Why Do They Do It?

[Melita Magic]

I'm here for a bit of a vent. Bear with me, please. :)

Most of my land in Second Life is open to the public. The only ban line I have is around a house that I let others set home to - that's so it won't need constant policing and tehy won't be griefed. Truth be told it's also so they can't invite any and everyone over for a bit of orgy or whatever, since, some of them, I frankly don't know. So that's to protect the ones I do know, since I know they wouldn't do the same and are there for some privacy. So far that's worked fine, but in general I don't like ban lines as I find them a bit unfriendly in the SL landscape. (This one has no complaints from neighbors - I own the land on three sides of it anyway.)

So can I have one piece of land that's mine? One piece of land that I can go to and be relatively assured I won't be intruded on, won't have someone right in my face? 

I fell in love with a certain parcel which is bordered on two sides by ocean and one by Linden road. No, not the most private, but usually it was quiet there whenever I went to stop and look at the parcel for sale. So, I eventually bought it. I didn't put any ban ilne or orb, since it's near those public access ways and I don't want to knock anyone off their sailboat or car. In fact for a long time I had a sailboat there anyone could borrow by sitting in it; until it stopped working and i finally removed it. I even have a little thing outside that isn't obvious but if someone clicks they get a scooter to ride the Linden road with. So I think I'm friendly, right? To a point?

I did put in the land description that people are welcome to use the outdoors to relax on but please don't go in the house. Well they did anyway. My first house there had doors that didn't automatically shut and when I'd come home, every time, the doors and windows would all be hanging open and the attic door would be down, too. So people were obviously exploring anyway. I put in a visitor detector and guess what, the two names that came up daily as being in the house itself were my neighbors. My neighbors whose land is larger than mine and had their own house, but who had built up every inch of it and apparently wanted something a bit roomier. I can only guess. Maybe they just considered my land to be their patio, and my house their gazebo.

Rather than confront them I simply put a new house down which had automatically closing doors. I redid my land to allow for the prims. I then made a sky platform and flew up to 3500 meters in the sky for my privacy. I've been on that sky platform for over two years now without incident. Remember there is no neighbor on three sides.

Last week I logged in and couldn't believe that my neighbors had rezzed an enormous floating - not even sure what to call it - world at eye level with my sky platform. I mean, my little platform with a texture of flowering grass and a tent is about all I have up there, and I couldn't have gotten much higher in the sky at the time, trying to avoid them.

There is a waterfall, mountains, California style mansion, trees, the works. My question is, out of all the room in the sky, why would they rez it within arm's length of mine? It isn't as if it's a skybox rental place that has to rez a skybox every 100 meters. They have a parcel big enough for a sizeable house and that is all. So that means one house, and about 4000 meters to choose from. Why choose an inch away from me?

At first their stuff was also way over my border, so I contacted them. One was online. There is a language barrier but she did come up and ask me to help her so together we flew around and I tried to illustrate how to find the land borders in the sky. She thanked me for being so nice about it and said she would fix it. I thanked her profusely and next time I logged in was going to send her a bouquet or something with a nice thank you note.

But today it's worse. Not only is the whole thing still there but she has rezzed an enormous plywood cube around it. I cammed in to see if the rest was gone. It wasn't, but the interior is textured with clouds. So, she knows enough to do all of that. Why doesn't she know about people wanting their privacy if they are up at 3500 meters in the sky? 

I guess she took to heart the reason I gave for wanting some space around me for privacy. I told her if both things are next to each other we cannot change clothes in privacy, either of us. Well she solved that by seeing to her own privacy I guess.  And her view, with the textured clouds around her sky world. But me? I get to stare at a huge plywood box as far as I can see. 

Told you this was a vent. It wouldn't be so bad if a neighbor on anotherh plot of land wasn't doing the same - every place I have a sky platform on that place, which were rezzed to 'raise' virtual pets, they put a big glowing orb skybox or a huge black box skybox. 

Why do they think we want to stare at their space junk? Why do they not have enough manners to at least stagger things enough so someone else isn't staring right at it when they are on their own skybox or platforms? I have always tried to rez things where no one else is. Sometimes it's difficult. But in BOTH of these cases I have ONE neighbor and they should have absolutely no problem finding an empty skyline to rez their space junk in.

