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Super String

Direct Delivery Second Life - payment system broken

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Merchants, don't hurry to update to Direct Delivery on the Second Life Marketplace, because there might probably be a Delivery Disaster waiting for you, just like what I've been experiencing--since I finished migration to the new system, I never receive payments from any sales, but the customers still being charged by their purchases.

Direct delivery works, but the payment system turns to be a disaster, because even though customers receive items, the transaction history doesn't update, merchants won't get payments.

 

Original JIRA 4559 https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/WEB-4559  (being closed and merged to Mickey's issue JIRA 4441 by LL)

Update>> New JIRA 4580 https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/WEB-4580

 

1. I'm a merchant. Since I've updated all my products to the new direct delivery system on 3/21, all purchases in my store have been stuck on "being delivered" for days.

2. The test delivery works well, but the real delivery/transaction never be successful.

3. Even when I tried to buy something in my own store and already got the item inworld, the transaction history stays showing undelivered.

4. Even though my purchases were charged by the marketplace, the payment never got received by my store. Neither can I get any payments from other customer's purchases.


marketplace 1.jpgmarketplace 2.jpg

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Let me just say it...

Someone at Linden Labs is stealing.

Care to deny it, Lindens?

OK.

Take me to court and see how far you get with that. 

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Super String,

I've been reading your posts and JIRA about all your sales getting stuck in Undelivered, and I've been thinking about what might cause it. As far as I know you are the only one suffering this problem. So I want to ask you some questions.

Do you unpack your items so they are delivered as a Folder, or did you just put your Boxed item into the Merchant Outbox and allow DD to deliver the boxed items just like the Magic Boxes did before?

If you did unpack, when you've made a test purchase (or when anyone else has made a purchase) are you sure every single item is in the folder, or are there one or more items missing from the folder?

I'm thinking that it might be stuck at undelivered because it hasn't been able to deliver ALL the parts that it's supposed to deliver. If for some reason there is one item in the folder that cannot be delivered, that might cause it to get hung up and never fully complete ... and thus it would never pay you either.

I hope you don't mind me asking. I'm as anxious to understand and fix this issue as I'm sure you are.

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sorry Super - went through that in January, with a stuck in "being delivered" phase on a large portion of sales, and lost a ton of income on it.

I filed a support ticket to get paid, and here's what they did.....

they told me to go to a Jira and describe the problem.  So I did, along with some others, and it sounds like the others were given the same message, that to collect your funds, you had to go to that Jira.

Then in the Jira they said that they cannot give us funds until they fix something.  Huh?  that's bull.

I'll go find it for you.  I reported only one loss, just to see if they would refund, was not going to go through a whole month of records and spend hours on that.  Cannot get a refund for 10 bucks for 3 months, so glad I did not go through all of that work.

That's one reason I pulled completely off of marketplace, because January was pure hell, with the same problem.  You're going to have people here tell you to do this or that and that you are doing something wrong......

maybe, maybe not.  but they have already said more or less that they are not refunding on the "being delivered" phase - just a heads up on that.

here it is  https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/WEB-4441

anyway, that's how they handled customer support on that - sent us to a cell in the basement and washed their hands of it.

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Darrius,

yes, I unpacked my items and they are delivered as folders. When I received the folder inworld myself, everything was in the folder.

Further infomations--all my products are unrigged mesh, and I also use a second folder.  

I don't mind you asking, of course, I don't even really mind the small loss of my money, what I want most is ths problem can be completely solved and I can rely on the report and system again.

Although experiencing this problem, I think Direct Delivery is a right direction in the long term, ideally it should help to reduce customer's risk and make marketplace a more efficient tool.

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Super String you certainly are not the only one experiencing this. I escaped all the other problems people seem to be having, in fact, migrating went like a dream.

Took me around 5 minutes to complete the migration, maybe 10. Easy as. Did a test purchase, payment taken, all items received, but Transaction stuck on 'Being Delivered' for both myself and the buyer. No payment received for that or any subsequent transaction.

It's not that I rely on sales to pay tier or anything, but that is not the point. The payment system is broken, at least for some of us. I'm watching and voted for the JIRA, if there's anything more I can do, let me know.

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Hi Mickey, I had that same experience and was sent to JIRA 4441. It appears though that the two situations are different.

In JIRA 4441, the customer did not receive the item and the order is stuck in "Being Delivered" on both customer and Merchant sides. At least in my case (I spoke with the customer who confirmed she had not received the item and has been charged for it).

In this new situation, the customer does receive the item, and is charged, but the records on both sides still show "Being Delivered" and the Merchant does not receive payment.

They are both failures of the system, but a little different in nature.

 

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hi Arwen - yeah, I know it is a different issue, just giving example of how they handled it.  I recall that when it happened on Valentine's Day, that some reported being reimbursed.  Guess it depends upon what day and who you know.

just saying, think about it, if it happens all day long, and you are not in a position to give stuff away all day.

