Drayke Newall Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Fauve Aeon said: Fun fact...I have set my maturity settings over and over. I’m age verified with payment on file and the settings continue to randomly default to ‘general’. It’s been that way since I joined in 2008. As far as searching goes if I set it to general and search for something within one session, I can search multiple times without having to re-dropdown the maturity ratings box, same with sort by and item number dropboxes. This is what I was implying the new filters should be. The only time the dropdown boxes reset for me is when I have to log in again or reopen the browser and go to the site due to another issue LL have with their MP website where it doesn't save settings over multiple sessions. Such as the sort by and item number dropdown boxes. That said, the maturity ratings for me default to general, moderate, adult so no idea why yours would be defaulting to just General. Edited January 9, 2020 by Drayke Newall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Gregoire Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 16 minutes ago, Fauve Aeon said: Fun fact...I have set my maturity settings over and over. I’m age verified with payment on file and the settings continue to randomly default to ‘general’. It’s been that way since I joined in 2008. Have filed a support ticket for that? Could be an issue with your account that LL can easily fix. It has happened before and LL was able to fix it. Not to me but to people I know/knew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claireschen Hesten Posted January 9, 2020 Share Posted January 9, 2020 12 hours ago, Drayke Newall said: Why do I get the feeling this is just a short term fix until we see sellers and resellers just abusing the system (like they are already) by just selecting unlimited quantities when listing them. If the seller has a No Copy Gacha item the system recognises how many items there are be it a single item or you have 5 of the same item to sell using the same listing you can't abuse the system and select unlimited quantities there is no option on one of my own Gacha listings i get this in the quantities section Quote Available quantity:1 You may add or remove stock units using the Marketplace Listings folder in the viewer. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drayke Newall Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 16 hours ago, Claireschen Hesten said: If the seller has a No Copy Gacha item the system recognises how many items there are be it a single item or you have 5 of the same item to sell using the same listing you can't abuse the system and select unlimited quantities there is no option on one of my own Gacha listings i get this in the quantities section I cant say whether this is a new feature added with the filter or not but, currently there are items that are on the marketplace that are gacha items being sold by resellers that are ignoring the filters. If what you said is a new feature introduced as part of the update, then perhaps these are just existing ones pre changes, however they are present on MP. https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/8GBCummerbund-Gray-Signature/13946783 As to gacha's in general. It still doesn't stop gacha's that a copy and it also doesn't stop gacha's that are sold by the creator. When I want to search for something and LL state that they are doing something to fix it so gacha's don't come up in search I, as I would expect most people, want no gacha items to come up in search. This isn't the case with this filter. A couple of examples of these systems not being filtered: https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/inZoxi-Kitsune-Animesh-Shoulder-Pets-SERIES-3-XMAS-Edition/18609945https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Tardfish-Robo-Lurker-Gacha-1-play/18628480https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Tardfish-Chompy-Tail-Gacha-V2-1-Play/18628355 Edited January 10, 2020 by Drayke Newall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Gregoire Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Drayke Newall said: https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Tardfish-Chompy-Tail-Gacha-V2-1-Play/18628355 Quote **Important** This is a Gacha play! By purchasing you are playing a gacha, and will receive a random prize as pictured above. If you have any questions please contact me in world 😃 Using the MP as a gacha machine. I have no words. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drayke Newall Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 2 hours ago, Selene Gregoire said: Using the MP as a gacha machine. I have no words. Fun isn't it. I glimpse of what is to come perhaps... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alwin Alcott Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, Drayke Newall said: https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/inZoxi-Kitsune-Animesh-Shoulder-Pets-SERIES-3-XMAS-Edition/18609945 https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Tardfish-Robo-Lurker-Gacha-1-play/18628480https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Tardfish-Chompy-Tail-Gacha-V2-1-Play/18628355 @Dakota Linden ... this is allowed ?? good luck if it is, ruining things for serious merchants ánd customers. mustn't get weirder.. MP as juke box ... you might get something or not... but we'll take your payment Edited January 10, 2020 by Alwin Alcott 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alwin Alcott Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 19 hours ago, Claireschen Hesten said: If the seller has a No Copy Gacha item the system recognises how many items there are be it a single item or you have 5 of the same item to sell using the same listing you can't abuse the system and select unlimited quantities there is no option as you see at Drayke's post, there is already a work around .. still gacha garbage, and nót limited. Ban and distroy this type of selling at least at MP OR FORCE gacha in the gacha category only, everything else: delist Edited January 10, 2020 by Alwin Alcott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drayke Newall Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 17 minutes ago, Alwin Alcott said: FORCE gacha in the gacha category only, everything else: delist Not that simple. To have items categorised you would still have to rely on user input to make the right choice. If they are forced to select a category they can easily put it in the wrong category, which then forces the use as it is now of flagging, which has proven to not work and clogs up the system. If you make it so the filter catches keywords from the title and description this should work a lot better however then you will just get people uploading images with a green background and bolded text with GACHA. Not to mention it then also penalises the people tryin to sell gacha's as their listing wont show even if you search specifically for gacha. Basically it is a lose-lose situation. Even as it is now the Limited filter is already impacting on other peoples products that aren't gacha's but are limited options due to other reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alwin Alcott Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 19 minutes ago, Drayke Newall said: Even as it is now the Limited filter is already impacting on other peoples products that aren't gacha's but are limited options due to other reasons. i know, this has been discussed several times in the merchants forums too, but Dakota didn't/doesn't want/understands that for very unclear reasons. