getting woke and SL

[Luna Bliss]

Experiments have shown that White women (and some POC) clutch their purse or hide it more often when they see a Black man approaching vs a White man.  It's been known a long time (through tests) that people expect a Black man to be more guilty of a crime compared to their white counterpart, so it was deduced that this stereotyping of the Black man being criminal was the cause of the fear and purse clutching.

I think, from now on, when I see a Black man in public I'll smile and wave.

It's not so hard to remedy stereotypes which contribute to racism.  Reading the books the OP referenced can facilitate awareness.

[Janet Voxel]

1 hour ago, Jackson Redstar said:

There are still some issue with cops - a small minority of them. Most are good. But I wonder if the thought has ever occurred maybe just stop resisting arrest? even if is a BS stop, a profiling stop, or what ever, maybe let the attorney and courts settle it ......until we can fix (or remove) the bad cops this might help in the mean time....

Because it’s hard to resist arrest when the police barge into your house and shoot you 8 times. It was the wrong house, the police already had the person they were looking for in custody...her name was Breonna Taylor. The police that were involved in this still haven’t been charged yet.
 

I’m not a big fan of terms like “woke” and “white privilege”, but when people make comments like this, it does imply someone is asleep or not paying attention.

 

[Jordyn McGregor]

8 minutes ago, Janet Voxel said:

Because it’s hard to resist arrest when the police barge into your house and shoot you 8 times. It was the wrong house, the police already had the person they were looking for in custody...her name was Breonna Taylor. The police that were involved in this still haven’t been charged yet.
 

You missed out the part about her live in boyfriend pulling a gun and shooting first.  Granted it was because they broke down the door and never identified themselves, but that's a big part to leave out.  Would they have fired their weapons if he hadn't pulled his gun and shot first?  We'll never know.  

P.s. I pay attention.

 

Edited June 11, 2020 by Jordan Whitt

[Janet Voxel]

Just now, Jordan Whitt said:

You missed out the part about her live in boyfriend pulling a gun and shooting first.  Granted it was because they broke down the door and never identified themselves, but that's a big part to leave out.

 

Then stop right there.

[Paul Hexem]

1 hour ago, Innula Zenovka said:

And who, while you've been doing this, has said to you something like this?

You want me to go all over the Internet for sources? How about just in this thread?

18 hours ago, Luna Bliss said:

Whites really aren't aware of their privileged status

 

15 hours ago, Beth Macbain said:

you are not a black American and you are ignorant and uneducated

 

8 hours ago, CoffeeDujour said:

upset with terms like white fragility or white privilege

...

one hell of a slog for white people, because we're the ones with the problem

There's a couple examples.

1 hour ago, Innula Zenovka said:

I mean, references to white privilege might make you feel uncomfortable or embarrassed at times-- they do me, sometimes, anyway -- but I doubt anyone's talking about them simply to make you or me feel bad.

You're still missing the point I'm making. It's not about being uncomfortable or embarrassed. I'm not. I know I've made honest effort to make a difference.
It's about calling out that using a hostile approach- insulting, racist comments- to convey that you're trying to oppose racism, is not a good way to do it.

[Paul Hexem]

54 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Do you think you've ever done anything wrong related to these issues?  I don't mean being a racist, but have you ever been prejudiced against people who were different from you?

What does that have to do with what I wrote?

I suspect we all have, in some way.

[Innula Zenovka]

51 minutes ago, Jordan Whitt said:

White person here!  When I ask anyone how they are feeling, I really want to know how they are feeling!  I'm dazzled by Academic Foxhole's mind reading abilities though since they seem to be able to tell the sentiment behind a question.

 

 

If you read the rest of the Twitter thread, I think you will find it becomes pretty clear from his account of why her reactions and subsequent actions led him to form the conclusions he does.