Yes, if it is someone else's it's junk, you see. Lol

I haven't said anything to the second neighbor but I don't even use those platforms any more. I've been there at least three years in that case and to move everything would be an enormous hassle. We're talking about pens that now others are renting or sharing but it does increase my tension every time I go. To move my things, I'd have to get other people involved and then we're talking about breeding schedules and lots of disruption.

I had a list of things to do today and did not need this. But rather than vent to her, in case she is clueless instead of thoughtless, I am venting here. Do I feel better? No, not really. I'm hoping someone can say something that will make me feel a bit better. :)

The only thing I can think of is, I do have rez enabled and return time quick on both parcels and that these people flew up to rez things on my platform and then slide it over to their own land. They were too lazy to just do it the hard way like I did, and send things up into the sky on their own, fly up, make landmarks, etc.

A lot of people have landmarks to these platforms especially the pens, some of which are even in my picks. So it is a hassle on that end, too. And of course there's no guarantee they both won't just do it all over again. Moving doesn't seem to be the answer. So, what do I do? I can't derender on my viewer and I can't ask everyone who goes there to go and derender it all either. Especially when it's a skybox with a lot of things inside of it. And that means trespassing over there to do it, even if they did derender every prim floating out there.

And speaking of trespass - what were they doing up in my air space at 1500, 2000, 3000, 3500 meters? (The home platform is 3500 meters high. I thought if they ever rezzed anything it would be much lower.) Why were they flying around my land to try and find out what is up there, to rez their own junk and scoot it over for convenience sake? (I'm guessing that's why they did it.) 

Shouldn't anything in the sky be considered private and off limits unless otherwise noted? And isn't rezzing on someone else's land or rezzing right up to the border in the sky at the same altitude incredibly rude? I know it isn't against TOS but it's so rude.

I just want to hit something. :(

Here is a photo of the one case. In the other case picture much the same except it's solid black.

 

 

[Madeline Blackbart]

yeah it's a little rude. it's especially weird if you only have one neighbor. Ic ould see having multiple neighbors MAYBE. Like where me/my partner live there's a lot of people so avoiding others is impossible  but in an area with low people? I can't imagine why you'd do that. I geuss what you could do is create a wall around your own things that is close or encrouching on there land see if they enjoy it? I dunno. I'm sorry to here all this as it's a shame when generous people are punished.

[Syo Emerald]

Kick your neighbors butt. If you can't I do it for you. Such mean selfish people...someone has to set them limits!

You pay for your land and enjoyment, they should respect you! Confront them with everything. If they refuse to stop their behavior, do the same and show them how it feels.

[161488303349]

if I had evil thoughts then would say they want your land. 3 sides linden tell the story of their desire

easiest way to check this is to move your home platform upto 4000m. if they follow you up then you know for sure

+

if I not have really evil thoughts then your neighbor is one of them people who just has to be friends. like a share the sugar bowl bff

they just cant understand why their neighbors not want to be bff with them. they just keep on coming over the fence and knock on your door and go Hi! is me. like all happy as

and when tell them to please go away then they huff off and spend rest of their life twitching their curtains at you

[Janelle Darkstone]

'We don't see the world as it is, we see the world as we are.'

There might be more than a language barrier; while we understand the courtesy and reason behind distancing skyboxes, their culture might be different and they might not understand the point.  The first option is to talk to them and try to get your point across, with even more patience.

If it were me, I'd quietly collect my things and move a little higher.  Most confrontations are just not worth the stress.

[Syo Emerald]

From the rest of the story I don't see this as a working solution. They seem to clearly have their goals set on anoying Melita as much as they can. They could have many reasons for that, but because she was friendly, patient and polite all the time I don't see the point in continuing to "play dead" and noncaring.

[Treasure Ballinger]

I've had my mainland parcel since 2007.....I lost count of how many 'neighbors wit issues' I've waited out.  I'm still there........Patience, grasshopper.

 

ETA: and yes, you are a 'nice' and wonderful person. 

[Trinity Yazimoto]

Hi

in try to make you smile, let me tell you what a painter who was exhibiting his art in the library i work told me : 

"A good neighbourgh, is a dead one"

It was for joking of course. But this sentence make me laugh everytime i remind it lol...(like now)...I hope it will make you smile at least.

More seriously, firstly, isnt some convenants saying that renters cant build not too much at the limit of their land ? (mine has this kind of rule). If yes, just report them.

