Czari Zenovka

I am so very sorry to hear this, Faye. Losing a huge chunk of one's inventory that cannot be retrieved even with LL helping is disheartening (I lost my entire folder of Victorian dresses that I had collected over the years and, after a flurry of customer support tickets back and forth, LL said they could not "see" the outfits and thus were lost forever) BUT - losing all the supplies that constitute your business would be horrendous. Add to that the now all to common "Sorry about that" so-called support is rubbing salt into the wounds. It may be months, it may be years, but eventually LL will be left with very, very few content creators.

Kennylex Luckless wrote: For how often do folk intrude in to the house? I did belong to a group that had Land in Minna, we had a big house there that was open, but even it was in a popular area near Natoma we had very few users, so I just wounder if intruders are a so big problem that folk has to grief explorers, drivers and flight entusiams to protetc ther privace even they not are online? (Emphasis mine) As has already been pointed out, per the LL TOS land owners putting up any type of privacy they wish is NOT griefing. As for how often do people intrude - you'd be surprised. I have always done as you suggested and lived in the sky - just a personal preference and not made initially due to intruders. Years ago the highest one could fly or place a home was quite a bit less than 3,000m. (Can someone please refresh my memory on what the max height was back in 2007-2008?) Finding a spot in the sky where one has a modicum of privacy is tricky as well - a LOT of people have homes, building platforms, you-name-it in the sky. My former partner and I finally found a spot around 600m. So, going on your assumption that this will allow explorers to go on their merry way while simultaneously not having intruders in one's home - that didn't happen. No clue what was going on at ground level - our home was on a water sim and we didn't have any structure at water level, so people could have been swimming, sailing, walking, hot air ballooning to their hearts content. Back up at 600m, however, we averaged at least 1 person/week trying to enter our house. This was not just a "lost explorer" as people would land on our doorstep, ring the doorbell, hover outside our windows; one amusing case was a guy who kept slamming into our windows much like a bird who flies into glass windows, although our windows were very visible. Not sure if this dude thought by slamming into the window long enough it would break or he would somehow pass through solid matter (without doing the sit on a prim trick). Regardless of how entertaining this could be, there were "private times" when we did not find this so amusing. My partner finally got an orb that was set for just the perimeter of our house - it did not include the entire property which, at 600m, was just empty air - so people could fly "around" our house, just not have their noses pressed against our windows. I believe he set the time for 30 sec. The high-flying types didn't lessen, but they got "escorted away" quickly. I wore a Mystitool all the time back then and when I saw someone get within our orb space I would quickly pull up the person's profile out of curiosity. (Love reading profiles!) Nine times out of ten, the avatar was male. I was taken aback one time when one of the profiles I pulled up was filled with "Voyeur" and "Peeping Tom" groups. I didn't even know they existed. I have had no reason to look, but it would be interesting to see if those groups still exist - my assumption is they do. The point being - yes there are some people who get "lost" but there are other people who truly are "peeping" for other reasons. I was thrilled when the max air height was raised. I now live at around 3500m, do not have any kind of security on my parcel and, at least when I've been home, have not seen any "peeping toms" - lol. I also live on the same water sim, now on a parcel bordered by two protected Linden oceans. Anyone sailing in the ocean can safely pass by, around, and between my land while I'm generally in my home or building platform - in the sky.

Divine Falodir wrote: Hi My name is Kyle, and I'm a new designer in Second Life.. I make mesh furniture, and I just can't seem to get my name out there and get people to visit my store (.lame furniture, btw) So i wanted to post in here and see if maybe anyone had some advice for me on how to get your name really out there? I tried to apply to some of the events that I really like, but it just seems like no one is interested or they are always offline and don't recieve my offline IM's/Notecards. So does anyone know of anything that is accepting new designers? Or does anyone know a way that I could get some people to check out my work? Any help would be fabulously appreciated. I'm new to the forums! I don't know if this is against the rules, I will take it down if it is.. but heres my SLURL: http://maps.secondlife.com/secondlife/Orcus/200/226/3948 and my flickr! (add me as a contact, I loooooove stalking flickr!) http://www.flickr.com/photos/divinefalodir/ Thanks guys <3 -Kyle (Divine) You must be in the Homestuff Group because I know I've seen a lot of your notices. That group has probably been the single best method for my store, especially the hunt held a couple of months ago.

