Lindens Statements from Governance Meeting

[Zalificent Corvinus]

Just now, JacksonBollock said:

And there's the rub... the legality or otherwise of a contract is almost always open to question.

That's what expensive lawyers are for  

And you admitted you are not one.

Oh but you spoke to some.

Guess what, their replies translate into real English as

"Yes, I'm prepared to waste thousands of currency units of YOUR money finding out that you are wrong! Oh by the way, I'm not  licenced to practice in California, so I'll waste even more of your money hiring American lawyers to waste your money, and charge a commission on that on top of my already extortionate fees. Thank you for your business, sucker".

 

You could look up the law suits of previous attempts to claim the ToS didn't count and that [insert idiot with more legal budget dollars than braincells here] tried claiming they were entitled to something the ToS said they were not.

 

 

[JacksonBollock]

1 minute ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

And you admitted you are not one.

Oh but you spoke to some.

Guess what, their replies translate into real English as

"Yes, I'm prepared to waste thousands of currency units of YOUR money finding out that you are wrong! Oh by the way, I'm not  licenced to practice in California, so I'll waste even more of your money hiring American lawyers to waste your money, and charge a commission on that on top of my already extortionate fees. Thank you for your business, sucker".

 

You could look up the law suits of previous attempts to claim the ToS didn't count and that [insert idiot with more legal budget dollars than braincells here] tried claiming they were entitled to something the ToS said they were not.

 

 

Ooph, ok ok Zalificent, you win  

[Love Zhaoying]

30 minutes ago, Sid Nagy said:

One can even try to change the rules by discussing, sometimes even protesting.
But one should pick the targets one wants to accomplish carefully and above all realistic. Just like the way of discussing and protesting.
"I demand this, I demand that..." is not the best way 99.9% of the time.

Using the word "lawyer" over and over doesn't help?

[Love Zhaoying]

14 minutes ago, Scylla Rhiadra said:

Hah. 

While I in fact have produced images that are thematically related to all of this -- one on RL child sexual abuse, and another very explicitly on a*eplay in SL -- neither employed nudity or explicit visual sexual imagery.

I can't imagine a context in which I'd require a naked child avi, in or out of a sexual context, for an image, so fortunately I'm pretty sure none of this will be restricting my creative freedom.

Putti are cute, but not really my style!

Plus, do we really need art in SL of Romulus and Remus sucking at their wolf-mom's teat?

Possibly nawt!

[JacksonBollock]

39 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

I wish others could understand that.

It really is as easy as, "just follow the rules then there is no reason to worry about it".

And thus spake the "Reasonable Man"

First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

—Martin Niemöller

Edited May 10 by JacksonBollock

[Vivienne Schell]

22 minutes ago, Ceka Cianci said:

I wish they did it with voice, but I understand  that probably adds to the lag for many..

I'll live.. hehehe

God no, imagine some toddler talking like a granny. Eeeeep....

[Scylla Rhiadra]

2 minutes ago, Love Zhaoying said:

Plus, do we really need art in SL of Romulus and Remus sucking at their wolf-mom's teat?

Possibly nawt!

And it's been done!

https://marketplace.secondlife.com/p/Ancient-art-Relief-of-Lupa-nursing-Romulus-and-Remus/4074777

[Ceka Cianci]

2 minutes ago, Vivienne Schell said:

God no, imagine some toddler talking like a granny. Eeeeep....

I would hope in a serious meeting where many are looking for answers.. The rp would be put on hold.

[ErwinVonVlotho]

1 minute ago, JacksonBollock said:

And thus spake the "Reasonable Man"

First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

Just for context, the reason Niemoeller didn't speak out when the Nazis came for the socialists, trade unionists and Jews is that he enthusiastically supported the Nazis until they came for him.

And nobody is "coming for" child avis. They're merely being excluded from adult activities and content - because they're pretending to be children, and shouldn't be doing that sort of stuff anyway.

[JacksonBollock]

1 minute ago, ErwinVonVlotho said:

Just for context, the reason Niemoeller didn't speak out when the Nazis came for the socialists, trade unionists and Jews is that he enthusiastically supported the Nazis until they came for him.

And nobody is "coming for" child avis. They're merely being excluded from adult activities and content - because they're pretending to be children, and shouldn't be doing that sort of stuff anyway.

Thanks Erwin, but I think you've just made my point for me

Anyway, sorry all for the diversion - what can I say, it's a quiet Friday afternoon.

All the Best
Jackson

[Madi Melodious]

45 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

The legal context is specified, it's called the Terms of Service, and you agreed to it when you logged in.

End of discussion.

LL's way or the Highway.

 

An there is the core issue, isn't it?   Linden's way or the highway.   What happens to LL when enough people chose the highway?  I know for a fact that they have  lost several high paying accounts because of this issue.  I know there are more that are waiting to see how this plays out before they cancel. 