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OMG...

It sounds awful!!:matte-motes-crying:

In my case, I'm sure the item was indeed delivered to the customer, and the customer was also charged, because I myself was that customer

I was charged by marketplace when I purchased my own products in order to test DD, the payments neither be refunded to me (customer) nor be received by myself (merchant). The money was just gone to nowhere.

 

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Super and Arwen -

maybe they will fix it on the Direct Delivery system - suspected that they did not want to attempt on the old system, since DD was on they way, and that's sort of fine (not really)

but very disappointed to see all of the problems the last few days.  Beyond not being reimbursed, it took massive amounts of time each day to contact each customer and figure out what happened - required several messages and notes back and forth, trying to figure out who actually paid, who got refunded, most customers could not really figure it out on their transaction list, nor did they want to spend time doing so, and filing a support ticket, was too much to ask of them - I HATE doing that, and will only do it if I'm really pissed that day.

So beyond the fund collection issue, it was just a major time suck each day.  Sorry you're having such a problem with that, hopefully that one will get fixed right away.

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Unless Super String is also the person who started the thread "Free for you and you and you..." I think there is more than one person affected.

And are you surprised?  

There is a long history of releasing functionality and then reacting to clean it up and correct it after the fact.  Terms like scalability, performance, and reliability appear to be elusive ones whenever there is a major functional rollout of any nature.  Just take a look at the MP performance since redirecting everyone there to buy the bear.  

It took me close to an hour to find and purchase one item yesterday.  That merchant uses DD and I wonder if they know that I bought from them and if they got paid.  I know that I paid for the product.


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I have to agree with Darrius as it seems more like problem unique to how the migration process happened specifically for those that are getting this issue.  When I saw this thread I got nervous that the few sales I had made so far on my DD migrated items were delivering me my $L after the sale, but I confirmed that they were.  I did receive payment for my DD delivered items.

But my migrate was one of the most simple.  I only have about 40~ items in MP in total and my 6 hottest sellers were excluded from the DD migration until I am 100% comfortable that the DD is working properly and that most of the SL Residents are fully aware of what DD is.

I also did the basic Boxed Item MagicBox to Boxed Item DD migration.  I did not unbox anything into folders.  Nor did I rename any migrated items when I moved to DD.  Finally I only did about a dozen or less items at a time and tested before I went to the next batch.  I was worried with LL likely not preparing for the massive migration they were forcing on us with the tight migration cutover that their systems would become overloaded (which we all saw that it did).  As such, making my own massive blocks of migrations was a risk.  So I did a little at a time.

Just my thoughts - because my DD items are working 100% that I see.

I still wished LL would send a DELIVERED PRODUCT notification after the sale was 100% completed and the customer was assured to have his/her product delivered and that the merchant was paid.

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I have the same issue for items being sold on the 22 and 23. The items in question were at the time boxed DD items, they have been converted to folders yesterday and today. 

I have filed a ticket for it. 

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Yup, now that more folks are coming forward, it clearly is not unique to Super String. Also since the customer is getting all the parts, that theory just went down in flames. (I was thinking that maybe one particular item common to all products was getting hung up.)

So now I guess we wait until Monday when the LL Crew comes back in and realizes they've got a bonfire (literally) burning a hole in their new feature. Whatever is going wrong, it's probably some sort of timing / interlocking thread issue ... but that's just one of those edumacated guesses at this point.

I've only converted one product to DD as I'm waiting for ANS to be released. It wasn't my intention to wait this long ... but sometimes we just screw up the right way. 8^)

Here's to hoping they dig out and exterminate this bug before lunchtime out west. Cheers!

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I've had nothing but problems with Direct Delivery... to the point I'm about to swear off Linden Lab and close down my store.

 

Except of course, there appears to be no way to delete my store.

 

The problems are varied and major:

1. The system can actually duplicate items with identical names.  If this happens... you can't mass-delete the errant items.   You have to delete them one... by... one.  And with the lag on SLM... that can take hours.  Or days.  Or weeks.

" There are multiple items with the same name. To list or combine items, please review and mange them accordingly."

That is a royal pain.  Why not delete en-masse and re-try ???

 

2. Items that are showing up as errant... but cannot be deleted.  I reported this bug to LL a long, long time ago... but of course it's still unfixed.

 

3. Although it is possible to edit the listing name... the item name cannot be changed (at least, not that I can see).

 

4. System keeps "resetting connection" when I try to access my Marketplace home.

 

Not to mention the extreme lag. One has to wonder at LL giving us such a limited amount of time to convert our inventory.  Do they have no idea how many merchants are involved in this... or how many items we'll be converting.

 

This is a major pain in the tooshie that will never be worth all the work involved in moving from a simple prim rezzed on a piece of land.