JeanneAnne wrote: Czari Zenovka wrote: JeanneAnne wrote: Czari Zenovka wrote: Freya Mokusei wrote: Czari Zenovka wrote: I've always seen red ban lines with the word "BAN" intermittently interspersed. Is this a different viewer thing? It changed with V2, 2010 or whenever that was. Now they're yellow, diagonal and vaguely-transparent. I believe they only display at a closer range and from more precise angles (i.e., cam almost perpendicular to the parcel line), too. Ah ok, thanks Jeanne and Freya. Yes, I am still using a PC that cannot run the updated viewers, thus I use Phoenix. I *was* able to use the SL V2 when it first came out. Logged into it and immediately said..."I don't think so," but once it was upgraded to V3, I could no longer log into V2 I still had installed. Apparently somehow those two viewers "morphed." What is interesting about SL given the differing PC systems one uses (yes I realize I'm using a dinosaur but, from reading the forums, I'm not the only one....lol), and the different viewers, the "shared experience" is not quite totally shared. Throw in individual windlight settings and custom setttings for certain skins and what one person sees within SL can look completely different to another person. Another example - mesh. I can't run any of the mesh viewers currently so people wearing mesh, on my viewer, look odd at best and ridiculous at worst. Oh, and then there are the avatars with gaping holes in them. I should be getting a new PC by the end of the year (although it still gripes me that the one I have is working perfectly for everything else BUT SL), but I may still run non-mesh viewers for the entertainment value....lol .. you need a new pc Czari !! Jeanne Yes I've been told this ad infinitum on these forums. One person went so far as to suggest I get a new "hobby" if my PC wouldn't run the new viewers and another said no one who builds should use anything but the SL v3. I am quite sure you didn't mean the statement in a mean way, Jeanne, but some people have said this to me in a very hurtful way with no idea of my RL circumstances. Sometimes in RL we have to make choices, especially in the current economic situation. On Maslow's hierarchy of needs, a new computer *just* to run a viewer to see mesh in SL is pretty far down the list....lol. oh im sorry Czari .. no i didnt mean it in a mean way @ all .. best wishes! :heart: Jeanne I was sure you didn't Jeanne. *Hugs* Mainly wanted to head off "the others." /cue Twilight Zone music...lol.

JeanneAnne wrote: Czari Zenovka wrote: Freya Mokusei wrote: Czari Zenovka wrote: I've always seen red ban lines with the word "BAN" intermittently interspersed. Is this a different viewer thing? It changed with V2, 2010 or whenever that was. Now they're yellow, diagonal and vaguely-transparent. I believe they only display at a closer range and from more precise angles (i.e., cam almost perpendicular to the parcel line), too. Ah ok, thanks Jeanne and Freya. Yes, I am still using a PC that cannot run the updated viewers, thus I use Phoenix. I *was* able to use the SL V2 when it first came out. Logged into it and immediately said..."I don't think so," but once it was upgraded to V3, I could no longer log into V2 I still had installed. Apparently somehow those two viewers "morphed." What is interesting about SL given the differing PC systems one uses (yes I realize I'm using a dinosaur but, from reading the forums, I'm not the only one....lol), and the different viewers, the "shared experience" is not quite totally shared. Throw in individual windlight settings and custom setttings for certain skins and what one person sees within SL can look completely different to another person. Another example - mesh. I can't run any of the mesh viewers currently so people wearing mesh, on my viewer, look odd at best and ridiculous at worst. Oh, and then there are the avatars with gaping holes in them. I should be getting a new PC by the end of the year (although it still gripes me that the one I have is working perfectly for everything else BUT SL), but I may still run non-mesh viewers for the entertainment value....lol .. you need a new pc Czari !! Jeanne Yes I've been told this ad infinitum on these forums. One person went so far as to suggest I get a new "hobby" if my PC wouldn't run the new viewers and another said no one who builds should use anything but the SL v3. I am quite sure you didn't mean the statement in a mean way, Jeanne, but some people have said this to me in a very hurtful way with no idea of my RL circumstances. Sometimes in RL we have to make choices, especially in the current economic situation. On Maslow's hierarchy of needs, a new computer *just* to run a viewer to see mesh in SL is pretty far down the list....lol.

