Is NoCopy NoModify NoTransfer ethical? Is it allowed by TOS?

[Innula Zenovka]

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Telexa

Gabardini wrote:

The owner has claimed to have that ability, and yes the owner has in fact called out correct

alts

in their group. The owner has also banned correct

alts

as well. They do own a website though and I could assume that if people posted in their forums with different avatars then it could also be assumed that they could connect avatars.

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That sounds to me a more likely way to try to guess alts, since the forum owner will certainly be able to see what IP addresses posts are being sent from.

 

[Solar Legion]

Nah - it's been answered. You just don't like the varied answers you've been given.

Buyer Beware - remember that next time.

While I may not agree with such a practice, you bought the device. You sought it out for its features. You neglected to do proper research. You knew the moment the first alteration occured server side that there was the distinct possibility of your device being diabled. You took this risk.

You get to pay the price and deal with your own, poor choice. 

[PeterCanessa Oh]

I got bored on page 4.  I'm in the wrong timezone for these super-popular threads ^^

Yes, it's perfectly ethical.  Yes it is allowed by TOS.  No, it is stupid to buy these things.  No, camping is not banned.  Yes, gaming traffic is bannaed.  Yes, this is a device for gaming traffic.  Yes, using this sort of device could get you banned.

As such everyone who uses this or similar products should be AR'd and all their stuffs taken away (I can haz cheezburgr now?)

In this thread, by the way, I read some bigger failures to understand how SL, or even computers, work than I have for a long time.

[Ceka Cianci]

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Telexa Gabardini wrote:

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Griffin Ceawlin wrote:

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Telexa Gabardini wrote:

I agree with everything you said. However if this product was also used to identify the use of Alts and then this information was shared within their own group as a form of harassment, would it still then be OK?

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No, it wouldn't. But you already knew that.

I love how this was about one thing and now it's becoming about another. Just how many types of TOS violations are you going to accuse these people of before it's over?

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I wasn't really accusing them of anything so not sure what you are talking about. I know its rather impossible to create a prim or linkset of prims with the permission set to No Copy/ No Mod/ No Trans though, unless you add something to its contents. So my original post remains for now until im proven otherwise. As for the Alt detection and revealing of alts, I as well as hundreds of others have seen it first hand so is that really an accusation?

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if a creator can set the permissions to the product they created..then yes they can create a product and set the perms to no copy no mod and no transfer and be able to hand it off to anyone  they choose..

only the person they give it to will be under the permissions..not the creator..the creater can change those permissions from the original or any copy they decide to make that remains in their posession..

the creator gives the permissions ..they don't fall under them..

so ya i could make  1 prim or 30 prim linkset and make it nocopy notrans nomod and give it to you just as easily as if i made one copy mod transfer and gave it to you..

 

 

[Theresa Tennyson]

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Erik Vrandic wrote:

What ways are there to 'track' an alt? I thought the only way outside of cracking SL's servers is to track IP addresses. 

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If it looks like an alt, walks like an alt and quacks like an alt, then it's probably an alt, especially in an ongoing conflict. When someone's running two accounts in the same situation it's often easy to guess correctly.

[Rival Destiny]

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Theresa Tennyson wrote:

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Erik Vrandic wrote:

What ways are there to 'track' an alt? I thought the only way outside of cracking SL's servers is to track IP addresses. 

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If it looks like an alt, walks like an alt and quacks like an alt, then it's probably an alt, especially in an ongoing conflict. When someone's running two accounts in the same situation it's often easy to guess correctly.

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This is total misinformation.  Your statement should read:

If you think & believe it looks like an alt, ....

It is utterly impossible to detect an alt in sl.  Yes you can guess by looking at certain factors but you cannot determine100%.  And, if you cannot determine 100% then it's a total fail.  So, guessing correctly is also a fail, because unless said alt comes forward and proves they are who you guessed they are, then you are still 'guessing'.

And as far as the tracking part?  Unless someone gives you map rights, you can't track an avatar.

[Solar Legion]

As to tracking ... apparently, you're not very familiar with LSL. There are items out there which can track which sim you're in if you're wearing them. On toop of this, it is possible to use a third party client ot track an avatar's position inside a sim, so long as your avatar is also on the same sim.

So sorry to burst your privacy bubble. 

[Rival Destiny]

No apologies necessary, am aware of those.  One you have to wear an item so I assume the tracker has to somehow give/sell the trackee the item.  And the 2nd, is tracking an avatar in same sim is not what I am speaking of. 

