purchased items on MP but link to items not working and seller profile says they have left SL

[Amberyl Ethaniel]

So who can I contact to get my L$ back? It was terrain files, I purchased 2 and they had download links that take me to a defunct site. Seller profile says he moved to another grid 😞

[Lindal Kidd]

53 minutes ago, Amberyl Ethaniel said:

So who can I contact to get my L$ back? It was terrain files, I purchased 2 and they had download links that take me to a defunct site. Seller profile says he moved to another grid 😞

It's doubtful you can recover your money.As a first step, you should try sending a notecard to the seller, even though they say they've left SL. If you get no response in a few days, you can escalate. You can leave a negative review on the Marketplace, and flag the items for LL's attention. You can also file an Abuse report in-world, using the L$ Fraud abuse category.

But please try contacting the seller first. They may not be aware their product no longer delivers as advertised.

[Amberyl Ethaniel]

Yes, I've sent a message as well as a notecard, no luck 😞
I'll check into the rest, thank you so much. It sucks that someone can still leave items up even though they are gone..

 

[Chic Aeon]

2 hours ago, Amberyl Ethaniel said:

Yes, I've sent a message as well as a notecard, no luck 😞
I'll check into the rest, thank you so much. It sucks that someone can still leave items up even though they are gone..

 

To be fair they may not have wanted to agree to a new TOS and so HAD to leave their things up. Mine have been up in Sansar still for years for that reason. 

 

 

[Amberyl Ethaniel]

11 hours ago, Chic Aeon said:

To be fair they may not have wanted to agree to a new TOS and so HAD to leave their things up. Mine have been up in Sansar still for years for that reason. 

 

 

I suppose, but not to notify people somehow who might purchase those items is kinda shady IMO..this will make me more cautious about purchasing from MP now 😞

[Chic Aeon]

8 hours ago, Amberyl Ethaniel said:

I suppose, but not to notify people somehow who might purchase those items is kinda shady IMO..this will make me more cautious about purchasing from MP now 😞

Since -- in my case I cannot log into Sansar how do you suggest that I make it so folks know. I did go on Discord and the folks there KNOW I am gone but I see no way make changes to a site I cannot get into without agreeing to a TOS or privacy policy or both that I do not agree with.

Honestly -- suggestions would be appreciated.  You CAN of course in your future dealings contact the seller and see if they are still around.   This happens all the time and for the most part "I" am OK with it. My very favorite and very well used trees and bushes come from a seller who has long ago left the grid. Whether she actually get the money from sales -- or like me who does not but the grid owners get, "I" got to buy those favorite bushes. If she had taken them off the Marketplace that would make them completely unavailable and there are many stellar builds that while older are still great.  

[Rowan Amore]

15 minutes ago, Chic Aeon said:

Since -- in my case I cannot log into Sansar how do you suggest that I make it so folks know. I did go on Discord and the folks there KNOW I am gone but I see no way make changes to a site I cannot get into without agreeing to a TOS or privacy policy or both that I do not agree with.

Honestly -- suggestions would be appreciated.  You CAN of course in your future dealings contact the seller and see if they are still around.   This happens all the time and for the most part "I" am OK with it. My very favorite and very well used trees and bushes come from a seller who has long ago left the grid. Whether she actually get the money from sales -- or like me who does not but the grid owners get, "I" got to buy those favorite bushes. If she had taken them off the Marketplace that would make them completely unavailable and there are many stellar builds that while older are still great.  

Since you can no longer USE sansar, simply agree to the ToS, remove all your content and delete your account.  An account you have no intention of ever using again?  Agreeing to the ToS would have no effect then.  Agree, remove products, delete account.  Simple and would keep people from purchasing items you have no intention of ever helping with if they have an issue.

[Chic Aeon]

2 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

Since you can no longer USE sansar, simply agree to the ToS, remove all your content and delete your account.  An account you have no intention of ever using again?  Agreeing to the ToS would have no effect then.  Agree, remove products, delete account.  Simple and would keep people from purchasing items you have no intention of ever helping with if they have an issue.

I GUESS you kind of missed the point. I left Sansar BECAUSE of the TOS and Privacy policy. I have no intention of agreeing to something that I don't agree with. That is a lie in my book.  Deleted some comments along the way. 

Edited November 27, 2022 by Chic Aeon
deleted

[Rowan Amore]

23 hours ago, Chic Aeon said:

I GUESS you kind of missed the point. I left Sansar BECAUSE of the TOS and Privacy policy. I have no intention of agreeing to something that I don't agree with. That is a lie in my book.  Deleted some comments along the way. 

No, I understand.  But..it's kind of a moot point if you agree and then remove your stuff and delete your account.  Then, the agreement means nothing as you no longer have an account which has agreed.  I understand you don't want to agree on principle.  Keeping your products available but your help inaccessible since you can't log in, is far worse in my opinion and is kind of shady as mentioned.  Agree, log in, grab your stuff, log out, delete your account.  They can't have any agreement once you've left for good.