Freya Mokusei wrote: Czari Zenovka wrote: I've always seen red ban lines with the word "BAN" intermittently interspersed. Is this a different viewer thing? It changed with V2, 2010 or whenever that was. Now they're yellow, diagonal and vaguely-transparent. I believe they only display at a closer range and from more precise angles (i.e., cam almost perpendicular to the parcel line), too. Ah ok, thanks Jeanne and Freya. Yes, I am still using a PC that cannot run the updated viewers, thus I use Phoenix. I *was* able to use the SL V2 when it first came out. Logged into it and immediately said..."I don't think so," but once it was upgraded to V3, I could no longer log into V2 I still had installed. Apparently somehow those two viewers "morphed." What is interesting about SL given the differing PC systems one uses (yes I realize I'm using a dinosaur but, from reading the forums, I'm not the only one....lol), and the different viewers, the "shared experience" is not quite totally shared. Throw in individual windlight settings and custom setttings for certain skins and what one person sees within SL can look completely different to another person. Another example - mesh. I can't run any of the mesh viewers currently so people wearing mesh, on my viewer, look odd at best and ridiculous at worst. Oh, and then there are the avatars with gaping holes in them. I should be getting a new PC by the end of the year (although it still gripes me that the one I have is working perfectly for everything else BUT SL), but I may still run non-mesh viewers for the entertainment value....lol

lisahaze Chun wrote: and is it free? are these updates generally free? Where Can I find out more about updates? I'm a bit confused as to exactly what you are asking. Are you referring to SL *viewers* or additions to the SL platform/content itself? Those are two entirely different things, both of which have been addressed, but thought it might be helpful to clarify. The question "is it free" leads me to think you might be thinking of SL as a genre of MMORPGs. MMORPGs such as WoW, EQ, etc. periodically introduce expansions to the games which may include more content, increase the maximum player level, introduce more quests, etc. These are separate "add ons" that are indeed purchased. These games also have patches and updates to MMORPGs, almost daily in some cases, that generally correct some issue that is not working correctly ie. a certain quest-giver is not responding to the player dialogue, certain equipment is not working correctly, etc. The patches and updates are listed on the log in screen to advise the player what has been updated the next time the player logs on.These are obviously free as they are corrections for the most part. If this was what you were thinking of, lisahaze, SL does indeed add new content periodically - Linden Homes, mesh, and pathfinding being examples - but there is no charge. (Except perhapst to upgrade one's PC to handle the upgrades - been there, lol.) New content is introduced via SL announcements or blog entries that can be found on the dashboard (home page) of this website. The new content is generally also discussed at length within these forums. OTOH, if you were asking about updates to SL viewers - that is a whole other kettle of fish. The short answer is yes, but the expanded answer is that, in addition to the official SL viewer created by LL, there are a whole host of TPVs (Third Party Viewers) which can be found here. To add another level, there is usually more than one version of each of the TPVs. These generally fall into the category of viewers that are closer in look and function to SL's 1.x viewer version (ie. the Phoenix viewer) and ones that are the TPV version of the SL v3, such as Firestorm. Again, there is no charge to dl any viewer with which to log into SL. Hope that helps regardless of which question you were asking.