I suppose I wasn't crystal clear, but I am talking about someone tracking an avatar around the grid without their permission.

My bubble is still intact

omg inuendo in the am lol

[Perrie Juran]

I bet on Daddy Long Legs across the board yesterday.

You can guess what the bookie said when I asked for my money back.

[GilHamilton]

I just want to say that as a relatively new Resident I find this kind of stuff fascinating and quite educational. If the original item is what I think it is, I wouldn't touch it with a proverbial 10 foot pole because the whole thing sounds FISHY to me. I say that because there's one item that shows up multiple times when I search for a Traffic Aid in Marketplace and I haven't heard many good things about that group of products

 

But, to try to answer the original question I'd have to say yes, it's ethical to sell no perms items. What you're actually asking is if it's ethical for someone to force you to change to a no perm version of an object that had some perms (transfer, in this case) when you bought it. To that question I'd have to say no, it's probably not. But it may not be illegal either, or a violation of the TOS.

[161488303349]

now that has been lots of chatter i think i have played this game

+

i was at these shops. is a device. it says click to get free money

so i click and it says i have to join the group. then it says i have to go to a website to get my work permit

so i do that

then it says please work your shift and you will get your pay

so i wait and is no boss comes to tell me what my job is so i just stand there until my shift ends

i get 113L wages. woot!!! this a easy job

on the website is a list of lots of other shops where i can work. so i go to them. the boss never comes there either. so i just stand round doing nothing again and get paid wages by them as well

more woot!!! i <3 this job

+

anyways. after a time i think i will work twice as hard for my employers and get even more pay

so i log in another account at the same time. click. join the group. go to website. click for work permit

it then says: you greedy little pig !!!

i got the sack and lost my work permit

is so unfair !!! why they sack me ??? i was willing to work double shifts. triple even. i am a really hard worker. can ask anybody. is terrible what they done to me. should be a law or something to protect workers rights i think. i am outrage (:

[Dirtnap Mumfuzz]

NO one forced anyone to buy anything, you made the choice.

NO one seems to keep in mind the actual exchange rate between real money and SL monopoly money.

NO one believes you are being upfront, or honest, about what is really going on.

 

People who use traffic items deserve what they get; alot of 'people' who visit, take resources, and leave without spending a dime.

If you don't like it, you can always just NOT participate. Can't you? Or can you.

 

Why do you expect that bogging down your peers will result in someone 'doing something about it'?

Why not just sell products that people want, instead of trying to lure them in to impulse buys?

Why not just admit you don't want to feel like the fool who was parted too soon from their money?

Why not just admit you blew it, learn from it, let it go, and move on?

Why not just admit you are merely hoping to pass your expense on to anyone else?

 

But more than all of this....why do I hear the pot calling the kettle black?

 

Why doesn't this method of yours work when we all get pissed at the US government for bailing out all the banks that actually broke laws and ripped off an entire country?

Why doesn't this method of yours work when we all get pissed at the US government for bailing out all the car makers that actually broke laws and ripped off an entire country?

Why doesn't this method of yours work when we all get pissed at the US government for bailing out all the corporations that actually broke laws and ripped off an entire country?

 

Why don't all these responders aknowledge that you are just trying to get some attention for something that is not getting the attention you crave, as per your own admission, and stop feeding the troll under this particular bridge?

Why do you think Linden Labs makes it a policy to not get involved in this sort of 'mommy, make him give me my dolly back' sort of dispute?

Why do so many people think they know so much about things outside their scope of experience, when not being capable of handling what is already on their plate?

 

This thread wasted an hour of my time with nothing worth seeing or hearing, or bickering about. Why can't I get a refund on my time, or pass the expense on to someone else?

I could always just NOT participate. Can't I? Or can I.

 

I"m with the cat on page 8 who said LOL.

And the girl who said 'you and your alts'....thanks, you made me grin for the first time in weeks.

 

Other than that....this thread should be set to no copy/ no mod/ no transfer, and moved to the delete folder.

[Pamela Galli]

"Why do you think Linden Labs makes it a policy to not get involved in this sort of 'mommy, make him give me my dolly back' sort of dispute?"

Yep once you are an adult there is no mommy to run interferance (or give something for nothing) anymore, so people go around mad, trying to get someone to be like mommy.

 

[Rosemaery Lorefield]

Well then, don't buy it.

