The bot war is over and the bot farmers have won :-(

[Silent Mistwalker]

33 minutes ago, Qie Niangao said:

On Mainland, though, there's not much to be done about bots gathering whatever information they want, unless the whole region were to disallow access by scripted agents. Parcel-scope access can't prevent those agents landing elsewhere on the region and gathering everything they could if they were on the forbidden parcel.

But there's still a valid reason for Mainlanders to want bots off their parcel: they can be quite pesky, without the bot-runner having any ill intent at all. This would encourage them (the law-biding, well-intentioned among them) to find other parcels to use instead, maybe spreading landing points around the region a bit.

A Mainland-owner who owns the entire region might prevent a registered bot from landing anywhere on the region, and thereby reduce the data collected on that region by properly registered bots—as well as Estates could, anyway, although that data privacy motive seems futile to me, even on Estates, because the bad actors aren't going to self-designate their bots as scripted agents unless the Lab has enforcement tools beyond my expectations.

But to be clear, all this Mainland / parcel-scope / region-scope talk is hypothetical, and would depend on the Lab implementing something like the jira I submitted a few days ago. I mentioned it in at least one other thread already so I don't want to belabor the point here.

Someone should ask @Tyche Shepherd what she did to prevent her bots from landing on regions they weren't wanted.

 

 

Edited March 25, 2023 by Silent Mistwalker

[Coffee Pancake]

2 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

I just set my access to anyone, payment info on file and allow unrestricted access to anyone in my group.  Have yet to have a bot on my parcel or even near it when I've been at home.

Lucky you. Since they sent a bot to my home because I publicly challenged their actions,  I've had a constant stream of random bot visitors coming to and landing on my horizons parcel specifically. 

 

[Coffee Pancake]

1 minute ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

Someone should ask @Tyche Shepherd what she did to prevent her bots from landing on regions they weren't wanted.

Not be a jerk. 

I think that's about it.

[Love Zhaoying]

3 hours ago, AmeliaJ08 said:

I remain confused as to why anyone cared but have new insight on just how paranoid SL'ers can be. 

I respect and elevate your opinion. I'd give you 2 "thank you's" if it were possible!

[Silent Mistwalker]

7 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Not be a jerk. 

I think that's about it.

LOL

I meant how she coded her bots to not land on regions the regions owner requested not be included in her surveys.

I've never known Tyche to be a jerk even when it was obvious she was angry.

Edited March 25, 2023 by Silent Mistwalker

[Love Zhaoying]

2 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

Have yet to have a bot on my parcel or even near it when I've been at home.

Same, although I'm not home a LOT - I am home more than I have been in many, many years. 

I've had a few avatars pass through saying "Hihi!" or ask about local "Real Estate", but that's about it. (Thank goodness there's not a lot of traffic. Distractions make scripting more difficult.)

[EliseAnne85]

12 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

I respect and elevate your opinion. I'd give you 2 "thank you's" if it were possible!

Why?  

I did not want data published about "my sales" even if it was an absolutely stupid lie from these bots because other people could believe it's true. Not to mention, it creates a big hassle for me.  Supposedly, what the bots were doing was collecting data from the "What's Selling Now" section of MP and recalculating that over and over every second, and then posted an incorrect number on their website but were posting it as legit information on what merchants' make with an actual monetary value.

If you cannot see that causing problems to the merchants of SL, I think I need a break from SL for a bit.

Edited March 25, 2023 by EliseAnne85

[Lyric Demina]

44 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Lucky you. Since they sent a bot to my home because I publicly challenged their actions,  I've had a constant stream of random bot visitors coming to and landing on my horizons parcel specifically. 

 

That says so much, doesn't it, about the shadiness of the whole operation.   That right there.   If they target deliberately then they are weaponized, not random.  It is absolutely infuriating.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

46 minutes ago, Coffee Pancake said:

Not be a jerk. 

I think that's about it.

Hers is also not a 24/7 operation, and isn't attempting to hit literally every region on the grid in a 24 hour period.

I think that's what is causing so much consternation: it's not the odd random visit -- it's a constant stream.