An losing an account doesn't just mean losing membership dues.  It means losing marketplace business and sim/land revenue.   I have one friend with a dozen sims and pre pro membership.   She is one of those waiting to see how this goes.  But she has decided not to add two more sims to her estate.  So, this tos change has cost the lab $400 for set up fees, and $200 a month in sim maintenance as a source of potential income.  

If LL response with more drastic rules changes, more accounts get closed as people chose to vote with their feet and wallets.  The "my way" or the highway policy never really ends well for a business.  

💖Be Well and May Joy and Laughter Find you💖

Edited May 10 by Madi Melodious

[Arielle Popstar]

1 minute ago, Madi Melodious said:

An there is the core issue, isn't it?   Linden's  Zalifients way or the highway. 

💖Be Well and May Joy and Laughter Find you💖

Fixed it for you

[Zalificent Corvinus]

17 minutes ago, JacksonBollock said:

And thus spake the "Reasonable Man"

Oh. Look. Another outsider trying to equate a company imposing restrictions on problematic customers with 1930's Germany.

 

*Yawn*

 

Edited May 10 by Zalificent Corvinus

[Zalificent Corvinus]

2 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Fixed it for you

Nah, if it was MY way, all the tiny Toxic Terror tots would already be banned for "conspiracy to evade the ToS".

 

[Alwin Alcott]

4 minutes ago, Madi Melodious said:

 I know for a fact that they have  lost several high paying accounts because of this issue.

numbers please
or is it just said in first shock?

Quote

If LL response with more drastic rules changes

IF ... if the child players comply to the new rules there's no need to be more drastic .. that is so to say 'in your hands"
 

[Arielle Popstar]

1 minute ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

Nah, if it was MY way, all the tiny Toxic Terror tots would already be banned for "conspiracy to evade the ToS".

 

Well you could just give or link them to a copy of Dreamgrid and they might leave voluntarily and you can rest easy your world will no longer have any of that tempting click bait!

[Alwin Alcott]

1 minute ago, Arielle Popstar said:

and they might leave voluntarily

ahwwww, ... can i keep at least one? Just for fun?

[Zalificent Corvinus]

2 minutes ago, Arielle Popstar said:

Well you could just give or link them to a copy of Dreamgrid and they might leave voluntarily and you can rest easy your world will no longer have any of that tempting click bait!

Why would II advertise the OpenIPTheft Hyperfail Grid, orr IMVSpew, when that's your usual stock in trade., and the main reason for your scaremongering disinformation campaign to drive SecondLifers to those cesspits.

 

 

[Arielle Popstar]

Just now, Alwin Alcott said:

ahwwww, ... can i keep at least one? Just for fun?

Oh for sure, like I know of one i'd like to hideaway too!

[Madi Melodious]

1 minute ago, Alwin Alcott said:

numbers please
or is it just said in first shock?

IF ... if the child players comply to the new rules there's no need to be more drastic .. that is so to say 'in your hands"
 

I know of at least 3 Prim pro users that have close their accounts, $750 a year lost.  I don't know how many of them owned sim but I know where content creators.  At least 15 lesser accounts closed, some paying, probably not.  But that is 15 accounts lost that could have lead to higher revenue sources.  

My way or the highway is never a good business policy. 

[Arielle Popstar]

Just now, Zalificent Corvinus said:

Why would II advertise the OpenIPTheft Hyperfail Grid, orr IMVSpew, when that's your usual stock in trade., and the main reason for your scaremongering disinformation campaign to drive SecondLifers to those cesspits

Only doing what is best for you so you no longer have to suffer the paranoid angst of stepping on a Tiny Tot !

[JacksonBollock]

9 minutes ago, Zalificent Corvinus said:

Oh. Look. Another outsider trying to equate a company imposing restrictions on problematic customers with 1930's Germany.

 

*Yawn*

 

Yeah, but this isn't simply about a company imposing policies on customers - for lets say - not rewinding their Video Cassettes (I am that old  ).

It seems a bit bigger, it has implications for identity and freedom of expression across this new thing which some (admittedly not you) are calling the Metaverse.

So Martin Niemöller's piece felt relevant, touching as it does on themes of apathy and personal responsibility.

Believe it or not, platforms like Second Life are examples of how a new Social Contract might look in the future, and how policies like that being implemented by Linden Lab should be scrutinized from all side.

There you go, so I think what I've said so far in this thread is relevant and timely. I might be wrong though  

[Alwin Alcott]

7 minutes ago, Madi Melodious said:

My way or the highway is never a good business policy. 

and still... éverybody that gets or been online past days accepted the new changes ... i didn't see any button that said "perhaps, i'm still thinking" 

[Arielle Popstar]

Just now, Alwin Alcott said:

and still... éverybody that gets or been online past days accepted the new changes ... i didn't see any button that said "perhaps, i'm still thinking" 

Boilerplate contract. I believe they are frowned on but yes best to wait until there might be a class action thing.

[Love Zhaoying]

I like how people "seem" to go far off topic, but you're (I'm) not..quite..sure. lol