 

Edited June 11, 2020 by Innula Zenovka

[Luna Bliss]

8 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

  18 hours ago, Luna Bliss said:

Whites really aren't aware of their privileged status

Paul, how is this statement of fact some sort of affront to you?  It's not to me, as a White person. I know that in so many ways I'm unaware of how I've enjoyed a certain privilege as a White person. I certainly had misfortune in life, but it would have been worse if I had been Black.  It's just a statement of fact to own this reality as a White person -  it's not an insult to you or other White people, or an accusation of any kind.

Are you not aware of how White people have had an advantage in society compared to Blacks, and still do?

Edited June 11, 2020 by Luna Bliss

[Paul Hexem]

Just now, Luna Bliss said:

Paul, how is this statement of fact some sort of affront to you?  It's not to me, as a White person. I know that in so many ways I'm unaware of how I've enjoyed a certain privilege as a White person. I certainly had misfortune in life, but it would have been worse if I had been Black.  It's just a statement of fact o own this reality as a White person -  it's not an insult to you or an accusation of any kind.

Are you not aware of how White people have had an advantage in society compared to Blacks, and still do?

It's not, I am, and it's still irrelevant to the point I'm making.

[Luna Bliss]

6 minutes ago, HolyHarlot said:

10 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

I guess you don't understand how groups who have been oppressed seek out others of their kind to join with in support, both to feel heard by others like themselves and to develop solutions to rectify their disadvantages?  This is not racism....it is sanity.

It would all be much better if you were correct, but then they'd probably name themselves "Oppressed Lives Matter" instead of the racist slogan

This makes no sense...Blacks have been oppressed because they are Black.

[Jordyn McGregor]

8 minutes ago, Innula Zenovka said:

If you read the rest of the Twitter thread, I think you will find it becomes pretty clear from his account of why her reactions and subsequent actions led him to form the conclusions he does.

 

I choose not to use Twitter. 

[Luna Bliss]

2 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

It's not, I am, and it's still irrelevant to the point I'm making.

Could you restate your point, because with all your posts I still don't understand just what you are trying to say.

[Paul Hexem]

Just now, Luna Bliss said:

Could you restate your point, because with all your posts I still don't understand just what you are trying to say.

 

12 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

It's about calling out that using a hostile approach- insulting, racist comments- to convey that you're trying to oppose racism, is not a good way to do it.

 

[Innula Zenovka]

8 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

You want me to go all over the Internet for sources? How about just in this thread?

 

 

There's a couple examples.

You're still missing the point I'm making. It's not about being uncomfortable or embarrassed. I'm not. I know I've made honest effort to make a difference.
It's about calling out that using a hostile approach- insulting, racist comments- to convey that you're trying to oppose racism, is not a good way to do it.

I think we're at cross purposes here.   I'm talking primarily about supporting the BLM movement in practical ways, whether individually or as part of some collective action, out in the places we live and work.   From what you say, you don't need to persuaded to do that, so why are comments by particular posters in this forum any sort of deal-breaker?

 

[Paul Hexem]

1 minute ago, Innula Zenovka said:

I think we're at cross purposes here.   I'm talking primarily about supporting the BLM movement in practical ways, whether individually or as part of some collective action, out in the places we live and work.   From what you say, you don't need to persuaded to do that, so why are comments by particular posters in this forum any sort of deal-breaker?

Because, despite how I may come across, I don't like the situation and I want to see the problem solved.

I believe the aforementioned approach (telling people they're privileged and ignorant) makes the problem worse, not better.

[Luna Bliss]

1 minute ago, Paul Hexem said:

3 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Could you restate your point, because with all your posts I still don't understand just what you are trying to say.

 

14 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

It's about calling out that using a hostile approach- insulting, racist comments- to convey that you're trying to oppose racism, is not a good way to do it.

Not all people who use the term "white privilege' are doing so only to attack. But the term simply describes a reality, although I will confront people who have absolutely no awareness of their privilege as a White person and so simply can't comprehend the pain Blacks have endured.