JeanneAnne wrote: my point being: cursed be any1 who sets those dam yellow lines !! Jeanne Ok, now I'm confused, I've always seen red ban lines with the word "BAN" intermittently interspersed. Is this a different viewer thing?

Pamela Galli wrote: Okay got a reply from Dakota. She says she is sorry I had trouble with two sales (it was five). And good luck going to those people who got a very nice freebie and convincing/begging them to give you money out of the goodness of their hearts. Really? One person got a free mesh house and mesh kitchen -- why should they pay me for it now? I am paying LL almost $3000 a month in tier, enhancements, commissions, and cashout fees, and I cannot get even this basic level of contracted-for service? I am told "Go collect the payments yourself?" I am done. All those former Commerce Team supporters who have tried to be understanding? And now are bitter? And calling for heads to roll? Move over. /me goes off to get my tin cup and ask anyone if they feel like paying me. Another merchant received a similar message to the same issue back in July here. *Just shakes my head in utter disbelief and disgust*

Heart Brimmer wrote: Thanks for the update on this, Czari. Now more then ever people need to wear the necklace. :-) I've been keeping an eye out for when my friend comes on so I can do the "field experiment." Will update as soon as I can accomplish that.

Ceka Cianci wrote: somewhere along the line i had gotten bitten..i used to be so proud that they never got me..then somehow i ended up on their database.. Ceka, are you on the Bloodlines database or another vampire-themed one? I remember when The Hunger (think that's what it's called) appeared in SL a year or so after Bloodlines. Apparently based on the movie by the same name the M.O. of its players is to go to nightclubs or bars and randomly bite (I suppose) people BUT, here's the kicker, the victim has no knowledge of it. I still haven't figured out how that happens. Talked to my trusty friend, the Bloodlines Vamp, about this. He said the only way you can tell if Hunger vamps are in the area is by wearing their HUD. Yeah, just what I want to do - support that stupid rp - NOT. The last time I asked him for clarification of Bloodlines (as noted in my posts above) - he "reminded" me that Bloodlines aren't the only game in town and are actually less "insidious" since they are "open" about bite requests. Ok, found their website: The Hunger Game. It does indeed say that "Our game is discrete so as not to disturb any non-players you bite. They will not receive a popup and they will not be told you've "bitten" them." However, it adds: "They will also never appear on our website in any way." Ok, that's just creepy. On the one hand it's good an innocent victim who doesn't even get a choice in this particular group does not land on a database - so they say but, on the other hand, the whole thing just creeps me out. There are very creative ways to rp vampires - I met one years ago who was not a part of any of the "game HUD" types - and had amazing rp skills in addition to a great av look for the part, an AO that had all kinds of wierd effects and a castle that could have come straight from 19th century Gothic novels. IMO, wearing a HUD and walking around SL spamming bites is lazy and not rp of any kind. I'm with Perrie, for all the trouble, misconceptions, etc. Bloodlines has caused, I'd prefer to see it just shut down. But, it's a money maker and as long as it doesn't violate TOS, LL will let it stand.

Shelby Silverspar wrote: I don't mind people wandering around my house, just don't wander around my house and not speak to me! That's just rude~ lol, really tho. LOL - This reminded me of an incident when I was brand new in SL. I mean so new that I thought if I closed my drapes no one could see inside my house. :smileyvery-happy: So I was renting this two-story house in a themed sim. The house was huge, fronted a two-lane street and included a private beach. SL heaven! I tend to be on SL very late at night my time and also have low lighting RL, basically just enough to not kill my eyes when I look at the monitor. One night I'm upstairs in my SL home trying on a bunch of freebie clothes. It's about 2 am RL my time, house dark and very quiet. Also night in SL. Out of the blue I hear the door to my SL house open and see a green dot on the minimap. It sounds silly now but at the time, being so new to SL plus the whole "everything was dark and quiet in both worlds," I was a bit freaked out. The doors were locked, so how did the person get in? (Forgot how many little "nuances" there are in SL for a new resident to learn.) I quickly put some clothes on and go downstairs to find this chick wandering around my living room. I said, "May I help you?" Silence. Chick continues walking around. I try again, "Do you mind telling me why you're in my house?" No answer as intruder continues walking about ie. not afk. I was getting really annoyed by then (not to mention confused as to how she got inside in the first place). I knew nothing about ejecting people. Finally the woman poofed. I remember feeling spooked and even looking over my shoulder RL....lol. Talked to my landlord about this the next day and was introduced to some box thing by the front door that I had seen before but had no idea what it was, thus ignored it. It was modeled after the keypad for a RL home security system; if touched a blue drop down menu appeared that gave the normal land options for freezing/ejecting someone. Definitely some rude people walking around!