 

 

 

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I have said this in other blog posts will say it here...even with the workarounds that Darrius supplied and what I also tried.. the DD system is horrendous if you have a large amount of items to do. It has so far caused me untold amount of waste of time waiting for pages to refresh, resynching inventory, waiting and then clicking again. The sad thing about it all it does not even surprise me anymore. 

LL has a crazy time out in the Delete. The web site is working like a turtle. The time it takes to do things on the merchant web side is absolutely ridiculous. Again, like I said and will continue to say, one massive screw up as usual.

Why cant the LL tech team just get one thing right before they release it? Absolutely amazing. Any CTO worth anything would have fired these people on the spot.

Shows a total disregard for people and their time and so typical of the way LL handles things. For years this has been going on and just repeats itself over and over again no matter what promises are made. 

Merchants who have 20 or even 100 items are tickled pink. Go over that number, and you are up the creek without a paddle. 

Just sad. Really sad. That is all one can say about this DD update. Truly sad.

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Bump.

If you take a look at the JIRA, this is being reported by large Merchants now.

https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/WEB-4559

Since switching to DD, my sales have plummeted. I don't know if people just can't deal with the website lag, or, if something changed with search (although whenever I try to search for something it generally times out), or, if deliveries are being made and the transactions are not being recorded because the system is timing out.

If I thought I could change back to the Magic Boxes now, I would. The risk of further damaging the business is the only thing preventing me from doing it.

 

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Eren Padar wrote:

1. The system can actually
duplicate
items with identical names.  If this happens... you can't mass-delete the errant items.   You have to delete them one... by... one.  And with the lag on SLM... that can take hours.  Or days.  Or weeks.

"
There are multiple items with the same name. To list or combine items, please review and mange them accordingly."

That is a royal pain.  Why not
delete en-masse
and re-try ???

Double-check your Magic Boxes and make sure the duplicated items are not found in ANY Magic Box. Use the Magic Box Status page to make sure the only Magic Boxes (called Servers on the Status page) listed are really there. Remove any Magic Boxes listed that no longer exist.

Once done with that, Sync Marketplace with Magic Boxes .. wait five minutes .. and reload the Manage Listings page. That's your best bet to fixing the duplicated items problem.


Eren Padar wrote:

3. Although it is possible to edit the listing name... the item name cannot be changed (at least, not that I can see).

Edit the Product Listing. Right above the blank that says "Item Name" (which is the name of the Product Listing) is a button marked "Edit associated object". That's where you choose the name of the Item to deliver. No, you cannot edit it. You must either rename the item in the Magic Box, resync Magic Boxes then select the "New" (renamed) object, or upload a new folder for Direct Delivery and "Edit Associated Object" to pick the new DD Folder.


Eren Padar wrote:

4. System keeps "resetting connection" when I try to access my Marketplace home.

This sounds like a problem that often occurs on Wireless internet connections. If you can, switch to a wired connection and try that. If all else fails, power cycle your Internet Modem, the Router (if any) and any other network devices between you and the Internet. When was the last time you rebooted? (Old Techie Saying - "If at first you don't succeed, Ctrl-Alt-Delete")

Best of luck on the issues. Above all else, try and keep positive. Every problem has a solution. Sometimes they are just hiding on the tip of our noses though.

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We converted over to the DD system during the last 3 days by simply placing the same boxed products from old market boxes  still boxed to DD and during the past 3 days have had huge numbers of "Being Delivered" transactions followed up with customers to find they had all received the product without issues but i hadn't been paid for any of the transactions then tested with ourselves and staff purchasing the same products only to find that we also received them right away but i wasn't paid for any of the transactions and they all went into the "Being Delivered" holding pattern.I personally dont think this is an issue of how a merchant did the changeover but more a pot luck of when they did the changeover at any given moment during the day and what code was doing or being played with at that time by LL.We have filed a ticket contacted concierge and voted on Supers jira an i imagine are due for a run around on the phone Monday morning.I know something similar took place during Valentines weekend but it seems unless big numbers of merchants get vocal with them about an issue not much is done the deal with it let alone acknowledge it exists.In the end i guess Im really just posting so the other victims to this latest problem don't feel its just them  being touched by the random market  glitch demon.

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Mickey Vandeverre wrote:

 

maybe, maybe not. 
but they have already said more or less that they are not refunding on the "being delivered" phase
- just a heads up on that.

here it is 

anyway, that's how they handled customer support on that - sent us to a cell in the basement and washed their hands of it.

In this case customers apparently are being charged though so I'm wondering how exactly one distinguishes this from criminal theft. 

Is Commerce team hoping to do a lag rather than just create the stuff?

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It might come back. 

Try resetting the scripts in it, resynching and refreshing your inventory page on the marketplace, and going to X-street to see if your box shows there.  You could also burn a bear.  I don't think any of these things actually help but my disappearing marketplace inventory stuff always tends to come back automatically after a while, so the point is to fill in your time and reduce the sense of impotency while you wait.

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