[Coffee Pancake]

44 minutes ago, Silent Mistwalker said:

I meant how she coded her bots to not land on regions the regions owner requested not be included in her surveys.

She will just have had a list of regions not to visit. It's technically very simple to do.

[Love Zhaoying]

Just now, Scylla Rhiadra said:

it's a constant stream.

I'm reminded of the Ghostbusters, take care not to cross the streams..or possibly a urologist.

In any case, you'd think people would be pleased that we finally have streaming in Second Life!

[Love Zhaoying]

Perhaps we could try signing the Bots up for multiple subscriptions to Sales notices? They may find that both interesting and informative.

[xDancingStarx]

2 hours ago, Prokofy Neva said:

One doesn't preclude the other. They can enforce their policy AND have a solution on land tools.

It's not enforceable in a way that would matter. Nothing will change. The angry forums threads will be titled differently and there will be the same amounts of bots. In huge mmorpgs it's a cat and mouse game. Here, this game can't be won in the first place since accounts are free. Instead of throwing resources at a fight you can't win (there are already way too many ARs to handle properly,) maybe it should be asked what the intention of those bots is. Is it to gather land statistics? Then why not provide these stats in a better way and make those bots obsolete. If someone wants to send bots to your sim and doesn't care about TOS then they won't be stopped because their bot account is banned after 14 days.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

12 minutes ago, xDancingStarx said:

Is it to gather land statistics?

If that were all they were doing, there'd be fewer objections.

I will agree, though, that LL could render some of this redundant by doing a better job of publishing some forms of non-private data themselves.

[Scylla Rhiadra]

1 hour ago, Love Zhaoying said:

4 hours ago, AmeliaJ08 said:

I remain confused as to why anyone cared but have new insight on just how paranoid SL'ers can be. 

I remain confused as to why anyone cared but have new insight on just how paranoid SL'ers can be.

What part of this statement do you especially approve of, Love? All of it?

[Love Zhaoying]

16 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

What part of this statement do you especially approve of, Love? All of it?

Candor.

Honesty.

Unabashed telling of one's own point of view.

A thirty-thousand feet view, as if by an outsider who has not read our multitude of posts on the topic, and so lacks the context of "why it matters".

Let me know if that is sufficient.  I didn't say that I "agreed" with their opinion, or even - your word - that I "approve" of it. Just that I "respect and elevate" it.  (Would you prefer if I disrespected their opinion, and tried to suppress it?)

ETA: Sorry, I didn't know it was our role to "approve" or "disapprove" of other's opinions. My education must be sorely lacking in that regard!

Edited March 25, 2023 by Love Zhaoying

[Scylla Rhiadra]

2 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Candor.

Honesty.

Unabashed telling of one's own point of view.

A thirty-thousand feet view, as if by an outsider who has not read our multitude of posts on the topic, and so lacks the context of "why it matters".

Let me know if that is sufficient.  I didn't say that I "agreed" with their opinion, or even - your word - that I "approve" of it. Just that I "respect and elevate" it.  (Would you prefer if I disrespected their opinion, and tried to suppress it?)

I don't "prefer" anything, Love. I was just interested in why you had given it your stamp of approval.

[Love Zhaoying]

1 minute ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

I don't "prefer" anything, Love. I was just interested in why you had given it your stamp of approval.

 

5 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

ETA: Sorry, I didn't know it was our role to "approve" or "disapprove" of other's opinions. My education must be sorely lacking in that regard!

 

[Scylla Rhiadra]

13 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

ETA: Sorry, I didn't know it was our role to "approve" or "disapprove" of other's opinions. My education must be sorely lacking in that regard!

It's not, nor did I say it was, although the reputation system here is certainly predicated upon an assumption rather like that.

You "thanked" her for it, and said you would have done so twice had you been able. That certainly seems to imply something very much like "liking" and "approving" of it. I was curious to know why, and what sponsored an enthusiastic two thumbs up. That's all.

I think we can be done this now: I asked you a question, and you answered it quite comprehensively and clearly. There's no subtext, and I've nothing more to really say on this.