Toysoldier Thor wrote: And you are on a RC sim... so maybe a recent upgrade messed with all but the newest MB version. just a thought There is a thread about issues on the Le Tigre RC server after a restart here. This one was on Oct. 3 so perhaps other RC sims were restarted about the same time.

Arwen Serpente wrote: Toysoldier Thor wrote: @Czari, The only reason I did not exdcute that tool to make up for a critical missing feature in DD is that once deployed, and distributed, I couldnt ever stop it. So I could end up getting countless emails or notices from a growing number of customers every time they rez the product and not stop it. ... Hi Toy, I remember during all the discussions about the lack of DD notifications, there was at least one post regarding a notify script that only notifies once (upon first rez) and then self deletes. Zanara makes one (here: https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/ArtiZan-Business-Script-IM-Creator-on-Rez-notifies-when-products-are-unpacked/3061369) Maybe that will help you That's the one I use. I don't have the volume of sales that some merchants do so for me this solution works wonderfully.

Toysoldier Thor wrote: what really does bother me and has been totally ignored by the Commerce Team is that DD has no delivery notification. This all scared us once before to the point that we were all talking about how to put scripts in our MP products that would be triggered on-res so that we could develop some half-baked alternative to LL's DD not providing this important notification within the system. Sorry I didn't combine this all into one post. :matte-motes-bashful: I actually do use a notify on rez script for my MP items. Even though I still use MBs and am still receiving email notifications, with all the MP screw-ups, beginning with the mixed listings (which still remain lo these many months later), I decided to take whatever pro-active measures I could.

Toysoldier Thor wrote: Maybe now that LL Commerce Team is indicating that MB distributing may never be retired (cause LL cant seem to fix the bugs in DD after all these months)... the option for merchants to seriously consider is to revert back distribution to the old but more trusted MB. Especially with the "indefinite" postponement of shutting down MBs, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the MBs remain. Also another reason I will not go DD until forced to - ie. when/if the MBs are turned off. I submitted a ticket back in April asking what would happen to a merchant's MP store when the MBs were shut down and one did not yet have the ability to run DD. I was advised by Dakota Linden that as long as items were not delisted they would remain intact and could be converted to DD at a later date (or words to that effect).

Bree Giffen wrote: What do you think? What things indicate that a land is for private or public use? That's a tricky one. Re: homes I simply don't enter. However, when the subject of orbs/banlines has come up over the years, many residents say they don't mind people going inside their homes as long as they are respectful if asked to leave when the owners show up. Some residents go so far as to say they welcome visitors, even if they're at home. Expanding beyond private residences to privately held land is a whole other issue and I agree it's a bit confusing. I think people who are adamant about not wanting others on their land will use either banlines or orbs. I would not hesitate to wander onto land that I found interesting, not that I wander much anymore, lol, but would check radar to see if the owner is about and, if so, send an IM to her to ask if it is ok to be on the land.