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Dakota Linden Posted January 10, 2020 Moderators Share Posted January 10, 2020 4 hours ago, Alwin Alcott said: @Dakota Linden ... this is allowed ?? good luck if it is, ruining things for serious merchants ánd customers. mustn't get weirder.. MP as juke box ... you might get something or not... but we'll take your payment Greetings! This isn't specifically forbidden by the Terms of Service, Terms and Conditions, nor the Marketplace Listing Guidelines. The listing says that the buyer WILL get one of the items and as long as they do, then the listing is essentially for a "random" item, and there are other listings on the Marketplace for random items as well. 1 2 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alwin Alcott Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 1 minute ago, Dakota Linden said: This isn't specifically forbidden by the Terms of Service, Terms and Conditions, nor the Marketplace Listing Guidelines. We only can hope many respectable sellers will put things inworld. And they avoid the new filters. So WE again get the whole load of gacha sellers on our plate. Great move i think.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drayke Newall Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Dakota Linden said: Greetings! This isn't specifically forbidden by the Terms of Service, Terms and Conditions, nor the Marketplace Listing Guidelines. The listing says that the buyer WILL get one of the items and as long as they do, then the listing is essentially for a "random" item, and there are other listings on the Marketplace for random items as well. I am a bit confused. If a gacha by definition is selling a chance to get a random or themed item, then by definition all those other listings for a random item would despite them not being labeled (even though some are as per my post above) in the description a gacha, be a gacha. So now I must ask, what was the motivation of Linden Lab bringing in the Limited Quantities filter if it wasn't to filter out all gacha's as your entire userbase has been requesting since they were created in SL? Furthermore some of those examples I posted are not even in the gacha category (random chance for an item category). If this isn't against Marketplace Listing Guidelines, then I really don't know what to think at this moment with regards to these guidelines or LL's stance as far as anything guideline goes. It is also interesting that the Limited Quantities filter, filters out genuine non gacha items that are for sale as a Limited Quantity, yet the statement by you Dakota on the other hand shows that you are not prepared to take the same stance on all gacha's at the cost of what you seemingly portray as genuine random item listings (despite those also being by definition gacha's). Edited January 10, 2020 by Drayke Newall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Dakota Linden Posted January 10, 2020 Moderators Share Posted January 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, Drayke Newall said: I am a bit confused. If a gacha by definition is selling a chance to get a random or themed item, then by definition all those other listings for a random item would despite them not being labeled (even though some are as per my post above) in the description a gacha, be a gacha. So now I must ask, what was the motivation of Linden Lab bringing in the Limited Quantities filter if it wasn't to filter out all gacha's as your entire userbase has been requesting since they were created in SL? Furthermore some of those examples I posted are not even in the gacha category (random chance for an item category). If this isn't against Marketplace Listing Guidelines, then I really don't know what to think at this moment with regards to these guidelines or LL's stance as far as anything guideline goes. It is also interesting that the Limited Quantities filter, filters out genuine non gacha items that are for sale as a Limited Quantity, yet the statement by you Dakota on the other hand shows that you are not prepared to take the same stance on all gacha's at the cost of what you seemingly portray as genuine random item listings (despite those also being by definition gacha's). Greetings! All of your concerns and questions should be directed to the Web User Group who maintains and controls the Marketplace http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:User_Groups As one of the forum moderators, I try to help or answer basic questions, with a larger slant towards the Marketplace since I started with the Marketplace back in 2008 when it was still a 3rd party property. Specific concerns or questions always need to be directed to the team that handles those properties, like the Marketplace. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drayke Newall Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, Dakota Linden said: Greetings! All of your concerns and questions should be directed to the Web User Group who maintains and controls the Marketplace http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:User_Groups As one of the forum moderators, I try to help or answer basic questions, with a larger slant towards the Marketplace since I started with the Marketplace back in 2008 when it was still a 3rd party property. Specific concerns or questions always need to be directed to the team that handles those properties, like the Marketplace. Thanks for the help Dakota, however I'll have to decline such an invite to in-world meetings. As much as I would love to attend, time zone restrictions make it impossible. I really shouldn't be on these forums now and should have been snugly tucked into bed 5 hours ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alwin Alcott Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 56 minutes ago, Dakota Linden said: Specific concerns or questions always need to be directed to the team that handles those properties, like the Marketplace. ah ok... in that case i'm sorry .. i only tagged you because i thought you were one of the MP Lindens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wesleytron Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Drayke Newall said: So now I must ask, what was the motivation of Linden Lab bringing in the Limited Quantities filter if it wasn't to filter out all gacha's as your entire userbase has been requesting since they were created in SL? I think this is making an issue out of something that isn't an issue - the Limited Quantities filter is to filter out