Edited March 25, 2023 by Scylla Rhiadra

[Love Zhaoying]

4 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

It's not, nor did I say it was, although the reputation system here is certainly predicated upon an assumption rather like that.

You "thanked" her for it, and said you would have done so twice had you been able. That certainly seems to imply something very much like "liking" and "approving" of it. I was curious to know why, and what sponsored an enthusiastic two thumbs up. That's all.

I think we can be done this now: I asked you a question, and you answered it quite comprehensively and clearly. There's no subtext, and I've nothing more to really say on this.

Cool! Experience says, we can keep going as long as we like.

Thanks for asking!

 

[Marigold Devin]

1 hour ago, EliseAnne85 said:

Why?  

I did not want data published about "my sales" even if it was an absolutely stupid lie from these bots because other people could believe it's true. Not to mention, it creates a big hassle for me.  Supposedly, what the bots were doing was collecting data from the "What's Selling Now" section of MP and recalculating that over and over every second, and then posted an incorrect number on their website but were posting it as legit information on what merchants' make with an actual monetary value.

If you cannot see that causing problems to the merchants of SL, I think I need a break from SL for a bit.

A break from SL sometimes is needed, but be assured it's not you, it really is "them".

[Love Zhaoying]

35 minutes ago, Marigold Devin said:

2 hours ago, EliseAnne85 said:

posted an incorrect number on their website but were posting it as legit information on what merchants' make with an actual monetary value.

If you cannot see that causing problems to the merchants of SL, I think I need a break from SL for a bit.

A break from SL sometimes is needed, but be assured it's not you, it really is "them".

Wow! I wonder who in the world would get sales figures from that website? How irresponsible that would be! 

[Anna Salyx]

6 hours ago, Alazarin Mondrian said:

 one fact was seldom discussed: The capped size of the land ban list [300 avatars max].

Raising the ban list cap to 500 avatars only puts off the saturation point by a small amount of time but does Linden Lab have the resources to implement unlimited size ban lists?

The limited size of the ban list is why I rarely ever put anyone one on a  permanent ban.  I'll do ban for 144 hours  (6 days) which is the max you set someone on a timed ban. They'll fall off automatically at that point. I've found that in the majority of cases a troll will have gotten bored by then and moved on or a bot name will have been retired and a new one created to take it's place.  If a troll or a bot does come back around after 6 days, I can always add them in for another week, but in either case, my parcel ban list is self maintaining and I don't have it clogged up with avatars that a) most likely will never come around again, or b) the account is deleted/closed.  I don't have to go through the list and try and remember when/why I banned someone and try and do manual cleaning. Yes, in some cases I'll make the ban perm, but that's exceedingly rare.  As I've said, in my experience a week, maybe 2 ban is enough.  Something to consider.

[EliseAnne85]

2 hours ago, Love Zhaoying said:

6 hours ago, AmeliaJ08 said:

I remain confused as to why anyone cared but have new insight on just how paranoid SL'ers can be. 

I respect and elevate your opinion. I'd give you 2 "thank you's" if it were possible!

My candor about the post you respect and elevate, is it was rude and insulting.  I cannot understand why you would want to elevate such a post and "give 2 thank you's" as you put it.  Let alone stereotype your own community as paranoid.  Many come to the forums with real reasons and needs, and discussion is important.  

What you responded too was a trollist bait post, and it seems to me, the real reason you want to elevate it is to get the thread shut down.

To the OP, in case the thread gets shut down, can you check 'allow PIOF' on your parcel?  You can do that in the meantime to keep the bots out until something else comes along.  Unfortunately, doing that keeps others out with no PIOF as well.  

I feel after seeing someone so, imo, uncaringly agree with a troll to put the whole SL community down, made me feel like the SL community is nothing.  It's all profit that matters.  And, the truth and those in need don't matter.

Edited March 25, 2023 by EliseAnne85

[Silent Mistwalker]

2 hours ago, Coffee Pancake said:

She will just have had a list of regions not to visit. It's technically very simple to do.

That is my point. 😁