Heart Brimmer wrote: I agree with you Perrie, that's why if someone wears the garlic necklace, you are no longer in the database. I was simply pointing out that if someone scans you and you have worn it, it will say "this person has worn the garlic necklace, please do not disturb them" I don't know IF someone went ahead and offered a bite if that person would receive it or not. To update my previous quote: As far as "There hud say that they should"nt disturb you. They still can send bite. This is what I was told by a vampire" then I believe the "vampire" who informed you of this is mistaken. I have a friend who has been in Bloodlines for years and he said after wearing/touching the garlic necklace one is "invisible" or somehow says one is "protected." At any rate he cannot send a bite request to me and apparently if someone does I don't see it. (My words in bold to distinguish the quote to which I was responding) I checked back with my friend who is in Bloodlines. He said that if someone has worn the garlic necklace it will indeed say something to the effect of "Please don't disturb them." I then asked him if someone disregarded this and still tried to send a bite request if they could. He said it will not work. Whether this is due to the garlic-protected not seeing the request by some coding or if the "vampire" gets a message they are unable to send the bite request I'm not sure. /makes note to follow up on that So, to the best of my knowledge at the moment, after wearing the garlic necklace that person will no longer get bite requests. I will follow up on what happens on the "vampire's" end if he tries to do so, ie. I'll have my friend try to send a bite request to me. I will say that I did get a number of bite requests, usually in "vamp hangouts" like info hubs in the past but, since wearing the necklace and clicking it, never received another one, even when dumped into crowded hubs during times my home sim is offline. IMO, it would be fairly useless for the Bloodlines creator to offer a garlic necklace ostensibly to keep those using it from being bothered by bite spam (and I daresay the main reason the creator did so was the uproar from residents about bite spam when Bloodlines was first released and the resultant bad publicity) to then have to depend on Bloodlines players adhering to a "pretty please don't bite that person" situation.

Kaidin Ulrik wrote: nah it's jsut like the barter system has always been, things come in waves. the last wave wa the bdsm and just be overtly sexified.... i think that needs to go because it's just been too trendish... bloodlines was the thing to do for soooo many but they were ditzy and shifty.... there were way many hornballs and a ton of bots, it's time for those who really see what this stuff can achieve to come together and get it done.... the good part of sl will come back again, i miss the underground scene and events where people want to have a good time not just make some money for showing up.... but it takes those who know the market and are able to make things happen to be able to establish hotspots and premiere sims. when sex sells goes to just being whatever, and feeding the mind and body with creativity are revived sl will see a lot that hasn't been around because we can do a lot more with rl and other internet resources now! So if I'm understanding you correctly, established merchants, some of whom are making their RL income from SL and others who are supplementing their income to the tune of $500/mo or more (and yes, I do know many merchants in this category) don't know the market and are not able to make things happen? Incredible. You've stated yourself that you've never given commerce a try. Why not become one of those great visionaries and open a store, club, rp venue, etc. Czari over and out on this particular issue.