Secondly, rezz a big board between your and their skybox. put a ugly texture on their side, and make urs with a lovely view. 

I rem in the past i had a parcel in mainland. this one had a weird shape and so i had a small abandoned parcel in the middle of mine. i looked for purchased it but it was not for sale. Then... one day, obviously it has been put on sale, but hey, ive stopped checking it everyday, so sm1 purchased it for puting it to rent.

kindly ive asked this person if she wanted to swicht her parcel (in the midle of mine ) with a corner on my parcel, what was better for her, bec then she could have an access to the road. She has been right away  disrespectful and laughed at me bec i mystyped "awesome". OK then. Firstly, i banned her from my land, so she couldnt walk till her parcel. She put a big sign "on rent" on her parcel... ive build some lil stands all over her parcel.. with ugly textures on her side... She complained... i muted her, telling her that since she laughed at my english, i will accept to talk to her only in my own language... 2 weeks later or so, she was gone... I guess she reported me , but i havent done anything that i wasnt allowed to do. So well... we made a big party after she left lol.

Good luck, Melita... 

[Sephina Frostbite]

I had this issue to. I would send back what you can. I would believe it was a misunderstanding if it wasn't for the fact that they had scoped her place out before. So this was an issue already established. As much as it might kill you show some patience explain how you feel and why. Copy the convo of course. If its still and issue Idk. Wouldn't it be a violation for having her stuff on your property? As for the eye sore that's horrible and rude. I feel for you hun. WIsh you the best of luck.

[Dillon Levenque]

That really does bite. It may be just as 16's 'evil thought' suggests: they're trying to make you so disgusted you leave so they can buy your parcel. That would certainly be consistent with what you've described and pictured. Even if that's not the case it is incredibly thoughtless at best.

I'm sure you've already considered just moving your 'changing' platform and/or boxing it in the way they did theirs, but it really stinks that you need to do that. As I said, they are either deliberate or unacceptably thoughtless. I'm not sure which is worse.

[wiked Anton]

.....................................I'm sorry, i got bored and fell asleep before i got to you problem. It's SL, people can do as they wish, and unless they are breaking TOS then there is not much you can do about it accept build a bridge and get over it....here is a hint that i dont think anyone has told you.......have you tried de rendering it? you can make it disappear so you dont see it. of course it will still be there but what do you care. and as far as naked goes and changing clothes....OMG ITS SL< YOUR AN AVATAR>>>ITS NOT REAL

[Peggy Paperdoll]

I'm not as nice as Melita.    I, too, would have politely approached my nieghbor and tried to arrive as some reasonable resolution that both the nieghbor and Melita could live with.  That, it seems, fell on deaf ears (or maybe purposefully ignored....which is my guess) so nice is out.  Play as rough as they do and ignore requests to cease playing rough.  Particle generators come to mind.     You say they have some pretty cloud texture on their side of the wall so that they have this peaceful view of puffy white clouds against a blue sky (that's what I envision anyway).  I wonder what a gorgeous waterfall would look like "accidently" spilling over occassionally on their side of that beautifully textured wall.    Out of place I would guess...especially if you could find a waterfall with some fish jumping in the falls.  Keep the generator on your side but we all know particles spill over a little bit.  Don't be blatant about it put it just close enough so that a few particles make it over on their side occassionally.  You could put a pretty cliff on your side to make the falls have sense......and to be "not so blatant".  What's the worse that will happen?  She AR's and LL makes you move the falls?  I mean, it was an accident don't you know. 

Nice is a wonderful thing.......but nice is not wonderful when you get shafted because if it.

[Sidnella Riler]

You seem very considerate of others, regarding letting people in your property and even not using ban lines, I do not use ban lines either, what they gonna do, stain my sheets? so, Yes I believe people doesnt need to be using banlines, and I believe in not bothering anyone because I do not like to be bothered, so I think a neighbour deliberately putting that ugly piece of wood there next to you, is very rude,  I would suggest changing height even though it is not your fault, and if they follow you, then at least you know they are doing it on purpose and act on it, some previous post says, it is SL people do what they want, get over it, well that is not right Mr boring hair,  this is SL yes, and you can do what you want, but values should remain, and people should still live and let live,

Wish you fix your problem Melita and keep enjoying SL

[Syo Emerald]

Bet you are also one of the guys who says "Ah its just the internet...don't listen to them!" when it comes to cyber bullying.

