Refund Money for a claim?

[birne5 Beck]

Hello,

 

I have a problem!  I sell a article full perm (Link:  ) and all scripts work together. A customer unlinked the article because he want only some parts off it. So some scripts are not working anymore (the scripcts work in a network).  So customer complains that he can do nothing because he can't script. He want a refound now for this article. 

Do I have to pay back the money? He has received what the description says.

He would like to report me to LindenLab if he dosn't get the money. Is this legitimate?

 

[Knowl Paine]

You do not have to give a refund.

They broke it, they own it.

If the Customer want to report you, they can do that. I don't believe that Linden Lab will get involved.

This is a non-issue.

[birne5 Beck]

OK thanks for your answer... i thought the same but i needed another meaning too

[Ariel Vuissent]

Knowl's right. If the product had been broken when he got it, there might be an issue, but HE broke it. You provided what you said you would provide, and it's not your fault that the customer chose to try to take it apart and thus broke it.

I do suggest (especially since you sell the object full perm, letting people modify it) that you include a notecard with the purchase explaining that the scripts in each part work together, so unlinking the parts will break the product.

[Amethyst Jetaime]

Absolutely not. It was entirely his fault.

He can't return' a full perm item.  He will always have a copy of it unless they delete it from their inventory and there is no way that you can know if that is done.

Its not your fault he doesn't have the skills he needs to create what he wants.  He can hire a scripter to mod the scritps to work on the parts he wanted.

He can report you all he wants but nothing will happen.  LL does not get involved in disputes between customers and merchants.  It even states that in the TOS in section 10.1 .

[iCade]

Did you state in the product page that unlinking parts will break the scripting?

[Perrie Juran]

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iCade wrote:

Did you state in the product page that unlinking parts will break the scripting?

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Does a car dealer need to tell me if i take the tires off the car i am not going to get very far?

[birne5 Beck]

Did you state in the product page that unlinking parts will break the scripting?

 

I don't state it in the product page, but it is clear that for example a built-rental system in a photostudio are networked with the other scripts. 

[Chelsea Malibu]

Since the product is full perm, just send him a replacement. Seems to be the easiest path to good customer service.

You don't have to do anything but if you want to offer crap for support even when it's their fault, then that is up to you but I personally think it's a no brainier..Just replace his product, it's not costing you anything to do so.

[Pamela Galli]

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iCade wrote:

Did you state in the product page that unlinking parts will break the scripting?

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It's like when someone complains because I did not mention that the set does not include X.  I include a list of everything included. If I included a list of everything not included, it would be a very long list.

Creators should not be expected include a list of all the ways something can be broken.

[Pamela Galli]

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Chelsea Malibu wrote:

Since the product is full perm, just send him a replacement. Seems to be the easiest path to good customer service.

You don't have to do anything but if you want to offer crap for support even when it's their fault, then that is up to you but I personally think it's a no brainier..Just replace his product, it's not costing you anything to do so.

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He doesn't want a replacement, he wants money.  (Apparently he is part of an industry in SL that consists of buying copyable items then demanding a refund.) It is not crap for support not to send it.

[Ilyra Chardin]

I agree with the responses that said that you do not have to give a refund.  I would also encourage you to state under your store's profile that you do not give refunds for full perm items.  As for those that recommended giving the customer another one - there's no need.  It's a full perm item and they already have a back-up full perm copy in their inventory.

Most people can and will be reasonable if you speak to them, but there will always be that percentage of people that are difficult no matter what you do.  And you can't do anything about that.  

If you've tried to help and reason with them and they're still unyielding and threatening to report you, let them.  As others have said, likely nothing will come of their report.

Besides how much are we talking about?  2,500L?  which is...um...ten dollars US?

Always helps to put things in perspective.

My two cents (L$5)

[Chelsea Malibu]

Still doesn't mean she can't replace it.  The post has been focused on getting him his money back.  If its full perm of course not but I've not seen anyone suggest offering a replacement.

[Princess Verwood]

Everyone is right. While many people have enough sense to not take things apart seeing how they all need to be linked together in order to work, there's a percentage out there (i.e. the customer in the OP posting) who will. So while we all may be smarty pants, it might be wise to still include the fact that they all need to be linked in order to function and taking it apart will break it. I also agree that you (birne5) should include a notecard with the product stating that you do not give refunds on full perm items.

Whether you'd like to try and explain to the customer how the scripts work, or offer him a new replacement (though like many has already said, he should have a copy of it since it's full perm), or whatever...how you'd like to deal with him is up to you. :matte-motes-big-grin: Hope all works out for you!

[Perrie Juran]

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Pamela Galli wrote:

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Chelsea Malibu wrote:

Since the product is full perm, just send him a replacement. Seems to be the easiest path to good customer service.

You don't have to do anything but if you want to offer crap for support even when it's their fault, then that is up to you but I personally think it's a no brainier..Just replace his product, it's not costing you anything to do so.

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He doesn't want a replacement, he wants money.  (Apparently he is part of an industry in SL that consists of buying copyable items then demanding a refund.) It is not crap for support not to send it.

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If I buy and destroy something by taking it apart (and yes I have done that) I would consider it MY responsibility.  If a Merchant then replaced that item for free I would consider that above and beyond customer service.  If they didn't replace it I might bemoan my fate, but it was still my problem, not the Merchants.

Also, the OP stated that the item was Full Perm so a copy still resides in the buyers inventory. 

If the buyer is playing the game that the OP now states, trying to get something for nothing, I would play the game back.  "Sorry you had this problem and the original got destroyed.  Here is a replacement."