 I'm wondering if because you spend time in the Twittersphere and to some degree here, where all people want to do is fight to win &  use this term, you have decided the term is wrong itself ? 

BTW, I do feel from discussions days or weeks ago, that some unfairly accused you of being a racist. 

[Luna Bliss]

2 minutes ago, Jordan Whitt said:

Okay examples.  Let's talk about David Dorn, 77yr old black man going to protect a business from BLM rioting looters who gets shot and killed by...wait, he doesn't count cos he was killed by another black man.

Was there a news story or some edict given by a jury that proclaims his murder does not count?

[Paul Hexem]

3 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Not all people who use the term "white privilege' are doing so only to attack. But the term simply describes a reality, although I will confront people who have absolutely no awareness of their privilege as a White person and so simply can't comprehend the pain Blacks have endured.

Not all people use "all lives matter" incorrectly, either- and yet, if you go back and read that other thread... See the conflict?

I can absolutely admit that plenty of people use both phrases wrong, and doubling down on it makes things go further in the wrong direction. 

4 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

BTW, I do feel from discussions days or weeks ago, that some unfairly accused you of being a racist. 

Further proving my point.

[Luna Bliss]

3 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

11 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

Not all people who use the term "white privilege' are doing so only to attack. But the term simply describes a reality, although I will confront people who have absolutely no awareness of their privilege as a White person and so simply can't comprehend the pain Blacks have endured.

Not all people use "all lives matter" incorrectly, either- and yet, if you go back and read that other thread... See the conflict?

I can absolutely admit that plenty of people use both phrases wrong, and doubling down on it makes things go further in the wrong direction. 

11 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

BTW, I do feel from discussions days or weeks ago, that some unfairly accused you of being a racist. 

Further proving my point.

One might not actually be a racist, but if they further the causes of racists through their use of language (either consciously or unconsciously), then they are furthering the problems of racism.  But they are not themselves a racist.

 

[Jackson Redstar]

the main question I have is what is this White privilege and where can I get some?  does it pay your bills for you? put free food on the table? pay rent? inquiring minds want to know!

[Paul Hexem]

3 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

One might not actually be a racist, but if they further the causes of racists through their use of language (either consciously or unconsciously), then they are furthering the problems of racism.  But they are not themselves a racist.

That's sort of what I'm saying, too. Using the wrong language sends the wrong message, no matter what your intent may be.

[Luna Bliss]

1 minute ago, Jackson Redstar said:

the main question I have is what is this White privilege and where can I get some?  does it pay your bills for you? put free food on the table? pay rent? inquiring minds want to know!

Read the books the OP referenced and you will have your answer.

[Arielle Popstar]

1 minute ago, Jackson Redstar said:

the main question I have is what is this White privilege and where can I get some?  does it pay your bills for you? put free food on the table? pay rent? inquiring minds want to know!

Yes, I think my white privilege card must have got lost in the mail!

[Luna Bliss]

2 minutes ago, Jackson Redstar said:

the main question I have is what is this White privilege and where can I get some?  does it pay your bills for you? put free food on the table? pay rent? inquiring minds want to know!

Is it possible you might be unaware of how you've benefitted in society via having a skin color that has not been demonized through the centuries?

[Luna Bliss]

9 minutes ago, Paul Hexem said:

15 minutes ago, Luna Bliss said:

One might not actually be a racist, but if they further the causes of racists through their use of language (either consciously or unconsciously), then they are furthering the problems of racism.  But they are not themselves a racist.

That's sort of what I'm saying, too. Using the wrong language sends the wrong message, no matter what your intent may be.

I think pressing the issue that "all lives matter" at this point in time furthers the causes of racists, because they often use this particular saying to minimize the problems Blacks have endured.  Racists simply can't concede that another group has had it worse via the color of their skin. Either they are unable to see it, or they see it and want to continue to have the right to stomp a disadvantaged group to the ground so they can have higher status.

Edited June 11, 2020 by Luna Bliss