all those MULTIPLES of individual resale gacha items which pollute our search results (with emphasis on resale). It's all those multiples of items polluting our search results that is the problem, not gacha items per se. On the other hand, the random purchase marketplace gachas you pointed out to us DO NOT list multiples of times - they are not limited items sold by resellers, so there is only one listing per gacha. It only shows up ONCE, so they are NOT polluting our search results any more than any other type of item - in fact probably considerably less than a shirt available in twenty different colours - so basically their presence is a non issue. There is a difference between gacha items and gacha machines. Gacha items are the obnoxious listings on the MP we want to filter out. Gacha machines on the MP are not the problem saturating our search results. Edited January 10, 2020 by wesleytron ETA: Credited finding of links to wrong person, so corrected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Gregoire Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 7 hours ago, Drayke Newall said: Fun isn't it. I glimpse of what is to come perhaps... That kind of thing is one of the reasons (blatant abuse) I use the MP more as a catalog than to make purchases. The only creators I will buy from on the MP are the ones whose work I know. If it's someone I'm not familiar with their work and they don't have an inworld store with the items on display where I can inspect the quality of their work, I won't buy from them. I refuse to enable anyone's crappy "business practices". 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drayke Newall Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, wesleytron said: I think this is making an issue out of something that isn't an issue - the Limited Quantities filter is to filter out all those MULTIPLES of individual resale gacha items (I'm putting emphasis on the word resale) which pollute our search results. It's all those multiples of items polluting our search results that is the problem, NOT gacha items per se. On the other hand, the random purchase marketplace gachas @Alwin Alcott pointed out to us DO NOT list multiples of times - they are not limited items sold by resellers, so there is only one listing per gacha. It only shows up ONCE, so they are NOT polluting our search results any more than any other type of item - in fact probably considerably less than a shirt available in twenty different colours - so basically their presence is a non issue. It's why I make a distinction between gacha items and gacha machines. Gacha items are the obnoxious listings on the MP. Gacha machines on the MP are not the problem. I have already provided an example of a gacha that is being resold without a limited quantity listing. So until someone can clarify if that is a work around or a somehow missed pre change bug. Consider me still not convinced. Edited January 10, 2020 by Drayke Newall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bitsy Buccaneer Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 On 1/9/2020 at 3:10 AM, Fauve Aeon said: Fun fact...I have set my maturity settings over and over. I’m age verified with payment on file and the settings continue to randomly default to ‘general’. It’s been that way since I joined in 2008. Happens to me too. I just assumed it was a browser cookie thing and it doesn't play well with my security settings. I don't actually know that though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wesleytron Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Drayke Newall said: I have already provided an example of a gacha that is being resold without a limited quantity listing. I possibly wasn't clear enough - I'm specifically referring to listings like the 'Chompy tail gacha' you linked to (and sorry, I credited finding the link to Alwin, not yourself). https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Tardfish-Chompy-Tail-Gacha-V2-1-Play/18628355?id=18628355&slug=Tardfish-Chompy-Tail-Gacha-V2-1-Play That's a gacha machine (or playable gacha as another listing calls it), so it is NOT a limited item like gacha items. In fact, you can probably purchase from it an infinite amount of times, like inworld gacha machines. I'm saying those are not a problem as far as our search results go. It shows up just the once. The filter is designed to get rid of all the individual resale gacha items because THOSE are the annoying ones, not listings like this one. If we're wanting the filter to get rid of these type of listings as well, then we are are losing sight of what the point of the filter is in the first place. However, if there are resellers selling individual resale gacha items and bypassing listing them as Limited Quantity, then I agree that's an abuse of the system and a problem, but it's a different issue. Edited January 10, 2020 by wesleytron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Gregoire Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 IMO, all gachas, regardless of item or "playable" on the MP, are annoying. Why? Because I do not purchase no copy items, nor will I jump through a creator's hoops to get one that is copy/mod/no trans. Gachas should be confined to inworld machines rather than cluttering up the MP. But no one gives a crap about that. Certainly not LL. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theresa Tennyson Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 26 minutes ago, Selene Gregoire said: IMO, all gachas, regardless of item or "playable" on the MP, are annoying. Why? Because I do not purchase no copy items, nor will I jump through a creator's hoops to get one that is copy/mod/no trans. Gachas should be confined to inworld machines rather than cluttering up the MP. But no one gives a crap about that. Certainly not LL. Then select the filter to only show "copy" items and you'll never even know gachas are there. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selene Gregoire Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Theresa Tennyson said: Then select the filter to only show "copy" items and you'll never even know gachas are there. Been there done that. I still see some of them because the creator didn't bother with the permissions display setting that shows on the right hand side of the page. https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/NINI-Planet-Next-To-U-Skirt-GRAY/18739717 Edited January 10, 2020 by Selene Gregoire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fauve Aeon Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 32 minutes ago, Theresa Tennyson said: Then select the filter to only show "copy" items and you'll never even know gachas are there. This. It really does filter out most. No not all. But few searches for anything else are so absolute either right? And we don’t lose our minds and rage because a few miscategorised or badly keyworded occasional *hair* or *socks* make it through do we? No, just...Gacha...🙃 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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