Kaidin Ulrik wrote: i'm simply pointing at commerce and how merchants have access to more.... giving us room to make more stuff happen as others come in. the money isn't am otive but it's a huuuuuuuuuge target right now no matter how u try to see it.... more people bring up money in a day then just being socially active. me i use this for music and entertainment not money, but i can se the motive in gettign more people in through commerce. Have you read any threads on the Merchant Forums lately? There have been so many major screwups re: The Marketplace that some well-known/established merchants have closed up shop completely; others have reduced their SL businesses to just the bare minimum and have gone to other grids or some very ingenious types are selling via their own websites. These would be the type of items that translate outside of SL, such as mesh and animations. There is currently a huge land glut in SL. As you travel around, open up the map and look at the sea of yellow denoting land for sale. Click on some of those areas and see how many are abandoned land selling for 1L sqm. With the advent of Direct Delivery in the SL Marketplace, there is no longer a need to own/rent any land to set up shop whereas previously at least a small chunk of land was needed to place a Magic Box. This is a good news/bad news type of issue. It's great that someone new to SL who wants to try their hand at selling creations can do so with little investment besides their time but, on the other hand, this glut of cheap land is greatly affecting another area of commerce - those who sell/rent land. LL already dealt a blow to land sellers when they introduced Linden Homes which places LL in direct competition with their own customers. The MP fiascos just since last April alone (mixed listings, being charged double for listing enhancements, items being sold/customers having lindens deducted from their accounts for purchases/but merchants not receiving the funds for the sales, etc., etc.) are causing long-time merchants to pull their hair out in frustration. If that is happening to people who have been in SL 3-6 years, how long do you think a new Resident setting up shop would put up with this before saying adios? Even if I knew someone who would like to give SL a try for commerce purposes, I couldn't in good conscience suggest it until and if LL gets its act together in this regard. I agree that content creators and those who have the creativity and imagination to open amazing venues for us to enjoy have access to the tools with which to make this happen, but many are choosing these tools on other grids. Those who wish to purchase entire sims for their creations can do so at FAR greater cost than on SL. I personally love SL and am not saying "the sky is falling" but, having been involved with commerce even on a small scale and watching the issues that are prompting many creators to move elsewhere, I believe the era of creators and entrepreneurs flooding into SL is over. It is sad to watch places that I so enjoyed over the years disappear. If someone is interested in giving SL a try for the creative aspect and doesn't expect to make any appreciable money from it, that is the type of person to whom I would recommend SL; but if the basic motive is making decent money, which was the premise of your original post, unfortuantely SL may disappoint in that regard.

Kaidin Ulrik wrote: i think the focus has to be on those who just want money first and foremost =x as much as i hate to say it! music heads, designers, architects, fashion minds, social party goers who want to sim their next big event, and artists who are trying to make global connects also again u have to have something set up simwise that they can get an idea of everything coming in... we need something like prim towers again only more in depth! I would have to disagree on that. I had no interest whatsoever in making money in SL when I began - I didn't even know it was possible. I came with my rp group from IRC on invitation of someone in SL from a similar rp group. It is a common phenomenon to think that because I might like a given activity, then everyone else must as well. When I was into heavy rp, the only people I met were other rpers. From spending a lot of time at dance venues, I meet a ton of people who only come to dance/socialize. One particular person who I've come to know in the last year has been in SL since 2009 and ONLY comes to dance. To my knowledge he has never spent a penny in SL (all clothes/skin/shape, etc. are freebies) and has no interest in anything other than dancing. When I opened a small shop and began reading the merchant forums, it can seem like SL is comprised of only merchants. You get the drift.

JeanneAnne wrote: >>He says he doesn't see anything to kill.<< LoL .. sounds like my brothers .. maybe he coulduv killed the naked man who spoke French .. so very sorry about your friend who passed away .. Jeanne Thank you for the kind words, Jeanne. I miss her so much. Trying to get hard core gaming types to "get" SL is almost a lost cause I think. Can't say we didn't try.