If you purchase something knowing that it is expensive, no perm, at the mercy of the creator, and charges a "tax", it's pretty dumb to then come in and carry on about it.

If the seller misrepresented any part of this, then it is wrong, but there isn't much to be done besides avoiding their products.

[Rosemaery Lorefield]

<<"Gosh sorry its only $15, get a life!"?!?>>

Yes, that is all that can be said. It is unethical to take someone's rent and shut down the sim but it is not against TOS, and there is absolutely nothing LL will do about it.

Of course, this is nothing at all like buying a product, permissions known, and then complain about the perms. Selling something no perms is not unethical or against TOS, no matter how much you would really, really like it to be.

[Rosemaery Lorefield]

I agree with Prokofy- this kind of traffic gimmick is doing absolutely nothing for your business.

People who want to use camp chairs are people who do not want to purchase things. Why do you want them coming to your store? Just to artificially inflate traffic? I'd rather have a traffic score of 5 and a sale or two than traffic in the thousands and no sales.

[Rosemaery Lorefield]

<<Updated products are NoCopy, Mod (except for scripts, NoTransfer>>

So...then it wasn't sold NO perms.

Exactly what is the problem again?

[Bouttime Whybrow]

it's kind of a drag when your object updates on you
it's kind of a drag the perms they sold were untrue

listen to me when i'm speaking, i know you've been cheating and one day soon we'll be meeting, but

anyway, anyway, anyway

it's kind of a drag when it's too good to be true
it's kind of drag i can't pass this off on you
 

listen to me cause i'm freaking, i know a sucker you were seeking...

anyway, anyway, anyway

it's kind of a drag when you find out it was you
it's kind of drag when you know its all true

[Phil Deakins]

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Rosemaery Lorefield wrote:

I agree with Prokofy- this kind of traffic gimmick is doing absolutely nothing for your business.

People who want to use camp chairs are people who do not want to purchase things

. Why do you want them coming to your store? Just to artificially inflate traffic? I'd rather have a traffic score of 5 and a sale or two than traffic in the thousands and no sales.

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I completely disagree with Prok about that. She is no doubt right about many places that have camping but she is definitely not right about all of them. Some camping is there just for the sake of giving something away. Some people are like that, y'know. Such places put the camping on its own parcel that isn't in search, so its traffic is irrelevant.

[Rosemaery Lorefield]

The subject of this thread is a "camp chair-like" object that is intended specifically to generate (false) traffic.

Actually, the subject of this thread was a thinly veiled jab at a certain completely different object and service, not sure why the OP thinks it's a big sekrit, but there's a whole thread about said sekrit other thing at SLU. 

[Dillon Levenque]

Shocking, really. You should form a union or something. :smileylol:

[161488303349]

q; (:

[Phil Deakins]

It hasn't been clear what the product is that the OP was talking about. Apparently some people know what it, or assume they do, is but I don't. The actual subject of this thread is permissions. My 'camping' post wasn't about that either.

I am interested to know exactly what the product is. Perhaps you, or someone, will describe it. It isn't necessary to name it. I'm only interested in what it does.

[Qie Niangao]

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 It isn't necessary to name it. I'm only interested in what it does.

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Well... if it's the product that some others in the thread have been hinting, there's more for a buyer to be upset about than just what the item does.

On the other hand, a buyer of this item isn't going to be innocent, either. It's pretty explicitly for traffic gaming.  I suppose it's theoretically possible to use it to reward the L$-impoverished, but it would be absurdly inefficient at that, given the share of money skimmed by the product creator from every transaction (where that share is presumably justified by delivering a networked stream of L$-seeking traffic).

In reality, then, the item is only ever used to violate the anti-traffic-gaming terms of service. A buyer can't very well fuss about the item not violating the ToS effectively enough, so in this thread we see an attempt to catch the item's creator on a (nonexistent) technicality.

I'm sure the item itself is a complete piece of crap, too, based on everything else this creator has listed on Marketplace, but any buyer of this thing truly deserves what they get.  It's actually better, I think, that those buyers are being screwed by the product creator, perhaps thus discouraging them from using the product to screw everybody who uses traffic-sensitive Search.

I wonder if the Lindens might be leaving this stuff on Marketplace as a form of automatic punishment for traffic gamers.

[161488303349]

this one i think

http://tracker.vudu.sl/

if you go to the places on the list and click the device then can get free money off them