Until then, you haven't really left Sansar.

Edited November 28, 2022 by Rowan Amore

[Love Zhaoying]

This wasn't your question, but it certainly seems one big lesson is: do not buy things that require downloading from an external site!

[Chic Aeon]

2 hours ago, Rowan Amore said:

No, I understand.  But..it's kind of a moot point if you agree and then remove you stuff and delete your account.  Then, the agreement means nothing as you no longer have an account which has agreed.  I understand you don't want to agree on principle.  Keeping your products available but your help inaccessible since you can't log in, is far worse in my opinion and is kind of shady as mentioned.  Agree, log in, grab your stuff, log out, delete your account.  They can't have any agreement once you've left for good.

Until then, you haven't really left Sansar.

I guess it just depends on your point of view. I pretty much read EVERYTHING I agree to and don't if I don't agree I opt out.  I did the same with the popular blogging ap that so many creators use.  I didn't like their privacy policy and so I didn't sign it. It doesn't matter to me if I signed it for ten minutes or ten years. I still signed something saying I agreed with it when I didn't.  Just how I see things.  I was very happy when LL posted their new TOS almost a week before it took effect. THAT way folks COULD do some housekeeping before any exits.  Nice to see that.  

 

[Sam1 Bellisserian]

12 hours ago, Chic Aeon said:

I guess it just depends on your point of view. I pretty much read EVERYTHING I agree to and don't if I don't agree I opt out.  I did the same with the popular blogging ap that so many creators use.  I didn't like their privacy policy and so I didn't sign it. It doesn't matter to me if I signed it for ten minutes or ten years. I still signed something saying I agreed with it when I didn't.  Just how I see things.  I was very happy when LL posted their new TOS almost a week before it took effect. THAT way folks COULD do some housekeeping before any exits.  Nice to see that.  

 

Do your customers though expect support when they buy something of yours that is still up there? Does it say on your products that you are no longer there and if they have an issue, any issue, they are just out of luck? After they paid their money to you, whether you collect it or not? I find that so disrespectful to your customers and if your things are still there able to be purchased they are still your customers.

[Lindal Kidd]

I have to agree with Rowan and Sam on this one. I understand not wanting to be on record as having agreed to something you don't agree with. But it's wrong to leave customers in the lurch, too. In this situation I'd accept the terms, remove my products, and then cancel my account. If you wanted to make your point crystal clear, you could also send a registered letter to the company, telling them that you revoke your agreement to their terms.

[Vanessa Amethyst]

On 11/27/2022 at 8:45 PM, Lindal Kidd said:

I have to agree with Rowan and Sam on this one. I understand not wanting to be on record as having agreed to something you don't agree with. But it's wrong to leave customers in the lurch, too. In this situation I'd accept the terms, remove my products, and then cancel my account. If you wanted to make your point crystal clear, you could also send a registered letter to the company, telling them that you revoke your agreement to their terms.

i am agreement as well and yes these companies that pry into your life and sell everything to the lowest bidder are the scum of the earth and while yes they state they can take your data and your dox and look at everything on your computer and sell what they see there is nothing saying you have to give them good data. use a VPN and a script that changes the IP every two minutes now there data says you moved from New York City to Tokyo japan so now they think you are the flash LOL

Secondly i discovered the beauty of Linux especially QEMU+KVM with PCIE passthrugh now my sketchy applications all run in there own little virtual machine that is never used for anything else Cant steel data from a computer that does not have any in it

And if all else fails and its a business you want to try up and blow away like Facebook you can take the sadistic glee approach of using Wireshark to make a list of every Fishy URL that they ping and than use your router to block those IPs

but ultamtly its a choice shortly agree to a Contract full of BS terms to uninstall after the fact, or keep breaking the unwritten contract between buyer and seller. I know which one i would choose to break but I like looking at myself in the mirror in the morning

[Amberyl Ethaniel]

I didn't mean to open a can of worms..sorry! However, I agree. It is wrong to leave your customers in the lurch like that.So far, I have not received any response from LL and am sort of bummed about that. You'd think they woulod want to remove items from MP that are defunct and are just taking L's from people. I am upper tier premium-whatever that's called and read somewhere we have concierge service but I believe it's only phone so will have to check into it. At this point it's not all about the L's I just want to make sure this doesn't happen to anyone else.

[Nick0678]

1 hour ago, Amberyl Ethaniel said:

I didn't mean to open a can of worms..sorry! However, I agree. It is wrong to leave your customers in the lurch like that.So far, I have not received any response from LL and am sort of bummed about that. You'd think they woulod want to remove items from MP that are defunct and are just taking L's from people. I am upper tier premium-whatever that's called and read somewhere we have concierge service but I believe it's only phone so will have to check into it. At this point it's not all about the L's I just want to make sure this doesn't happen to anyone else.

Write a LL support ticker again, according to what you said that user in no longer using SL

LL has your money and they should return them to you.