Pretty much the same here, Jeanne: *When I first came to SL in 2007 from having spent the last 15 years or so in various social and rp channels, I went back to IRC and encouraged a friend to try it. She couldn't get the viewer to run on her PC, tried several times and gave up. *Any discussion of SL with RL friends and family has been met with blank stares at best and comments about wasting my time on a porn environment at worst. *Took a 6-month break from SL last year and returned to EQ. Mentioned SL to a number of people in my guild and received the same general response from all: "I tried that game; didn't like it." I tried explaining SL was a "virtual world," not a game, although there were games *in* SL. If I could have seen their faces they likely would have been the blank stares I saw in RL. *Finally got a friend from EQ to give SL a try. This is someone who is extremely skilled at MMORPGs, computers, and technology in general. His SL name was a bit odd (not that *that* in and of itself is unusual...lol), so asked him if it stood for something. He said, "Crap!!!! That is showing???? That's my pw!!!!" Now just how he managed to think he was entering a pw in the name area was beyond me. Not having created a new av for a long time, I went through the new resident sign up process and discovered it *is* a bit confusing. There is some verbiage about not worrying too much about your name, you can change it in world. Friend starts over and creates new AV with a name (instead of pw). I show him around a bit. He says he doesn't see anything to kill. *Sighs* I think he may have logged in once more, but that was it. *I was introduced to WoW by another EQ friend. Turns out he had created a SL account years ago but said he logged in and all he saw was a naked man who spoke French, didn't see anything else to do, so never returned. I told him what my SL name is and we agreed to meet in SL. Never happened. Going one step further, of the good friends I made within SL: *After my partner of 3 years and I broke up, he left SL and, to my knowledge, never returned. He was getting tired of SL before we broke up and was only logging in to see me. *A good female friend left SL for IW 2 years ago. *One of my best friends who I met over 15 years ago on IRC discovered SL before I did, but never mentioned it until I excitedly told her about joining in SL during a phone call; which is when she laughed and said she was already here. She died RL last Nov. :smileysad: *I've taken a lot of classes in SL over the years. Most of my favorite instructors have either stated on their profiles they are no longer around or haven't logged into SL in a long time, nor posted on their blogs.

JeanneAnne wrote: Czari Zenovka wrote: jwenting wrote: There was an economy. The only way for there not to be one is for nobody to make, share, sell, or buy anything whatsoever. As I know I did all those things almost (except selling stuff), there must have been an economy. There just wasn't a quarterly *report* of the economy (like we used to get). so how come we dont get them anymore? what are they hiding? & how do you know that the reports they use2 provide were accurate? Jeanne As for why we're not getting them anymore - honestly I've forgotten the "official" reason. Someone else will likely know. As for knowing if they were accurate - after the reports were posted, there was almost always a flurry of posts on the general theme of "the numbers are being artifically inflated" - speaking of number of new residents (are these unique new residents or another alt of someone); people questioned the financials, etc. (Maybe that was the reason LL quit posting them...lol).

Dillon Levenque wrote: There's no question that 100L$ (in exchange value) means much more in some places than others, but I think in terms of Second Life maybe the differences are not all that important. Just about everyone in Second Life is using a computer they (or someone in their family) owns. Just about everyone in Second Life is using an internet connection they or their family or some organization they are connected with pay(s) for. Right now in my neighborhood you can get SL usable internet for about 5,000L$/month (first six months, special introductory offer, exclusions apply). A person who needs to think carefully about spending 100L$ should not be spending money on internet access. This woman probably does not have internet access at home. She probably doesn't mind, since there's a good chance she doesn't have a computer anyway (nor electricity, for that matter). Might not even know what a computer is. Funny thing is: she seems to be in a pretty positive mood. Maybe she knows something we don't. Maybe she doesn't know stuff we do. The important thing is: she's found a way to make that work for her. Will I meet her in RL or SL? No, probably not. Would she be thrilled to have my (unexciting by local standards but no doubt fabulous by hers) income? Maybe. Maybe she'd be smart enough to decide she's gotten this far with what she has. She does look pretty smart. I kind of got off track, but I was trying to suggest that for just about everyone in Second Life (I do realize there are some possible exceptions) the price of Lindens doesn't really matter all that much. People for whom the exchange value of 100L$ matters are probably not wasting their money on internet access. Edited: I'd originally made an erroneous comment based on Phaedra's numbers (the error was mine). Deleted one sentence and replaced it with another. This reminds me of an old, somewhat obscure movie - The Gods Must Be Crazy. It is presented as a documentary but is actually a comedy. In a nutshell, an isolated native tribe is healthy, happy and thriving until a pilot throws a Coke bottle out of his airplane and either hits one of the tribes people or it falls in front of him. Having never seen anything like this, the bottle becomes a treasure, resulting in jealousy, fighting, and general interruption of the peaceful life the tribe had known prior A bit of a commentary on materialism. Great movie - higly recommend it.