The other alternative would be for the OP to ask the customer exactly what were they trying to accomplish.  For instance, "I wanted to use animation X in a sex bed I already own."    The OP could just provide the animation no mod/ no transfer to the buyer as a gesture of good will.

 

[Pamela Galli]

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Chelsea Malibu wrote:

Still doesn't mean she can't replace it.  The post has been focused on getting him his money back.  If its full perm of course not but I've not seen anyone suggest offering a replacement.

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She can give him another copy, but why, if he already has one in inventory? That is why you have not seen anyone suggest offering a replacement.

[VonGklugelstein Alter]

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Pamela Galli wrote:

It's like when someone complains because I did not mention that the set does not include X. 

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I get rocked on this one all the time. People shop by looking at pictures now , half of them do not even bother to read the text.

[Pamela Galli]

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VonGklugelstein Alter wrote:

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Pamela Galli wrote:

It's like when someone complains because I did not mention that the set does not include X. 

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I get rocked on this one all the time. People shop by looking at pictures now , half of them do not even bother to read the text.

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If there is something in the picture that is not included, I do specifically mention, in all caps, that it is not included.

But ppl will assume something is included that is not in the picture and nowhere implied.  But that's true also if they bought a clearly labeled transfer item and are mad because it is not copy.

[Paula001 Goldschein]

since your customer 'threatened' to report you, i picture the customer didn't adress  you in a nice, polite way from the start? if that is the case screw refunds or a redelivery.
if he would have been nice from the beginning, a refund or store credit would have been in order to keep sl fun for everyone. it wouldn't have been like you have lost anything. although, easy talk for me since i don't sell any full perm items.

further i don't agree with llyra (exception!), personally i don't like the no refunds  comment. to me it sounds like you cannot talk to the merchant about issues in general and it makes me feel unwelcome right away.

you could update the marketplace listing as someone pointed out, adding that the scripts do not work by themselves. it may cost you a sale or some but i believe in honest listings, sometimes customers show you a point of view you haven't even thought about. always try to avoid to get in the same situation a second time.

edited: as icade pointed out

[iCade]

Wow at some of the responses to my simple question.

Not everyone knows about scripting, or at least not in depth, I certainly don't, but what I do know is that I can and have taken scripted items apart before without them breaking. So honestly? I wouldn't know whether picking an item apart would or would not break it till I tried it.

Everyone started out at one point, and what may be very clear to you guys, may have not been to that costumer. I am not defending him, from what I read he wasn't corteous, something I simply can't condone. But I'd just like to give my two cents as someone who knows nothing about scripting and whose new to building.

Every extra text of line goes a long way and helps the costumer. I actually did come builds before that stated 'don't unlink this and that or it won't work' and for that I was thankful. It saved me my Linden that were much more happily spent on other things

[Paula001 Goldschein]

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iCade wrote:

Wow at some of the responses to my simple question

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well you made a good point without trying, enjoy lol!

[Ilyra Chardin]

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Paula001 Goldschein wrote:

further i don't agree with llyra (exception!), personally i don't like the no refunds  comment. to me it sounds like you cannot talk to the merchant about issues in general and it makes me feel unwelcome right away.

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They don't have to put that in their store policies that they do not give refunds for full perm item purchases, but if they have no intention of ever giving a refund for full perm items, I think it's best to state that up front.

Just my opinion.

[Paula001 Goldschein]

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Ilyra Chardin wrote:

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Paula001 Goldschein wrote:

further i don't agree with llyra (exception!), personally i don't like the no refunds  comment. to me it sounds like you cannot talk to the merchant about issues in general and it makes me feel unwelcome right away.

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They don't have to put that in their store policies that they do not give refunds for full perm item purchases, but if they have no intention of ever giving a refund for full perm items, I think it's best to state that up front.

Just my opinion.

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hmmm yes true

 

[Ela Talaj]

Your "network" is poorly designed to begin with so you should prolly redo it. If don't know how, pay someone who does.

Let's consider this. The Internet is just a bunch of servers and routers and user stations. You take out any part of it and it is going to adjust very fast and will do without (unless of course you take out all DNS servers but this is not going to happen any time soon). On a smaller scale, the SL is a grid of servers, talking to each other all the time. But if several servers go down, it affects only the regions they support, not the whole grid. On an even smaller scale any script talking to other scripts, either local or remote should gracefully handle a situation when there is no one to talk to. In such case it may for instance switch to a stand-alone mode.

Yet you don't owe anything to a customer and LL would not get involved.

[Paul Hexem]

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Ela Talaj wrote:

Your "network" is poorly designed to begin with so you should prolly redo it. If don't know how, pay someone who does.

Let's consider this. The Internet is just a bunch of servers and routers and user stations. You take out any part of it and it is going to adjust very fast and will do without (unless of course you take out all DNS servers but this is not going to happen any time soon). On a smaller scale, the SL is a grid of servers, talking to each other all the time. But if several servers go down, it affects only the regions they support, not the whole grid. On an even smaller scale any script talking to other scripts, either local or remote should gracefully handle a situation when there is no one to talk to. In such case it may for instance switch to a stand-alone mode.

Yet you don't owe anything to a customer and LL would not get involved.

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I'm always amused by input from someone that clearly has never done any scripting, telling people they should improve their scripts. There's a very used function called llMessageLinked. Guess what it does? Passes messages between links in an object. Unlink them, and now they don't work. Adding ways for links to talk with things like llSay or llShout or more is just un-needed lag when that function works perfectly well. Or, in this case, it could be using functions like llSetLinkTexture or llSetLinkPrimitiveParams... Things that simply stop working when the linkset is no longer linked.