squeezes those estate owners for all they can. It costs a lot more both in terms of money and work than a regular isolated estate and you have to be a true SL enthusiast with a firm belief in the shared experience idea to even consider running an estate attached to mainland.

[Garnet Psaltery]

44 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

None that I'm aware of although to be fair, I don't know them all.

I can't find the info about estates connected to mainland right now but you have to accept some seriously strict condition if you want one. There's a considerable non-refundable application fee (with no guarantee your application is accepted), there are limits to how many and how few region you can have and you have to keep a certain amount of the land open to public so you can't rent out everything. Linden Lab really, really squeezes those estate owners for all they can. It costs a lot more both in terms of money and work than a regular isolated estate and you have to be a true SL enthusiast with a firm belief in the shared experience idea to even consider running an estate attached to mainland.

I didn't know about any of this so I assumed they were mainland landlords.

[ChinRey]

59 minutes ago, Garnet Psaltery said:

I didn't know about any of this so I assumed they were mainland landlords.

Oh no, it's all private estates with a mess of extra strings attached. Except for the open water regions of course. They are owned by LL but there has never been a parcel for sale in them and I can't imagine there ever will be.

[Marianne Little]

Even if I cash out or not, the 300 L is money I don't have to buy, and pay transaction fee for, both to LL and PayPal.

Some may never buy hair, shoes or stuff for the home, and save the stipend.

Bellisseria is very different from Mainland. You can spend a day or 2 refreshing, and then get a houseboat with guaranteed access to water you can sail in. Or a house with plenty of rez zones around, also for boats.

Edit: (I have an alt free for the log cabins, and she has been testing. Got plenty of houses and some boats. And without auto-refresh too)

 

Edited March 28, 2020 by Marianne Little

[Marianne Little]

I am posting what I said in another thread about coronavirus. My thoughts about Premium and that I mean it could be smart of LL to offer reduced price on a quarterly.

 

 

[Hunny Bunny]

When asked if there would be any relief for region owners during the the most recent episode of Lag Gag, Ebbe said to contact support. I took that as a yuge 

I highly doubt premium users will fare much better. Besides someone has to make up the difference for the increased costs that will be incurred by generously offering discounts to education & nonprofits.

[animats]

I'm a bit worried about Bellisseria eating the world. It now seems to be the biggest continent.

Bellisseria - We're #1! Do we have a suburban sprawl problem?

 

Mainland for sale. Want some?

 

Kama City, Zindra. Something strange is going on here. One big landlord is buying up properties and raising the prices. They put nice empty buildings on them, so the property doesn't look abandoned, but nobody rents or buys most of the properties.

Something needs to be done to revitalize Mainland. We can't just have endless suburbia and unused mainland.

Edited March 28, 2020 by animats
rm blank lines

[Alwin Alcott]

1 hour ago, animats said:

 We can't just have endless suburbia and unused mainland.

where have you been last years? .. it's not been different since the big land crash nearly a decade ago

[Mollymews]

i read over on Inara's blog that Patch Linden mentioned that Linden is working with the Second Norway people to do something with the estate

is quite good news this as the estate is in a fairly good location for the boating community. It may be that it ends up as a Belli-like estate but with bigger parcels like mini-islands. Which  for the boating community would be quite attractive I think

 

[ChinRey]

37 minutes ago, Mollymews said:

i read over on Inara's blog that Patch Linden mentioned that Linden is working with the Second Norway people to do something with the estate

That's interesting and promising. It would set a new precedence if anything comes out of it though. If LL offers Ey a bailout, there is bound to be quite a lot of other estate owners who want the same. I certainly do.

I had a look at both Second Norway and Sailors Cove today and so far there isn't anything happening at all. The estates are still owned by Ey Ren but all the vacant rental boxes at Second Norway (I didn't check SC for this) are locked.

I'm surprised there is no mention of Sailors Cove in this btw. I would have thought that would be the first to go if Ey Ren was downsizing or giving up. Second Norway is his own baby after all, he made it himself from scratch (with a little bit lot of help from his friends of course). Sailors Cove is an estate he took over only a few years ago when Blacktip Razor, the original owner, passed away.

Edited March 29, 2020 by ChinRey

[animats]

22 minutes ago, ChinRey said:

That's interesting and promising. It would set a new precedence if anything comes out of it though. If LL offers Ey a bailout, there is bound to be quite a lot of other estate owners who want the same. I certainly do.

I had a look at both Second Norway and Sailors Cove today and so far there isn't anything happening at all. The estates are still owned by Ey Ren but all the vacant rental boxes at Second Norway (I didn't check SC for this) are locked.

I'm surprised there is no mention of Sailors Cove in this btw. I would have thought that would be the first to go if Ey Ren was downsizing or giving up. Second Norway is his own baby after all, he made it himself from scratch (with a little bit lot of help from his friends of course). Sailors Cove is an estate he took over only a few years ago when Blacktip Razor, the original owner, passed away.

LL would presumably charge tenants tier or rent.

It's a cheap way for LL to experiment with something more structured than mainland but not LL-built like Bellisseria.