-

Always look at Seller info and how updated it is, for example i had a business account put "On hold" 4 years ago for " traffic violation".

I totally abandoned it, didn't need to play "chicken or egg" with some Linden employee for a violation that the majority of SL businesses did..(*they still do..)

That account had an MP store and although it was "inaccessible to me", remained active and people were buying stuff.

 

Was i responsible?

No they paid an account that i wasn't able to log in or cared for.

 

Who's responsible?

Simple answer. Linden Lab, it's their platform, the money are still in their systems and not withdrawn to US$ so they are the ones keeping them.

[Alwin Alcott]

1 hour ago, Nick0678 said:

the money are still in their systems and not withdrawn to US$ so they are the ones keeping them.

not really, it's a sink now, it are L$ removed from the market and holded by that locked account.
They take nothing, LL doesn't get other income from exchanges than the fees. It are other residents delivering you the USD by buying your , now locked, balance.

[Nick0678]

1 hour ago, Alwin Alcott said:

It are other residents delivering you the USD by buying your , now locked, balance

Residents don't deliver me or anyone else any USD, they pay Linden Lab to buy L$ 'virtual currency'.

It is simply a number in the game database and even them won't accept it as payment for "regions" or "memberships" that they provide.

The real currency (USD.EURO,etc) is already in their real bank account.

[Lindal Kidd]

2 hours ago, Nick0678 said:

Residents don't deliver me or anyone else any USD, they pay Linden Lab to buy L$ 'virtual currency'.

It is simply a number in the game database and even them won't accept it as payment for "regions" or "memberships" that they provide.

The real currency (USD.EURO,etc) is already in their real bank account.

True. But that money came from the people who bought your product and received nothing in return.

YOU could log that account back in (I assume it's no longer on hold, or could be reactivated), and cash out those tokens. In which case, you'd be committing fraud, IMO, since you got money for nothing and your customers got zip. Or you could (in theory, if you could locate them all) send everyone a refund, in which case you'd be a shining example of goodness and niceness and everyone would love you.

Either way, it's up to you. It seems disingenuous somehow to blame it on LL.

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to make this sound so personal. I'm really thinking of "you" as a hypothetical example, not the perfectly fine Nick0678 we all know and admire.

[Nick0678]

13 hours ago, Lindal Kidd said:

True. But that money came from the people who bought your product and received nothing in return....

 

So Linden Lab should had also disabled the Marketplace Store the moment they put the account on hold,

instead of leaving the Store Open but the Account Locked and profiting from those peoples money.

 

Things are very simple.  

 

13 hours ago, Lindal Kidd said:

YOU could log that account back in (I assume it's no longer on hold, or could be reactivated), and cash out those tokens....

Yes and in another hypothetical scenario we could be living in the Matrix

...but that's not the case and Linden Lab has their money and also control of that account.

Edited November 30, 2022 by Nick0678

[Amberyl Ethaniel]

So does anyone have an idea how best to report this? Again I have sent messages and notecards to seller. So I filed an abuse report since that was all I could think of to contact LL about this..is there a better way?

[Lindal Kidd]

1 hour ago, Amberyl Ethaniel said:

I filed an abuse report since that was all I could think of to contact LL about this..is there a better way?

Nope. Aside from also reviewing the items on the MP and flagging them, as I suggested earlier.

[Amberyl Ethaniel]

14 minutes ago, Lindal Kidd said:

Nope. Aside from also reviewing the items on the MP and flagging them, as I suggested earlier.

oh yes, and I did do that as well as leaving reviews stating what happened.

 

[Nick0678]

7 hours ago, Amberyl Ethaniel said:

Again I have sent messages and notecards to seller

Since you said that they have put a message in their profile that they left. SL then this game is over for them, you might as well consider them dead.

The money can be refunded to you only by Linden Lab so talk to live support, that's why you pay Premium.

[Amberyl Ethaniel]

So just as an update I did send in a support ticket (not sure it was to the right department) but I did get an answer back as well as a refund within a few hours. It seems like the store is no longer on MP which is the real reason I took the issue this far as 770 L is not a huge amount of money-I probably spent way more than that in my time chasing all this down.So no one else will have their L's taken anyway..

I guess I'll have to learn to terraform better because I believe all those files are too large to put in a box. Ah well, back to the drawing board.

Thanks for all your help!!

Edited December 1, 2022 by Amberyl Ethaniel

[Gabriele Graves]

In my opinion, LL needs to add a system to mark all accounts that haven't accepted new terms of service for a length of time (let's say a month) along with all other kinds of "on-hold" or banned accounts with an "inactive" status if there isn't one already.  Then they need to do a couple of things automatically once that status is set:

• Remove all listings for that account from the marketplace.
• Return any L$ payments made to that account back to the sender's account.

All of which are reversed if/once the account has been set to an "active" status.

Edited December 1, 2022 by Gabriele Graves