It is pretty real if she can't peacefully live on her parcel without this continued rudeness from her neighbours and she has every right and reason to be offended by that. SL is not a place to let all manners drop.

Why do people want homes? Because they want privacy and peace.

[Fayette Charron]

You could try rezzing another dummy skybox/platform and see if they move to that, if they do then for sure they are harassing you. But yeah, it's very rude of them to think they can build nearly on top of you like that. If you can't get them to agree to move their items, then you should try reporting to the sim owner and see if they can do something about it. Even if it is just that person contacting them, sometimes it's just the matter of a higher authority getting involved.

[Peggy Paperdoll]

This is mainland.

--------------------------------------

From Melita's original post to start the thread:

I fell in love with a certain parcel which is bordered on two sides by ocean and one by Linden road. No, not the most private, but usually it was quiet there whenever I went to stop and look at the parcel for sale. So, I eventually bought it. I didn't put any ban ilne or orb, since it's near those public access ways and I don't want to knock anyone off their sailboat or car.

-----------------------------------------------

The "higher authority" is Linden Lab.  From what was discribed there is no ToS violation so any appeal to the "higher authority" (in the form of an Abuse Report) is going absolutely no where.  A waste of both Melita's time and LL's time filing such AR's..........I believe Melita knows that since she's smart enough to be aware of any ToS violation that might be occurring (and there isn't any).

She's done everything reasonable to resolve the problem (in a polite and calm manner).  She's out of ideas........so are most here.  Some say move (or run and hide).  Some say ignore (don't run but hide).  I say fight fire with fire.  Stay within the ToS but stop being the nice guy.......she's tried that and got flipped off for it.

 

[Perrie Juran]

I suggest you throw a script party on your Platform.

Invite us all over and we can compete to see which of us can wear the most scripts and or generate the highest Avatar Render Weight.

How many of us do you think you can fit on your platform?

[Alicia Sautereau]

Create a cube and make it 10x10
Rez a cube at the same location and sit on it
Edit the cube and set it to the platform altitude +1 meter

Instant sky travel

 

Why they started to annoy you, no idea
I`d just extend draw distance and start moving it down, or up and see if they follow, if they do, it`s pretty obvious

[solstyse]

---

Peggy Paperdoll wrote:

I'm not as nice as Melita. 

  I, too, would have politely approached my nieghbor and tried to arrive as some reasonable resolution that both the nieghbor and Melita could live with.  That, it seems, fell on deaf ears (or maybe purposefully ignored....which is my guess) so nice is out.  Play as rough as they do and ignore requests to cease playing rough.  Particle generators come to mind. 

   You say they have some pretty cloud texture on their side of the wall so that they have this peaceful view of puffy white clouds against a blue sky (that's what I envision anyway).  I wonder what a gorgeous waterfall would look like "accidently" spilling over occassionally on their side of that beautifully textured wall. 

  Out of place I would guess...especially if you could find a waterfall with some fish jumping in the falls.  Keep the generator on your side but we all know particles spill over a little bit.  Don't be blatant about it put it just close enough so that a few particles make it over on their side occassionally.  You could put a pretty cliff on your side to make the falls have sense......and to be "not so blatant".  What's the worse that will happen?  She AR's and LL makes you move the falls?  I mean, it was an accident don't you know. 

Nice is a wonderful thing.......but nice is not wonderful when you get shafted because if it.

---

Peggy, you beat me to it. I would say the same thing if you didn't already. Clearly, there's a reason why they chose the exact same altitude, and put up the board. The only thing I would suggest different is something much uglier than a waterfall. And go ahead and be as blatant as you want. If they have a problem with it, then Melita could retort, "Look, you chose to build right next to me. You chose to keep invading my land.  Now, you can choose to move out of range of my particles. And you can choose to give me the privacy I deserve."

[Peggy Paperdoll]

Actually, I'm the type to do just that.  But I don't think Melita is (and that's a good thing.....I'm just a different person in that way).  The only potential issue is that by being blatant and putting a particle generator right at the edge of the property line is that, as I mentioned, particles do spill over and everyone knows it.......it could be a violation of the ToS because of that.  Me?  I'd take the chance knowing LL will probably, at the worse, warn me and make me move it.

I chose a waterfall since that's innocent enough and makes some sense for placement near a property boundary.  I did think of a bonfire (which, in my mind would be more annoying) but that really doesn't fit what I believe is Melita's style.    I'm not afraid of a spat once I've done the polite thing...I enjoy a little feud once in a while.

*why do I think I could be a griefer?*  :smileyvery-happy:

[Paul Hexem]

Step 1. Disable Safe on your parcel. Enable that SL system damage.

Step 2. Install robots with laser guns that detect your neighbors.

Step 3 Wait for your neighbor to come over.

Step 4. Giggle insanely.

[Qie Niangao]

No matter how you counter, it's really a question of waiting out the neighbor. The more you react to them, I think, the more "interesting" it will be for them to respond--whether it's because they think you might leave and they can get your land, as 16 suggests, or if it's just their special amusement to try to perturb the universe starting with you.

The only response I'd make, if it were me, would be to turn off "Avatars on other parcels can see and chat with avatars on this parcel." That has the drawback of making everything at your ground level, too, invisible from outside the parcel, but the objective would be to become as boring as possible to them, and making your sky build invisible seems a step in that direction.

I would definitely not put up any kind of screen on my side unless I'd also taken the above step to block their visibility into the parcel from outside. Those screens are admissions of vulnerability, whereas making your parcel contents invisible says the opposite: that you simply can't be bothered by anything they might do on their side of the border. (That's not the case, of course, but we certainly don't want them to know that.)

[161488303349]

I just add here

I think they do want your land

if look at their behavior. like you know they been in your house. sitting on your porch. stuff like that. more than 1 time. quite often.

you got a fabulous view. so they come over and just sit and dream what if was ours. when people do this then it can easy become an obsession to have to have it. they know you enough by now seems that you never going to sell voluntarily. their obsession to have to have has tipped them over

+

I always try give benefit of doubt as best I can. but in this case now I think about it more

sometimes people not mean to end up this way. like they not start out like that. but envy and desire can be pretty cruel sometimes and tip us over quite bad sometimes. and we end up do stuff that we not normally ever consider ourselves capable of

+

Melita if was me

then I would just be polite to them and if they ever ask then say quite firmly that I am never going to sell this land ever. is part of who I am. is my whenua (my land). is where I belong. where my soul (my wairua) belongs. I can no more part with this land than I can part with my soul

and that's alI I would ever say about it to them or to any else who might have designs on it

and I just keep moving my sky home platform. when they move next to me again. then I move back down. and I keep moving up and down up and down until they give up

I not ban them. I not verbal fight them. I not argue. I not upset them or wrong them in any way. I just be my normal self. and greet them politely every time I see them. if they put stuff on my platform then I just silent return it and never say nothing

+

someone going to quit first when do this way

the whenua never quit. nor do its wairua. it remains always. and so do my soul my wairua bc is one with te wairua o te whenua. same me avatar with it and me RL self. forever and ever beyond the end of time

whatever they do is up to them. but my soul wairua will not surrender. it will not be extinguished. it draw its strength from the whenua - the land. without the whenua then my wairua is lost. and me with it

and that never ever going to happen. ever

so kia kaha - be strong. endure. and move. up and down. up and down. up and down. for as long as it takes

+

from practical tactical pov. don't make more than one home platform for yourself. only have one. they will then have to make the move as you do

then start take timestamp snapshots. they follow snap. move. they follow snap. move. snap. move snap. move snap. is a history you see. of a battle. a war. but is one fought on your terms now when you do this way. is a war of endurance. of kaha - strength

one you can win on your terms if do this way. and you will win bc of your wairua and your kaha. and your aroha - love for all beings. even them who oppress you

but if they want to fight and make war then fight it on your terms. and not fight on theirs ok

move and strike. move and strike. move and strike. the snapshot is your strike

 the pictorial history of the battle will tell itself. you not ever need say anything

 +

edit to add for complete bc I forget (:

take two snapshots. move timestamp snapshot of clear space. they move next to you. snap/strike. move up/down and snap of clear space. and on and on

[Syo Emerald]

Hope you keep us updated Melita! Now I'm curious what happens next.

[Emma Krokus]

Too funny!!!

If I wasn't so grateful for my first laugh of the day I'd say you owe me a keyboard - spat coffee all over it )))

Thank you!

Emma